WFB 'Superheavies' (Ogre Howdah)

[eldargal]

So according to reliable rumourmonger 75hastings69 over on Warseer a plastic Ogre Howdah and a bunch of other non-specified 'HUGE' plastic kits (presumably for other armies) are on their way. Personally I love the idea of large, army centrepiece kits coming with 8th edition.

[Aldramelech]

Mmmmm they'll be expensive mind. I'll buy into it if they can be used in normal games.

[eldargal]

Agreed, I would much rather they be an extension of WFB than an extra like Apocalypse, keep the systems arranged differently.

[Faultie]

This could be exciting...bring on the War Wagons!

[CitizenZero]

I hope this is true! After seeing the "Legendary Battles" spread in the new book, I was immediately thinking "Warhammer Apocalypse would be so cool!!!"

Also, for what it's worth the Design Team hinted at this ever so slightly at the Las Vegas GW Meeting.

Also, if GW is listening...my roomate wants a Thunder Lizard. Haha...

[eldargal]

Ok it seems the Dorf zeppelin may be the Dwarfish plastic 'superheavy', a certain rumour monger of uncertain accuracy has claimed it is.

So:

Dwarfs: Zepellin.
Ogre Kingdoms: Howdah
Empire: ?? (War Wagon?)
Beastmen: ??
Bretonnia: ??
Daemons: ??
Dark Elves: ?? (maybe those ships seen inone of the battle images? Neat but not so useful)
High Elves: ?? (obese Everqueen? Maybe not)
Lizardmen: ??
Orcs et Goblins: ??
Skaven: ??
Tomb Kings: ?? (huge Nagash would be nifty)
Vampire Counts: ??
WoC: ??
Wood Elves: ??

[Old_Paladin]

Ok it seems the Dorf zeppelin may be the Dwarfish plastic 'superheavy', a certain rumour monger of uncertain accuracy has claimed it is.

So:

Dwarfs: Zepellin.
Ogre Kingdoms: Howdah
Empire: ?? (War Wagon?)
Beastmen: ??
Bretonnia: ??
Daemons: ??
Dark Elves: ?? (maybe those ships seen inone of the battle images? Neat but not so useful)
High Elves: ?? (obese Everqueen? Maybe not)
Lizardmen: ??
Orcs et Goblins: ??
Skaven: ??
Tomb Kings: ?? (huge Nagash would be nifty)
Vampire Counts: ??
WoC: ??
Wood Elves: ??

Well, Forgeworld makes a chaos WarMammoth; that'd be pretty cool to see in plastic (and already has awesome and suitable rules).

Skaven would likely have a bigger and more dangerous (to friend and foe alike) version of some imperial or dwarven warmachine: like a gyro-warp-copter or mega-warpsteam-tank.

[TheZombieSquig]

I think that TK detest Nagash for trapping them in their eternal war. Maybe their superheavy could be some sort of floating sphinx or a massive skeletal mammoth/sand serpent.

[CitizenZero]

Ok it seems the Dorf zeppelin may be the Dwarfish plastic 'superheavy', a certain rumour monger of uncertain accuracy has claimed it is.

So:

Dwarfs: Zepellin.
Ogre Kingdoms: Howdah
Empire: ?? (War Wagon?)
Beastmen: ??
Bretonnia: ??
Daemons: ??
Dark Elves: ?? (maybe those ships seen inone of the battle images? Neat but not so useful)
High Elves: ?? (obese Everqueen? Maybe not)
Lizardmen: ??
Orcs et Goblins: ??
Skaven: ??
Tomb Kings: ?? (huge Nagash would be nifty)
Vampire Counts: ??
WoC: ??
Wood Elves: ??
Oooh! I want to play!
Here are some of what I would like:
Empire: There is a picture in the book of a gigantic war alter being pulled by hundreds of Flagelants. I want that!
Lizardmen: I already said it, but I want a Thunder Lizard!!! (The fluff doesn't describe it fully, but it sound like a T-Rex kinda)
Orcs: I would like to see a Fantasy Version of a "Stompa" like a giant orcish version of a trojan horse, but that "breathes" fire!
Skaven: As above post, some sort of massive Warpstone powered construct...
Tomb Kings: SPHINX!!!! Just like in Warmaster!
Wood Elves: A giant bush, since they already have trees.

