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  1. #31
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    And yet that 'problem' is self correcting: prices in China are starting to rise as the living situation there does and as the government begins clamping down on unsafe work conditions. So I don't feel it is inevitable that all manufacturing will move overseas simply because of prices. Even now we're at the point where you need sizable production runs for that to be viable. There is always going to be room for more local artisan companies when those companies are focusing on smaller production runs.
    Kabal of Venomed Dreams

  2. #32

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    I feel like this topic's compared apples to oranges. Action figures maybe be cool and all, but they're absolutely no substitute for a designed-for-gaming model, or even a constructed model.

    As a side note, it's worth pointing out that there's very few pictures of action figures in this topic. Most of what's being shown are display figures, which are designed almost exclusively for look and don't touch, so they get more detail. Action figures are designed for play, and are generally much more robust and less detailed. Based on what I've got on my shelves, there really isn't many that are both look great and stand up to gaming.

    There's also the matter of construction and painting, which I'm sure is impossible to deny as a huge part of the hobby to players and collectors alike. Display figures aren't designed for that, and unless you want it to stand horribly out of place in terms of aesthetic, pose and paintjob, you need to put in a far more advanced and difficult job of converting it.

    I think a far more fair comparison would be to sit large GW kits next to mecha model kits, like the Gundam mentioned in the topic or, what I think is even more appropriate, Kotobukiya's Armored Core model kits. They're roughly the same size and perhaps slightly more complex, while offering the same kind of paintablity and durability. Certain Core designs, such as Crest or GA America, even hold enough of a blocky, heavyweight feel to even pass for 40k with minimal conversion.







    Unfortunately many of these kits are discontinued, and as such they're pretty expensive to get a hold of, but even newly released they don't compare too favourably compared to GW. It's a saving in the region of 20% of a similar sized GW kit, and that's assuming no conversion work.

  3. #33

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    Oh boy, those are pretty...
    Read the above in a Tachikoma voice.

  4. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by ShadowcatX View Post
    If my friends wanted to field a zoid as a riptide I'd laugh him out of the room.
    WHAT?!? That's ridiculous, and a really poor attitude. Sure, it's not 100% an "official GW model," but if someone converted one or had something they wanted to use to represent a GW model and it made sense, I'd definitely let them. Maybe it's because I was around back when you didn't have much choice. But heck, the original 40K rulebook had a picture of a "hover-tank" converted from a deodorant stick container (and they brought it back for the Vehicle Design Rules a few years ago). They also had a picture of a G.I. Joe vehicle they'd repainted and positioned to try to hide the more blatant parts of it. GW themselves used to do that stuff and encouraged gamers to convert and have fun with stuff.

    Now, just because the current suits running the place want you to only believe GW exists and no one else out there exists, you want to act like people can't use anything that isn't a GW model? Really?

    If you tried laughing me out of the room, I'd laugh you out of the room in such a manner as to make you feel like the kind of small git who won't let a person field a nicely converted model.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    But that leaves ... Orks swinging in the wind.
    Pft. Real Ork players can make Ork models out of ANYTHING. Seriously, when I take a trip through the toy section of a department store, my mind starts making Ork vehicles out of everything.

    Still, you should obviously convert it, and not just show up somewhere with a fleet of Scooby Doo Mystery Vans as "Ork Trukks." (It's happened.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Denzark View Post
    I don't like the term toy soldiers although GW have started to use it.
    It's not exactly a recent change. Back in 1998, after a nasty house fire, we were having issues with our insurance paying to replace stuff, and I wrote to Andy Chambers asking what he'd classify GW figures as, and he called them toy soldiers and seemed to think that was pretty obvious. (Granted, he later changed his mind to calling them "collectible miniatures" when he found out that insurance companies will depreciate those a lot less than "toy soldiers." Good man!)

  5. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Setzer View Post
    Pft. Real Ork players can make Ork models out of ANYTHING. Seriously, when I take a trip through the toy section of a department store, my mind starts making Ork vehicles out of everything.

