Eldar Rumour Titbits

[Learn2Eel]

fixed that for you

Not really. From a purely modelling perspective, the Dragon Princes look quite a bit more detailed by comparison. The Cold One Knights are pretty cool too, but they aren't as impressive IMO.

Anyways, on topic, I'm very curious to see how many plastic kits Eldar get. We know about the "Wraithknights/Wraithguard" that Hastings has mentioned, but has anything else been rumoured? A rumour was going around about a much smaller Avatar model, but I can't see that happening honestly.
I'm hoping they don't weaken an all-Wraith army, or prevent you from doing it. I expect Wraithguard will either be cheaper or have longer range guns in the new codex. Wraithlords should see a price increase - particularly when one compares them to recent codices - but gain an extra attack. I expect Eldar to get a lot more than just points decreases across the board - with very few increases. I can see Farseers getting cheaper, but paying more for their gear. Guardians need to have at least 18" guns.

[Defenestratus]

Now I've got to know, what made them different from Guardians? I really miss that book.

Nothing of substance really, except that exodite knights couldn't take frag or krak grenades like Guardians could. They have the same base stats and same points cost when fitted with lasguns or shuriken cats.

Pirates have to be lead by a Pirate captain. Thats about all.

[Power Klawz]

Cold One Knights will always be the superior elven cavalry, there is no alternative.

It'd be nice to see a few larger numbers under the "A" column on a lot of Eldar units. If I remember correctly farseers get 1 attack base! Its purely counter-intuitive to give an HQ access to melee weapon beatsticks and then limit their potential so brutally. Understandably a farseer is first and foremost a force multiplying support HQ, but damn can't he judo chop a little faster than that? I mean he's a psychic, genius space elf for goodness sake.

[magickbk]

If I remember correctly farseers get 1 attack base! Its purely counter-intuitive to give an HQ access to melee weapon beatsticks and then limit their potential so brutally. Understandably a farseer is first and foremost a force multiplying support HQ, but damn can't he judo chop a little faster than that? I mean he's a psychic, genius space elf for goodness sake.

Their low attacks and low (for an Eldar) Initiative was supposed to represent the fact that they were so old that their bodies were turning to crystal. Back in the day, that is.

[Power Klawz]

I can get the low initiative thing, but attacks are generally represented as martial skill and equipment rather than actual quickness, which is represented by initiative.

Like, IG Officers still get a pretty nice number of attacks despite being grumpy old dudes with bad backs.

Honestly I just don't want my farseer to lose a fistfight with like... Major Chuck Friendly, officer and gentleman.

[-Tom-]

I can get the low initiative thing, but attacks are generally represented as martial skill and equipment rather than actual quickness, which is represented by initiative.

Like, IG Officers still get a pretty nice number of attacks despite being grumpy old dudes with bad backs.

Honestly I just don't want my farseer to lose a fistfight with like... Major Chuck Friendly, officer and gentleman.

It depends what you're comparing to for Initiative, I wouldn't have said they were particularly low... one tends to think of Orks as being good in CC, but I had a Farseer and Warlock retinue squad that I knew I couldn't avoid being charged by in a following turn in a game, so I thought 'meh' and charged first. My opponent called out a challenge with his Warboss, which I took with the Farseer, who ripped the Warboss into little bits and then the warlocks carried on and made mincemeat of the rest of the squad. They're certainly not *bad* in CC.

However, fluff-wise, the Warlocks are meant to have trod dual paths, both the warrior and the seer path so you would expect them to be better in combat than the farseers (whom you would expect to be much better than warlocks with psychic powers, which they are). But, the Warlock stats don't really seem to mirror this fluff.

[Defenestratus]

Honestly I just don't want my farseer to lose a fistfight with like... Major Chuck Friendly, officer and gentleman.

I actually RP a farseer in a Rogue Trader Campaign. I don't have great combat stats but if I get in hand to hand with Major Chuck Friendly without having at least melted away half of his brain from the inside, I've done something very, very wrong.

I am hoping that we get some BRAND NEW Eldar powers for our farseers - including some better offensive ones than crappy Eldrich Storm and unreliable (especially with DtW) Mind War.

[spaceman91]

I am hoping that we get some BRAND NEW Eldar powers for our farseers - including some better offensive ones than crappy Eldrich Storm and unreliable (especially with DtW) Mind War.

why is mind war unreliable? Im not calling you out i just would like to know. I am no expert at eldar powers.

[Archon Charybdis]

why is mind war unreliable? Im not calling you out i just would like to know. I am no expert at eldar powers.

Because it requires you to win a d6 roll off to inflict wounds. You get a bonus if your Ld is higher, but it's a crap shoot if you're say trying to attack an enemy HQ.

[Dalleron]

I would also like to see some more offensive powers available to farseers. I understand that generally it is not very eldarish but some eldar psychers must have not gone down the "Farseer" path and have gone all nasty with their abilities. Even if the more offensive powers aren't allowed to be taken with fortune and guide, it would still be nice.

I don't know if it would be overpowered, but since the eldar race as a whole is somewhat psychically attuned as I understand it, they would have some additional protection from enemy psychers.

[Defenestratus]

Because it requires you to win a d6 roll off to inflict wounds. You get a bonus if your Ld is higher, but it's a crap shoot if you're say trying to attack an enemy HQ.

Additionally the target gets two saves against it now. They get an initial Deny the Witch, which if its an enemy psyker is usually 5+, and then they get an invulnerable save against the wounds - if any occur.

I've played Eldar now for 20 years. I can count on one hand the number of models I've killed with Mind War.

[DrLove42]

I've mindwarred...Abaddon Once. And a Space Marine Sergeant or 2...

My biggest problem is the eldar best powers....guide and the like became the Divination Table. And now everyone seems to have physkers with that table. So the Eldar have to pay 20-30 points for their powers, while everyone seems to get the same ones for free

[Learn2Eel]

I expect Eldar will still keep at least four of their codex powers, though I wouldn't be surprised if Guide and any other cross-overs are removed with the stipulation that Eldar psykers can take powers from both their codex and rulebook disciplines in the same game.

[ElectricPaladin]

I expect Eldar will still keep at least four of their codex powers, though I wouldn't be surprised if Guide and any other cross-overs are removed with the stipulation that Eldar psykers can take powers from both their codex and rulebook disciplines in the same game.

This seems highly unlikely to me. So far, of the codices we've seen, we have Dark Angels, who use the basic disciplines, and Chaos Marines, who - IIRC - also use the basic disciplines. Daemons don't use psychic powers at all (though the have cards that work like them in some cases). I suspect that Eldar will also use the basic powers, especially since divination is basically written for them.

[Defenestratus]

especially since divination is basically written for them.

Except for the fact that pretty much every other army can take it.. yeah sure.

You know how irritating it is that marines can get a better version of guide?

[DrLove42]

I wouldn't be suprised if the Eldar had multiple tables of their own to choose from

A guiding (buffing) set of 7, and an offensive set of 7. Warlocks are all level one, Farseers Lvl 2, with an upgrade that lets them do a third power

[magickbk]

I could see it being the way High Elves are in Warhammer Fantasy, give them their own fancy powers, and then they can also use any of the big book tables.

[bfmusashi]

This seems highly unlikely to me. So far, of the codices we've seen, we have Dark Angels, who use the basic disciplines, and Chaos Marines, who - IIRC - also use the basic disciplines. Daemons don't use psychic powers at all (though the have cards that work like them in some cases). I suspect that Eldar will also use the basic powers, especially since divination is basically written for them.

Dark Angels get rulebook powers and a character has a signature power.
Chaos Marines get rulebook and three unique disiplines.
Daemons get rulebook and three unique disiplines.
Tau are the first to get nothing.

[Learn2Eel]

This seems highly unlikely to me. So far, of the codices we've seen, we have Dark Angels, who use the basic disciplines, and Chaos Marines, who - IIRC - also use the basic disciplines. Daemons don't use psychic powers at all (though the have cards that work like them in some cases). I suspect that Eldar will also use the basic powers, especially since divination is basically written for them.

See bfmusashi's post.


Dark Angels get rulebook powers and a character has a signature power.
Chaos Marines get rulebook and three unique disiplines.
Daemons get rulebook and three unique disiplines.
Tau are the first to get nothing.

[ElectricPaladin]

Dark Angels get rulebook powers and a character has a signature power.
Chaos Marines get rulebook and three unique disiplines.
Daemons get rulebook and three unique disiplines.
Tau are the first to get nothing.

I stand corrected.

[Learn2Eel]

I like the idea of an offensive discipline for Warlocks and a support discipline for Farseers. I think that would do justice to what is the most highly psychic race in 40K, though unfortunately I don't think GW will do it.
I'm curious, has anyone thought of Phoenix Lords unlocking their Aspects as Troops if they are your Warlord? I don't think it will ever happen and it would definitely favour some Aspects over others - and lead to some broken combos, most likely - but...well it would be cool to have an entire army of Warp Spiders (provided they eventually get their own Phoenix Lord) :D Competitive? No. Awesome? Hell yes!

[DrLove42]

I liked the idea of Autarchs making one squad of aspects a troop.

But we need to stop wishlisting and wait now. If all is true, it shouldn't be long

[bfmusashi]

There's room for debate as Orks seem to be more psychic than Craftworlders. I do think splitting disciplines (like the Daemons codex does) would be a solid method. While a Farseer chucking fireballs around the battlefield would be discordant a Warlock saying "Hey, wanna see what I can do?" to some guardian he has the hots for would be rad.

[Defenestratus]

From Natfka:


via an anonymous source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Eldar are indeed coming.

Path system has been revamped. Autarchs take paths that are now fixed in point cost (before they became more expensive the more you took) but do not make their aspect troops.

Instead it allows corresponding aspects to be taken as compulsory troops.

Ergo, the Path of the Striking Scorpions would allow you to take up to two striking scorpions as troops.

If you also took the path of Swooping Hawks you could take up to two Swooping Hawks as troops or one and one.

Guardians are a lot cheaper and have more options for special weapons.

New transport for dire avengers / weapon platform (with no transport capacity).

And lots of new goodies.

If tau are the long range shooting army, eldar are a mix with potential units in short, mid and long range

Long range comes almost exclusively from heavy support, however so you need to create a mix it seems.

Aspects are still hyper focused and saw a very small decrease in points except fire dragons.

[eldargal]

Sounds plausible but is probably nonsense. We've had hardly any reliable rules leaks this far out from a release (even assuming it is the codex not a wave coming in June).

[Dalleron]

how much cheaper could guardians get. 8 pts is cheap already. Just fix their basically useless gun. Still not cheap enough to take as they stand right now though. Also don't buy the path system.

[Mr Mystery]

I hope they sort out Dark Reapers rules wise.

As is, they are only a credible threat to Power Armour, and even then marginally so. AP3 is always nice to have, but I feel the unit is hampered by their low numbers, and being S5. Against Horde armies, they are fairly pointless. Not enough shots to worry blobs, and not enough S to instant kill anything. Against light vehicles? Scatter Lasers and even the humble Shuriken Cannon are just as good, possibly more so as you can have more, and they are typically more manoeuvrable.

I wouldn't say they are currently useless, as against the right target they are worth the investment. But those units aren't exactly prolific, so in a general purpose list, they lose out to more flexible units.

If you ask me, just give them Missile Launchers proper!

[Defenestratus]

I think that the DR's are basically an exarch delivery system as they are now. The tempest launcher with crack shot is simply MURDER to MEQ's and with the advent of LoS, its relatively easy to keep him alive. I also use him on the quad gun with crack shot to be able to ignore jink saves.

As for the quality of the rumors EG, Natfka doesn't post rumors unless he gets several sources saying the same thing. He says to me that he's sitting on a lot more information right now but he can't release it until its independently corroborated by another source or two. He said that he's been sitting on the farseer pic for weeks for this very reason.

