Profiting from Necromunda

[son_of_volmer]

Recently I've gotten pumped about the idea of Necromunda.

I think it will be difficult for Games Workshop to produce Necromunda the same way it was produced back in the day. For one, they no longer make pewter miniatures, and the resin ranges are disappearing. These means of production suit smaller scaled range of miniatures. The company is now geared towards large scale miniature production, many mens and big machines. It would be difficult producing the variety of gang sets that once graced the hives of Necromunda.

If a customer buys in to a certain gang, it means there are several different gangs they will not be buying. The smaller size of gangs (compared to full armies) means that customers are also buying less models. There’s also the problem of scenery. Necromunda traditionally uses multi-level scenery and all of the Specialty Games of late are supplied with 2D boards.

An Introductory box set for Necromunda has got to feature models without gang affiliations (like betrayal at Calth was wise enough to do), and a variety of outfitting options. It would be so cool if the gang models had terrain pieces included on the same sprue. Necromunda needs cool terrain. Asking gamers to make it all themselves steals time away from hobbying, and is a missed opportunity to make money. It amps the size of sets that would contain relatively small amount of models. Customers can not avoid acquiring the scenery needed to make the game fun and engaging.

The coolest thing they could do is change the sprue so that all the gates (paths plastic is poured through) looks like terrain junk. People often use the excess plastic left over in the sprue to make terrain, but what if that excess stuff came already looking like ladders and I-beam and cables and pipes. There are resin model companies out there already doing this.

Forge World is best geared to producing the individual models we used to buy in pewter. I think whatever happens when Blood Bowl is released will give hints of what to expect with Necromunda.

If we only get Human and Ork teams then perhaps we should expect something similar for Necromunda… BUT if Forge World steps up and supplies addition factions, then perhaps they too will be the major supporters of Necromunda.

I totally understand if GW decides to make all of its Specialist Games 'one off' box sets that never need additional support. After throwing so much support behind the Lord of the Rings line, they received very little payoff.

Necromunda is the perfect game for growing the hobby. It only requires a small purchase to get into, its easy to travel with, less competitive but to be done right it certainly requires a great deal of support on the part of GW, so if they want to make it just a one off thing, I'd rather they simply not do it at all.

[Asymmetrical Xeno]

Isn't Malifaux all plastic these days though? And thats a similarly scaled game with ten miniatures or so. They could also go the clampack route for expansions, with new characters (or generic heroes) to use for existing gangs. It will be very interesting to see what they do as this kind of niche is really taken over by other companies these days (Infinity, the aforementioned Malifaux and a dozen more...)

[grimmas]

GW has shown an increased efficiency on how how they produce plastic miniatures of late, I see no reason why they couldn't manage Necromunda. It might be monopose like we've seen in 40K/WFB/AoS starter sets or most of the board game releases. It seems do able though.

[Path Walker]

I spoke with Andy Hoare at an event about Necromunda. He said they were currently looking at it being most likely FW Resin for the gangs (all but the 2 starter teams for Blood Bowl will be resin too, if there is the demand for them, current firm plans at the time were only for the Orcs and Humans in plastic, they had 4 more teams lined up for resin)

The hard part for Necromunda is definitely the terrain, its probably the most important part of the set up for Necromunda and something GW has no way of providing cheaply to starter sets unless they went down the cardboard ways of the original, which they won't want to because it looks pretty naff.

[grimmas]

Didn't they try using cheaper Aluminium moulds for making some of the standard scenery fairly recently? Could make it possible? Necromunda needs the scenery to work though.

[Path Walker]

Didn't they try using cheaper Aluminium moulds for making some of the standard scenery fairly recently? Could make it possible? Necromunda needs the scenery to work though.

They did, the results were mixed though! I've had a few dodgy kits out of that experiment. Its also still not particularly cheap.

