Avatar, Molten body Vs Flamestorm cannon

[Bunny]

This came up in a recent battle, when my opponent fired his Lr Redeemer at my Avatar.

The Avatar's Molten body rule, states that the Avatar is immune to flamers and heavy flamers. This seems simple enough, as they are both specific weapons. But the FAQ makes this rule more vague by stating:

"Q. Is the Avatar immune to wounds caused by incinerators, inferno cannons and inferno pistols?

A. Yes, as they are all either melta or flame weapons under different names."

This implies that the Avatar is immune to any weapon that is described as being a 'flame' type weapon.
We decided as a house rule that the Avatar should be immune to flamestorm cannons.

Does anyone agree with this interpretation or if not, what weapons not listd in the codex or FAQ do you think the avatar is immune from (Warhound Inferno gun for example!).

Cheers.

[Rapture]

I agree. He can't be hurt by heat. That isn't too much to ask for.

[mercer]

I agree and its common sense that the Avatar would be immune to all flame and melta attacks, disregarding name.

[Old_Paladin]

At first, I would have agreed with everyone else.

But then I started looking at it with a different view; namely Vulcan. His special rule makes flamer and melta based weapons twin-linked, but the flamestorm cannons are NOT included in this list.
It would seem a little unfair to enforce not allow it to be a linked flaming weapon; then turn around and say "oh, but its a flaming weapon against my Avatar... so... no damage!"

[Sharp]

Yeah, this is something that would be fine to allow in a friendly game, but in a tournament setting you would have to get a Judge to rule.

Just because, from what you guys have posted, RAW says he takes damage.

[DarkLink]

At first, I would have agreed with everyone else.

But then I started looking at it with a different view; namely Vulcan. His special rule makes flamer and melta based weapons twin-linked, but the flamestorm cannons are NOT included in this list.
It would seem a little unfair to enforce not allow it to be a linked flaming weapon; then turn around and say "oh, but its a flaming weapon against my Avatar... so... no damage!"

The thing is, the Avatar's rule is stated differently than Vulcan's. Vulcans rule says x, y and z weapons get twin linked and master crafted. That's it. So any weapon not on the list is out.

On the other hand, the Avatar's rule says; the Avatar is immune to x, y and z weapons, because they are flame or melta weapons. The rule has an extra statement in it. Because of this, the list isn't definitive, and merely contains examples. The Avatar is immune to all flame or melta weapons as a result.

[sorienor]

While it may both be common sense and RAI for the avatar to be immune to flamestorm cannons, after reading the eldar codex it's obviously not supported by RAW; Both the avatar and vulkan list flamers and heavy flamers specifically. So for now, I'd agree flamestorms can hurt the avatar. Maybe they run a different technology then normal flamers

[Rapture]

The thing is, the Avatar's rule is stated differently than Vulcan's. Vulcans rule says x, y and z weapons get twin linked and master crafted. That's it. So any weapon not on the list is out.

On the other hand, the Avatar's rule says; the Avatar is immune to x, y and z weapons, because they are flame or melta weapons. The rule has an extra statement in it. Because of this, the list isn't definitive, and merely contains examples. The Avatar is immune to all flame or melta weapons as a result.

Exactly. People want Vulkan to be even better but he doesn't have anything written to back it up. The Avatar, however, does.

[Old_Paladin]

I don't have the Eldar codex, so I don't know the exact wording.

So my question is, is it vague (such as "melta and flamer weapons") or more precice (ie, "weapons such as flamer, heavy flamer, melta and mutimelta; to which the FAQ adds inferno weapons and incinerators)?

If it does give a list, one could still argue that the flamestorm is not on the list (just as it's not on Vulcans list).


Though the flamestorm cannon is clearly a form of heavy flamer (ie. it's a Mega heavy-flamer. A mega weapon being an upsized version that imporves both strength and AP by one each; like the mega-bolter).

[DarkLink]

The codex wording isn't vague, but the FAQ is (see OP for the FAQ quote).