[Mr Mystery]

They're a very expensive delivery method though.

And having checked my Codex, they seem the only Aspect not to actually benefit squad wise from their Exarch... Definitely in need of a change!

[Defenestratus]

via Stickmonkey from the Faeit 212 inbox
Stickmonkey here again, Fwiw, I reported this along time ago so im not sure how valid it still is.

Eldar were supposedly getting the following:

New tank chassis, 2 builds, between falcon and cobra in size, one build had transport capacity and some type of melta or flame based weapon (fusion cannon iirc) the other build was essentially a flakk cannon, but not the same as the fw firestorm, bigger tl guns.

There was a new avatar sculpt but im pretty sure that ended up being a designer test seen at GD

Wraithguard get a plastic box with new weapon variants. Lots of rumors of dial build, but nothing i've heard enough of to know what's true.

Heavy rumors of new jetbikes, building guardian and shining spears.

However, it seems to be a trend not to release too many rehash boxes. If we got wraithguard, jetbikes, and an avatar all in this release, well Ill be broke and need new shorts.

Rumors have pointed to a new farseer model, and thats all but confirmed by your recent post.

The bomber and fighter do not share a box from everything I've heard. The fighter is "very" similar to the nightwing, except for the wing shape. One of the two is rumored to use some form of distortion weapon, be it bomb or missiles i dont know.

Rumors of a new aspect exist, the word i've heard is this has something to do with wraith constructs, but really even that is too vague.

I know others have said there is a large wraith construct, but none of my sources are backing this now, fwiw.

For the release there are two new aspect exarch or p lord (not sure which) sculpts in finecast, and one named hq, these are all new scuplts, but could be old characters.

Ive been told guardians are getting a new box to make them and storm guardians. Again, i cant believe wed get so many redone plastics. But it makes sense on its own.

So to boil it down, from the new new dept could be 2 flyers, a dual build tank, a new large walker/mc, a few blisters, and a new aspect.

Then on top of that old models getting plastics.

Its just way too much for a release, so what will stick and what wont?

So maybe no mega wraithlord? I'd be fine with that actually. Would much rather us get (hopefully) an assault tank, AA tank, and a new aspect warrior.

[Kirsten]

he can't release it until its independently corroborated by another source or two. He said that he's been sitting on the farseer pic for weeks for this very reason.

that makes no sense at all, the Farseer pic is a photo of a sprue, it doesn't need verifying by anybody. Sounds like he is having you on.

[natfka]

As for the quality of the rumors EG, Natfka doesn't post rumors unless he gets several sources saying the same thing. He says to me that he's sitting on a lot more information right now but he can't release it until its independently corroborated by another source or two. He said that he's been sitting on the farseer pic for weeks for this very reason.

It does not have to do with corroborating sources. I get information that cannot be posted because the number of people that know it is very few and too easy for the powers to be to track down who is the source. Once the information or pics become more known to a larger number of people, the information can be released, with the permission of course. The Farseer pics were different in that regard, but I cannot go into that.

[DeadPanda]

Welcome to BOLS :) Natfka. Been a follower of the blog for a couple of years. The rumours may not always pan out but it always makes for fun reading.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Eldrad will be better than Ahriman, calling it now.

[DrLove42]

Eldrad will be better than Ahriman, calling it now.

Well he should be on par at least. Eldrad and Ahriman are the only two characters in the game who should be Lvl 4 Pyskers

[Mr Mystery]

But if they do that, the Eldar players may no longer whine.... And whining appears to be a suitable oxygen substitute for some! :p

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Well he should be on par at least. Eldrad and Ahriman are the only two characters in the game who should be Lvl 4 Pyskers

Kairos Fateweaver disapproves of your statement!

[Freakeh]

Really hope the Avatar and Eldrad are still amazing or hopefully even better!!

[kyfer]

Eldrad and Avatar both need to be better. Eldrad just needs to be brought into 6th Ed., but Avatar needs to improve vastly to be worth taking imho

Also welcome to BOLS, natfka :) Huge fan of your blog!

[DrLove42]

Kairos Fateweaver disapproves of your statement!

Shhh I forgot about him.

[kyfer]

Tragic that the Pathfinders will still be finecast :'( horrible stuff

And I doubt anybody will be surprised about what the 'rumoured' new jetbikes will look like, there are photos of a prototype that look pretty close to the details I'm hearing at the moment. The picture is from a year or two ago, and I'm certain it would have appeared on BOLS. If not...
3918
btw haven't read any posts before page 29, so if this has already been argued, I apologise to the nimble fox who did so before me. Consider it support of your argument.

[Wolfshade]

btw haven't read any posts before page 29, so if this has already been argued, I apologise to the nimble fox who did so before me. Consider it upport of your argument.

Page 29, mine only goes up to page 8...

[Defenestratus]

Tragic that the Pathfinders will still be finecast :'( horrible stuff

And I doubt anybody will be surprised about what the 'rumoured' new jetbikes will look like, there are photos of a prototype that look pretty close to the details I'm hearing at the moment. The picture is from a year or two ago, and I'm certain it would have appeared on BOLS. If not...
3918
btw haven't read any posts before page 29, so if this has already been argued, I apologise to the nimble fox who did so before me. Consider it support of your argument.

I'm in the process of painting some lovely finecast pathfinders and have nothing but nice things to say about them.

[Psychosplodge]

Page 29, mine only goes up to page 8...

beat me to it.

[BigGrim]

I'm in the process of painting some lovely finecast pathfinders and have nothing but nice things to say about them.

I thought the same until all the barrels bent either forward or backwards, popping the paint off or three out of the five have had their barrels snap off altogether.

[Defenestratus]

Hair dryer ftw.

[Wolfshade]

I thought the same until all the barrels bent either forward or backwards, popping the paint off or three out of the five have had their barrels snap off altogether.

Don't forget that we had this issue with lead and white metal before...

[eldargal]

I thought the same until all the barrels bent either forward or backwards, popping the paint off or three out of the five have had their barrels snap off altogether.
http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3919&d=1366643279
They laugh at your bent Pathfinder barrel...

[DrLove42]

I've had the sights fall off one FC pathfinder gun, and a snapper barell on another.

But my metal don't fare much better than their backpacks keep making a break for freedom

[Cosmic Schwung]

The picture is from a year or two ago, and I'm certain it would have appeared on BOLS. If not...

Closer to 6 years ago. By the time they finally come out I'll consider them old and want to wait for the next redesign.

[Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer]

But if they do that, the Eldar players may no longer whine.... And whining appears to be a suitable oxygen substitute for some! :pAnd whining about whining is apparently ambrosia to others :P

[BigGrim]

http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3919&d=1366643279
They laugh at your bent Pathfinder barrel...

Aaaaaaaaaaw! Don't laugh at my bendy barrels! :p

[kyfer]

http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3919&d=1366643279
They laugh at your bent Pathfinder barrel...

This made my day lol

[Defenestratus]

There are two types of men in this world - those that have had bendy-barrel (usually coinciding with alcohol), and those that lie about having bendy barrel.

Personally - I'm not ashamed.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-SJwQXoy9un4/UPGVQ2GLPSI/AAAAAAAAfg4/mtMR2Co15DY/s778/IMG_20130112_115349.jpg

[eldargal]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_XLlSC4VlwbE/TRDJQyG6Y2I/AAAAAAAAAJc/ZCvwCsA_gfc/s320/farseer_cartoon_by_yuliapw-d30xi0h.jpg

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

/facepalm

[Wolfshade]

There are two types of men in this world - those that have had bendy-barrel (usually coinciding with alcohol), and those that lie about having bendy barrel.

Personally - I'm not ashamed.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-SJwQXoy9un4/UPGVQ2GLPSI/AAAAAAAAfg4/mtMR2Co15DY/s778/IMG_20130112_115349.jpg

And we use this rifle to shoot over walls...

[Psychosplodge]

There are two types of men in this world - those that have had bendy-barrel (usually coinciding with alcohol), and those that lie about having bendy barrel.

Personally - I'm not ashamed.

I dunno by the point it probably wouldn't work I've always been more interested in sleep...

[Cosmic Schwung]

bendy-barrel

Oh dear. If your rangers are having performance issues, some combat drugs will get them back to shafting the opposition in no time.

[raven1man]

So I was reading through the tau codec and looking at the inside cover where the tau are fight eldar I noticed some outlines of some flyers that don't look like the nightwing. Anyone else notice that as well. FYI this is in the top right side. To me it looks like a crescent moon shape wing with the nightwing nose.

[Psychosplodge]

Is it a phoenix bomber?

[eldargal]

Any chance of a picture for those of us without a copy or who are too lazy to go downstairs and find one of her brothers copies?

[DrLove42]

I think its a Phoenix. From memory.

Was trying to find a copy of it on google. I've learnt not to google "Eldar vs Tau artwork", unless you want to see full frontal Banshees being raped by Deamonettes.....

[spaceman91]

I thought everyone had noticed the fighters? No lie i said this to a few of my mates the first day i had my codex.

[Psychosplodge]

I think its a Phoenix. From memory.

Was trying to find a copy of it on google. I've learnt not to google "Eldar vs Tau artwork", unless you want to see full frontal Banshees being raped by Deamonettes.....

That's not Tau.

Also found an early leaked image of the new codex

http://25.media.tumblr.com/869aa7cc4ad68dadc02d86690cb052c3/tumblr_mlqplzmiwY1rnzf9ro1_500.jpg

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Seems legit.

[Psychosplodge]

yeah I thought as much.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Needs more Dragons.

[YourSwordisMine]

There are two types of men in this world - those that have had bendy-barrel (usually coinciding with alcohol), and those that lie about having bendy barrel.

Personally - I'm not ashamed.

Prostate issues can cause the same problem...

The older I get, the more bendy the barrel...

And no amount of Combat Drugs, or Daemonette's Monthly can seem to get it to straighten back out...

[Defenestratus]

Prostate issues can cause the same problem...

The older I get, the more bendy the barrel...

And no amount of Combat Drugs, or Daemonette's Monthly can seem to get it to straighten back out...

You know - I usually groan when EG mentions "gender equity" in Eldar miniatures...

but maybe this place does need a woman's touch... sheesh.

[Anggul]

This thread is rapidly leading to the fall.

[DrLove42]

This thread is rapidly leading to the fall.

The true reason the Eldar race fell. Infinity Circuit discussions of droopy barrels

[Psychosplodge]

This thread is rapidly leading to the fall.

That happens after the woman's touch;)

[eldargal]

So, Faeit is reporting that Phil Kelly is the author of the eldar codex and someone has has said that Mr Kelly confirmed this to them at GD Chicago. If true, huzzah!

[DrLove42]

Yes Faeit has a rumour from 2 years ago that someone told him it was Phil Kelly

Phil Kelly told me two years ago he didn't want to do it cos it'd be wierd to redo his own stuff.

I hope it is

[eldargal]

Yes Faeits rumour is pretty rubbish really, but the chap in the comments claiming PK confirmed it to him last year is more interesting. It is possible that after spending years (allegedly) working on the DE codex he was fed up with eldar in general and after a break he wasn't so opposed to re-working his previous effort. Obviously pure speculation.

Personally I wouldn't be at all surprised if we get a new author for the book but I really hope it is Kelly.

[Defenestratus]

Yes Faeits rumour is pretty rubbish really, but the chap in the comments claiming PK confirmed it to him last year is more interesting. It is possible that after spending years (allegedly) working on the DE codex he was fed up with eldar in general and after a break he wasn't so opposed to re-working his previous effort. Obviously pure speculation.

Personally I wouldn't be at all surprised if we get a new author for the book but I really hope it is Kelly.

Personally I hope Ward is writing it because I really enjoy his rules.

[rpricew]

Has Ward even been involved in any of the "New" 40k codices? The last one was the Necrons right? Since then it's been a combination of Kelly, Cruddace & Vetock???

