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Damn those are still horrifying results. Hasn't anyone came up with a productive way to manage civil unrest? The crap they are doing in Ferguson appears to just feed the fire.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfshade
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That is ridiculous! Like a wolf in sheep's clothing!Quote:
Originally Posted by eldargal
That's deliberate though, as people there have said they aren't out of control they know exactly what they are doing and are oging about it in a controlled fashion. The only issue is no one seems to know what they are trying to do beyond terrorise the African American community.
It depends - there are "bean bag guns" which are like super nerf cannons that fire rubber batons or beanbags (and are still potentially lethal), baton rounds for grenade launchers (instead of teargas) and shotguns which are often just lengths of wood, and rubber coated slugs for rifle calibre weapons. Not saying all these are being used but given the police equipped with large amounts of M4's they'd def be using rubber bullets out of them.
Also if you see pics of police with paintball guns they have special rounds that when they break open leak the liquid used in mace and tear gas instead.
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Most officers also don't have their badges on so have zero form of open identification visible.Quote:
it actually is illegal. officers are required to wear their name tags for accountability purposes.
if a cashier can be penalized for being on the clock without a name tag, so can an officer. the biggest ****ed up part about it is that you can’t even report it to their superiors because their superiors probably told them to remove their tags.
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You wonder at what stage this becomes enough of a PR nightmare/horrific example of state brutality that BO decides to intervene?
To be honest, with it being such a mess I wouldn't be surprised if he tried to stay as far from it as he could.
Dear America.
You really need to sort your house out, and pronto. You're meant to be a world leader, not some tinpot police state.
Don't forget we had our rioting that went national because of the killing of one youth in london.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Mystery
Isn't he in his second term? He might wade in...
If he had to worry about re-election he might avoid it. or would that work better the otherway? who knows?
ours definitely wasnt a peaceful protest though was it?
plus what rioting? :D
My thoughts exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfshade
Didn't see this in prior posts:
State Senator tells Govenor 'F*** You' on twitter:
[url]http://www.inquisitr.com/1419224/missouri-senator-drops-f-bomb-on-governor-jay-nixon-over-handling-of-ferguson-riots/[/url]
She was tear gassed while participating in a peaceful protest a few days back and she is not a happy lady.
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He is in his second term so no it wouldn't impact him. Although his party may not want him to get involved.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychosplodge
At this point, Obama is staying out of it because the swivel-eyed loons would accuse him of "stirring up discontent" no matter what he said. This way, they can't make the story about him, and even the (reasonable) right-wing elements are now saying "hmm, maybe giving the police tons and tons of military gear isn't a good idea". I'm hoping that the nation might actually do something useful this time, but I'm not going to bet spending money on it.
I'm not going to risk a wager on anything positive coming out of this debacle either! Whoever thought giving the police military gear was a good idea deserves to wear a dunce cap and set in the corner. That's why we have the national guard and let's not forget the actual armed forces!Quote:
Originally Posted by DWest
But the two are rather different. That was a lawful killing of an armed man in pre-planned police operation. The riots that followed were not really anything to do with that, it was just yobs nicking stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfshade
yeah, absolutely. when Lee Rigby was killed an american friend of mine was saying that the british army needed to be deployed in cities on a permanent basis, and all police armed. because clearly that will stop a nutter running you over and killing you...Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren Richardson
yeah highly suspect. it is absolutely astonishing how badly the police have handled this, you really wouldn't think they could be so stupid. as if they can get away with simply cracking down harder and harder on protesters. they don't like us using riot gear and beating them up, I know, rubber and wooden bullets, more threats, and more arrests, that will stop it...Quote:
Originally Posted by 40kGamer
apparently at one point some journalists were rounded up and put in a pen, then tear gassed.
you know things are getting ridiculous when the national guard are brought in and they might be a better option.
and you can always count on The Onion 'Battleship awkwardly propped up against Ferguson Police Department
[url]http://www.theonion.com/articles/battleship-awkwardly-propped-up-against-ferguson-p,36719/?utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm _campaign=Pic:1:Default[/url]
And the comedy of errors continues.... Seriously, is no one trained to defuse a volatile situation...