[grimmas]

Ah ok. I must confess I've not bought scenery since the card and plastic bulkhead days. I found it cheaper and easier to make my own. We've seen quite a lot of card board sections in the GW board game releases we might see them go old school of this one. 2 gangs of 10 and a couple of sprues of bulkheads would be in line with current releases really.

[Cactus]

I disagree.

Look at the GW boardgames like Deathwatch and Assassins. Heck, look at any box of space marines these days - it's 10 guys with a ton of options and I imagine that's how most gangs will be sold, perhaps with a couple of clampacks of characters.

If any company knows how to maximize profits and make minis more efficiently it's GW; even on a small scale.

[Cactus]

Deleted

[Path Walker]

A mold for a box of Space Marines will sell hundreds of thousands of units of the course of its usable life, an individual necromunda gang, given that uniqueness of each gang is important visually, might not, its a risk and not one they're likely to take.

And, as stated, I've spoken with the head of the Specialist Games team about this and everything I've said above is stuff he's told me.

[Captain Bubonicus]

That cardboard scenery was kick-***! I'm STILL using it 20 years later.

[Dyolfnai]

I think plastic would be do able if they wanted to

1. Each gang has
Boxed set of 10 gangers - various weapon options - at least 10 lasguns
Clam pack leader with weapon options
Clam pack heavy with 2 heavy weapon options
Clam pack heavy with 2 special weapon options
Clam pack 2 jives with minor weapon options

All weapon options transferable between all kits and gangs


2. Promote larger gangs by including rules in white dwarf to use gangs in deathwatch overkill, they already added rules for guard

3. Promote even larger gangs by adding rules/ formations for imperial guard regiments raised from necromunda gangs


They could use city of death terrain in the starter box and possibly some bulk buys at similar discount to starter armies, as they now seem to have no problem selling older stuff cheaper in boxed sets


Oh and loads of clam pack scum, bounty hunters etc with rules for all 3 games

[completeHook]

As far as scenary goes...

Mantic do BATTLEZONES: SCI-FI RUINED QUADRANT for £109.99 and it is massive, I saw a load of their modular scenery at Salute last year and it looks pretty sturdy, however I didn't get to handle it so I can't say for certain.

http://www.manticgames.com/mantic-shop/mantic-scenery-and-terrain/product/battlezones-sci-fi-ruined-quadrant.html

Stylistically it is very different from GW's stuff but it does show what is possible.

If it was down to me I'd do the bulk of it with laser cut MDF with plastic details, the Underhive doesn't need a million skulls, or any, it's a post industrial slum with lots of gantries.

Alternatively as it's moulds that are expensive not the plastic, so making lots of a couple of sprues with quite plain modular components could also work.

[Mr Mystery]

What they really need to do is multipart models.

Necromunda remains a firm favourite of mine, but being of limited artistic ability I found myself restricted to commercially available models. Sure I can handle the odd hand or head swap, but when the gun is modelled across two hands the torso, I can forget it.

I know that's a big demand, but to really open the best part of the game up to all and sundry, it really needs to be done,

Ideally? Standardise the weapon fittings on the models. That frees them up to sell the weapons separately if needs be, allowing us Standard Nerds to equip our Gangs as we see fit. It also helps avoid my age old irritation of 'eff me, I've just gone done invented an Autocannon! Shame I have no way of representing it....'

[40kGamer]

Hopefully multipart plastic kits are the way they go.

Necromunda minis do have some 40k crossover utility so that might justify it.

[grimmas]

Hopefully multipart plastic kits are the way they go.

Necromunda minis do have some 40k crossover utility so that might justify it.

Good point. If they design any gang kits with utility to existing Guard range it could used to provide the variety the Guard is supposed to represent.

Nice to see you posting again.

[Morgrim]

I think the way to make a profit could be the terrain itself. Good terrain has a wide scope of usages. 40k itself needs more than just ruined buildings and it would be a way of expanding those ranges, and if you make it flexible enough you can hit players of games outside the Games Workshop stable too. Infinity in particular needs a similar terrain concentration to what Necromunda had.

