Corsair Class Titan

[CaptainSinon]

when playing a game of cities of Apocastrike death (yes it is a combination of all three and rocks!) i came up with an idea (actually 2 but my awesome idea for a rhino carrier isnt as fun) When looking at a forgeworld reaver titan i thought - wow thats awesome i love that powerfist - what if it had 2? - and so the idea was born...

The corsair class titan is a design thought to have first been used in the middle of the horus heresy - to directly combat a khornate titan - however its speciality widenened during the horus heresy so that as well as combating titans and large vehicles it could also combat individual enemy infantry targets (primarchs spring to mind) this was achieved by the weight saved on ammunition from the carapace mounted weapon - as well as this the reactor in the Corsair is used to power additional void shields - due to the energy saved from getting rid of high energy weapons and their targetting systems and all this weight loss improves the manouverability of the corsair further so that it can almost match the speed of its eldar counterparts even with the weight additional armour adds.

so thas my idea im currently working on some rules for it but all feedback would be appreciated..

[Denzark]

nice but I seem to remember from somewhere that the Reaver close combat weapons can only hit other super heavy targets due to not being able to stoop - so no primarchs.

[CaptainSinon]

you forget this titan is specifically built for combat and the main reason for the reaver not hitting things on the ground isnt its bulk (which as i mentioned is reduced anyway) but its carapace weapon - which the Corsair lacks

[Xas]

like the idea. I'd use the PFist on my reaver if it at least could hit normal vehicles and monstrous creatures.

the normal PFist is useless because there is allmost zero chance of a titan getting into combat with you AND your TCCW survives till you strike (because all those superheavies that want tog et into combat easily rip off a titanw eapon before you can evens trike :( ).

[CaptainSinon]

heres some rules for it roughly

Corsair Battle Titan - 1700 points
Type:Super Heavy Walker
Structure Points: 6
Stats: Ws - 4 Bs - 3 S - 10 Front - 14 Side - 14 Rear - 12 I - 2 A - 3(5)
Weapons and Equipment: 2 Thunderfists, 6 Void Shields
Special Rules:
Thunderfist: Each Thunderfist adds one to the titans attacks (included in profile) As long as a thunderfist is operational the Titans attacks in close combat are resolved as destroyer hits
Unrelenting: Ignores any drive crew Shaken Results on the damage table
Reactor Meltdown: See Apocalypse Rulebook
Titan Slayer: Preferred Enemy against all Super Heavy Vehicles and Gargantuan Creatures
Reserve Power: The Titan may run 2D6 in the Shooting Phase And Rerolls failed attempts to refresh collapsed void shields
Fleet: See the 40K Rulebook

Options:
Additional Armour: Increase Rear Armour to 13 (+100 points)
Experienced Crew: +1 I +1 A (+100 points)
Experienced Commander: +1 Ws +1 A (+100 points)

[Magos]

That is way to cheap. 1700 Points, ability to reload collapsed void shields...no.

[wittdooley]

Yeah... I guess I just don't see a Titan, regardless of how it was outfitted, being able to deal with a Primarch in close combat. In addition, I don't really see the Mechanicum using the larger titans as close combat machines. Everything I've read about the Titan Legios suggests that they're focused on group combat at, at the very least, medium distance. I doubt the Princeps', who use the titans as extensions of their own body, would be that interested in getting up in the dirty.

Now, maybe the Knights would....

[Forhekset]

I don't care what you do to it a Titan is not able to bend over, otherwise it will fall. It's bad enough that they walk on two legs, but they have extensive actuators and all sorts of stuff to make sure they don't fall down even standing still or when just walking around, especially up steep terrain or giant steps.

I'm not sure any Princeps would be happy just having close combat weapons, as that totally limits what they're capable of engaging, but it could be possible as an extreme measure to outfit them as such to combat a specific foe, as you said, Khornate titans would be a good reason. If they didn't have any guns either that is, which they would :p

But that's just my take from a fluff standpoint, as that's how I almost always view things. If anything it'd look pretty cool and scary :) Giant robot punch ons!

