Leave my gamer group?

[Schnitzel]

So here I've only been a member of my gaming group, or league as you have it, for a short time. There are some great guys in there that are fun to chat and play with, but there are also some nasty WAAC types. Sure they come off moderately polite, but then they'll rule lawyer and manipulate every last thing they can to secure a victory. They'll also nag and groan a lot and it comes off as extremely petty.

Well, it was only a matter of time before I came to conflict with them. What over? The BA Vindicator. I believe, as it was enforced by the local GW I play at sometimes, that it is supposed to be a large blast template. The group however, the WAAC players particularly, side on the RAW and it being a direct shot. This irritates me greatly as the majority of the WAACs are gunline and horde players. No duh they're going to side on it being a direct blast, a fast tank with S10 Large Blast scares the crap out of 'em.

In the end, the debate thread of our groups forum got locked with them ruling BA Vindicator as being RAW. If I want to play with the group, I have to play with the tank being a direct shot. I can still play with it as RAI with a willing opponent, but then it's a "house rules game" and is "unofficial".

Is it wrong of me to leave the group because of individuals like these? Am I being the lame who could be interpreted as a WAAC? Or is it a case of WAAC gunline/horde players being bullies? Never the less, I'm highly considering taking all my gaming to the local GW despite a 20 minute longer drive. Thoughts?

[Lerra]

Bummer.

Who cares if the group calls it an unofficial game, though? I doubt anyone is keeping score. If it's a real game to you and your opponent, that's all that matters. Play with the good opponents, avoid the bad opponents. Every group has their great guys and their bad apples. Even if it's mostly bad apples, there should be a few players there who are closer to your own philosophy of the game. You could keep in contact with those players and schedule games at the local store, or just swing by the store and leave if your preferred opponents aren't there.

You don't need to game at one location at the exclusion of all others. You could always flip between the two locations.

It seems very reasonable to me to say "I'm sure the BA vindicator will be FAQ'd to be a large blast at some point, and I'd like to practice the list with the regular large-blast shot. What's the point of practicing with a direct fire vindicator that will be removed from the game soon?". Most players should be able to accept that, especially if you spell it out before the game starts. You could also point out to the WAAC players that they will have to learn to deal with the fast large-blast vindicator at some point. Now is as good of a time to start learning as any.

[AdamHarry]

Without getting into that debate about the BA thing, i will say that you should play where you feel most comfortable. It is a game afterall, and that should go double for a friendly PUG. You're not playing for anything, you're just playing to play.

Now if you're looking for a WAAC game or tourney prep, then they sound like a group that caters to that mentality...but you can also play competativly without being douchey...so again, play where you feel most comfortable.

[Schnitzel]

Who cares if the group calls it an unofficial game, though? I doubt anyone is keeping score.

I particularly don't care if it's an unofficial game or not, but I worry I might not be able to find a game that be the case as every one is caught up in their league standings. It's more or less a never ending tourney, with the occasional "unofficial" game consisting of "hey man, i want to test my tourney list for *insert store name* next weekend.

There are a few gamers I really like, and the WAAC guys are cool outside of gaming, but I absolutely can't stand them as gamers.

I'll probably just spend more time at the GW store. The employees there seem to be pretty cool as does the regular gamers that play there. And on the upside, I can paint there. :D

[DarkLink]

So here I've only been a member of my gaming group, or league as you have it, for a short time. There are some great guys in there that are fun to chat and play with, but there are also some nasty WAAC types. Sure they come off moderately polite, but then they'll rule lawyer and manipulate every last thing they can to secure a victory. They'll also nag and groan a lot and it comes off as extremely petty.

Well, it was only a matter of time before I came to conflict with them. What over? The BA Vindicator. I believe, as it was enforced by the local GW I play at sometimes, that it is supposed to be a large blast template. The group however, the WAAC players particularly, side on the RAW and it being a direct shot. This irritates me greatly as the majority of the WAACs are gunline and horde players. No duh they're going to side on it being a direct blast, a fast tank with S10 Large Blast scares the crap out of 'em.

In the end, the debate thread of our groups forum got locked with them ruling BA Vindicator as being RAW. If I want to play with the group, I have to play with the tank being a direct shot. I can still play with it as RAI with a willing opponent, but then it's a "house rules game" and is "unofficial".