Well, maybe not that last one haha...

[Brass Scorpion]

If there are large kits coming for Chaos I'll start saving some money for them now.

[Faultie]

Lizardmen: I already said it, but I want a Thunder Lizard!!! (The fluff doesn't describe it fully, but it sound like a T-Rex kinda)...Actually, looking at the Warhammer Chronicles 2004 book, I believe the Thunderlizard depiction there was an Ankylosaurus. It had pretty awesome rules too, as I recall.

[Aldramelech]

Dwarf Thunderbarge anyone?

[CitizenZero]

Actually, looking at the Warhammer Chronicles 2004 book, I believe the Thunderlizard depiction there was an Ankylosaurus. It had pretty awesome rules too, as I recall.Thanks, I've never seen that book! I think my roomate would be happy with any giant dinosaur though, he's not picky haha...

[Lucidum]

Beastmen: Chaos Mammoth, or maybe a massive model of a jabberslythe (not sure what base size it's supposed to be)
Brettonia: Uh...I dunno....maybe a huge shrine to the lady of the lake or something, like a mobile church?
Daemons of Chaos: A massive daemonic seige tower or hellcannon-esque thingy
Dark Elves: dunno.
Dwarfs: that zeppellin would be pretty amazing.
The Empire: huge engineer-created seige weapon or somesuch.
High Elves: again, dunno *shrug*
Lizardmen: Thunder Lizard or perhaps a real model of that arcanodon conversion for the engine of the gods in Lustria
Ogre Kingdoms: Sure, let's go with the bandwagon howdah thingy....
Orcs and Goblins: Some kind of "avatar of Gork/Mork" shrine or the like
Skaven: either a truly monstrous and gigantic Clan Moulder creation (like a rat-dragon monster or something :P) or a huge skaven warp-steam tank or other weapon- there was a plot to steal a steam tank in Nuln in one of the Gotrek and Felix books.
Tomb Kings: I'd put my money in for a 28mm-scale version of the warmaster sphinx
Vampire Counts: Giant Zombie dragon perhaps, or an even bigger undead creature
Warriors of Chaos: Mammoth again? *shrugs*
Wood Elves: A gigantic freakin' treeman! OwO

[eldargal]

I think 'giant versions of other things already in the range' would be very dissapointing personally. Of course that means GW would have to get very inventive.

Someone mentioned a WFB squiggoth for OetG, though it was more along the lines of what was feasible than a rumour.
Sphinx for Tomb Kings makes sense, I forgot about that. I'd still like to see a new Nagash kit.:rolleyes:
For DE, perhaps a Witch Elf riding a unicorn. (just joking, really have no idea.)

[Lord Azaghul]

Actually I really don't want to see things like that in the game. So far I'm really liking 8th ed because it more about the army, then it is about running 2 hydras, darkelf, daemon nastiness. I think the new skaven are a VERY BAD example for gw to build off of, too much big destructive crap, that makes them unbreakable, and almost no draw backs.

However if GW places a battle size limit on where these things should be used...then that's a different story. I did notice that there was no point limit on the dwarf zeplin, and in the rules the author pretty much says: 'if you keep taking crap like this and demolishing your opponents no one will want to play you'

Fantasy just became fun again, I don't want the game to go over board too quickly.

[eldargal]

Formosa on Warseer says Dorfs might be getting an Ancestor Cannon, possibly as a superheavy given they have a lot of warmachines already*:

Take this rumour with the normal pinch of salt

long story short, the local GW manager said he has seen the digital images of a new dwarfs warmachine called the ancestor cannon, apparently it is twice the size of the normal dwarf cannon, he is fairly reliable when it comes to this sort of thing (he told about the tervigon before the nid dex was out)

*Other peoples speculation. Why am I looking on Warseer at half past three in the morning?

[Aldramelech]

Formosa on Warseer says Dorfs might be getting an Ancestor Cannon, possibly as a superheavy given they have a lot of warmachines already*:


*Other peoples speculation. Why am I looking on Warseer at half past three in the morning?

Because you like to poison your dates? :D

[eldargal]

I don't poison them.:rolleyes: I didn't get the nickname 'Manbreaker' through poisoning.

So, big Dorf cannon. Boom and such.



