Originally Posted by
Learn2Eel
Why do I keep seeing the argument that "the Wraithknight is not that tough because "x" unit can destroy it in melee"?
It moves 12" and has Battle Focus in the Wraithost formation. Good luck catching it with Assault Terminators.
Another unit I saw mentioned as a counter was a 6-strong squadron of Sydonian Dragoons....they have the mobility but I'll be amazed if they survive the Eldar shooting phase for more than one turn.
"Eldar are weak in melee, get them there." Eldar are the fastest overall army in the game with Dark Eldar perhaps being their only equals, good luck catching them in melee.
"Eldar are fragile." This is true, but they can spam guaranteed Shrouded and get lots of chances to roll up Invisibility for fewer points than most armies. Besides, it only applies to the infantry and the light vehicles; Wraiths and their "tanks" are extremely tough compared to their similarly priced competitors from other codices.
"Their ranged Destroyer weapons are short-ranged." One is 36" mounted on a 12" moving Gargantuan Creature, one is 24" on an immobile Artillery unit, the others are 12" and 8" on a 6" moving infantry unit that can buy a Fast Skimmer as a Dedicated Transport and gains guaranteed 6" Run moves plus the ability to shoot afterwards in the Guardian Host detachment. They also happen to be Battle Brothers with Dark Eldar that have innately Deep Striking transports in the Fast Attack slot as well as Webway Portals on cheap characters.
"Jetbikes are easily countered by massed rate of fire." The problem here is that Scatter Laser Jetbikes can spend an entire game staying out of range of Tau Fire Warriors, you know, the basic Troops choice that has a 30" range gun that almost no other Troops choice has. The Jetbikes have a 12" move to get into firing range with their 36" ranged guns, then can use their Assault phase "Jump" move to move back out of 36" range so even Fire Warriors literally cannot fire at them. "But advancing Fire Warriors can catch them?" If there are enough left to move up....who moves Fire Warriors up again? Don't forget Eldar are now also the most devastating army in the game at sub-18" ranges with their Destroyer weapons and basic Shuriken weapons.
"Jetbikes are easy to counter in general." People forget that the entire reason these are ridiculously good is that they have Objective Secured (Troops choice, people) and are Eldar Jetbikes, meaning they can make 48" objective-grabs in a single turn when necessary. That they are reasonably tough and put out easily the most points efficient long-ranged high-strength shooting in the game from a Troops choice makes them the best unit in that slot in the game. They are so insanely points efficient that spending points to counter them is often an obtuse and ultimately pointless move.
"Eldar have weak anti-air." People keep saying this and I keep scratching my head in disbelief. Swooping Hawks, Dark Reapers and Crimson Hunters annihilate vehicular flyers. Dark Reapers and Crimson Hunters are very good against organic flyers. A Flying Monstrous Creature-spam list like the "Pentyrant" tournament list will find they have nothing left other than the flyers after one or two turns, and even those will eventually be brought down by sheer weight of high strength, long-ranged firepower.
"Eldar flyers will be destroyed by Interceptor shooting." Eldar are the best army in the game at 36"-48" because they have more high-strength shooting and more rate-of-fire with that high-strength shooting than any other army by far; Scatter Laser Jetbikes only exacerbate this issue. If they are really worried about your anti-flyer units (and mind, both Crimson Hunters and Hemlock Wraithfighters are only worried about anti-flyer units that have Interceptor) then they can easily focus fire that offender down, even if it is a Riptide.
"The Wraithknight isn't that hard to kill." It was already one of the most durable units in the game that would usually survive a full round of shooting with one or two wounds left simply because Toughness 8 invalidates most armies' heavy firepower, especially in an edition where competitively most anti-tank units are built to strip hull points efficiently rather than outright destroy things. Add Feel No Pain (5+), It Will Not Die and the closest thing to an immunity to both Poison and Sniper weapons and you have yourself something that is far, far more survivable than that 295 point price tag indicates. And it has two 36" ranged Destroyer weapons and is still very strong in a melee without its melee Destroyer weapon, so you absolutely have to deal with it quickly as otherwise it will tear multiple units apart swiftly.
"Wave Serpents aren't that good anymore." They still are, actually. It is the most durable Dedicated Transport in the game and still has the effective firepower of a fully armed Predator despite the one-use-only profile of the Serpent Shield while also having a very handy twelve-model transport capacity. Wave Serpents are no longer over-powered but those propagating the belief that Eldar players will avoid it because it isn't good are kidding themselves. The only reason Eldar players would skip it is if they are purely taking Jetbikes as their "infantry replacements".
"'X' unit counters 'Y' unit from Eldar." With their new formations and buffs to Runes and Ghosthelms on some of the cheapest psykers in the game, Eldar have the most efficient high-mastery-level psykers in the game. Unlike Necrons, Tau and Tyranids that have all been raised as "effective counter armies based on their firepower", Eldar get monumental defensive and offensive boosts from a wide range of psychic lores - the most ridiculous of which is Invisibility, a power none of those aforementioned three armies can ever benefit from. Don't forget "free" twin-linking from both Guide and Prescience. If you are looking at Eldar units in isolation without considering all the incredible psychic powers they can potentially (likely) get, you are doing your own theory-crafting a disservice. The only armies that can reliably stop them in the Psychic Phase are Grey Knights and Tzeentch Daemons, but you barely see the former competitively and the latter gets obliterated in the match-up in most cases as one of its biggest strengths gets hard-countered by Destroyer weapons. If someone says "Thousand Sons" I will laugh as that army won't survive more than two rounds of shooting with their expensive and surprisingly fragile units, and that is coming from one of the biggest fans and players' of the Rubricae in Australia.
Before someone jumps on me for spreading "doom and gloom" or "not looking at the facts", understand what I am really trying to say.
There ARE counters to the new Eldar. However, most of the "weaknesses to exploit" and suggested counters raised so far are NOT ideal at all.
Of the main tournament armies, they hard-counter Imperial Knights, they out-shoot Decurion Necrons to the point that the latter's insane durability won't matter, they make Pentyrant stars cry because they will still kill them even without their dedicated anti-aircraft units, they can deal with ANY death-star build because they have ranged Destroyer weapons in high numbers, they completely shut down expensive models while having the sheer mass to obliterate hordes, flyer-heavy lists get dismantled by a strong anti-air presence, armies that win on mobility and scoring are outmatched because Eldar are the best by far at that style of play, all on top of having a strong psychic phase.
Is it the strongest army in recent memory? Uncomped, yes, there is no question that this is the case. This is why I am very curious to see how tournaments and competitive groups respond to this codex as, functionally, it is still very strong even if you take out the "cheese".
Again, note that I am talking about this book purely from the perspective of competitive play, where it basically destroys the current meta. Regular games will deal with it as they have any other "over-powered" tournament army; that fact becomes invalid in pick-up games based on respective player skill, army list construction and a friendlier environment.