[CaptainSinon]

whoops forgot to mention a little bit more of fluff here...

The corsair Battle titan has seen an increased use of action against tyranid Hive fleet Monstrocities such as the Trygon as its Battlefield role allows it to Directly engage such threats and turn the tide of the battle. As well as this it has seen an increased use against the Orkoid Meance to combat their titans called 'stompas'

also to answer the overpowered bit - meltabombs kill it quite quickly.. and as void shields dont work in close combat it forces the opposite player to fight in a spectacular duel...

[Xas]

I like the idea because its cool but from both a gameplay and fluff-tactics view it is garbage. sorry.

it definatelly is NOT overpowered.

for 2000 that this beast costs you can allmost get a reaver and a warhound (2100pts). you guys know what that means in terms of firepower?

to make it simple: 14 5" Destroyer templates.


your fluff is a bit wrong as well. genreally you want to dump melee units into tough SHOOTY stuff. outfitting a loyalist titan to combat khornate deamonengines is like sending in a space marine to melee a khorne marine: you'll be at a disadvantage from day one.

same deal with tyranid biotitans: you want to shred them to bits before they reach you. and trygons definatelly dont need a titan to stomp them. normal powerfists do the job quite nicely.


the combat role I could see for a melee titan (because I still think the visual is cool!) would be to take down heavy static defenses which could not be broken even by weaponry available to titan legions.

because of the nature of the weaponry involved (speak: hughe guns with hughe range) the titan would need extremely pwoerfull voids to protext him so he can reach the target.

in game terms I'm talking about something along this:
voids: 8
hardened voidshields: the titans reactor's main purpose is to power the extremely advanced void projectors (which allmost rival those of small spacecraft!). the titan's voidshields have an armor value of 14. penetrating hits cause a shield to collapse on a roll of 4+ (ordnance may reroll this, destroyer, AP1 & AP- modify the damage roll as usual), glancing hits need a 6+ to collapse a void. additionally nothing every rolls more than 1d6 for armor penetration or counts the AV as less than 14 (so melta and alike are ignored as well as lance). the titan may roll two dice for every structure point remaining when regenerating shields while he is not using his TCCW (eg: not in combat or fighting smaller modells).

hulking behemoth: the titan can only target other super heavy vehicles/gargantuan creatures with his TCCW in melee. other modells may only be targeted by the TCCW if they are immobilized and/or did not move in their movement phase.

[CaptainSinon]

perhaps - but ilike the idea of 2 titans boxing

[Duke]

Like some people said there are some 'holes,' but all in all I like it when people use their imagination. In my apoc battles this titan would be useless, becuase there aren't enough super-heavies. But if your running against a lot of them then this would be useful.

Duke

[Gotthammer]

Str D only does one wound against gargantuan creatures, so engaging them in HtH is suicide as one lucky roll can knock out half your attacks.

The GC entry states that if they are hit by a weapon that would kill them outright (ie Instant Death, D-Cannons etc) they take D3 wounds instead. The StrD rules entry explicitly states that if the target is immune to instant death (as a GC is), StrD "inflicts one wound as normal".


Those hardened voidd shields look a bit much - either go AV14 or the re-roll or the extra dice, not all. Also less to keep track of. Simply running a normal Reaver with two TCCWs gives you 9 attacks on the charge (TCCWs give +3A), and you can stick twin turbo-lasers on the top.

As mentioned the best thing to deal with Bio-Titans is to shoot them alot from a long way away. Getting close means all their Carnifii and the like can assault you, and any allies can melta-gun you. This is a very bad thing. I've written a longer, more rambling analysis of Titans in assault here (http://collegiatitanica.blogspot.com/2009/07/support-your-local-titan-titans-in.html).

[CaptainSinon]

at the end of the day i play apocalypse games to have fun...