Also, somewhere in the White Dwarfs there is an article stating that the "Rules" are written by a team, and the "Fluff" is written by the writer. Therefore, Ward wouldn't be responsible for the "Rules", but would bear the blame for Necrons & Blood Angels "Bro-Fisting" each other.

[Kyban]

Personally I hope Ward is writing it because I really enjoy his rules.

Who did the rules for the new Tau dex? I haven't seen them in action yet but they look like a lot of fun and very interesting.

[DrLove42]

Tau was Vetock

I like Phil Kelly codexes. And I like 75% of Matt Wards rules and 25% of his fluff

And for my Eldar I'd rather have a well balenced codex with great fluff and rules, not overpowered rules at the expense of the fluff

[MarneusCalgar]

Kelly wrote Space Puppies and Dark BSDM eldar so... he´s not Mat Ward, you can trust his work

[raven1man]

Yes Faeits rumour is pretty rubbish really, but the chap in the comments claiming PK confirmed it to him last year is more interesting. It is possible that after spending years (allegedly) working on the DE codex he was fed up with eldar in general and after a break he wasn't so opposed to re-working his previous effort. Obviously pure speculation.

Personally I wouldn't be at all surprised if we get a new author for the book but I really hope it is Kelly.


Yes I was at chi town games day last year and i can say that is what was said by Mr Kelly. I was looking at the display case next to him with my ears listening why others were talking to him.

[Lexington]

Has Ward even been involved in any of the "New" 40k codices? The last one was the Necrons right? Since then it's been a combination of Kelly, Cruddace & Vetock???
Ward did work on the 6th Edition rulebook as well, but hasn't been involved (or at least credited) on any of the Codexes since. Ward did the Daemons book for Fantasy, and it looks like he's the author of the new High Elf book as well, which gives credence to my pet theory that he's been exiled to Fantasy, similar to poor ol' JJ. In this case, tho, good riddance / bad rubbish, etc.

[Ankhalagon]

Ward did work on the 6th Edition rulebook as well, but hasn't been involved (or at least credited) on any of the Codexes since. Ward did the Daemons book for Fantasy, and it looks like he's the author of the new High Elf book as well, which gives credence to my pet theory that he's been exiled to Fantasy, similar to poor ol' JJ. In this case, tho, good riddance / bad rubbish, etc.

As long as he don´t messes up the balance at fantasy (again) it could be better so.

[DeadPanda]

I said it once, I will say it again :o. I like Wards codex work. I like the fact I can take any unit and it never seems like a bad choice. My Marine army codex despite being 5 years old now( 2008 I think) still stands up to my friends newer armies and I never feel intimidated by any other army. My marines have an answer for pretty much anything. I know they have had a couple of flyers since the codex release but nothing else. I hope you guys do get Kelly for Eldar if that's what you wish. I really want Ward doing my marines.

[Power Klawz]

I think that its pretty much universally accepted that codex space marines was Ward's best outing in the 40k crunch arena. It was the fluff that really ticked everyone off in that codex.

It was also his first 40k codex, and we all know what happened after that.

[DeadPanda]

Fair enough, I read the fluff once or twice. But use the rules for years ;)
As for quality fluff, I don't think you can get much better than the Orks codex. That fluff is brilliant and hilarious in equal measure.

[Archon Charybdis]

I like Wards codex work. I like the fact I can take any unit and it never seems like a bad choice.

Flayed Ones. *Drops the mic and walks off stage*

Seriously though, there seem to generally be clear winners and losers in Ward codices (bluebook being a less egregious case, but even there). The bulk of his units may be fine, but is' the outliers that tend to really skew things. Grey Knights being the exception; when they were written they were so broken you'd have to work at NOT building a power-list. 6th ed has toned them down somewhat, but they're still really damn strong.

[DarkLink]

Ward still has much better internal balance in his books than any other author. And he pretty much avoids stupid stuff like the Daemon's new warpstorm table. If I wanted to consult randomized tables every five minutes every single game, my opponent would punch me in the face and tell me to stop being annoying.

[Power Klawz]

Yeah if there's one thing I can't stand about Warhammer its randomization tables.

Well, I mean, I guess if actually getting punched in the face was a thing that actually happened that would be the one thing that I couldn't stand, but then again it does feel a bit arbitrary to only pick one thing that I can't stand, you know?

(To be fair though, I'm not really a fan of the randomized psychic powers or warlord traits. Seems like you could make a much more nuanced and interesting list if you could just pick your faves. That one in six chance of getting infiltrators in your chaos force unless you take captain-eye-fist is pretty weak. Easy enough to fix with your opponents consent though. I mean, unless your opponent is that guy that apparently punches you in the face every 5 minutes, honestly I wouldn't try that with him. He'd probably punch you in the face.)

[DarkLink]

Regardless, I don't know why they think it's a good game mechanic.

[Tynskel]

because they don't care about the game, they care about Epicness.
Epicness comes from bat-shiznanitz-crazy stuff happening... which only occurs from random dice rolls.

[eldargal]

because they don't care about the game, they care about Epicness.
Epicness comes from bat-shiznanitz-crazy stuff happening... which only occurs from random dice rolls.

You mean they aren't WAAC arses who want every mechanic to be be absolutely predictable so winning comes down to easily formulated list builds and cookie cutter tactics.

[DarkLink]

Actually, it's because I want to be playing a game instead of watching a movie (without the benefit of a TV).

[eldargal]

Right, because you have absolutely no interaction ingames at the moment. Because of random charges/assaults and a few special rules.:rolleyes: Never mind that other random elements have been removed like guessing ranges and charge distances etc.

[Mr Mystery]

Flayed Ones. *Drops the mic and walks off stage*



Infiltrate? Check. Loads of attacks? Check. Ideal for charging into cover because when you're I2, it really, really doesn't make much difference? Check! Resilience to tie down pretty much any non-HTH dedicate unit in combat, and slice them up good? Check!

There we go. Deadpanda was correct :p

[eldargal]

Beyond the tedium that was the GK codex Ward does do excellent rules and I would be quite happy if he wrote the eldar book. But I would prefer Kelly because hid codices are usually full of fun, lore-friendly abilities and equipment which may not necessarily be over-competitive but are fun and work well enough to take. The haemonculi gear in the DE book is a good example of this. But then you have venom blades, djinn blades, huskblades and agonisers which are all good depending on your tastes, to name just a few examples. The only unit in the book which is sub-par in mandrakes and they can still be a nasty surprise for an opponent.

[DeadPanda]

[QUOTE=Archon Charybdis;299570]Flayed Ones. *Drops the mic and walks off stage*[QUOTE]

Maelstrom did a cool article on flayed ones right here on BoLs. Used correctly they are not actually that bad.

[Wenceslas]

Many games works well without that amout of randomness. It doesnt have to lead to easy predictable game or easy formulated list.
Though the game needs some random effect, this is too much. Assault, mysterious terrain, warlord traits, psy powers and other really mmakes you loose too much control.
Another thing ir that loosing battle becouse of some extreme roll, like double 1 or 6 is really bitter experience.
Those random rules are much more effective and common tham old guess and actually leads to predictable games and easy formulated army list like 9 Vendettas and Ch. Dragon... etc.

[Wenceslas]

Many games works well without that amout of randomness. It doesnt have to lead to easy predictable game or easy formulated list.
Though the game needs some random effect, this is too much. Assault, mysterious terrain, warlord traits, psy powers and other really mmakes you loose too much control.
Another thing ir that loosing battle becouse of some extreme roll, like double 1 or 6 is really bitter experience.
Those random rules are much more effective and common tham old guess and actually leads to predictable games and easy formulated army list like 9 Vendettas and Ch. Dragon... etc.

[Mr Mystery]

But let's not lost sight of a few, incontrivable facts yeah?

1. This is a hobby Wargame. Not an olympic event.
2. There is no prize. Let alone prize money.
3. The game is written to create a narrative battle. Not to make you feel the big man for crushing a child opponent.
4. The game is not written with strict tournament play in mind. If you need to crush an opponent to feel the big man, might I suggest Chess, assuming you can get your head around strategy. If not, perhaps Draughts.
5. Before people come up with a 'blah blah tournament blah blah balance helps all blah blah write for tournaments blah blah we're right' type argument, which yes we have all seen before.... Stop and apply that logic to other things. Like Car manufacturers. Because a minority want Supercars, car designers should all only produce supercars, because they can be used for the school run as well you know....

[eldargal]

What Monsieur Mystère said.

GW have consistently said they aim to produce a ruleset which allows for fun, narrative play. They deliver, I've not found a more versatile game system when it comes to making adaptations and tweaks to allow for extended, narrative campaigns and scenarios. If this isn't your priority then you have perhaps picked the wrong game to play, so you have a choice. Either accept you won't love the ruleset or move on.

Back to eldar, a chap on Warseer (who recently posted accurate rumours about High Elves before the WD leak) posted this as a rough indication of the silhouette of the new eldar flyer:

Here's a roughly drawn top down silhouette of the new flyer. Obviously the curves flow into each other more nicely than this drawing, but hopefully it's something to get you all excited:)
http://www.warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=169568&d=1366844334
My thoughts:

http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3919&d=1366643279
This is proving to be a versatile picture.

[Psychosplodge]

Are we sure that's a flyer and not some sort of "plug"?

[Wenceslas]

1 Yes. Aggree.
2-3 I play for fun, not to win. I do not play aggainst child, less skilled and never been on tournament. Absolutly not interested in super-competative. I consider myself rather casual player and loyal to Eldar for the fluff, not rules
4 You take it to the extreme. There is huge space beetween chess and rullette. And Warhammer is closer to the second.
5 Most valid argument. Though if none speak up his/her opinion, them we wouldnt know who is minority and how big it is. Beside this, it wont hurt anyone.

[Mr Mystery]

Warhammer is closer to roulette? Really? Really really? So your manouevres, deployment, overall strategy and tactical decisions play no part because it's just that dashed random?

Cobblers. Cobblers and you know it. When there is a random factor (oh, hello dice, you little defiers of chance and probability you!) the trick is to attempt to stack things in your favour. A fair fight is a fools fight after all, far better to tonk them over the head when they're not looking, and walk away still looking pretty.

The Daemon table? It's in character, and really, really not the big thing people make it out to be. Random equipment on Daemons? Yep, I'm happy with that too. Why? Because it's Chaos. Clue is the name. Not 'entirely dependable and predictable servants of naughty naughty Gods'. It all builds narrative.

Don't like it? I hear Warmachine is a limited game system with a distinct lack of visual and gaming styles. You may want to try it. Apparently, it's steampunk too, so it must be good.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

You know - I usually groan when EG mentions "gender equity" in Eldar miniatures...

Seconded.

[eldargal]

Well, we can't all be privileged white boys.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I am certainly not privileged.

[eldargal]

When I talk about female sculpts for eldar all I am asking is for the model range to reflect the background, as it does with Dark Eldar. That's all, yet some people (males) seem to think this is too much to ask.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Yeah, no.
That isn't how privilege works anymore, it's all about money.

And if you really need to compare Warhammer 40k armies to real life standards then maybe you should reassess your priorities.

[Magpie]

When I talk about female sculpts for eldar all I am asking is for the model range to reflect the background,

What would those look like? I love the DE mini's what are your thoughts on the best look for the Eldar minis?

[DeadPanda]

Well, we can't all be privileged white boys.

Some of us are "Men" ;)

[eldargal]

Yeah, no.
That isn't how privilege works anymore, it's all about money.

And if you really need to compare Warhammer 40k armies to real life standards then maybe you should reassess your priorities.
No, privilege (or male privilege) is not about money (though that is a form of privilege, there are many), it is about how society views you and treats you.