Is it wrong of me to leave the group because of individuals like these? Am I being the lame who could be interpreted as a WAAC? Or is it a case of WAAC gunline/horde players being bullies? Never the less, I'm highly considering taking all my gaming to the local GW despite a 20 minute longer drive. Thoughts?

It all depends on how much fun you're having. If you can't have fun with those... individuals in question, don't play with them. If they infect the others and you find you can't have fun with anyone there, then don't show up.

Regardless, go ahead and try out the local GW store, just to try it out. If everyone there is way cooler, then it may be worth switching over permanently.

You have every right to choose who you play. No one has the right to force you to play when you don't want to.

[ColCorbane]

Personally, I just wouldn't play them. If you have to, the don't use the vindicator, use a different list and gentle remind them that you can't wait for the FAQ to come out as you've got three of them on your painting station.

Above all, it's supposed to be a hobby you enjoy, so play wherever and with whoever are fun!

[BuFFo]

By and by, I find that so called' gaming groups' to be a pox on our hobby. It is exclusion to the max.

The best kind of gaming system that is friendly to everyone is just a simple store and everyone just pays each other whenever. The second 10 people make group, THEIR house rulings take over, and becomes exclusive to others who wish to 'join'.

Now there are exceptions, but this is the general find I come across when seeing exclusive gaming groups.

Pretty sad that your gaming group is full of ego-tools. Try another location if you can, and find new people to play with.

[Fizyx]

In the end, the debate thread of our groups forum got locked with them ruling BA Vindicator as being RAW. If I want to play with the group, I have to play with the tank being a direct shot. I can still play with it as RAI with a willing opponent, but then it's a "house rules game" and is "unofficial".


So they just completely ignore the line on page 58 of the BRB that states, "Unless their profile states otherwise, all ordnance weapons use the large blast template."

Like others have said, play where you feel like you're having fun, but man I'd hate to see a good group go sour because of a stupid rules argument.

[Paul]

So they just completely ignore the line on page 58 of the BRB that states, "Unless their profile states otherwise, all ordnance weapons use the large blast template."

Like others have said, play where you feel like you're having fun, but man I'd hate to see a good group go sour because of a stupid rules argument.

We've been through this before; that's not what the line states at all.

In either case, I'd just go where you have fun. "leaving" the "group" means going somewhere else. It doesn't mean paperwork, or heartache, or moving away. It just means driving that extra 1/3 of an hour so you can have a blast.

[DarkLink]

So they just completely ignore the line on page 58 of the BRB that states, "Unless their profile states otherwise, all ordnance weapons use the large blast template."

Like others have said, play where you feel like you're having fun, but man I'd hate to see a good group go sour because of a stupid rules argument.

Yeah... um... it says "all ordnance BLAST weapons use the large blast template."

There's a difference between ordnance and ordnance BLAST.

So, yes, by RAW BA vindicators are ordnance. Not ordnance blast. Just ordnance.

[BuFFo]

So they just completely ignore the line on page 58 of the BRB that states, "Unless their profile states otherwise, all ordnance weapons use the large blast template."

Like others have said, play where you feel like you're having fun, but man I'd hate to see a good group go sour because of a stupid rules argument.

I know it is hard to quote entire rules, but next time, please don't twist wording like this to suit your need, especially when it is so easy to counter by other people just reading the rule.

[Melissia]

Stop insulting the WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Auxiliary_Corps_(Britain)). Also, stop insulting the other WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Corps).

I friggin' hate it when people use that acronym for an insult.

mutter stupid disrespectful people mutter

[Lerra]

It just means driving that extra 1/3 of an hour so you can have a blast.

Pun intended? :p

[Schnitzel]

Stop insulting the WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Auxiliary_Corps_(Britain)). Also, stop insulting the other WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Corps).

I friggin' hate it when people use that acronym for an insult.

mutter stupid disrespectful people mutter

There's a difference between WAAC and Competitive. A normal comp player is not going to twist rules and lawyer every little thing to save one miniscule guardsman, a WAAC player will. By all means, WAAC carries a negative connotation in itself. They acronym shows thats its a negative thing, think about it... Win At All Costs. Its not Play Hard And With Competitive Lists And Hope To Win.

[Melissia]

You're not paying attention to my post. Go click the links. Read up on them. Then stop using the Win At All Costs acronym like the other ***holes.