Because you like to poison your dates? :D

[DarkAngelHopeful]

I was actually thinking about this subject as I was walking around base today. I thought maybe they would make a large ballista style bolt thrower for High Elves. Just a thought.

[Old_Paladin]

Formosa on Warseer says Dorfs might be getting an Ancestor Cannon, possibly as a superheavy given they have a lot of warmachines already.

The ancestor cannon is mentioned in the art piece "Battle of a thousand pillars" in the new rulebook.

Looking through that art collection, it makes me wonder what other things are in there (if this is another of GW's trends of putting in sneek-peeks of models/idea's/images of upcoming releases).


There's the Empires "boats on stilts" and floating mage-towers

The Dwarves thunderbarge has both art, rules and a (scratchbuilt?) model; but there's also the ancestor cannon and the "Iron Automatia."

For Chaos, there's the floating fortresses (which looks like a giant ring of fire-breathing skulls, with a small tower ontop).

For Tomb Kings, we see several different kinds of Bone Giants, Skeleton Mammoths with howdah, and a huge "scorpion daemon thing"

Orc art shows Giants with rok lobbaz build onto them.

[rbryce]

i believe the empire boat on stilts is a reference to an old terrain piece that proved to be a fan favorite.

[Akimbo Lizard]

\skaven are a VERY BAD example for gw to build off of, too much big destructive crap, that makes them unbreakable, and almost no draw backs.



Woah, woah, woah! I have the Army Book in my hand right now and practically everything has the opportunity to 'asplode it's self! Then again, they are dirt cheap =/

[carrotcolossus]

Considering that Apocalypse has been out since 2007 and they have only released 3 superheavy kits (Baneblade, Stormlord and Stompa) and two Apocalypse-style kits (Valkyrie and Trygon), I wouldn't be rushing to predict superheavies for every army in WHB. I would be surprised if they released even one kit for WHB.

40k gels much better with the idea of the Apocalypse scale, as a galaxy of billions and incredilbly destructive technology fits with the fluff and the rules work much better at that scale. I just don't see Legendary Battles every attracting as much attention.

[wittdooley]

40k gels much better with the idea of the Apocalypse scale, as a galaxy of billions and incredilbly destructive technology fits with the fluff and the rules work much better at that scale. I just don't see Legendary Battles every attracting as much attention.

I couldn't disagree with this statement more. I think the fantasy universe works a lot better for an "apocalypse" scale battle than 40k does. The notion of massive hordes of O&Gs lining up across from ranks upon ranks of Empire soliders seems like the perfect with, with each army having a single, massive unit to strike fear in their enemies.

I think the new tweaks to the 8E rules actually support it even more also.

[carrotcolossus]

I couldn't disagree with this statement more. I think the fantasy universe works a lot better for an "apocalypse" scale battle than 40k does. The notion of massive hordes of O&Gs lining up across from ranks upon ranks of Empire soliders seems like the perfect with, with each army having a single, massive unit to strike fear in their enemies.

I think the new tweaks to the 8E rules actually support it even more also.

I don't disagree that I can't be done at all or even that it can't be awesome - I would like to work towards a Legendary Battles-sized VC army. Having said that, 40k has Warlord titans, vortex missiles, superheavy tank regiments and billions of armed men to fight. O&Gs can have a horizon's worth of guys to fight; Orks can have that and more on thousands of planets all at once. When it comes to overwhelming scale, 40k has it in spades.

Also in terms of playing on a massive board, 40k makes it much easier. Much more dynamic movement, deep striking troops, infantry and transports (esp. the increase of flyers) make the logistics of a dynamic, flowing battleground much more possible. WHB, though I love it (in some ways more than 40k), cannot offer such a dynamic battleground. You still end up lining up against other units on the battlefield.

Having said that, sieges in WHB just kick arse and 40k has no real comparison to it.

[DarkAngelHopeful]

Having said that, sieges in WHB just kick arse and 40k has no real comparison to it.

I've never played WHB seige battles, but 40K Planet Strike battles are some of my favorite kind. They are siege'esque.

[Old_Paladin]

I don't disagree that I can't be done at all or even that it can't be awesome - I would like to work towards a Legendary Battles-sized VC army. Having said that, 40k has Warlord titans, vortex missiles, superheavy tank regiments and billions of armed men to fight. O&Gs can have a horizon's worth of guys to fight; Orks can have that and more on thousands of planets all at once. When it comes to overwhelming scale, 40k has it in spades.