"With City on Edge, St. Louis Police Shoot and Kill Another Man"
[url]http://news.yahoo.com/city-edge-st-louis-police-shoot-kill-another-191548306.html[/url]
No you are quite right in that respectQuote:
Originally Posted by Wildeybeast
If we believe the police accounts, he was waving a knife at officers and refused their instructions to drop it. They only shot him when he got dangerously close to them. Some news reports were saying he was screaming 'kill me' at them. The problem is, a lot of people won't believe them given their recent behaviour.Quote:
Originally Posted by 40kGamer
This is another example of the difference in our policing styles. Over here, police are trained to disarm people wielding knives (mostly it consists is hitting them with big sticks) and all wear stab vests. If they felt the need to call armed support, it most likely would have been a taser unit that arrived. If the reports about him shouting 'kill me' are true, they would mostly likely have guessed mental health issues and done their utmost to talk him down. Is this common behaviour for police in America 'shoot first, worry about consequences later' or are they just super on edge at the moment?
They tend not to bother with the sticks now and just tazer knife wielders these days, at least thats what reality tv has taught me.
When you [URL="http://www.miamiherald.com/2014/05/17/4123183/behind-bars-a-brutal-and-unexplained.html"]don't normally have to worry about consequences[/URL] you just shoot first:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wildeybeast
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But nearly two years after Rainey’s death on June 23, 2012, the Miami-Dade medical examiner has yet to complete an autopsy and Miami-Dade police have not charged anyone. The Florida Department of Corrections halted its probe into the matter, saying it could be restarted if the autopsy and police investigation unearth new information.
“They told people that he had a heart attack,’’ said a source close to the prison system with knowledge of the case.
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http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x24...-going-in_news
EDIT:
Rubber bullets:
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Look like tracker balls out of olden days mice. And having had one of those stegged at my head, let me tell you they hurt a lot, let alone when shot out of a gun.
And Wildey, allow me to FTY....
'If they're black, shoot first and worry about the consequence never, and if they're white, shoot a black person and say they did it all allong'
Remember this picture from previous offtopics?
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well today I saw it with this caption! :D
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i love this photo because at first you think that she was going to get married but instead her husband to be left her, or something like that. but actually its quite the opposite. i clicked on the source and it brought me to an article explaining the story behind this photo, and shes not crying, shes hungover. her and her husband went to a football game on their wedding day, and got extremely drunk and partied all night. they took the subway home because they couldn’t drive. so no, its not a sad heartbreaking story, its a crazy joyful one. which in my opinion makes the picture even more amazing
Cool!
oh my god XD
lmfao
Took me a second to what had happened there. Is good yes!
More common than it should be and the justification for using lethal force is vague:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wildeybeast
"Officers have long been trained to shoot to kill because that is the only way they say they can neutralize a threat. The idea of shooting someone in a limb is fiction."
"In all policy everywhere on force in any law enforcement agency in America, the bottom line statement should read: If you feel sufficiently threatened or if lives are threatened and you feel the need that you must use lethal force, then you must take out the suspect."
Firman said shooting to wound is impractical because "the likelihood of success is low." The officer may miss the target, leaving both the police and the public at risk, he said.
Officers are trained to assess the risk before firing, Firman said, but often a situation escalates quickly. A guide from his association on officer-involved shootings states that deadly force is legally justified "to protect the officer or others from what is reasonably believed to be a threat of death or serious bodily harm; and to prevent the escape of a fleeing violent felon who the officer has probable cause to believe will pose a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others."
Full Article:
[url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/19/police-deadly-force_n_5693020.html[/url]
And police are free to bring the hammer down on any group of people the moment them deem it to be a "riot"... another vague definition awaits!
[url]http://news.yahoo.com/can-the-police-really-do-that-105437241.html[/url]
Apparently the 'Land of the free' turns into a 'police state' at the drop of a hat. :(
[url=http://www.denofgeek.com/movies/sin-city/31788/sin-city-2-a-dame-to-kill-for-review]Den of Geek have nice things to say about Sin City 2[/url]
Defo going to see that when it's out.