[grimmas]

Well Morgrim that's a clever way of looking at it, I'm not sure they'd consider the Infinty side they do like to ignore the other companies even exist.

I think cross over with being able to use stuff in 40K and vice versa will be the key, of course we've seen this with Execution Force and Deathwatch Overkill so I'd expect It again. Within reason of course I'd rather Land Raiders didn't turn up in Necromunda.

[Defenestratus]

I think Necromunda is an area where GW can continue its recent renaissance and actually embrace some of the third party bits studios. Perhaps not endorse them explicitly but with a nod and a wink encourage some of the vast heretofore mostly untapped 3rd party studios to provide a slice of the overall necromunda pie that GW would derive even more revenue from.

I know, its a dream and a fantasy, but heck, with the developments of late, I figured I'd at least mention it as a possibility.

[Mr Mystery]

I think the way to make a profit could be the terrain itself. Good terrain has a wide scope of usages. 40k itself needs more than just ruined buildings and it would be a way of expanding those ranges, and if you make it flexible enough you can hit players of games outside the Games Workshop stable too. Infinity in particular needs a similar terrain concentration to what Necromunda had.

That.....is a bloody good point.

It seems the original demise for Specialist Games was their comparatively limited sales potential. Once you've got your Gang/Warband/Team/Fleet, you generally don't need much more. And because of the attachment you developed to your Gang in particular, I found people were less likely to get a secondary force.

But, if you can put something in your starter box that's bloody useful for say, 40k, you'll sell more of those. And even if many are just getting it as a scenery box....you've still got those Gang models. Might as well give it a try....

[Lord Manton]

Good point. If they design any gang kits with utility to existing Guard range it could used to provide the variety the Guard is supposed to represent

Or, cross over with Cultists. BOOM! Hit the double whammy, bring back Necromunda, making the long beards happy, and address a common wish: multi-part cultists!

I second the terrain notion. The way the ruins are designed, it would only require the release of a set of walkways and gantries, with some ladders and stairs thrown in for good measure. I'd buy it, that's for damn sure.

Also as a side note, not having played Necromunda, what is the cross-over potential with Inquisitor28?

[Theik]

I think Necromunda is an area where GW can continue its recent renaissance and actually embrace some of the third party bits studios. Perhaps not endorse them explicitly but with a nod and a wink encourage some of the vast heretofore mostly untapped 3rd party studios to provide a slice of the overall necromunda pie that GW would derive even more revenue from.

I know, its a dream and a fantasy, but heck, with the developments of late, I figured I'd at least mention it as a possibility.

This is completely wishful thinking and never going to happen. Age of Sigmar was created to have an IP that shares less overall themes with other fantasy ranges to try and limit the amount of bits people will buy from other companies. Why would they suddenly come around and encourage people to use bits from other ranges?

[Ben_S]

As others have said, Necromunda kits could certainly have crossover appeal for 40k players (Chaos Cultists, Genestealer brood brothers, IG, etc). It really wouldn't be too difficult to make a box that could be (say) either ten greatcoat IG with lasguns, or Cultists with autoguns, or a Delaque gang with various weapon options, and a box like that should be able to sell respectable numbers.

Really, though, I think GW's attitude to games like this ought to be that it's a 'gateway drug' that will help bring more people in to 40k, rather than something expected to make a significant profit in its own terms. You won't necessarily see the profits in terms of sales of Necromunda kits, but if they increase the 40k player base then they're doing their job (even though it won't be easy to recognise this from sales figures).

[40kGamer]

Good point. If they design any gang kits with utility to existing Guard range it could used to provide the variety the Guard is supposed to represent.

Nice to see you posting again.

Thanks mate, it feels good to be back! :)


I think the way to make a profit could be the terrain itself. Good terrain has a wide scope of usages. 40k itself needs more than just ruined buildings and it would be a way of expanding those ranges, and if you make it flexible enough you can hit players of games outside the Games Workshop stable too. Infinity in particular needs a similar terrain concentration to what Necromunda had.