Also in terms of playing on a massive board, 40k makes it much easier. Much more dynamic movement, deep striking troops, infantry and transports (esp. the increase of flyers) make the logistics of a dynamic, flowing battleground much more possible. WHB, though I love it (in some ways more than 40k), cannot offer such a dynamic battleground. You still end up lining up against other units on the battlefield.

I'm going to have to argee with Wittdooley on this; the imagery for Fantasy really supports truly massive battles.

40K is on a galatic scale; but when you break it down, we still play it as a single battle in a single war zone on a single world. There might be numberless amounts of Orks in the galaxy from a thousand planets, but their still spread over tens of thousands of worlds; and that's not how we play the game.
For every image of a 40K battlefield that has a titan and a flight of thunderawks, I can think of a fantasy image that shows a dozen giants and a dozen wyverns fighting a couple of elven dragons, a half dozen griffons and dozens of giant eagles.

As for the ability to move around; 8th ed has really changed this. I'd say that fantasy can be just as fluid in movement as 40K. A lot of armies can take fliers or cav. to move quickly around the field. Others have magic to do extra movement. Armies like dwarves, skaven, tomb kings and chaos have units/abilities to do things similar to 'deep strike and outflank.'
Anyone that plays 'line up and charge' in fantasy now, is going to be shocked when they get totally out-manouvered nearly each and every time (even if it might take awhile for people to accually learn/get used to, the new movement abilities). Even a smart dwarf player is going to be shockingly manouverable (with an anvil, miners and gyrocopters; plus an average charge distance of 9-11 inches for your infantry).

[Brother Sutek]

My 2 cents on TK's would be that they mentioned in the BRB that they sailed the desert on ships that floated above the dunes. That would be great! As for Nagash... yeah TK hate him, the VC might be a bit more excited to have him. For Skaven I'm thinking it would be Abomination time.

[Kieranator K82]

Would you kindly turn to page 445 of the BRB? Now that you've done that, focus your attention on the middle image. Depicted here is an Orc siege against a walled Empire town/city. Towards the right, a large structure is visible. A structure with a large mallet for a right arm and a battering ram for the left. It has a head, and feet. Orc Stompaz!

[rbryce]

from what you are describing, its the orc siege device from the issue of WD that had the rules for legendary battles in it. it was used in the Bat Rep, and has rules(iirc). yeah, its a wooden stompa though;)

[Render Noir]

The makers of Chronopia attempted to release a Warmaster style game. The miniatures never came out, but the concept photos were great. Most would easily transfer to the idea of WFB "Titans"

Elves - a 12" tall elemental
Tomb Kings - Cleopatra Death Barge troop transport of doom
Lizardmen - giant turtle siege weapon, a battering ram head with a shell to protect troops
Chaos Demons - this weird war altar being pushed by a dozen Bloodletter look alikes

[carrotcolossus]

I'm going to have to argee with Wittdooley on this; the imagery for Fantasy really supports truly massive battles.

40K is on a galatic scale; but when you break it down, we still play it as a single battle in a single war zone on a single world. There might be numberless amounts of Orks in the galaxy from a thousand planets, but their still spread over tens of thousands of worlds; and that's not how we play the game.
For every image of a 40K battlefield that has a titan and a flight of thunderawks, I can think of a fantasy image that shows a dozen giants and a dozen wyverns fighting a couple of elven dragons, a half dozen griffons and dozens of giant eagles.

As for the ability to move around; 8th ed has really changed this. I'd say that fantasy can be just as fluid in movement as 40K. A lot of armies can take fliers or cav. to move quickly around the field. Others have magic to do extra movement. Armies like dwarves, skaven, tomb kings and chaos have units/abilities to do things similar to 'deep strike and outflank.'
Anyone that plays 'line up and charge' in fantasy now, is going to be shocked when they get totally out-manouvered nearly each and every time (even if it might take awhile for people to accually learn/get used to, the new movement abilities). Even a smart dwarf player is going to be shockingly manouverable (with an anvil, miners and gyrocopters; plus an average charge distance of 9-11 inches for your infantry).