Won't touch anything Frank Miller is involved with personally, he's an immense misogynist.
Really?
The females seemed quite strong characters in the first film, even if they were a bit scantily clad.
He's obsessed with sex workers, he thinks modern men are terrible because they act like women and modern women are terrible because they act like men and he's just a terrible person in general. He tends to sexualise characters a lot and apparently subjects them to a lot of sexualised violence as well because realism or something.
Ah I see. Yeah some of that could apply.
I had assumed armed police in the Uk had a similar policy, until I asked my father about it (a bobby himself at the time). Apparently they don't shoot to kill or injure, simply to stop the threat. Exactly what that means depends on the situation, most likely a torso shot since it is the easiest part to hit and pretty much everyone stops being threatening when you put a bullet through their torso. This often turns out to be fatal, but they don't deliberately shoot intending to kill someone.Quote:
Originally Posted by 40kGamer
Police have an awful job that puts them in some impossible situations but the training here seems a little quick to justify lethal force. Plus citizens don't share the same blanket protection from prosecution that police have for using lethal force.
I don't know if it has been mentioned here already or not, this thread has moved quickly last few days. but apparently in Germany in 2011, with a population of 81 million people, police fired a grand total of 85 rounds. in America in the same year, 84 rounds were fired by police at a single individual in one incident.
Amazing! The US government (who keeps track of everything including as we now know individuals emails and phone conversations) does not track or report officer involved shootings. This is cause for suspicion in and of itself as it indicates they do not want the public to know these things. Here is an informal compilation from 2011.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten
[url]http://jimfishertruecrime.blogspot.com/2012/01/police-involved-shootings-2011-annual.html[/url]
From the data gathered there were 1146 people shot by police in the US and 607 of them died.
yeah it is quite something. the approach is so different to that of Britain for example. I don't know why it is that guns have such a hold over the imaginations of people in the US. so many other countries get by without shooting random people in the street. and who the hell fires 84 rounds at one person? must be a police issued M60 :rolleyes:
Gun culture and violence both run deep in the US. personally I would be happy if they at least required gun safety training and started screening people who want to buy guns. It is sad that people with mental health issues have no problem getting a gun but face an uphill battle of getting treatment. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten
it is such a bizarre situation. most people in western nations are largely indifferent to firearms. why do the americans go so crazy over them? I don't know what makes otherwise normal, intelligent people foam at the mouth over guns and how amazing they are and how they are going to save everybody, one lethal round at a time. my american friend is a smart, left wing (for an american) guy, yet the fact that a police helicopter was over his town looking for an escaped criminal made him get out his pistol, **** it, and grab several loaded magazines (because obviously nine rounds aren't enough, you need at least thirty to stop a single criminal) and wait up all night in case the guy broke in...
Well this is a loaded topic... :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten
I'll try to frame it with my own experience. I was born and raised in a rural part of the US where guns were imbedded in the culture. So much so that I was given a gun (and taught how to handle it) many years before I could legally drive... Seriously, how many people think it's a good idea to give a 10 year old a rifle? But that's how things were where I came from. Hunting, fishing and raising your own food were the way of life there. Every member of the family and community enforced gun safety and responsibility... and you practiced... a lot. I actually got pretty good at target practice but I was never one to shoot animals. Just didn't have the "killer instinct" or whatever it takes to kill living things.
Now move forward to the present. I haven't touched a gun in 2 decades and have no desire to use one for anything, yet the minute that the government mentions gun control my blood pressure goes through the roof...
Maybe its not wanting the government to take more freedoms away. The majority of the gun rights population does not trust the government.
Maybe its a cultural echo through history from when the country rebelled all those years ago. The War of Independence was covered with patriotic fervor in school so it has to have some impact on one's thinking.
...or maybe after having guns in your life from childhood you develop an irrational attachment to them like Linus and his blanket.
I honestly have no idea exactly why I have such strong feelings about this issue and I would be surprised if most people on either side of the debate truly know why they feel the way they do. I wish that they at least screened people and had mandatory safety training before selling weapons but it seems like that is even too much to ask at the moment.