Greed Makes Me Sad...

[Chapter Master Jake]

I'm sure it's the most prevalent, recognizable flaw in wargames today, particularly with Games Workshop, and particularly with Warhammer 40,000. If anyone wants a science fiction wargame to play with friends, one has many choices but all are relatively the same, flawed. This flaw is the price.

I realize that as a business, and especially for all the business owners out there, you're in it to make money even if you're passionate about what you're doing. Money's the inevitable evil of the world, I get that. My problem is the level of sheer and entirely conspicuous greed behind the prices of little molded plastic figures.

We live in an age where plastic is about as abundant as salt. As for modeling plastic, I can safely say that it isn't entirely expensive to make depending on the quality of the plastic formula. The technology behind the sculpting and molding process is equally efficient to the abundance of the plastic. It's all designed by hand or by computer program which is then saved and uploaded to the prototype machine which creates the basic copy for approval. Once approved it goes into mass production.

It's a complicated process! I get it! ...BUT after your capital is returned through the new item prices and demand for the models reaches a stable level, there should be a sort of balance between cost and profit. It's clearly a concept that is well beyond the mindset of the Citadel marketing office.

Since they have no inclination to provide a report as to the reasoning behind the obscenely inflated prices for GW WH40K products nor the seemingly gouged pricing increase of popular models, it's clear to me Games Workshop does NOT care about or even respect its customer base. I think the preeminent example of this obscene, disrespectful, greedy mentality is the price of Eldar Dire Avengers.

Those who have played Eldar sure remember the Dire Avengers being boxed in 10 construct-able models at around $37.50 before the current update. Post-update we are now looking at only 5 construct-able models for a staggering $35.00. That's $7.00 per 1.2-inch tall miniature compared to roughly $3.80 per model before. That's just over double the price per model...

As if $37.50 wasn't obscene enough for a box of plastic models, they double the price of the models, reducing the quantity of models available per box... What the eff?

I just can't understand why this is okay. Don't even get me started on the bullying business tactics they've been using the past decade.

The worst part is there's really no affordable sci-fi wargames out there to try and replace WH40K that I know of. DUST Warfare, MERCS, Dropzone Commander, Epic 40K (discontinued), Battletech (random, discontinued), and several others I can't remember off-hand. All are either equally obscenely priced or discontinued.

What's this world coming to when something meant to be an accessible, fun and enjoyable hobby, turns into a rich jerks-only type of thing? It really disgusts me. Something I want to engage in and enjoy is kept out of reach because being a thinking, responsible member of society, I don't want to spend obscene amounts of money on vanity items.

[Bitrider]

What's this world coming to when something meant to be an accessible, fun and enjoyable hobby, turns into a rich jerks-only type of thing? It really disgusts me. Something I want to engage in and enjoy is kept out of reach because being a thinking, responsible member of society, I don't want to spend obscene amounts of money on vanity items.

You make an assumption here that GW wants the game to be "accessible" and not for "..rich..types". Here is a Hobby Center building requirement quote from the GW website:


Hobby Centers - Site Criteria
SITE CRITERIA

Demographic Criteria: At least 500,000 total population within 10 miles with 33,000+ 14- to 24-year-old males. Median household income is at least $50,000.

(link [url]http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?catId=&categoryId=&section=&pIndex=7&a Id=3500005&start=8&multiPageMode=true[/url])

Not sure they really want moderate income players. Just my 2 cents.

[lobster-overlord]

Capitalism != Greed. You mistake greed for trying to turn a genuine profit on a luxury item.

I'm tired of people complaining about prices and inaccessibility of product. GO find a new hobby if it bothers you so much.

John M>

[MrBo]

Hate to say it, but i am sure you would feel differently if it was your IP.

[Cpt Codpiece]

i don't normally complain about GW pricing, its a double edged sword... love the minis and games but pay the price... i dont smoke or drink so i have a little to spare.

but the recent move with the dire avengers is a very big WTF???????
halving the content for a marginal price cut...... WOW! im just gutted i only snagged one box last week, turns out i have a box less than i thought i did from the last eldar launch LOL

but apart from the DA im happy to pay what the minis are priced at (at the moment) even forgeworld (though the marines are a little much £70 per 10 man squad).