What would those look like? I love the DE mini's what are your thoughts on the best look for the Eldar minis?
Well the basics are there already. There are two female guardian torsos per sprue (or box, I forget), if they could bump that up to 50/50 that would be great. One or two female aspect warriors per set would be nice, or if they are plastic more female torsos. The new HE shadow Warrior kit actually could set a precedent in that it has ten male torsos and ten female torsos in one box, so you don't need to mix. That would be ideal for eldar plastics. The DE range has an almost 50/50 split across the plastics even if individual kit are skewed one way or the other, and most of the torsos are interchangeable so you can make all-female squads easily enough.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I'm a man.

For the gods' sake, I am nearly 21.

@EG - And society views a rich white woman with disdain?

[Kirsten]

When I talk about female sculpts for eldar all I am asking is for the model range to reflect the background, as it does with Dark Eldar.

quite, a perfectly reasonable thing to expect, it is not as though it would bother anybody by making it proper 50/50, but other people think it is a shame that they are not, so it is an obvious thing to do.

TDA stop being a pillock and arguing for the sake of it.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I'm just sick to the back teeth of coming on here and solely seeing rants about sex. It's annoying.
Yes, I get that you feel you are getting a hard time of it, but it's just models at the end of the day; people are starving in the world, there is war, etc. There are a lot worse things going on in the world.

As we have seen, GW aren't even the best at producing female sculpts, they made advances with Dark Eldar, but even those still aren't great.

[eldargal]

I find it annoying that I have to 'ran't about these issues too, I would much rather live in a society where I don't have to make a fuss to be treated as something other than eye-candy or have the model range of my favourite army reflect the background like most of the others do.

Actually between the DE sculpts and the new High Elves and Vampire Count lahmians GW have made huge advances. In fact the Sisters of Averlorn are some of the best female sculpts I've seen from any company. Feminine but not even slightly sexualised with unprecedentedly small breasts.

[Kirsten]

I'm just sick to the back teeth of coming on here and solely seeing rants about sex.

well it is hardly all over the place, and you are the one who has just brought it up again, so you only have yourself to blame.

[Magpie]

Well the basics are there already. There are two female guardian torsos per sprue (or box, I forget), if they could bump that up to 50/50 that would be great. One or two female aspect warriors per set would be nice, or if they are plastic more female torsos. The new HE shadow Warrior kit actually could set a precedent in that it has ten male torsos and ten female torsos in one box, so you don't need to mix. That would be ideal for eldar plastics. The DE range has an almost 50/50 split across the plastics even if individual kit are skewed one way or the other, and most of the torsos are interchangeable so you can make all-female squads easily enough.

Yes that would be good. I've had the devils own job trying to put together my lady Vampires and Inquisitors. I would be nice to have a bit more "base material" so to speak.

The next lot of elves does have a female focus, do you think Eldar might too?

Not wanting to derail the thread but do you have a thought why GW don't have a lot of female models?

[Psychosplodge]

Not wanting to derail the thread but do you have a thought why GW don't have a lot of female models?

I would assume a lack of female sculptors, in the same way that white model painters will generally paint their models white. It's not malice it's just automatic...

[Psychosplodge]

Glitched...

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I find it annoying that I have to 'ran't about these issues too, I would much rather live in a society where I don't have to make a fuss to be treated as something other than eye-candy or have the model range of my favourite army reflect the background like most of the others do.

Actually between the DE sculpts and the new High Elves and Vampire Count lahmians GW have made huge advances. In fact the Sisters of Averlorn are some of the best female sculpts I've seen from any company. Feminine but not even slightly sexualised with unprecedentedly small breasts.

I agree that there needs to be more, but at least they are working on it. At least Eldar have more female squads, I only have 1 Commander that is female. :(
Although, for purposes of whatever, my Riptide pilot is a female. She'll probably end up taking over from Lightbringer when he dies.


I imagine that the Eldar will get more female models when we start seeing the new stuff. If we don't, feel free to rant.

[eldargal]

I like to hope that the next batch of eldar will have more female presence. But given it is possible we may only see wraithguard, wraith construct, flyer and jetbikes the only opportunity may be some female torsos in the jetbike box. Maybe when guardians get re-made at some point in the future they will up the number of female torsos and hopefully if aspect plastics are released we will see female torsos in them too. Given how many bits GW are fitting in kits now I really don't feel there is any excuse not to do this beyond indifference.

As to why, well the demographic has been primarily young men and while young men are happy to have female sculpts it isn't a high priority. As GW are run primarily by men they probably don't think about it much. I think they are starting to wake up to the fact that there are girls in the hobby too and that there could be more if women weren't largely ignored in the armies and also that more men are starting to realise this is unfair. You only have to see how popular Raging Heroes female sculpts have been to see there is demand for it.

Finding a sculptor who can do female faces well can also be a problem, though GW have shown this is less a problem now, we have seen quite a few female sculpts by a cadre of different sculptors and most have been good to excellent.


I agree that there needs to be more, but at least they are working on it. At least Eldar have more female squads, I only have 1 Commander that is female. :(
Although, for purposes of whatever, my Riptide pilot is a female. She'll probably end up taking over from Lightbringer when he dies.


I imagine that the Eldar will get more female models when we start seeing the new stuff. If we don't, feel free to rant.
Well Tau at least can pass for female in the same armour, and for bareheads I think you just need to fill in the nasal cavity and carve a v shaped one into the plastic higher up? I was told how to do it but I forget. But I agree a female bare head Tau would be nice on the sprues. The issue with eldar is that the females look obviously different and the background has the eldar not having any kind of gender roles so we should be saying more females. The same applies somewhat to IG, we know the Valhallans have all-female and mixed sex regiments and some other worlds too. I'd like to think that if we ever get a Valhallan plastic box it will include some females but I doubt it.

[Kirsten]

I would assume a lack of female sculptors, in the same way that white model painters will generally paint their models white. It's not malice it's just automatic...

yeah I think there is a lot of that, but there has also not been that many women in fantasy/sci fi stories /settings generally, always the odd one or two, but never really a lot of them. the stories and myths that form the basis of most fantasy or sci fi feature very few women, so the games end up with few as well, it is inevitable. GW have done a great job in introducing them really, and mentioning the gender neutrality in things like the guard, the models are gradually catching up.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I like to hope that the next batch of eldar will have more female presence. But given it is possible we may only see wraithguard, wraith construct, flyer and jetbikes the only opportunity may be some female torsos in the jetbike box. Maybe when guardians get re-made at some point in the future they will up the number of female torsos and hopefully if aspect plastics are released we will see female torsos in them too. Given how many bits GW are fitting in kits now I really don't feel there is any excuse not to do this beyond indifference.

As to why, well the demographic has been primarily young men and while young men are happy to have female sculpts it isn't a high priority. As GW are run primarily by men they probably don't think about it much. I think they are starting to wake up to the fact that there are girls in the hobby too and that there could be more if women weren't largely ignored in the armies and also that more men are starting to realise this is unfair. You only have to see how popular Raging Heroes female sculpts have been to see there is demand for it.

Finding a sculptor who can do female faces well can also be a problem, though GW have shown this is less a problem now, we have seen quite a few female sculpts by a cadre of different sculptors and most have been good to excellent.

I hope there is a female Autarch model, that would be siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiick .
Autarch Amonthyryr was female, back int day.

[eldargal]

I would assume a lack of female sculptors, in the same way that white model painters will generally paint their models white. It's not malice it's just automatic...

Which is the form of privilege I was referring, white men are the norm in our society. I should mention at this point that being privileged in itself is not blameworthy, the GW sculptors/painters aren't doing anything wrong.

But it isn't just the lack of female sculpts, there are other companies which make a point of producing a lot of females (Raging Heroes) which don't necessarily have any female sculptors either.

[Magpie]

I would assume a lack of female sculptors, in the same way that white model painters will generally paint their models white. It's not malice it's just automatic...

No I don't follow that at all, a sculptor is a sculptor and will model the subject they choose. Dark Sword, Raging Heroes, Reaper all have large numbers of female mini's.

The only reason I can think of is the market. Female minis must simply not sell well.

I don't know why as my armies contain quite a few female mini's and would contain more if I had more options. I am also patiently waiting for the "New Sisters of Battle", which granted are reaching Urban Myth levels.

[Kirsten]

I should mention at this point that being privileged in itself is not blameworthy, the GW sculptors/painters aren't doing anything wrong.

this bit is worth noting, talk of privilege seems to get people annoyed. nobody is being accused of being a white male, it is simply a statement of the way things are. no individual is being blamed for societal norms, but individuals can help change them.


No I don't follow that at all, a sculptor is a sculptor and will model the subject they choose. Dark Sword, Raging Heroes, Reaper all have large numbers of female mini's.

The only reason I can think of is the market. Female minis must simply not sell well.

I don't know why as my armies contain quite a few female mini's and would contain more if I had more options. I am also patiently waiting for the "New Sisters of Battle", which granted are reaching Urban Myth levels.

as I said a few posts back I don't think it is about sales, it is more about habit and source material. GW are making more female models over time, and newer companies are starting off with a good share of female minis.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I don't know why as my armies contain quite a few female mini's and would contain more if I had more options. I am also patiently waiting for the "New Sisters of Battle", which granted are reaching Urban Myth levels.

I want Sisters too, love the background, plus, our Deathwatch group has had a few interesting run-ins with them. :p
Y U NO RELEASE WHAT WE WANT GW?

[eldargal]

I want to emphasise just how far GW have come too, for all my (seldom...) complaints. The DE range being 50/50 or close is an immense achievement. None of the other major players in the industry (Mantic, PP) have anything close to that and certainly not of the same quality in terms of sculpts and being injection moulded plastic with an abundance of extras. Isabella von Carstein (while sexualised) is beautiful and the Coven Throne gives three more Lahmians that can be converted to be on foot/riding a horse with a little effort. I'd like to see a new Lahmian on foot because the old one isn't so great but it still an improvement. The New High Elf set is amazing though. Not sexualised, well sculpted and the Sisters of Averlorn kit is, as I mentioned, unprecedented in that it includes enough bits to make ten male or ten female figures. Female figures which are not sexualised and show abnormally small breasts for the genre. Even the Dark Elf dragon from a couple of years back had a female option (even if not an armoured female option). I've no doubt that ten years go it wouldn't have occurred to them to include one

While there are missed opportunities and I worry that we may be let done by the eldar release in particular GW have made HUGE improvements and as the industry leader this is extremely important and impressive.

[Magpie]

the Coven Throne gives three more Lahmians that can be converted to be on foot/riding a horse with a little effort.

Speaking of which, finished this last week.

3946

[Psychosplodge]

I Even the Dark Elf dragon from a couple of years back had a female option (even if not an armoured female option).


Wasn't that an immensely high armour class female or was that just the artwork?

[eldargal]

Speaking of which, finished this last week.

3946
Nice, I've done something similar. Also used one of their heads on an armoured female Dark Elf torso on zombie dragon rider legs for a zombie dragon mounted version.



Wasn't that an immensely high armour class female or was that just the artwork?
Which artwork? I mean this:
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1850313a_99120212005_DreadDragon06_873x627.jpg

[Psychosplodge]

yeah high armour class.
I think I'm thinking of something on a really old WD in the 200 numbers?

[Magpie]

I would have liked to use that Dark Elf rider but I've not been able to find one in a "bits" shop.
I also can't really get my head around riding into battle in a G-string and strapless bikini top.

[eldargal]

Maybe around the 5th or 6th edition army book release then? I'd check but that would mean going downstairs to my WD collection and I'm feeling lazy.

[Mr Mystery]

I would have liked to use that Dark Elf rider but I've not been able to find one in a "bits" shop.
I also can't really get my head around riding into battle in a G-string and strapless bikini top.

Never underestimate the power of distraction in a good punch up....