[eldargal]

And I thought I was the only one who thought this.:)


Stop insulting the WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Auxiliary_Corps_(Britain)). Also, stop insulting the other WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Corps).

I friggin' hate it when people use that acronym for an insult.

mutter stupid disrespectful people mutter

[Vaktathi]

To play devil's advocate (note: please keep this in mind), perhaps insisting that a BA vindicator has a large blast, despite a clearly and unambiguously stated profile as stated in it's codex that it does not have one, does not make the others in your gaming group the "WAAC" players?

Codex's are designed to be entirely self contained and have no relation to any other codex's, thus why we have 3 different assault cannons, multiple different Typhoon and Cyclone missile launchers, land raider and drop pod transport capacities, PotMS rules, 3 different stormshield rules, different Vindicator wargear (CSM's have no bolter weapon, only C:SM, SW and BA have terrain ignoring wargear, etc.) and hugely varying points costs and rules for what in theory should be identical weapons, units, and wargear. Is it so hard to believe that they could have changed demolisher cannons in light of this?

Is the issue with the BA vindi more likely a mistake? Yes. However given the history of the codex's author and the huge array of variation between what would otherwise be identical equipment amongst SM's, one cannot be sure. Why is asking a player to play by the rules, clearly and unambiguously stated in their codex, suddenly a gigantic **** move?

[DarkLink]

And I thought I was the only one who thought this.:)

Nah, it irritates me, too. It tends to carry the implication that it refers to most competitive players, which, combined with its other negative connotations, make it feel like the poster is indirectly degrading me.

That may not be the intent, but that's always how it comes off. In my experience, the real jerks are so rare that I can't help but think that WAAC refers to all competitive players, not the extremely small subset that I don't play with even if I did know any.

[Schnitzel]

If you think I'm inferring that all competitive players fall into the WAAC category, I appologize. There are plenty of friendly, and very sporty, competitive players out there. In fact, the majority of competitive players I'd wager to say are good fellows. When I say "WAAC" I am meaning the almost insignificantly small minority that suck the joy from the game.

And Melisa, soooooooo sorry, didn't even know there's an actual real group out there that goes by the acronym. Haha, nor did I realize you posted links. I thought they were just underlined for emphasis.

[Dralafi]

Having been stationed in Europe and played in both tournaments and friendly games in most of western Europe I've come across a fair degree of win at all cost people. So far most of them has been a misunderstanding of the english language and twisting the true meaning to suit their needs and they've been put in their place by official rulings and tourny directors. Me and my friends having played a bit in those.

When going to tournaments, get a ruling on something prior to going and adapt accordingly, in friendly games, just don't play them. Personally I draw the line at cheating, and if that happens. that's it, I'm moving on.

As for the BA vindicator issue. Haven't heard anything around here, as we've assumed it works as a normal demolisher and without having books around to look in, if it does not fire a template that would seem to be that it's the only demolisher cannon in the entire game that doesn't do it. Which I find odd. Alternatively is to play nilla marines and bring your vindis against them.

Not to long ago I switched gaming group because a couple of people were blatently cheating and when I said something they just said that's how they play and it's ok. Not in my book and as much fun as the other players are it gets repetative and boring very fast. Here in the UK there's plenty of other groups within striking distance so I didn't have a problem finding another group. In germany it was very much a shut up and smile type of situation if I didn't like the group, luckily that wasn't a problem.

Ulitmately we play to have fun, yes, even the win at all cost folks (their fun is usually winning however, not the game itself) and if you're not having fun, move on.

[Sangre]

Stop insulting the WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Auxiliary_Corps_(Britain)). Also, stop insulting the other WAAC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_Army_Corps).

I friggin' hate it when people use that acronym for an insult.

mutter stupid disrespectful people mutter

You're a silly. Seriously, this might be the dumbest post I've ever read here, and I waded through the FSM thread.

[DoctorEvil]

There are a few gamers I really like, and the WAAC guys are cool outside of gaming, but I absolutely can't stand them as gamers.

Cool outside of gaming, but you can't stand them as gamers????.......I'm having difficultly grapsing that one. I guess my experience has been if they're a jerk at the gaming table, then they're a jerk away from the gaming table.