[MrBo]

i don't normally complain about GW pricing, its a double edged sword... love the minis and games but pay the price... i dont smoke or drink so i have a little to spare.

but the recent move with the dire avengers is a very big WTF???????
halving the content for a marginal price cut...... WOW! im just gutted i only snagged one box last week, turns out i have a box less than i thought i did from the last eldar launch LOL

but apart from the DA im happy to pay what the minis are priced at (at the moment) even forgeworld (though the marines are a little much £70 per 10 man squad).

Maybe im being mean because i already have all the DA's i need.just sayin'

[TheBitzBarn]

"I realize that as a business, and especially for all the business owners out there, you're in it to make money even if you're passionate about what you're doing. Money's the inevitable evil of the world, I get that. My problem is the level of sheer and entirely conspicuous greed behind the prices of little molded plastic figures."

As a Business Greed is Good. Greed and Demand for money over all things in Life is BAD. Greed to have a better life, better house, spend money on those you love are all good but when you make chasing Capital thing the only purpose of life you are Lost. I have no problem with money . Money is not evil men's Hearts turn it evil. No more than TV or Guns are evil.

[Charistoph]

Money is not evil men's Hearts turn it evil. No more than TV or Guns are evil.

Indeed, the love of money is the root of all evil.

And isn't it greedy to demand a company sell for less, as well?

[StarWarsDoug]

I know its hard to comprehend moves like the dire avengers, but let me break it down a little.

Price for tooling a new 3D multicomponent injection mold ranges from 15k-30k (currency type irrelevant here, for my discussion)
Design cost for a model (man-hours) is highly variable based on the size and level of detail, and experience of the humans doing the design. But lets take the wraithknight. I've heard it took aroubd 4-5 months to design fron concept to ready for mold. And on average 2 people were working on it. Average designer sakary is around 70k annually, so running that math a conservative estimate is around 50k in human design time.

So before we start manufacturing that model has cost 70+k!

Each model will incur 5-10k of marketing effort. That includes initial model building and painting and photography, print and digital, descriptive write ups, etc.

We are up to 80-100k

Now we start selling that model. The manufacturing cost is roughly 40% of the suggested retail. That includes labor and supplies to manufacture. If we sell at 115 we are only making 69 gross.

Cost to ship to destination for sale averages out to around 5% of msrp across all markets so lets say 5. That brings our profit to 64.

Back office overhead is around 20% that includes all the facilities, maintennance, salaries and benefits of everyone not directly tied to sales. So 23 to keep the lights on. Down to 41.

Or it costs 74 per model until design costs are recovered.

Wholesale sales to partners(distributors) is averaged at 40% discount to msrp. So we sell it externally at $69 intrnal sales/ direct sales is 115. 60% of sales are thru partner channels. So we lost 5 for every external sale until we make back the design cost... Thats not good!!! So our direct sales to break even have to be...2400 units roughly...

Thats 2400 sold from website or gw stores at full price. Worldwide its like 300-400 stores i dont recall an exact count, going with the bigger number thats 6 models sold per GW store. And thats highly doable with a popular model. But not everything is. And thats discounting that we take a loss on the other sales until we cover our r&d, so we have made 0...ZERO! As a company at that point.

So if 60% of sales are at 3rd parties. We have to sell another 500 units direct to cover that loss.

This means that wraithknight has to sell almost 7000 units to break even, at which point we make an average 13.6 per unit sold. ( 60/ 40 split, 5 loss on 3 to 41 gain on 2, so 82-15= 68/5= 13.6)

Or about 10% on every pound of revenue. Which is darn near close to GWs EBITDA...

Thats the reality.

[Rennegade]

What I think this leads into, is why the codex's are being pushed out so fast. Slam everything out, stabilize the product, remove 3/4 of design staff. Continue for a long time on the current edition while making small upgrades to each force in the magazine as "chapter approved" to revitalize the earlier armies and coast off into whatever technology this will lead into. Perhaps 3D printing patterns that are sold for a limited number of uses by online stores or like build a bear shops, but for Warhammer armies.