[Psychosplodge]

http://derpicdn.net/media/W1siZiIsIjIwMTMvMDEvMjkvMDFfNTJfNDFfOTczXzIyNjc0MV 9fVU5PUFRfX3NhZmUucG5nLnBuZyJdXQ/226741__safe_rainbow-dash_tumblr_image-macro_filly_cute_caption_adorable_50e8353ca4c72dbd 2a00111d_artist-sketchyjackie_my-little-filly_lazy.png

[Power Klawz]

I also can't really get my head around riding into battle in a G-string and strapless bikini top.

I think it could only increase my efficacy by producing a terror effect.

I was going to do some totally ironic mansplaining to emphasize my distaste for certain content in this thread, but I just don't have it in me this early in the morning. Need coffee before caustic sarcasm.

What I really REALLY want out of any new Eldar sculpts is to tone down those helmets, I mean damn.

Once you put a lid on conehead syndrome I think a lot of the current aesthetic is actually quite good, just never follow the GW proscribed color palette ever.

It would also be nice to see some helmet-less female eldar heads. A howling banshee exarch with long flowing braids and maybe the psycho-sonic amplifier bits installed in the chest to reveal her snarling visage would be pretty sweet. Helmetless Warlocks and Farseers all around too. And a female autarch doing something dramatic like jumping off a piece of scenery in mid-attack. A bit more dynamism in general for the Eldar line would be great.

A lot of current sculpts suffer greatly from what I call "Come At Me Bro Syndrome." Where they are inexplicably standing with legs and arms splayed, a gun in one hand and some form of beatstick in the other. The Eldar have sort of perfected a subset of this disease with the "Hey What's That Over There?!" pose wherein they are looking off to the left or right and pointing at something in the direction they are looking. Kind of like Kim Jong Un.

[bfmusashi]

I think it could only increase my efficacy by producing a terror effect.

I was going to do some totally ironic mansplaining to emphasize my distaste for certain content in this thread, but I just don't have it in me this early in the morning. Need coffee before caustic sarcasm.

What I really REALLY want out of any new Eldar sculpts is to tone down those helmets, I mean damn.

Once you put a lid on conehead syndrome I think a lot of the current aesthetic is actually quite good, just never follow the GW proscribed color palette ever.

It would also be nice to see some helmet-less female eldar heads. A howling banshee exarch with long flowing braids and maybe the psycho-sonic amplifier bits installed in the chest to reveal her snarling visage would be pretty sweet. Helmetless Warlocks and Farseers all around too. And a female autarch doing something dramatic like jumping off a piece of scenery in mid-attack. A bit more dynamism in general for the Eldar line would be great.

A lot of current sculpts suffer greatly from what I call "Come At Me Bro Syndrome." Where they are inexplicably standing with legs and arms splayed, a gun in one hand and some form of beatstick in the other. The Eldar have sort of perfected a subset of this disease with the "Hey What's That Over There?!" pose wherein they are looking off to the left or right and pointing at something in the direction they are looking. Kind of like Kim Jong Un.
Lies, it's all been down hill since they've reduced the helm silhouette. Taller, grander hats for the Eldar! It prevents helmet hair and Eldar MUST look fabulous at all times. Especially if they get their mohawks back.
I always describe the 2nd ed. pose as them posing for the sculpture while making their warface. They're always holding their weapons up, making an X shape, and growling like everyone wants to be Wolverine.

[magickbk]

I think it could only increase my efficacy by producing a terror effect.

I was going to do some totally ironic mansplaining to emphasize my distaste for certain content in this thread, but I just don't have it in me this early in the morning. Need coffee before caustic sarcasm.

What I really REALLY want out of any new Eldar sculpts is to tone down those helmets, I mean damn.

Once you put a lid on conehead syndrome I think a lot of the current aesthetic is actually quite good, just never follow the GW proscribed color palette ever.

It would also be nice to see some helmet-less female eldar heads. A howling banshee exarch with long flowing braids and maybe the psycho-sonic amplifier bits installed in the chest to reveal her snarling visage would be pretty sweet. Helmetless Warlocks and Farseers all around too. And a female autarch doing something dramatic like jumping off a piece of scenery in mid-attack. A bit more dynamism in general for the Eldar line would be great.

A lot of current sculpts suffer greatly from what I call "Come At Me Bro Syndrome." Where they are inexplicably standing with legs and arms splayed, a gun in one hand and some form of beatstick in the other. The Eldar have sort of perfected a subset of this disease with the "Hey What's That Over There?!" pose wherein they are looking off to the left or right and pointing at something in the direction they are looking. Kind of like Kim Jong Un.

Posing of any figure from the days of metal always was a trade-off of the casting process, and still is even with plastic and finecast to a certain degree. Using the old spin and press molds meant a model had to be as flat as possible, and all the detail has to maintain the same axis. For a one piece model, that is a massive limitation, and is a good reason for the helmets, too, because you can't create a lot of depth on the opposing axis, unless it is where the mold halves meet, and that means you don't get fine detail there like wild hair. To create dynamic posing, you need to split into a lot of pieces, and they should optimally have ball and socket joints. As many of us that have been around a while can attest to, if you split a human-sized figure made of pewter into more than 4 pieces, assembly horrors ensue. Eldar suffer more from "Come at me bro" because many of their models are using older sculpts, from before the computer design process was in use, and the materials were less forgiving. I think it is getting better, and the Riptide is a good test run of what can be done with dynamic poses where there is a standard assembly, and a "clip off the guide pegs for advanced assembly options".

[Power Klawz]

I guess a lot of people are into the current wraithguard and wraithlord models, but man those need to go away forever. Giant bobble headed, skinny legged monstrosities. They should probably have a silhouette more akin to current forgeworld eldar titans. A bit more grace and economy, more human proportions, less random guns sticking off of shoulders and giant heads.

[bfmusashi]

I guess a lot of people are into the current wraithguard and wraithlord models, but man those need to go away forever. Giant bobble headed, skinny legged monstrosities. They should probably have a silhouette more akin to current forgeworld eldar titans. A bit more grace and economy, more human proportions, less random guns sticking off of shoulders and giant heads.

Heresy.

[Power Klawz]

Heresy.

The paths of the Eldar are myriad and eldritch sir.

[bfmusashi]

The paths of the Eldar are myriad and eldritch sir.

I want SD wraith constructs. Like the old Ghost Warrior but with an even bigger head and smaller body. Hear me GW and make it so!

[Kirsten]

I think the wraith stuff should stay as it is style wise. They are dead alien statues, they don't need to be graceful and more human. The shape they are now perfectly highlights the fact that they are not a suit of armour to be worn. making them more like titans would start treading on aspect style toes. leave them as they are, far more alien and weird, we have more than enough humanoid proportioned models.

[Power Klawz]

That's all well and good I suppose, but does not stand up to the fact that they look dumb as hell.

The rule of cool must prevail.

Want to make them look unearthly and inhuman? Here's an idea, create a stylized wraithbone skeletal structure for them, complete with rib-like constructs that allow you to see all the way through their bodies, no one will mistake them for aspect warriors like that!

[Kirsten]

to you they might, that doesn't mean they do to everyone.

[Power Klawz]

They should look like slightly oversized skeletons with swirling runes carved into the bones, like the walking spirit fetish that they are, a living tomb to encapsulate the once burning soul of the long dead.

Not like bobble head robots.

I'd really like them to be a bit creepier. More of a death and mortality motif, they are basically half-living avatars of the doom of their people, their existence is testament to the unavoidable truth that the Eldar are a dying race. They're just way too cutesy to portray that properly as they are now.

[Kyban]

They should look like slightly oversized skeletons with swirling runes carved into the bones, like the walking spirit fetish that they are, a living tomb to encapsulate the once burning soul of the long dead.

Not like bobble head robots.

I'd really like them to be a bit creepier. More of a death and mortality motif, they are basically half-living avatars of the doom of their people, their existence is testament to the unavoidable truth that the Eldar are a dying race. They're just way too cutesy to portray that properly as they are now.

They kind of remind me of Marvin from the Hitchhikers movie...

[bfmusashi]

It used to be so big because that's where the soul stone was. At least if I remember my vehicle damage charts right.

[Power Klawz]

Yeah their heads used to be even bigger back in the day didn't they? Man that's some crazy big head going on right there I tell you what.

I'm thinking of a carved skeletal face with a soulgem in the forehead, some strange fins sticking from the back and a skeletal construct with boney talons for hands. Empty glowing eyes and a deathly silence only broken when their armament rends reality itself in bitter pursuit of vengeance for the sad fate of their race.

[Mysterion]

Any actual "Rumour Titbits" for Eldar lately?

[eldargal]

Yep.


Don't worry, any resemblance to a butt plug is due to my lack of artistic ability, and the fact that if I was to stand around trying to sketch every little detail and cutout of what I see I think someone would take notice :P
The pods on the wings of my drawing are the engines by the way, and yes, this fighter doesn't have a forked nose. Overall, the length of the Hemyock is a little longer than the Wave Serpant chassis, and the cockpit is located in the nose of this particular design.

Oh, and I think you're all expecting the obligatory mega-walker. From the glance I got, it looks like a wraithlord scaled up to twice the height I guess.

[Lost Vyper]

But seriously, any new rumors?

[spaceman91]

But seriously, any new rumors?

dude, chill those beans. It's at least a month before we see the eldar up for pre-order. I shocked we have this much info so early. More will come in time. Once the HE are done and out the way im sure the info will flood in.

[Lost Vyper]

3947 :)

[Moriquendi]

Good grief I cannot wait... I want all eldar vehicles to get the assault drift. THE RETURN OF THE ELDAR POP UP ATTACK. Seriously though, we need our speed back.

[Freakeh]

It's really stupid that eldar don't have a single assault vehicle -.- especially now with the rules stopping you assaulting from the turn you disembark from a vehicle

[Lost Vyper]

It's really stupid that eldar don't have a single assault vehicle -.- especially now with the rules stopping you assaulting from the turn you disembark from a vehicle

This. They gotta do something about it in the new codex. Interesting to see, shall the Banshees come back in (at least in my lists) play?

[Mr Mystery]

See, I've never understood that request. Well. Game wise yes I of course understand it.

But your tanks are rear-loading, which isn't particularly conducive to a frontal assault, as you'd either have to steg it round the hull, or arguably worse, show your thin rear armour to the enemy whilst your dudes pile out.

[eldargal]

It's a super fast anti grav skimmer, the idea that it can't rotate quickly on the spot to let the people inside charge out is a bit silly in my opinion.

[Mr Mystery]

Charge or tumble/fly out?

[eldargal]

Anti-grav!:p No g-forces to make them tumble out.

[Defenestratus]

See, I've never understood that request. Well. Game wise yes I of course understand it.

But your tanks are rear-loading, which isn't particularly conducive to a frontal assault, as you'd either have to steg it round the hull, or arguably worse, show your thin rear armour to the enemy whilst your dudes pile out.

Who says that a new assault vehicle has to be based on the wave serpent/falcon chassis?

[Mr Mystery]

Nobody? Going on the older demands that Eldar should have everything everyone else has, but for half the cost, and with brass knobs on...because they're Eldar :p

Oh, and EG...Antigrav does so have g-forces and that! Unless you have intertial dampening. Which one imagines might make one a bit wibbly when disembarking as the field would surely fluctuate? So tank pulls up, Eldar pile out. Quick vomiting sesh, and then CHAAARGEEE!!!!

[eldargal]

Given how fast the grav tanks can travel (and the fact they have been shown flying through space and whatnot) I think it is safe to assume they have some kind of dampening. It may even be referenced in the Path series but I don't remember.

[Defenestratus]

Nobody? Going on the older demands that Eldar should have everything everyone else has, but for half the cost, and with brass knobs on...because they're Eldar :p

Oh, and EG...Antigrav does so have g-forces and that! Unless you have intertial dampening. Which one imagines might make one a bit wibbly when disembarking as the field would surely fluctuate? So tank pulls up, Eldar pile out. Quick vomiting sesh, and then CHAAARGEEE!!!!