Schnitzel....when I first read your post, I immediately thought...."Geez, this guys a poor sport. When the rule issue went against him, his first reaction was to take his ball and go home" (granted I'm not up to speed on the BA rule issues). This one thing was really the tipping point for you orr would you have quit this group eventually due to the behavoir of some of these guys?

If these guys are really cool outside of gaming table, it would seem to me that you could discuss your gaming issue with them away from the gaming table. Don't get into a debate about the specific rule issue, discuss the issues you have with the "tone" of the games. Basically if there are any redeeming qualities to being a part of this gaming group, don't you think you should exhaust all your options to fix the issues before quitting?

[eldargal]

Just because someone is too moronic to appreciate subtle humour doesn't mean it isn't there.


You're a silly. Seriously, this might be the dumbest post I've ever read here, and I waded through the FSM thread.

[Sangre]

Just because someone is too moronic to appreciate subtle humour doesn't mean it isn't there.

No, no, I'm British, we invented subtle humour about a hundred years before we invented America.

Also you quote funny. Quotes go at the top. Silly Americans.

[DarkLink]

If you think I'm inferring that all competitive players fall into the WAAC category, I appologize.

No worries. It's just that "WAAC" players are just competitive players who also happen to be jerks. The term WAAC always feels, to me, as if the problem with those players is their competitiveness as much as their jerkiness.

If another player's a jerk, then thats what they are, and I wouldn't play against them.

[david5th]

Yeah... um... it says "all ordnance BLAST weapons use the large blast template."

There's a difference between ordnance and ordnance BLAST.

So, yes, by RAW BA vindicators are ordnance. Not ordnance blast. Just ordnance.

This will probably be changed in a FAQ just was the SM codex was.

[Fizyx]

I know it is hard to quote entire rules, but next time, please don't twist wording like this to suit your need, especially when it is so easy to counter by other people just reading the rule.

I reread the rule and I see what you mean. I also went through the thread on the rules sub-forum and I see why I got such a vociferous response about it. I guess I've been reading that rule wrong for a while now (not that it mattered, up until now.)

I guess we'll wait for the inevitable errata. My second point still stands, though.

[Melissia]

Shutup sangre.


Why not just use the terms powergamer and munchkin?

A Powergamer is an intelligent person who's able to maximize the effectiveness of their lists and strategies.

A Munchkin is an unintelligent person who wants to be a powergamer.

Powergamers are typically mature and highly competitive. Munchkins are also competitive, but rarely mature.

[eldargal]

I'm British.:rolleyes:
I find it much more sensible to place quotes below what I write, that way people do not have to wade through quotes if they are already familiar with the conversation.

I've never been mistaken for an American before, I wonder if I can learn to type in recieved pronunciation.


No, no, I'm British, we invented subtle humour about a hundred years before we invented America.

Also you quote funny. Quotes go at the top. Silly Americans.

[BuFFo]

I guess we'll wait for the inevitable errata. My second point still stands, though.

I agree with your second point, up to a 'point'.

The game is about having fun, but it goes both ways. If I am playing a BA player, why is it fun for him to 'house rule' his Vindicator, yet not fun for me to make sure he is playing by the rules?

[DarkLink]

This will probably be changed in a FAQ just was the SM codex was.

Almost certainly. In another 12 months or so:p.

[Schnitzel]

Cool outside of gaming, but you can't stand them as gamers????.......I'm having difficultly grapsing that one. I guess my experience has been if they're a jerk at the gaming table, then they're a jerk away from the gaming table.

Schnitzel....when I first read your post, I immediately thought...."Geez, this guys a poor sport. When the rule issue went against him, his first reaction was to take his ball and go home" (granted I'm not up to speed on the BA rule issues). This one thing was really the tipping point for you orr would you have quit this group eventually due to the behavoir of some of these guys?

If these guys are really cool outside of gaming table, it would seem to me that you could discuss your gaming issue with them away from the gaming table. Don't get into a debate about the specific rule issue, discuss the issues you have with the "tone" of the games. Basically if there are any redeeming qualities to being a part of this gaming group, don't you think you should exhaust all your options to fix the issues before quitting?

Well, for smoking and joking they're pretty cool... There is at least one that comes off as a dick all around though. The general tone of playing style of at least half the group just rubs me the wrong way. Hell, one guy refuses to play on a table unless he's got his terrain on it... which is full of TLoS blockage and adds ridiculous protection to his Nids and Nurgle armies.
The rules lawyering and manipulation just turns me off completely. Thats all.

