"On a 6, I win.", or The problem with ranged D

[Sly]

Yup, and Imperial Knights are a top tournament army right now. That Eldar hard-counter them alone makes them a meta-shifting codex, not to mention all of the other insanity present in the codex.

Without the Wraithknight, I can't see how the new Eldar codex is not the strongest in the game.
The Wraithknight is not only the best unit in the game, but it might be the best unit in the game since 2nd edition. Certainly Heldrakes weren't as nasty, and I don't think that 5th edition Falcons were as nasty.

So, add the best unit in 5 editions, to what is already the best Codex in 7th, and you have a facepalm moment.

[Arkhan Land]

As a person whos played three games this year against opponents with Primarchs as LOWs using ym eldar army, usually it ends with small handful of my units remaining and the primarch about 2-3 wounds to go.
in these situations, I think the wraithknight will fit right in. All of those games were all literally draws except one which I lost by a single maelstrom point. Previously I saw these sort of games as a pretty big ultimate challenge when they happened now If I add a wraithknight to my list ill probably view them as being as difficult as a normal game, just with added "fireworks".

[Da Gargoyle]

I just posted on another board about this and I can't disagree with what has been said about overpowered Eldar. But does it not fall to you guys to come up with solutions. For example I immediately went to the idea of multiple high power units for the non Dar armies. I saw a guy use missile launching units of 3 XV88 suits to ignore cover and re-roll hits. These are as manoeuvrable as jet bikes and a lot less prone to jet bike counter fire. As for 4 WK on the battlefield, I did not know the new rules gave them FNP, they did not have it before. But that said SM can field devastaor squads and las cannon tanks across the battlefield, even Razorbacks. I know razors are ronsons but field 4 of them cheaply + devastators then the threat to the WK can not be removed in one fell swoop. Add to this standard SM squads with grav guns, melta's and plasmas, things get tricky.

What I'm saying is that wraithguard should not have destroyer weapons, agreed. But there are options that are effective. How easy would it be for the WK to hit flyers, like say a squadron of Valkyrie, armed with las cannon? My son built a squadron of Laser tank destroyers, which are D weapons. A couple of Rip Tides are still leathal to WK, especially if they are a part of package.

So here is a challenge. What would you do with your army to kill the list put forward by Learn2Eel:

Farseer on a bike - 115 points
Two 5 man jetbike squadrons - approx 135 points each - (based on old codex - 17 for bike 10 for hvy wpn)
Four WK with Hvy Wraith Cannon - 1180 points (295 each based on what I heard)
giving you 285 points to play with and you are not going to fit Wraithguard and a serpent into that.
Maybe more bikes and say warlocks - you could get 5 bikes & 3 Warlocks on the table for 285. For Eldar this is a dangerous potent army, but very low in numbers. So the challenge is up to you

[Da Gargoyle]

Just out of curiosity, I don't play very many tournaments and the ones I have done are low key local things where they don't do unbound armies, to date at least. In the bigger tournament are unbound lists a part of the deal? Because of course unbound would allow 4 WK where as battle-forged would not.

[daboarder]

Just out of curiosity, I don't play very many tournaments and the ones I have done are low key local things where they don't do unbound armies, to date at least. In the bigger tournament are unbound lists a part of the deal? Because of course unbound would allow 4 WK where as battle-forged would not.

No tournaments do not.

HOWEVER the eldar book contains a formation which allows up to 12 wraithknights. the unlocks for this formation are trivial. Therefore it is relatively simple to include multiple wraithknights in a battleforge list and their movement to LOW is more of a boon to the Eldar HS slot than a restriction upon the wraithknight

There is also another wraith formation along the lines of 3 units of guard/blades (your mix) a lord, spiritseer and a Knight

Both these formations leave ample room for support option given the massively low cost of the units in the eldar book.

[Da Gargoyle]

Somebody out there must really love Eldar

[DarkLink]

I just posted on another board about this and I can't disagree with what has been said about overpowered Eldar. But does it not fall to you guys to come up with solutions. For example I immediately went to the idea of multiple high power units for the non Dar armies.

Do you think tournament players don't already bring the best lists they can? It's not like we've just been messing around and now that Eldar are out, we're all "oh, crap, we should bring our good stuff now".

I saw a guy use missile launching units of 3 XV88 suits to ignore cover and re-roll hits. These are as manoeuvrable as jet bikes and a lot less prone to jet bike counter fire.

Do you mean Broadsides or Crisis Suits? Broadsides are the exact opposite of mobile, and very static. A unit of jetbikes will sit out of their range, then jump up and drown them in shots and kill most of them in one go with no retaliation. Crisis Suits are more mobile, but are still much, much slower than jetbikes, much more expensive, and have much less firepower. The suit commander/markerlights that give them ignores cover and reroll to hit and the like are good, but they're vulnerable to being killed and are expensive.

As for 4 WK on the battlefield, I did not know the new rules gave them FNP, they did not have it before. But that said SM can field devastaor squads and las cannon tanks across the battlefield, even Razorbacks. I know razors are ronsons but field 4 of them cheaply + devastators then the threat to the WK can not be removed in one fell swoop. Add to this standard SM squads with grav guns, melta's and plasmas, things get tricky.

Devestators are pretty crappy. They are not a counter to Wraithknights. Nor are Razorbacks or Predators. No one fields them currently, no one will field them now.

[Charon]

Devestators are pretty crappy. They are not a counter to Wraithknights. Nor are Razorbacks or Predators. No one fields them currently, no one will field them now.

To be fair, SM should be in a good shape as CentStars should be able to get Knights pretty easy. I rather worry for the rest that can#t just wound them on a 3+ with a whole buttload of shots.

[SnakeChisler]

Our area we just don't play ranged D weapons unless its Apoc

You get the odd guy whining on that its in the game but generally if you point him to another D weapon fan they can go duke it out and if he can't find anyone he'll have to not include Super Heavies or Gargants in his list

You make the game you and your opponent want to play within the parameters you both set

[Defenestratus]

Yup, and Imperial Knights are a top tournament army right now. That Eldar hard-counter them alone makes them a meta-shifting codex, not to mention all of the other insanity present in the codex.

Oh... I really hate it for em....