BA Honor Guard

[Erasmus of Baal]

In the main rules, it is stated that any Independent Character with a retinue must be joined to that retinue as long as possible. In the Blood Angels codex, p. 84 that "you can take one unit of Honor Guard for every HQ unit you have included in your army...." Does this mean that my HQ choices with the Independent Character special rule treat them as retinues? And if so, what about those without the Independent Character rule, specifically Mephiston, the Sanguinor, and Death Company Captain Tycho?

[Sir Biscuit]

Honor Guard are not a retinue, they are purchased and function as a separate unit. The restriction is that you may take only one squad of them per HQ choice, they are not bought as part of an HQ choice.

So no, units that do not have independent character cannot join them.

[Erasmus of Baal]

That is what I thought as well, but then some other people began arguing them as retinues and since I'm so new to the game, I wouldn't know what other Codexes to compare to (in terms of what definably is a retinue) for an argument.

[Culven]

If the Unit is called a Retinue or there is a rule that prevents the IC from leaving, it is a Retinue. There are very few codecies in 5th edition with Retinues, and they include the Daemon and Witch Hunters and the Tau.

[Nabterayl]

The defining feature of a retinue is that you can't leave it. If a supposed retinue doesn't have a special rule preventing a joined character from leaving while the supposed retinue still lives, then it isn't a retinue.

[Tynskel]

If the Unit is called a Retinue or there is a rule that prevents the IC from leaving, it is a Retinue. There are very few codecies in 5th edition with Retinues, and they include the Daemon and Witch Hunters and the Tau.

Actually, there is only one codex in 5th edition that has a retinue-- the Tyranids. Hive Tyrant and the Tyrant Guard.

The other codexes mentioned are either 3rd or 4th edition codexes in the 5th edition environment.

[Culven]

The other codexes mentioned are either 3rd or 4th edition codexes in the 5th edition environment.
Which means that they are still the current codecies for use in 5th edition, despite being released under previous editions.

Also, the Hive Tyrant is an odd situation since it isn't an IC anyway. It just has a means to become part of the same unit as the Tyrant Guard.

[Tynskel]

True, True...

[RocketRollRebel]

Actually, there is only one codex in 5th edition that has a retinue-- the Tyranids. Hive Tyrant and the Tyrant Guard.

The other codexes mentioned are either 3rd or 4th edition codexes in the 5th edition environment.

Imperial Guard command squads fall into that slot don't they?

[lobster-overlord]

The IG commands don't really follow it either, as the commander isn't an IC or even a Special Character. He's one model of the unit. The special characters are then upgrades to that particular model. While they are unique, they don't have "retinue" holding status, but as they are a model in the unit, the are bound by the unit until all others are killed, then can act alone, but still do not gain IC and are thus not able to join others. Weren't the older retinue holding special characters still considered ICs thus able ot join other units once the retinue was dead?

John M.

[HellCrusader]

They were indeed
Another question concerning HG: it says, at least the french translation does, that any honour guard may upgrade to carrying special weapons, but as squad comp lists 4 HG + 1 SP. Can the SP upgrade to PW/PF/... or not?

[Tynskel]

in a RAW setting, only HG can take the gear, because the rule specifically states HG. If the rule stated any MODEL can take the gear, then the SP could take something.

:(

Too bad- My Honour Guard Sanguinary Priest was equipped with PP and PF-- I can just use him as the Independent Character version.