    Still, you should obviously convert it, and not just show up somewhere with a fleet of Scooby Doo Mystery Vans as "Ork Trukks." (It's happened.)
    At what point though do you have so much plasticard on the thing that you would have been better off simply twisting together a wire armature and gluing card to it to start with? From my forays into Orks, I found it fairly hard to get a good looking model out of a toy vehicle. Maybe breaking one up for parts (wheels, guns, etc), but that that point, it's likely cheaper to order the needed components from a bits seller.
    Thank you for voxing the Church of Khorne, would you like to donate a skull to the Skull Throne today?

  6. #36

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    Folks, first away, let's run the relevant flags up and salute, shall we? Gee-dubs stuff is INSANELY expensive. And subbed models from other lines are not welcome at Gee-dubs tables.

    There are endless justifications for those two statements. A good many of them have been aired here. I don't care.

    The price of just one of Gee-dubs big models is anywhere from half to two-thirds of our two-weeks food bill. Or half of my (brand new when signed for) truck payment. Or nearly the entirety of our monthly utility bill - and I live in South Texas. Air conditioning is not spared here.

    I am not a good painter. But I am a highly skilled builder, if I say so myself. The last kit-bash I did, the by far kindest reaction I got was 'Looks cool. Why'd you do it?' The concept was a Tau-refurbished Sentinel that I was proposing to use as a stands-for Crisis Suit in a Gue-vasa (human helper) army. The general consensus of the store was that I had to be cheating, that the bigger model base of a Sentinel meant the tip of the fusion blaster mounted in place of the las-cannon was a quarter inch further out than on a real Crisis Suit. I had IG guys that I had built with pulse carbines, and that was cheating too, even when I showed that I was paying for them as Fire Warriors. I went home, shelved everything and won't go back. Maybe in ten years after that store isn't remembered anymore.

    The game is dying because of Gee-dubs greed and the nothing-goes mentality of the rules lawyers. I used to support this game. Now I just bitterly regret all the time, money, and heart I poured into it.

  7. #37

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    Sounds like you were facing a bunch of ijits. I myself have a Gue'vesa army, that used to feature things like Sentinel-Broadsides, Gue'vesa with Pulse weapons and Drone-Controlled Mortar Teams.

    Everyone at my local is cool with them, and it allows me to recycle spare parts, (got 3 Lascannons and 3 Mortars out of a Heavy Weapons box by buying extra bases and building Drones into the weapons to replace Guardsmen.) IMO, and from what they've said, it also adds some cool flavour to the look of the army.

    If you've got people claiming that a half-inch extended weapon is modelling for advantage and cheating, they're not worth playing with IMO. Can't help but imagine them being the type that demand you measure and move each one of a 50-strong Guardsman platoon otherwise you might get an extra half-inch in there on a couple!
    Read the above in a Tachikoma voice.

  8. #38

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    And subbed models from other lines are not welcome at Gee-dubs tables.
    Who cares? As they are down to 1 man stores anyways often with tiny tables for 3 unit promo games you wont play there anyways.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by joosterandom View Post
    I feel like this topic's compared apples to oranges. Action figures maybe be cool and all, but they're absolutely no substitute for a designed-for-gaming model, or even a constructed model.


    Unfortunately many of these kits are discontinued, and as such they're pretty expensive to get a hold of, but even newly released they don't compare too favourably compared to GW. It's a saving in the region of 20% of a similar sized GW kit, and that's assuming no conversion work.

    All those pictures, they're the new Tau suit xv677766?
    I'M RATHER DEFINATELY SURE FEMALE SPACE MARINES DEFINERTLEY DON'T EXIST.

  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Denzark View Post
    All those pictures, they're the new Tau suit xv677766?
    I only posted the Crest/GA America designs, but certain other cores could easily be used as grounds for Tau suits. Take either of the White Glint kits, for example.




    Either of them could easily work as a Riptide with a little converting, and they are in fact newer kits, so you're likely to get them for cheaper than the Riptide itself.

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