If the biggest that Warhammer can muster is a Dragon or Wyverns, then the comparison between WHB and 40k cannot be starker. Having played numerous Apocalypse games, if you do it right, then the amount of devastation that can be leveled in a single turn of shooting is mind-boggling. It isn't hard to wipe out a whole army's worth of Marines in a single phase of shooting in Apocalypse with planetary bombardments, Baneblades and Vortex missiles. Legendary Battles would be cool but not that cool.

Having said that, it would be nifty if they released a book similar to Apocalypse that details high-level magic rituals and loads of other totally crazy stuff that just cannot for balance's sake be put in WHB.

[Old_Paladin]

If the biggest that Warhammer can muster is a Dragon or Wyverns, then the comparison between WHB and 40k cannot be starker. Having played numerous Apocalypse games, if you do it right, then the amount of devastation that can be leveled in a single turn of shooting is mind-boggling. It isn't hard to wipe out a whole army's worth of Marines in a single phase of shooting in Apocalypse with planetary bombardments, Baneblades and Vortex missiles. Legendary Battles would be cool but not that cool.

Yeah... it sounds totally fun to spend over an hour placing hundreds of guys just to spend another 30 minutes taking them off the board without them having done anything :rolleyes: (I can see why apoc is as 'popular' now as it ever was.)

And we're not just talking about a dragon or a wyvern or a giant; we'd be talking about a dozen of these monsters on each side. Also, we're not just talking about the normal GW sized models, there's also the much larger sized forgeworld monsters; elder dragons, huge-sized giants, named greater daemons, war mammoths (things which are just as large, or even larger, then a warhound or baneblade).

[Brass Scorpion]

it sounds totally fun to spend over an hour placing hundreds of guys just to spend another 30 minutes taking them off the board without them having done anything Fantasy Battle is like that a lot of the time in "normal" games for those of us who play armies with little or no shooting. It's one reason why I've spent a lot less time on WFB than 40K. As for Apocalypse, I like it regardless of how fast the models get killed, it's just cool playing with so much massive stuff.

Personally, I'd like to see some large monster kits for WFB, but then the hobby part of the hobby is the main part of the hobby to me.

[Beta_Ray_Bill]

How about this for the rats:

Some form of effigy of the horned rat, pushed in by slaves. Similar in form and function of the bell/furnace, but it eats the slaves pushing it each turn?

I remember reading in the fluff that the seer lords summoned the great horned rat, and it's arm popped out of the warp(presuming that's where it hangs out), and snatched up a bunch of rats and ate them. They did sacrifice 169 slaves just to get it to show up though, so that would push your model count up, but that's what GW wants, right?

So it pumps out magic, eats slaves, and when there are no more slaves, it "shuts down" so to speak. Large pluses and minuses, which fits the army.

Sorry for the wishlisting nature of this post, but there are already tanks and the HPA is pretty much as far as moulder can go. Just trying to think out of the box a bit!

[Old_Paladin]

You know, with the newest orc and goblin rumor, I wonder if we haven't just overblown the scope.

Maybe most armies are just going to get some larger, powerful special/rare choices.
Goblins are getting a collosial spider.

Ogres might be getting a mastadon (but it might just have a driver on its neck and a platform with two leadbelchers and a half-dozen gnoblar loaders), or similar extra-sized verson of the scrap-launcher.
The dwarves have rules for the thunderbarge, but it's not really 'over-the-top' powerful; and a 'iron atominton' would also fit the scale and power-level.

Maybe, each army will get a new 'stegadon-like' addition where needed.

[Beta_Ray_Bill]

You know, with the newest orc and goblin rumor, I wonder if we haven't just overblown the scope.
...
Maybe most armies are just going to get some larger, powerful special/rare choices.
Goblins are getting a collosial spider.
...

Maybe, each army will get a new 'stegadon-like' addition where needed.

My friend (who plays greenskins) and I were just saying that last night. Armies that lack the "something big and scary" just might get one where they need it.

He played against another friend's lizardmen, and brought his stegadon; which, if they had time to finish the game, would have massacred the warboss general.

Afterwards we basically discussed that O+G, OK and Beasties lack that big monster. They fill a few important roles and those armies that lack them really miss out. The Greenskins
player was disappointed that the largest thing(model wise) he could bring was his chariot.

To make a long story short(too late), good point.