I would so love to see them do this for all the crossover potential!

[son_of_volmer]

I realized it is hard to sell terrain because it is something a player buys and may not see any in-game benefits from.

I buy a barricade, my opponent gets cover from the barricade, and kicks my butt, and I wish I never bought that barricade.

This isn't literally how someone thinks, but when I could be spending my money on units that benefit me in-game (guns and troops) I'm buying a hunk of junk that can sit in the corner of a board and look pretty, but actually serve no purpose to in the game I'm playing.

I wish GW would get into the laser-cut MDF game. Just buy a promising company, fork over your licenses AND THEN PROFITS! (It is how Forge World began)

I think a plastic box-set would be cool if it had an escaped prisoners versus Arbiters theme. Escaped convicts can be thrown back into Warhammer 40k as Penal Legions and Arbiters also have a place (despite infringing on Judge Dread). Both represent new and random folks arriving un-expectedly on Necromunda (much like the actual player) and both factions could potentially be recruited into the gangs of old.

[40kGamer]

I wish GW would get into the laser-cut MDF game. Just buy a promising company, fork over your licenses AND THEN PROFITS! (It is how Forge World began).

Is the mdf pretty nice? I'm quite the plastic/solid resin lover when it comes to terrain.

[son_of_volmer]

The only problem I have with MDF is it is light. Light terrain is constantly being nudged and floats around. Being light, it is easier to ship. I think it would be cheaper than plastic, it takes up less space on store shelves (don't even package it in a box) and it might be better for the environment. Also, the burning effect the laser has on the MDF gives it a two-tones look, so as soon as its assembled, the stuff doesn't look so bad un-painted.

[Defenestratus]

The only problem I have with MDF is it is light. Light terrain is constantly being nudged and floats around. Being light, it is easier to ship. I think it would be cheaper than plastic, it takes up less space on store shelves (don't even package it in a box) and it might be better for the environment. Also, the burning effect the laser has on the MDF gives it a two-tones look, so as soon as its assembled, the stuff doesn't look so bad un-painted.

Glue the assembled building to a slate tile. It's not going anywhere. Its what I do with my 40k ruins to keep them from getting nudged all over the place.

[Mr Mystery]

No! No MDF terrain!

I loathes it precious, loathes it.

Always just looks cheap and nasty to me.

Other opinions are of course available (but in this case I'm adamant they'd be quite wrong :p)

[Sicarius182Uk]

I remember it in WD about 130. I personally would prefer a 40k version with Arbiters and Space Marines etc clearing hives of Chaos infestation like in Dark Heresy FF and DOW2 when the Blood Ravens under Angelos fight in the Spires.

[Captain Bubonicus]

I remember it in WD about 130. I personally would prefer a 40k version with Arbiters and Space Marines etc clearing hives of Chaos infestation like in Dark Heresy FF and DOW2 when the Blood Ravens under Angelos fight in the Spires.

I'd be happy if they did it like they did it before plus Arbites and the Cult of the Four Armed Emperor.

[son_of_volmer]

No! No MDF terrain!

I loathes it precious, loathes it.

Always just looks cheap and nasty to me.



Generally MDF Terrain only looks cheap because it hasn't had enough time and dedicated effort to improve. Check out Iron Battlefield Terrain. It's a company that's taken MDF terrain to the next level. Their sets come with adhesive backed thin metal sheets that add an incredible level of detail.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/iron-battlefield#/

I feel these guys haven't gotten much attention because they are based in Spain, and lack connection to English-based miniwargaming information outlets.

[Sicarius182Uk]

I'd be happy if they did it like they did it before plus Arbites and the Cult of the Four Armed Emperor.

Makes total sense Cpt Genestealers are the best foe to fight against as we all know.

- - - Updated - - -

It could certainly be like Spacehulk but in the Spires.