I think you vastly overstate the behavior of Eldar players - the reasonable one anyways.

All we want is a viable way of transporting some of our glass cannon assault troops across the table top so they have a reasonable chance of actually getting into combat before dying in droves.

Whether thats accomplished with an assault transport, or some exarch power that bypasses the "no assaulting out of transports" rule, I care not. All I'd like is to be able to use my banshees again since 6th edition took away that ability for the most part.

Is it "demanding" that I have everything that everyone else has? I don't think it is. I think its a reasonable request.

[eldargal]

Yep, contrary to popular belief Banshees themselves are still a viable unit, there is just no way of delivering them to the enemy reliably. You can get way with it in Cities of Death or heavy terrain boards with lots of LoS blocking bits but the fact is eldar need a transport that is actually worth taking for our assault units.

[Learn2Eel]

I'm excited about their imminent release. It is nice how Games Workshop are updating all the older/more obscure armies lately (though obviously some are still missing out).

Methinks points cost drops won't be enough.
EDIT: Before going on a rant, realized I've already ranted on this discussion and will thus keep my fingers tied up.

[bfmusashi]

Better than just gravity dampening or letting them tumble out they are launched like fighter jets off aircraft carriers. Nothing is more shock and awe than a squad of screaming space elves soaring overhead shouting insults only they understand.

[Power Klawz]

See, I've never understood that request. Well. Game wise yes I of course understand it.

But your tanks are rear-loading, which isn't particularly conducive to a frontal assault, as you'd either have to steg it round the hull, or arguably worse, show your thin rear armour to the enemy whilst your dudes pile out.

I like how the dark eldar vehicles are presented, especially the vipers being used as transports. Just a bunch of crazy elf ninjas hanging off the side and jumping off as it zooms past the enemy.

I'm of the opinion that eldar vehicles need a top down redesign though, they look a bit clunky in my estimation, Tau are much sleeker by virtue of being newer. A bottom hatch for assault deployment while flying over would be ideal, I mean hell all eldar vehicles are skimmers with flight capability (in the fluff at least.)

They likely wouldn't use any sort of short range teleportation device for regular troops for obvious reasons, only the warp spiders are crazy enough to take shortcuts through the warp at risk of becoming an aperitif.

[Mr Mystery]

But what does a Banshee shout? As Bfmusashi says...it's a language you can't understand.

What if it's just MILK WITH TWO WOULD BE LOVELY! that shatter your brain?

[Aldavaer]

if the inertial dampener isn't working properly " I feel sick!"

[eldargal]

But what does a Banshee shout? As Bfmusashi says...it's a language you can't understand.

What if it's just MILK WITH TWO WOULD BE LOVELY! that shatter your brain?

THEY STOLE ALL THE ******* SPACE-CHOCOLATE!

OMIGOSH WHERE ARE ALL THE KITTENS?!

NO MEANS NO!

DOWN WITH PATRIARCHY!
Something along those lines probably.

[Power Klawz]

Whatever the Eldar word for misandry is. Luls

[bfmusashi]

But What Does the Banshee Shout? would be a rad crime drama set on a craftworld. Make it happen Black Library.

[Psychosplodge]

But What Does the Banshee Shout? would be a rad crime drama set on a craftworld. Make it happen Black Library.

Come on if they won't let ADB re-write Romeo and Juliet between navigator houses they won't do this...

[bfmusashi]

Come on if they won't let ADB re-write Romeo and Juliet between navigator houses they won't do this...

God, I want that too.

[Mr Mystery]

Something along those lines probably.

Ha! Tricked you! All those things are internationally woman....and whilst we may not understand the exact words...the gist...and the violently swung, unexpected and highly inventive weapon comes across loud and clear!

[-Tom-]

Going on the older demands that Eldar should have everything everyone else has, but for half the cost, and with brass knobs on...because they're Eldar :p

Well, yeah, according to the fluff they are the most advanced race, therefore one might expect them to have a certain amount more technology than other races... like, if the IoM have wargear for assassins that can disable shields, preventing inv. saves, then the Eldar ought to not only have lots them available but furthermore they should be small enough to be built into their wris****ches. Similarly, you'd think they could manage the technology to be able to get out of a vehicle and assault someone, rather than just standing there getting shot. As an 'endangered species', getting out of a vehicle ready to be shot to bits in the next turn without killing anything seems to be counter productive to survival.

Clearly, the only possible explanation for the behaviour of the Eldar on the 40K battlefield is that really it's all a ploy. They're not really an endangered species at all, having recovered a huge number of their losses since the fall, but all in secret. In fact, behind the lines of the Hive fleet advances, the Tyrannids actually secretly being controlled by the Eldar who then sweep up behind them 'eldar-forming' the planets scoured clean for resettlement. Of course if the IoM realised the true size of the danger they would act and the Eldar wouldn't be able to re-take the galaxy in the relatively bloodless manner they currently are doing, sending out just a tiny fraction of their numbers to die in diversionary battles that reassure the IoM due to how **** the Eldar turn out to be when with all their advanced technology they can't even manage to build a vehicle that you can get out of and hit someone! ;)

[Kirsten]

I do like all this talk of the Isle of Man ruling the galaxy.

Eldar are very advanced, but then they are also very ritualised. they don't necessarily invent/give everyone all the best toys just because they are capable of it, everything has a role.

[bfmusashi]

Well, yeah, according to the fluff they are the most advanced race
No, they aren't and I can't think of a source to collaborate that.

[-Tom-]

No, they aren't and I can't think of a source to collaborate that.

"and they are the most ancient and technologically advanced of all the intelligent races of the Milky Way Galaxy, with the exception of the Old Ones, and their ancient enemies the Necrons. Their armies usually have the advantages of great mobility, potent psychic abilities and technology that is more advanced than that deployed by the human Imperium."

From Warhammer 40k Wiki, which granted may not count as official canon. However, the ;) at the end of my previous post was meant to indicate a certain amount of tongue-in-cheek-ness. :D

[Power Klawz]

Eldar should be extremely effective in narrow applications, fragile, fast and expensive.

Right now they are fragile and expensive, so we're halfway there!

I think we'll see an assault or assault like transport, either through the vehicle itself or special rules for particular squads. After seeing what was done for slaanesh daemons we might see something a bit more unique in the mobility department.

[Kirsten]

two thirds technically :p

[Power Klawz]

well ok, but the applications are a bit too narrow right now. I mean "sitting around and drinking tea while discussing the finer points of eldar literature" is far too specific a field to find use in warfare.

(I kid, they just really need to be caught up to 6th edition thats all. The basic framework on most units is sound. Except hawks... ugh.)

Wait that would be 3/4. I think your counting is off.

Fragile: Ok avatars and wraithlords not withstanding, we can put a checkmark in this box. (even avatars are somewhat weedy for MCs.)

Expensive: Still rocking those 3rd edition price tags. double check

Fast: meeeehhh, The aforementioned lack of assault vehicles and the nerf to fleet kind of puts this column in question. They need to be faster both in flat out speed and in responsiveness.

Effective: This is just a matter of power creep honestly. Look at death company, now back to your striking scorpions. Especially in comparison to units generated at the height of power creep madness (ie: 5th edition) eldar units just don't have that pizzazz. This isn't to say that all aspect warriors need to be sly marbo levels of unmitigated badassery, but they should at least be able to tangle with other lists elite units and emerge on top under some circumstances. They have high initiative which is great, but even when you get to strike first 90% of the time it matters not when you can't kill enough to make a difference. What do they need?

More accuracy, slightly more attacks, "neater" weapons. I think higher weapon skill and/or ballistic skill would be a good place to start. Maybe bump some close combat oriented units up an attack to be more in line with other elite units. (terminators and vets have 2 attacks base, nobz have a lot, genestealers are like woah etc.)

I'm mainly looking at Swooping hawks, howling banshees, striking scorpions and warp spiders. Hawks need something they can actually do (besides glance vehicles to death like beardy gits) banshees need to be able to get into CQC without being vaporized first, Scorpions need to hit a little bit harder and spiders need a little less RNG and a little more oomph. Ap 5 would be awesome really.

[Kirsten]

aah, didn't realise the narrow bit was a feature too, thought you were describing narrow as fast, fragile, and expensive

[Power Klawz]

I'm thinking we might see applications similar to both daemons and tau at work in the new dex. They did some interesting things in those.

For instance, there's a rule that allows firewarriors to fire snap shots after running. If something like that doesn't go into at least a few eldar units I'd consider it a missed opportunity for greatness.

Adding inches to run distance is another convention that could easily mesh with eldar. In fact these two things combined would bring eldar a long ways towards being kings of maneuverability again.

Jump shoot jump needs wider exposure in the eldar list as well. Hawks are a prime candidate for jetpacking and AP3 mid ranged madness. If the imperium can give you ap3 lasguns at 18 inches, I'm pretty sure the eldar can too. They can also plop those on jetpacking frames.

Then just up the range on standard shuriken catapults and give avengers rending on theirs.

Buff autarchs a bit, let them unlock aspects as troops, give farseers more than 1 attack and you're probably well on your way to a revamped eldar list.

[Mr Mystery]

You raise a good point. Army Wide special rule.

Everyone, and I mean, everyone else has one. But what might it be? Once upon a time it was Fleet, then as happened to most from 3rd Ed, that got shared out.

Kind of a tricky one really. Rending? Popular request, but would ramp up the points somewhat, so I don't think it will.

Any ideas folks?

[Power Klawz]

Its going to be something that lets them move around faster. Rending doesn't make a whole hell of a lot of sense as an army wide rule. Its not like Eldar have vorpal claws or whatever. I think rending on a few more eldar weapons would be nice, but not as a defining characteristic of the army.

I will bet imaginary space money that its going to be almost identical to what slaanesh daemons got.

[-Tom-]

You raise a good point. Army Wide special rule.

...

Any ideas folks?

Due to the nature of farseers being able to scry into the future, your opponents must furnish you with their army lists 2 weeks before a battle? :D

[Lost Vyper]

Maybe something around Deny The Witch-boost, 5+ at least on everyone? Fleet or +3" to run would be so mehh...(and get us off board quicker :) )

[Mr Mystery]

Could be they're allowed to assault after running? Which is kind of giving them the old Fleet back, with the extra knobs of a 2D6" assault move?

But yeah. That seems kind of...lame and sucky. Great for Bumshees and Scorpions, absolutely pointless and bobbins for everyone else.

I'm expecting a whole new rule straight out of leftfield. Which unfortunatley isn't great for prognostication!

[Chosen One]

Would like to see rending on Shuriken and the kind of Warpspider weapons. But that would be too hard and/or expensive. Or just Spiders and the Tank (don't remember the name), Avengers and Shurikencanons...

[Mr Mystery]

Would like to see rending on Shuriken and the kind of Warpspider weapons. But that would be too hard and/or expensive. Or just Spiders and the Tank (don't remember the name), Avengers and Shurikencanons...

I can imagine WS getting pinning rather than rending. It's nasty stuff monofilament wire! Dead strong and tangly, and getting it off you is quite literally murder!

[Autarch]

Bring black flamer templates for the warp spiders!

[DrLove42]

I can see a Physic power that gives a unit Intercept.

The Farseers like "BTW guys, a bunch of guys are about to teleport in ...there....in 30 seconds. Get ready to shoot em!"

[Mr Mystery]

I'll be slightly upset if they don't get that. And I don't play Eldar!

Also, hows about giving Aspect Warriors some skills flat out, rather than needing an Exarch. Scorpions are meant to be Stealthy, but apparently, only when Dad's around..... Swooping Hawks apparently need Dad around to figure out leaving their jump/flight packs switched on longer means they go higherer up.....

Make Aspect Warriors betterer, and leave Grauniads a bit sucky, and you have a decent army!

[Defenestratus]

Ignore night fight as a army special rule.

