The Lost Primarchs; A Speculation.

[Kyban]

if II is 'the lost' and XI is 'the damned': maybe Russ took out II and XI become the Legion of the Damned? A legion whose genetic mutation actually turned them into spectral undead marines maybe?

My impression was that the II is "the lost" and "the forgotten" and it sounds like the entire legion vanished in a suitably mysterious way (not uncommon in the 40k universe). The XI was "the purged" and was wiped out by the wolves for genetic flaws or something similar. I don't really have a whole lot of evidence but that's what I've assumed from everything I've heard about them.

[wittdooley]

They are the lost and the fallen. Not lost and the damned.

There's no reason the legion has to have been psychic. Magnus was not punished for having a legion of psykers. He was punished for disobeying his fathers direct instruction.

I hate to sound like that douchy fluff ****, but nearly all of this stuff is in the books.

[Cpt Codpiece]

They are the lost and the fallen. Not lost and the damned.

There's no reason the legion has to have been psychic. Magnus was not punished for having a legion of psykers. He was punished for disobeying his fathers direct instruction.

I hate to sound like that douchy fluff ****, but nearly all of this stuff is in the books.

the whole lost and damned thing, when i said it earlier it was a throwback to the old chaos book.

but fallen/damned can really be used to fit the legion that was wiped out. fallen via heretic or mutation grounds means they would have been damned by their actions or their genetic instability.

given the exchange between horus and sanguinius in fear to tread, i suspect the fallen/damned were indeed mutants of a more severe level than the initial thousand sons (flesh change not sorcery).

[mjasghar]

OK theres a lot of people talking from a unrealiable memory.
First Heretic: Major expos here. Assuming the gol vorbek really did what they did - One of them damages XIs incubator (htf he could do that beats me, these things survived crashing into adamantium crusted planets) because 'it would solve a lot of heartache' (explicitly for Lorgar) by killing him. This means that XI is more damaged in the warp vortex. There is actually a scream from him i think. So it is likely Chaos entered his incubator while he was in the warp and mutated him.
Lorgar was really upset about this one, maybe because he was there when the Emperor found XI? A distinct probability is XIs legion is also there, and the Emperor decides XI is too mutated to live, maybe he is already affecting his Legion. This would account for calling in the wolves - not all of them, but Russ and a great company probably. With XI dead, he can't voodoo his legion and they get absorbed by Smurfs.
Now I am not convinced with the absorption, btw. There is no hint in Know No Fear (which I haven't finished) of a smurf thinking about how he wasn't a smurf once. But sumrfs have 500 worlds to recruit from and their geneseed seems immune (at least from prime source) to mutation from speeding up.
So there was something very specific and horrific about XI. Probably it was only revealed after a time, not right out - after all, the Emp didnt kill Magnus (granted they'd been chatting for years before meeting) or Sanguinius for their mutations.
I havent started fear to tread, so i can only speculate, but the general feeling on II is sorrow. More liklely that suggests a gradual deterioration and then ? execution when he went of the edge? The sorrow would make sense if he had fought beside his bros for a while. Whereas with XI its a lot more anger at XI himself.

As a side note, the Emp comes to Colchis, a planet of Chaos worshippers, and he doesn't wipe them out and doesn't think of the effects on Lorgar? Wtf? There is no way he could have missed it. Yet with Angron he either nukes the planet for using nueral exciters or leaves it behind.
Now the truth is, the fluff was messed up and the whole secret Colchis stuff came later when it seemed a good idea.And no one thought to reconcile it. I blame Alan Merrett.

[Foxhound2delta]

In regards to opposites and similarities what if one of the missing legions wasn't a physic legion as some may think but the exact opposite and were a legion of blanks? That could be very dangerous.

[wittdooley]

In regards to opposites and similarities what if one of the missing legions wasn't a physic legion as some may think but the exact opposite and were a legion of blanks? That could be very dangerous.

Oh snap. I like that. A lot. That would be a very real problem for the emperor. Big time.

[Psychosplodge]

Were they necessarily psychic though?

How else do you explain unicorn magic?

thank you!
Best thing I've seen on this site =D

It's what the internets for....

Why do all of our threads end up involving ponies?
I blame splodge.

So do I. He is a menace and must be stopped at all costs.

I'm sorry, but it's mostly relevant - as relevant as we get anyway, plus Tizzy loves them really

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Get out.

Nope.


Get out.

[mjasghar]

The gene-seed has a psychic element to it - a link to the Primarch and a way to enable the change. This is often used to explain how sometimes marines can approach silently despite being in power armour - esp Ravenguard and mutation effects like Salamander glowing eyes. Being blanks would not allow that.
Also, chapters use Librarians to purge the psychologicaly unsiutable. HTF the Exorcists and Black Templars do that without Librarians I don't know - maybe they use their serf-Astropaths

[Foxhound2delta]

The gene-seed has a psychic element to it - a link to the Primarch and a way to enable the change. This is often used to explain how sometimes marines can approach silently despite being in power armour - esp Ravenguard and mutation effects like Salamander glowing eyes. Being blanks would not allow that.
Also, chapters use Librarians to purge the psychologicaly unsiutable. HTF the Exorcists and Black Templars do that without Librarians I don't know - maybe they use their serf-Astropaths

I haven't been in this hobby nearly as long as others but I have read my fair share of fluff and I don't ever remember a librarian being present to unlock a marine's gene seed. Plus I feel being silent in armor has nothing to do with psyhic geneseed activation. Maybe the legion of space marines shared the link of being blank with their primarch. Who's to say but I think the idea of a blank legion would be very controversial and could allow for some very interesting story twists. I wouldn't rule this out quite yet.