[DoctorEvil]

Well, for smoking and joking they're pretty cool... There is at least one that comes off as a dick all around though. The general tone of playing style of at least half the group just rubs me the wrong way. Hell, one guy refuses to play on a table unless he's got his terrain on it... which is full of TLoS blockage and adds ridiculous protection to his Nids and Nurgle armies.
The rules lawyering and manipulation just turns me off completely. Thats all.

Wow....that's not good.

Personally, I would expect some amount of rules lawyering, power gaming, ultra-competitiveness from any large gaming group. But when you get over 50% of group like that and people like the terrain guy.....it's probably just not worth salvaging.

[Denzark]

HAHA Eldargal a septic? Sangre you really are quite droll old horse.


On the subject of WAAC, last game my Berzerkers ran away and hid so as not to give away a KP, as did the sole survivng member of a Khorne Terminator Squad.

Am I WAAC - tempting fate with the Blood god like this?

[BuFFo]

Am I WAAC - tempting fate with the Blood god like this?

-lifts your tail, and smells your back side-

Yes... Yes you are tempting fate with the Blood God.... You got the smell of Khorne all in ya.

[Sangre]

I'm British.:rolleyes:
I find it much more sensible to place quotes below what I write, that way people do not have to wade through quotes if they are already familiar with the conversation.

I've never been mistaken for an American before, I wonder if I can learn to type in recieved pronunciation.

I've misjudged you. I apologise.

(P.S. It's "received")

[Fizyx]

The game is about having fun, but it goes both ways. If I am playing a BA player, why is it fun for him to 'house rule' his Vindicator, yet not fun for me to make sure he is playing by the rules?

Completely understood.

I agree some rules are prime for errata and/or clarification, and until then it would be wrong to insist on playing RAI until that point. I just have a hard time with that. I play 'nids, so I know the feeling.

In other news, after reading more about the OP's situation, man that sounds rough. It might be better to go elsewhere. If you can make it to Maryland, there is going to be a pretty huge event on May 29th at the Annapolis store. Stop on by if you want to meet some pretty cool players. Of course there might be a couple bad apples, but there should be a lot of people there.

How much longer do you have in Quantico?

[BlacknightIII]

You can't quit and leave just yet.
If you quit and leave than the enemy has won against you.
One thing I have learned from many of the munchkins is that they do what they do because it is the only way they know to win.

So the horde players won't let you have your vindicator. Next time bring a new toy, like a whirlwind.
Sure it might not hit as hard but when all there little toughness 3 gaunts don't get cover saves they will wish you had a vindicator instead.

There are other things you can do but that was the first one to pop into my head. As for the terrain guy... well... your playing blood angels... out manuver and overrun with your superior close combat! Those warriors dont do squat to a Dread and assault marines eat gaunts for breakfast!

Once you beat them at their game, they will either loosen up seeing that it doesn't work or they will leave and play their game somewhere else.

[eldargal]

Quite right, how embaressing. I can write words like floccinaucinihilipilification without checking a dictionary but damned if I can remember"i before e except after c'.:o


I've misjudged you. I apologise.

(P.S. It's "received")

[bigrob281]

So the horde players won't let you have your vindicator. Next time bring a new toy, like a whirlwind.
Sure it might not hit as hard but when all there little toughness 3 gaunts don't get cover saves they will wish you had a vindicator instead.



whirlwinds have the same problem it just says ordanance no large blast.

[synack]

rabble rabble rabble

Ignoring all that. Get phone numbers / email addresses of the people you enjoy playing with. Then organise ahead of time to play against them at the group. Just don't bother playing against the guys that want to be otherwise. If you're not having fun playing against particular people, don't play them and make sure you tell them why.

[Shipmonkey]

whirlwinds have the same problem it just says ordanance no large blast.

They dont have the same problem. Whirlwind MMLs are Ordnance Barrage. The rulebook says all Barrage weapons are Blast. The rulebook also says all Ordnance Blast weapons use the Large Blast template. So where is the problem with them?