Done.

[kyfer]

But What Does the Banshee Shout? would be a rad crime drama set on a craftworld. Make it happen Black Library.

I can picture it right now. All noire, so it's probably on Ulthwe ;) But yeah with some hotshot/young gun Eldar warlock and being accompanied by a wraithguard, trying to solve the mystery before events escalate beyond control.

I hope BL does, bfmusashi, I really do.

[Mr Mystery]

Ignore night fight as a army special rule.

Done.

Flavoury, but given Eldar aren't especially noted for range, perhaps not really the boost they deserve? I mean, compare to Self Repair, Pain Tokens, Supporting Fire, ATSKNF, Guard ORders etc?

[Aldavaer]

An Eldar army really needs some way to ignore nightfighting.

An interesting thought arising out of the Tau Codex, will the Eldar also get a range increase to 18in on fusion guns, if so does the firepike become 24in range?

Intercept as a psychic power would certainly be fluffy, I recall it is used in path of the Seer to foil an ambush within a battle.

[Mr Mystery]

Intercept.....Warlock or Farseer power?

I'd say Warlock meself, because it's such an obvious 'auto-on' power that it would reduce the flexibility of a Farseer overall.

[-Tom-]

Also, hows about giving Aspect Warriors some skills flat out, rather than needing an Exarch.

Yeah, I've been away from the hobby quite a while, not played many games of 6th Ed so I may be wrong on this but some units seems to be pretty sucky yet with a kick-*** Exarch. The rest of the aspect warriors are more of an Exarch delivery system.

[Gwyidion]

An Eldar army really needs some way to ignore nightfighting.

An interesting thought arising out of the Tau Codex, will the Eldar also get a range increase to 18in on fusion guns, if so does the firepike become 24in range?

Intercept as a psychic power would certainly be fluffy, I recall it is used in path of the Seer to foil an ambush within a battle.

Of all the big problems with eldar, I would rate nightfight being very low on that list.

There's general offensive ability - which is really just 4th edition balancing

There's price vs durability, which limits possible builds

There's over-reliance on single units and single models (which is, again, more edition creep than anything else, but must be fixed)


There's a lot of things wrong with the codex, mostly caused by age. Inability to nullify nightfight - I don't see this as one of the problems.

As far as i'm concerned, since DtW is basically a psychic defense, simply making nearly every freaking infantry unit in the codex a ML1+ psyker would go a long way towards making the eldar unique. Buff Ld, and make RoW primary detachment only, and you have an army which acts differently than all the rest.

Even if every eldar isn't an active psyker, at the very least, warlocks should be ML1.

[Aldavaer]

Of all the big problems with eldar, I would rate nightfight being very low on that list.


I wouldn't class it is as a major issue, but i play a lot of Tau and it gets irritating that they get cheap black sun filters to ignore nightfighting and there is nothing i can do as Eldar but live with it and try and keep out of LOS the first turn.

[Lexington]

Ignore night fight as a army special rule.
From a background perspective, this is a rule that should apply to damn near every army in the game. 'Nightfighting' isn't really something to take into consideration when you're dealing with a universe of warriors in HUD-equipped armor and monster predators who can see in the dark.

[bfmusashi]

From a background perspective, this is a rule that should apply to damn near every army in the game. 'Nightfighting' isn't really something to take into consideration when you're dealing with a universe of warriors in HUD-equipped armor and monster predators who can see in the dark.
Kind of miss the autosenses gear. Made the difference between better equipped armies (Space Marines and Eldar) and the mass production armies (Imperial Guard and Orks). I'd be surprised if there wasn't a biomorph in the next 'nid book for it.

[gresha]

Maybe army wide Eldar nullify Psychic powers on 5+ instead of 6. Fleet will probably be army wide as oppose to only certain units like now.

[Archon Charybdis]

Yeah, Night Fighting just doesn't make any sense fluffwise. The whole point of Dark Eldar having it is they live in a state of perpetual near-darkness. As Gresha and a few others have mentioned, a default 5+ DtW wouldn't be bad to represent their inherently psychic nature, but just as DE have Power from Pain and poison weapons, I think Shuriken weapons could use something to differentiate them from bolters too.

[deaddice]

I personally would like to see the shred rule applied to shuriken weapons.

[Archon Charybdis]

I personally would like to see the shred rule applied to shuriken weapons.

Shred seems appropriate powerwise (Rending would be too much), but I can't help but think in the back of my mind "But then Doom will be useless!" even though we have no reason to expect Doom will even exist in the new book.

[Lost Vyper]

Shred would be cool fluff wise...it would get me to use Shuriken Cannons on (Outflanking) Walkers instantly :)

[bfmusashi]

Yeah, Night Fighting just doesn't make any sense fluffwise. The whole point of Dark Eldar having it is they live in a state of perpetual near-darkness. As Gresha and a few others have mentioned, a default 5+ DtW wouldn't be bad to represent their inherently psychic nature, but just as DE have Power from Pain and poison weapons, I think Shuriken weapons could use something to differentiate them from bolters too.
5+ DtW makes less sense because of their relationship to the warp. The best the could get warp wise is immunity from Perils since they use fuses.

[Archon Charybdis]

5+ DtW makes less sense because of their relationship to the warp. The best the could get warp wise is immunity from Perils since they use fuses.

I'm not sure how you figure that. DtW is based on sheer willpower and psychic strength; Eldar have more innate psychic power than any other race and spend their whole lives following the Path for discipine. I'm not sure I could think of a better mechanic to dovetail with those particular fluff-traits. As far as immunity to Perils, I think if the Ghosthelm continued working as is it would be perfect. Eldar are resistant to Perils, but they're not immune to possession.

[Mr Mystery]

Shred is fair I guess. But when applied to Shuriken Cannon, would it not make scatter lasers redundant?

[Dalleron]

no, that wouldn't make scatter lasers redundant. +1 shot and longer range aren't to shabby in my eyes.

[Archon Charybdis]

no, that wouldn't make scatter lasers redundant. +1 shot and longer range aren't to shabby in my eyes.

Yeah, it might require some repointing of things or the Scatter Laser could get a change to it's own stats, but it's not like there's no way to work it.

[Chosen One]

It was always a problem, that there was so many weapons. It's hard to make them all balanced. After all I think it would be more than good to make all Shurikencatapults 18". Then make Avengers get Rending. I would also like to see them the most flexible Aspect as it should be. I like the Exarch powers, but I would like an additional rule for them to get a second Attack in CC - that wouldn't be that powerful with S3, but would make them more flexible on the board.

And I hope for the flamer template for Warpspiders with new Models :)

[bfmusashi]

I'm not sure how you figure that. DtW is based on sheer willpower and psychic strength; Eldar have more innate psychic power than any other race and spend their whole lives following the Path for discipine. I'm not sure I could think of a better mechanic to dovetail with those particular fluff-traits. As far as immunity to Perils, I think if the Ghosthelm continued working as is it would be perfect. Eldar are resistant to Perils, but they're not immune to possession.
Probably the whole 'can't use the warp without fuses' thing or the not being a psyker when you're off the path of the Seer or how the Dark Eldar have nothing similar in game terms even though they possess a similar prohibition. Also, we just had daemons hit, and as critters composed solely of will they do not get a 5+ DtW. Nor did the Tau and they're warp inert.

[Archon Charybdis]

Probably the whole 'can't use the warp without fuses' thing or the not being a psyker when you're off the path of the Seer or how the Dark Eldar have nothing similar in game terms even though they possess a similar prohibition. Also, we just had daemons hit, and as critters composed solely of will they do not get a 5+ DtW. Nor did the Tau and they're warp inert.

I have no idea what you mean by "fuses". Secondly, Eldar are very much psykers (or at least psychic if you're going to restrict the term to people who manifest powers in battle) even when not on the Path of the Seer--every single piece of their technology revolves around the fact. As to Dark Eldar, that's an absurd objection-- why would you expect them have such a rule? Ignoring the obvious fact that there was no DtW in 5th edition, you're talking about the very defining differences between the two cultures. Eldar = psychic and highly disciplined Dark Eldar = not psychic and unrestrained hedonists.

And as far as Daemons, the metaphysics of 40K and how the warp interacts with reality is murky. You might also wonder how they can suffer Perils of the Warp, yet that can happen as well. Not to just just write it off as a fluff/mechanics disconnect though, there's a number of fluff related reasons I can imagine they don't get any special benefit. Once again, DtW and Adamantium Will talk about psychic ability and strength of mind. The majority of Daemons are not psykers, and I'm not sure that being creatures of raw emotion (which is not the same as will) is the same as having strength of mind. Secondly, being made of warp-stuff wouldn't necessarily make you immune to it's effects anymore than being made of matter would make you immune to getting hit in the head with a rock.

Also Tau are not warp "inert"--they're not blanks. They simply have a low warp presence, which if you take the 40K wiki's word on it means: "This gives them some level of resistance to Warp-based powers affecting the mind, but it offers little, if any, protection against physically-manifested offensive psychic powers"

[bfmusashi]

The runes, they can not use psychic powers without channeling through runes. The runes act as an intermediary, ablative substance used to keep the gribblies out and keep them on task (otherwise they wouldn't need to be in particular shapes). If this has changed in recent years let me know, but this is how it was described in 1st and 2nd and I haven't seen anything indicating this has changed.* The very discipline of the Path keeps them from using Path of the Seer skills in non seer jobs. To imply otherwise negates the entire cultural background of craftworld Eldar. Their entire schtick is pouring almost the entirety of themselves into one discipline at a time. Only Warlocks and Autarchs draw on previous paths as part of their current exploration. There is no reason Eldar should have a 5+DtW due to their lifestyle, in fact their nature makes them MORE susceptible to the warp. All the discipline just keeps them from being sucked into the Slaanesh immediately. Now, you could make an argument that robot zombies made of wraithbone should have a 5+ and you can champion an upgrade to troops but an army wide 5+ DtW is counter to the background and neuters the core tragedy of the Eldar.

*but if you can change a titan from having a crew to just some dude plugged into the head everything's on the table.

[Bigred]

From the little birds in the trees... 5-5-2013

The Dark Reaper Exarch regains a classic weapon option from the days of yore. HINT, HINT - it involves skulls and chain.

Aspect Warriors are moving to plastic using the "combo-unit" dual-build format GW has moved to of late. We'll leave it up to you to guess which aspects could be paired off into combo-kit boxes with differing heads/weapon options.

The new Eldar flyer is quite curved in nature, with sweeping lines all about. A real head turner.

The new Eldar "big kit" is a wraith construct that shares numerous design cues with the current War Walker - but much larger. A virtual beast...

Eldar keep their distance from Tau from an overall design theme. They will be the masters of maneuver and outright speed. Look for multiple options and units types for jetbikes including up-armored and even faster versions. Jetbikes as a family may well become the staple hallmark of the army. They will come in multiple flavors with both anti-personnel and anti-armor types.

FOC wise, look for a whole lot of jumping about of units between the HEAVY SUPPORT, FAST ATTACK, and ELITES slots. There will be difficult player decisions to be made in there.

[DrLove42]

I dislike the sound of nearly all that.

Large wraith yes
Combo aspects - no. Theyre unique! I can see Dragons and Reapers maybe...but nothing else
Jetbikes as our thing? No. Unless the new jetbike model is incredible

[Mr Mystery]

Hmm....

Dark Reapers / Fire Dragons
Swooping Hawks / Bumshees
Striking Scorpions / Warp Spiders.

Rough match up of armour bulk. But I don't buy it. For a start they all got new models last time around, and have been given the Finecast treatment. That's two sets of time and financial investment, albeit the latter would be a lower investment I'd imagine.

Jetbikes desperately need a redo, so I guess we can expect Shining Spears to be plastificated as well. So that's one 'definite' box we can expect.

Big construct thingy? That's two were up to.

