Firing from fast vehicles

[Duke]

So this one is a little more simple than my previous questions:

Part 1:

Q: When shooting from a fast rhino how fast is the fastest you can go?
0-6" (Combat)
7-12" (Cruising)
13-18" (Counts as Cruising)

A?: From reading "fire points" it says that embarked passengers "...May not fire at all if the vehicle moved at Cruising speed that turn" Pg. 66 BRB

SInce 12-18" counts as cruising I would assume you can only go 6" and fire. Right?

Part 2:

Q: When firing from a fire point is it possible to fire smoke on the vehicle and fire weapons from the fire points which the embarked squad has. I.e. Melta guns from embarked marines in a Rhino that just popped smoke.

A?: There is nothing saying that the troops can't fire when smoke launches. For reference Pg 66 BRB "Fire Points" and Pg. 62 "Smoke Launchers."

Again, simple enough questions but it never hurts to get simple answers.

Duke

[SeattleDV8]

So this one is a little more simple than my previous questions:

Part 1:

Q: When shooting from a fast rhino how fast is the fastest you can go?
0-6" (Combat)
7-12" (Cruising)
13-18" (Counts as Cruising)
Not quite
0-6" (stationary)
6+ -12 (Combat)
12+ (Cruising)
So anything 12" and under the rhino's strom bolter can fire.


A?: From reading "fire points" it says that embarked passengers "...May not fire at all if the vehicle moved at Cruising speed that turn" Pg. 66 BRB

SInce 12-18" counts as cruising I would assume you can only go 6" and fire. Right?
right.



Part 2:

Q: When firing from a fire point is it possible to fire smoke on the vehicle and fire weapons from the fire points which the embarked squad has. I.e. Melta guns from embarked marines in a Rhino that just popped smoke.

A?: There is nothing saying that the troops can't fire when smoke launches. For reference Pg 66 BRB "Fire Points" and Pg. 62 "Smoke Launchers."


correct. although it seems odd.

[Nabterayl]

I agree with DV8. The vehicle being Fast has no effect on how fast you can go and still have passengers shoot, so any faster than 6" and the passengers can't shoot. And whether passengers can shoot is conceptually independent from whether the vehicle can shoot, so smoke has no effect on them.

[Tynskel]

Stationary --- 0
Combat Speed --- 0-6
Cruising Speed --- 6-12
Flat Out---12+

[DarkLink]

I agree with DV8. The vehicle being Fast has no effect on how fast you can go and still have passengers shoot, so any faster than 6" and the passengers can't shoot. And whether passengers can shoot is conceptually independent from whether the vehicle can shoot, so smoke has no effect on them.

I agree here, on both counts.

[SeattleDV8]

Stationary --- 0
Combat Speed --- 0-6
Cruising Speed --- 6-12
Flat Out---12+

That would be correct for a normal vehicle.
My chart is how you treat a fast vehicle's firing.

[Nabterayl]

I think Tynskel was pointing out that technically Fast allows you to treat the speed bands differently for firing. 0" is stationary, no more than 6" is combat, no more than 12" is cruising, and more than 12" is flat-out for all vehicles. However, what combat speed and cruising speed mean for shooting depends on whether or not you are Fast.

In other words, a Fast vehicle that moves 6" has still moved at Combat Speed. However, a Fast vehicle that has moved at Combat Speed is allowed to fire all of its main weapons and all of its defensive weapons. This is a more technically correct way of describing the rule than saying that Fast vehicles moving at Combat Speed get to fire as if they were stationary, though I don't think your way of thinking about it ever produces the wrong result, DV8.

[DarkLink]

...though I don't think your way of thinking about it ever produces the wrong result, DV8.

Well, I believe it specifies that passengers may not fire if the vehicle moves at anything above combat speed. Thus, if you consider combat speed on a fast vehicle to be 6-12" (which it isn't, technically), the passengers would be able to shoot. Which they can't, because 6-12" is always cruising speed.

[Nabterayl]

Well, I believe it specifies that passengers may not fire if the vehicle moves at anything above combat speed. Thus, if you consider combat speed on a fast vehicle to be 6-12" (which it isn't, technically), the passengers would be able to shoot. Which they can't, because 6-12" is always cruising speed.
That's a good point.

[SeattleDV8]

I agree

[Duke]

That is what I had originally thought.
6.1-12" is cruising
12.1-18 is flat out, but counts as cruising.

Thanks for the help everyone.

Duke

[Nabterayl]

12.1-18 is flat out, but counts as cruising.
Technically, it only counts as cruising for some purposes. It counts as cruising for purposes of assaulting a vehicle (meaning a vehicle is hit in assault on a 6+ whether it moved at Cruising Speed or Flat Out), but it does not count as cruising for purposes of shooting. For instance, you can't move a Fast vehicle Flat Out, say "Oh, that counts as Cruising," and then say "Page 70 lets me shoot one weapon if I move at Cruising Speed!"

Whatever accurate mental shortcut works for you works, but personally I find it best to think of the game as having three speed brackets, only two of which are accessible to most vehicles. Flat Out isn't a special kind of Cruising Speed; it's its own thing.

[karandras]

100% correct on passsengers not being able to fire from any vehicle moving more than 6".


The smoke launcher thing is pure cheese!!! But apparently within the rules. Ridiculous oversight IMHO.

[DarkLink]

100% correct on passsengers not being able to fire from any vehicle moving more than 6".


The smoke launcher thing is pure cheese!!! But apparently within the rules. Ridiculous oversight IMHO.

Yeah, the passengers getting to shoot while smoked had never occurred to me. It was one of those "wait, that actually works" moments.

[ashnaile]

The passengers cant fire if it moved 12" no, but they can disembark and then fire as normal minus heavy weapons as they count as moving.