[Schnitzel]

In other news, after reading more about the OP's situation, man that sounds rough. It might be better to go elsewhere. If you can make it to Maryland, there is going to be a pretty huge event on May 29th at the Annapolis store. Stop on by if you want to meet some pretty cool players. Of course there might be a couple bad apples, but there should be a lot of people there.

How much longer do you have in Quantico?

Ah blast it, I volunteered for duty on the 29th. :(
Otherwise, I'd make the drive.


You can't quit and leave just yet.
If you quit and leave than the enemy has won against you.

This is the very same logic that continuously gets me in trouble in life. lol.


So the horde players won't let you have your vindicator. Next time bring a new toy, like a whirlwind.
Sure it might not hit as hard but when all there little toughness 3 gaunts don't get cover saves they will wish you had a vindicator instead.

Interesting idea... I'll look into it for sure, and if its gtg, scratchbuild. :D

[DarkLink]

You can't quit and leave just yet.
If you quit and leave than the enemy has won against you.

Who gives a #^&* $*#%$ *(&^)( %*^$&$& about what the "enemy" thinks. If you're not having fun, go somewhere else. Don't let them control your life. $#^^ those $**^&$&%, no one gives a #$@#% #$^$^ %#^%$ what they think.

Ahem, excuse my french:rolleyes:.

[Slaanesh69]

I have looked at 4 different codex.

Space Wolves - Ordnance 1, Large Blast
Blood Angels - Ordnance 1
Imperial Guard - Ordnance 1, Large Blast
Space Marine - Ordnance 1 (or Ordnance 1, Barrage in the summary)

So which one is it? It seems to me that this is a case of bad proof reading and will need to be FAQ'ed.

[Melissia]

It's the one in the BA book for BA, and the one in the other books for the other armies.

you can always houserule otherwise.

[Schnitzel]

so I went to the FLGS today and threw down with the group again. Played against this awesome chap, Dave, who was very cool and fun to play against. We were both very lenient on cover saves and such and had an over all awesome time playing. Turns out neither of us really care so much for the win, but for the enjoyment of the game over all. Very cool.
Btw, he won. Game ended at turn 5 and I needed turn 6 to finish killing him in assault and claiming an objective. I mucked up a good number of times too, like forgetting Death Co are WS 5 and forgetting to disembark 'em from a downed Stormraven two turns in a row! :O

But then night had a lame ending with some greasy haired old dude telling me I should run Stormravens, or at least more than one, because they're garbage as are my Death Co and Dread. Two over priced and weak, his genestealers will rip them apart every time, whether or not I charge. I was just like, wow what a lame. I even called over another player who runs a similar list to his who I beat over the weekend to testify that Death Co, Death Dreads and Stormravens are actually pretty tough. The dread annihilated a squad of 12 elite gene steals for crap sake, and the old dude was just like "no, thats impossible" and I was having "beginners luck". What a dick.
If I ever want to play serious and stand a chance against him I need to drop the crap units and learn what works. He only plays with the best units possible, and attends every tourney possible. *paraphrasing*

Needless to say, I will never sit down and play a game with him. What a dick and a sour sport. Arrogant, cocky and just over all unpleasant.

I've decided to stick with the group btw. The guys I don't like, no matter how many there are, I just don't have to play with. Simple as that. I can have plenty of fun with the rest.

Also, one of the guys there offered me two Defilers for just 30 bucks! Awesome! He got four off some guy for 30 bucks a good while back he said, but even with that in mind I got a great deal. Fairly cool dude, for an Officer at least. :P

[scadugenga]

I have looked at 4 different codex.

Space Wolves - Ordnance 1, Large Blast
Blood Angels - Ordnance 1
Imperial Guard - Ordnance 1, Large Blast
Space Marine - Ordnance 1 (or Ordnance 1, Barrage in the summary)

So which one is it? It seems to me that this is a case of bad proof reading and will need to be FAQ'ed.

GW has already errata'd the Vindicator to be Large Blast for the C: SM, so every codex is in accordance accept for the BA one, which, given the popular assumption that the author did a sloppy "cut&paste" from the C: SM dex, means we can probably expect it to be errata'd shortly as well.

As for the OP: asshats will be asshats. Don't feed them, and they'll generally leave you alone. As for the 'Nid night-ruiner...an assertive "I didn't ask for your opinion and please get out of my face," will hopefully prevent repeat performances.

G'luck.