We may see Storm Grauniads added to the Defender Grauniads box. That's three.

Flier has apparently already popped up in WD, so that's four.

Also a high expectation for plastification of Wraithguard. They're amongst the oldest existing Eldar models, and too pricey for many collectors. That's five boxes.

I think we can also comfortably predict an AA unit. Tank or Aspect, perhaps something else, but would require a new model entirely by my reckoning. And we're up to 6.

So even if I'm off on the Grauniads bit, 5 plastic boxes for a new release is around about par for the course. So overall, I don't expect to see plastic Aspect Warriors.

Blister/Clampack wise, we've already seen the plastic offering in the shape of the Farseer. I expect a new FC special character, and perhaps one or two other FC offerings in that area.

[gresha]

Hmm....

Dark Reapers / Fire Dragons
Swooping Hawks / Bumshees
Striking Scorpions / Warp Spiders.

Rough match up of armour bulk. But I don't buy it. For a start they all got new models last time around, and have been given the Finecast treatment. That's two sets of time and financial investment, albeit the latter would be a lower investment I'd imagine.

I was thinking those same combinations but I also wasn't sure how well those would fit together.



Jetbikes desperately need a redo, so I guess we can expect Shining Spears to be plastificated as well. So that's one 'definite' box we can expect.


I don't see how we can't get this box of 3 but I have a bad feeling that we're not gonna get them. Nothing more than a gut feeling.




We may see Storm Grauniads added to the Defender Grauniads box. That's three.

I was thinking this but I was also thinking how easy it'll be to make a Guardian/Dire Avenger dual kit. I'm probably wrong (mostly because there is no reason to change the DA models at all) but it was a thought.



Flier has apparently already popped up in WD, so that's four.


Where was I for this? What White Dwarf?

[Cpt Codpiece]

Where was I for this? What White Dwarf?

yeah me too. i aint seen any flyer

[Chosen One]

I don't think GW will redo Guardians or Avengers as long there are so much metal and FC things. Hastings confirmed Jetbikes, Wraithguard, fliers and a big Wraithconstruct plus Characters. The plastic Farseer. I think we could see Fuegan, Jain Zar and Baharroth. Maybe another new SC. And that's it. I would be very disappointed if there are no new Warpspiders, but I think they will stay the same. And I would really like the Xentarchs, but that would be four more blisters. Another reason why it is not realistic that we will see all six Phoenix Lords. Maybe none of them. But I think all these old models could need a new look more like the current design. So I hope for more than four boxes and some Characters...

[Chronowraith]

But I don't buy it. For a start they all got new models last time around, and have been given the Finecast treatment. That's two sets of time and financial investment, albeit the latter would be a lower investment I'd imagine.


Warp Spiders haven't seen an update since 2nd edition. Also, as a matter of trivia, the Aspects have so far been redone with the release of both previous books (not including the original book). It hasn't been every aspect every edition, but every edition at least half the aspects have been resculpted and released.



Flier has apparently already popped up in WD, so that's four.

Where? All I've seen so far was the rather phalic silhouette from Faeit before his website was taken down.



Also a high expectation for plastification of Wraithguard. They're amongst the oldest existing Eldar models, and too pricey for many collectors. That's five boxes.


Personally, the old models are fine. Price usually isn't a factor in GW redoing models.



I think we can also comfortably predict an AA unit. Tank or Aspect, perhaps something else, but would require a new model entirely by my reckoning.

I really hope we don't get a new unit whose only role is anti-air. Our force-org slots are already crammed full of units. There are plenty of other potential alternatives out there for anti-flyer such as swooping hawks being able to attack flyers with grenades, new support platform weapon with skyyfire, and/or letting existing vehicles upgrade to skyfire. Time will tell though.


So even if I'm off on the Grauniads bit, 5 plastic boxes for a new release is around about par for the course. So overall, I don't expect to see plastic Aspect Warriors.

I wouldn't put them completely out of the running. GW has already stated they want to transition everything to plastic and Eldar have more metal/finecast in their line than any other current faction. It's quite plausible that GW will have a larger release for one of their more popular model lines to compensate for the additional metal/finecast models within the range.

[Emerald Rose Widow]

The thing with the dual kits though that you have to remember, when you look at the kit for the Triarch Praetorian and the Lychguard from the Necron line. The only thing that is the same between those two models are the legs, the rest is all different yet that is still a dual kit. They could do the same thing with aspects, make it so that the legs are the same on two kits where it is similar, but dual kit the rest. I could see that working really well, I mean hell they have already done it to some success.

Looking forward to seeing this release though, its been a while since I was super excited about a release.

[eldargal]

I strongly doubt there will be plastic Aspects in this release beyond possibly seeing Shining Spears in with the jetbikes.

Eldar plastic kits ruoured by Hastings:
Wraith Construct
Wraith Guard (with cc options possibly)
Jetbikes (maybe with Shining Spears)
Flyer (maybe dual build)

That is four plastic kits and thre or four plastic kits seems to be the new standard with codex releases. Tau had the riptide, sun shark, pathfinders and hammerhead. CSM had Heldrake, raptors and Slaughterbrute. Daemons had plaguebearers, plague drones, blood throne and herald. Necrons had one or two more I think.

Also giving Dark Reapers exarchs a CC item is nonsensical, there was a reason it was dropped in the first place.

I do not believe these rumours.

[GrauGeist]

Giving the Reaper Exarch an optional scythe blade isn't a problem, tho.

[Cpt Codpiece]

the web of skulls was not just a CCW though, it was also the same as the silent death (now triskele).

but yeah the web of skulls is (and wa at the time) a weird choice for DR, unless there is an autarch/xentarch with one in DR gear :)

[Learn2Eel]

I might be one of few, but I really hope the current Avatar model stays. Sure, it is a bit small compared to most monstrous creatures, but take the wings off of a Daemon Prince and they are a very similar size. I really like it, personally.

[Defenestratus]

I might be one of few, but I really hope the current Avatar model stays. Sure, it is a bit small compared to most monstrous creatures, but take the wings off of a Daemon Prince and they are a very similar size. I really like it, personally.

Another 2nd edition model that I forgot about that needs to die in a fire.

I don't think we'll see plastic aspects either honestly. If we do, then I'm more than happy about the fact that I have all of the current aspect models I'll likely ever need.

[Defenestratus]

Games Workshop - I implore you, please do not make me paint this model.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GTcPKAX4jCE/UYehA89MHOI/AAAAAAAAjkw/BL-CRAgoJiw/w616-h821/IMG_20130506_082334.jpg

[isotope99]

The DR exarch cc weapon could also have some sort of overwatch effect like reducing charge distance, that would give it some purpose for a reaper unit. Not that I can see anyone giving up the heavy weapon if its an either/or choice.

[bfmusashi]

C'mon you know you want a 24" S6 AP5 Assault 3 weapon that behaves like a flamer on overwatch!

[Mr Mystery]

In 3rd Ed, the Exarch weapons were redistributed to better suit the Aspects. Can't remember who got Web of Skulls, but I know it wasn't Reapers.

[Chosen One]

In 3rd Ed, the Exarch weapons were redistributed to better suit the Aspects. Can't remember who got Web of Skulls, but I know it wasn't Reapers.

Swooping Hawk Exarch with that Exarch Power, that gaves him more Attacks, when he hits - nice guy... ;)

[Gwyidion]

Don't buy this latest round of rumors.

First, the previous rumors come from some pretty high-quality sources. They're usually right.

Unless eldar are getting a huge release (which is out of the norm), those rumor-mongers would have to be wrong for these recent rumors to be right.

GW would also be replacing quite a few not-too-outdated kits (most aspect warriors) with new plastic kits.

In order for the high-quality 'mongers to be right, and for these new rumors to be correct, there would have to be - what, 7 plastic kits + characters for the eldar release?

reeks of a kernel of truth (large wraith construct + flyer, which is really just repeating the most obvious additions), and wishlisting (dual kits, return of web of skulls, massive FOC shifting).

Its possibly true, but (IMO) highly unlikely, considering the large # of priors which point in the opposite direction.

[bfmusashi]

Wishlisting would be trying to get the Death Mission power back in the game. Man, I used to have tons of fun with that.

[Mysterion]

Another 2nd edition model that I forgot about that needs to die in a fire.
But the Avatar is immune to flamer and melta:p

Personally I still like the 1994 Avatar sculpt and the fact it was put into finecast may hint it will stay for the time being, not to mention the cool forgeworld one you can get. I agree with most of you in thinking aspects redone again would be silly as all bar Spiders and Spears have been redone multiple times. Some like Scorpions, Banshees and Reapers have had new models every new codex. I suppose some could argue that sets a precedent? But I doubt it will continue.

[Mkvenner]

Don't buy this latest round of rumors.

First, the previous rumors come from some pretty high-quality sources. They're usually right.

Unless eldar are getting a huge release (which is out of the norm), those rumor-mongers would have to be wrong for these recent rumors to be right.

GW would also be replacing quite a few not-too-outdated kits (most aspect warriors) with new plastic kits.

In order for the high-quality 'mongers to be right, and for these new rumors to be correct, there would have to be - what, 7 plastic kits + characters for the eldar release?

reeks of a kernel of truth (large wraith construct + flyer, which is really just repeating the most obvious additions), and wishlisting (dual kits, return of web of skulls, massive FOC shifting).

Its possibly true, but (IMO) highly unlikely, considering the large # of priors which point in the opposite direction.

I'm right there with you. Aside from those new Aspect Warriors being 7 years old now I would have a huge bucket of salt with that last batch of rumors. Not to mention that trying to mix Aspect Warriors in kits is a pretty difficult task. I won't hold my breath.

If anything the Wraith Construct, Wraith Guard, Jetbikes, and Plastic Farseer that was seen will be it for the plastic. Warlocks could appear in the Wraithguard or Jetbike box for Seer Councils. Forces people to buy more or get more plastic Farseers to convert.


That sounds exactly like the GW plan.

Finecast would be a few characters, maybe a redo of a Phoenix Lord or two (wishlisting).

[Defenestratus]

I think that GW wants to move everything to plastic. Even FC is a stop gap measure in the effort to move the entire line to plastic. We WILL see plastic Aspect warriors eventually, and perhaps the warp spiders will get converted (hopefully sharing a box of those "everguard" that were rumored before) - it will just not be immediate likely.

[Dragannia]

Games Workshop - I implore you, please do not make me paint this model.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GTcPKAX4jCE/UYehA89MHOI/AAAAAAAAjkw/BL-CRAgoJiw/w616-h821/IMG_20130506_082334.jpg

What on earth is that? Looks pretty cool though. What were its rules?

[KINGS]

What on earth is that? Looks pretty cool though. What were its rules?
Web of Skulls
In third edition it was a power weapon in close combat. In the shooting phase you kept rolling to hit until you missed (max 4 shots) at some mediocor S and AP. it was best used on the Swooping Hawk exarch who had an exarch power "sustained assault" that allowed you to keep rolling to hit until you missed in combat, and with WS5 and 4 attacks on the charge that took a while... Still S3 though :/

[Dalleron]

I heard a story of a swooping hawk exarch killing Abbadon with the sutstained assault. May or may not have had the web of skulls. For some reason, I see sustained assault coming back in some form. Maybe on Jain Zar, as I believe she had it at some point. And GW has been known to resurrect things from previous edition.

[Learn2Eel]

May have to put my High Elves on hold to get a small Eldar force. May. Well, they are definitely the next 40K army I will do regardless of how their new codex turns out - really, I love Eldar as a race, and always have. If Games Workshop slow up their release list and/or stop flooding it with stuff I want I will be one happy customer. Thankfully, it sounds like what follows after Eldar isn't too much to my interest (Space Marines, Lizardmen, Orks, Skaven, Dark Elves, Imperial Guard, etc) though Tyranids are definitely the odd duck out that I would go for.