How are Orks these days?

[mikethefish]

Been wargaming for decades now - played a ton of Orks from back in the original RT era, and following up into the early stages of 5th edition. Took a break from 40k (though not from wargaming) and sold off my Orks and now I find myself considering getting back into the game with my favorite army, basically starting from scratch. With this in mind, I have some questions...

1) How would you rate Orks in the overal meta? Are they considered to be a weak codex? I have heard some disparaging comments about them lately (not that I really care if they are weak - just getting the lay of the land)

2) What's worthwhile in the list? Killa Kans? Battlewagons? Buggies? Shoota Boyz? What works well in the current edition?

3) Are there any popular Ork tournament lists making the rounds these says?

Thanks all!

[Erik Setzer]

Honestly, Orks are one of the "weaker" codices, especially with all the new stuff coming out. But they can be fun to model and play with the right attitude (if you don't have people running tourney lists... not sure one-sided affairs are ever "fun").

Lootas are nice, but being moved to Heavy Support hurts some, since that's where a lot of the good stuff is. Kans of various sorts are about the same as before. Killer Kanz add some firepower with a bit of survivability, but don't expect them to scratch Land Raiders any more. Some of the Mek Gunz are amazing, especially Traktor Kannons wrecking flyers and FMCs. Shoota Boyz are awesome because you can shoot a lot (pretty much the emphasis of recent editions of 40K) and yet still charge with 3 attacks at S4 on the charge (yay for Furious Charge and A2 base).

Painboyz are good for helping a large mob gain some survivability, or even MegaNobz (who are pretty expensive for not having any kind of invulnerable save). If you do have MegaNobz, get at least one with killsaws. Those things tear through vehicles (4 attacks, 5 on charge, at S8/9+2D6 for armor penetration).

Burna Boyz went up in price, so not really that great, IMO. They might seem awesome on paper, but 16 points a model for something with a 6+ save is ridiculous.

Not sure on Ork tournament lists. Some Ork player got to the heady position of eighth in one of the big tournaments recently, but I haven't found his list anywhere. And that's about as high as they go. I think you'd probably have to get extra cheeky with Orks to run them well in a tournament, to the point that if you're big on Ork fluff, it might not be a fun time for you.

It's worth grabbing the Ghazghkull supplement. Plenty of formations, and the relics are great. The detachment is also fun to play with.

If you like funny crazy stuff, the Orks have that. Played a 2700 point game last week against a friend for fun... I brought a Stompa with five Meks total, the 4+ inv. KFF from Waaagh! Ghazghkull, a Green Tide, and wrapped up the W!G detachment with two units of Grots, two units of Lootas, and a Morkanaut. One unit of Lootas gained Deep Strike with the formation, and the Warlord (who was the Warboss leading the Green Tide) rolled the Warlord trait giving him and a unit he joins Outflank... so imagine 101 Orks outflanking, and Lootas teleporting onto the battle, as a Stompa rumbles forward with Meks and Grots hammering it repeatedly back into shape. It actually won (lots of luck on my end), but even if it lost (as I'd originally expected), it was just so funny that you can't help laughing at it and having a good time. That's how I approach Orks now: Just play them to have fun, and throw fun lists on the table that will hopefully be effective.

[mikethefish]

Yeah honestly that was my big fear. I don't need to play a power codex or anything, but playing one that out-and-out sucks is another story entirely. It just seems like too many of the options that I really love about the Orks are somewhat sub-par nowadays.

I am thinking that I might try to get into Fantasy instead, since the new edition is about to drop soon

[KaptinDregzag]

Orkz can be good, even tournament winning, but they have huge, glaring weaknesses in the codex. Currently the three tournament builds I have seen are: Green Tide (that's 100+ boyz in a single unit Formation), Stompa filled with Mekz (although this one seems pretty 50/50 really, as it has a lot of bad matchups), and the one that won a recent big tournament (Broadside Bash): Bike Deathstar (multiple Warbosses, Special Character from FW: Zhardsnark, Big Mekz, and Painboys all joining a Warbike unit) supported by an obscene number of Tankbustaz (40 I think) in trucks. In general, the Orkz will have a pretty rough time as the codex is usually considered to be quite subpar (many "nerfs" in the last codex such as the new fluffy but harsh Mob Rule, points increases on key units (Burnaz, Shoota Boyz, Battlewagonz, etc...) and complete lack of some options like Invulnerable Saves in Hand to Hand). Lootaz are still good (cheaper even), Tankbustaz are good (hell, rokkitz in general), Mek Gunz (the Traktor Kannon is one of the best AA weapons in the game), and some of the Formations are quite powerful (Bully Boyz for instance). None of this stops me, however. I just throw what I have together, show up, yell WAAAAAGGGGGHHHHH, and have a good time. Yeah, that means I went 1-2 at my last tournament, but whatever. Don't let that stop you. Get some green paint, put together the boyz, ignore that they die in droves, and just stomp some 'oomiez.

[daboarder]

its a tired old chestnut,

But how and who you play against makes a big difference in what is viable.

When mucking around (if thats your thing) then the lower tier codexes can do alright, but your opponents have to understand the game. Doesn't really work for tournaments or pick up games, but with 2-3 mates you game with consistently you should be OK

[Chomskie]

For what it's worth, I have sort of a different take.

Orks are fine. Good, even. They have a few fun, interesting builds that are winning major GTs and making it to the top tables. Torrent of fire has their win percentage at 42% which if anything is misleadingly low since some of their harder match ups are some of the really popular flavor of the month armies, and (the real issue) it's really, really easy to build some pretty bad Ork lists. I think there's this sort of unsubstantiated opinion out there that Orks are one of the weaker armies in the game right now. That's been the consensus opinion since the middle of 5th ed. In reality, I think Orks are probably one of the harder armies to play well, and certainly one of the more interesting armies with which to build a really good list, but if played (and planned out) well, they're genuinely nasty.

The Ork lists that I'm afraid of are usually either threat overload/high pressure lists or green tide. For the threat overload/high pressure lists, Orks have a few options for durable, terrifying death stars. A warboss on a bike with a lucky stikk can take a ridiculous amount of punishment while tanking wounds for squishier warbosses/nobz on bikes, and set up a threat that really has to be dealt with while the rest of the army (trikks, etc.) moves up.

I played against a brilliant list at Adepticon. The Ork player brought a unit of nob bikers with few warbosses, one with the luky stikk, a ton of boyz in trukks, a few units of tank bustas and a void shield generator. I think there were some backfield grots in there too. Anyway, he ran the bikes up the middle of the board and into some ruins, using the luky stick to make them *absurdly* durable. That death star also had the speed and board control to more or less wreck a list on it's own, so it absolutely needed to be dealt with. The net was that you could sort of deal with either the bike deathstar or the trukks, but probably not both. it was a really, really fun game!

Anyway, the upshot is that good players with good lists can *absolutely* make Orks work just fine. They're probable one of the harder armies to play right now, but hey, more the glory :-).

As to your question about which units are good, there are a bunch of good options. Green tide is great. Stormboyz can be good. Warbuggies can be down the middle brokenly good (in the right kind of list). Figuring out how to use Ork ICs/HQ slots seems to be pretty key. They do both horde lists (green tide) and mech MSU as well or better than any other army in the game right now.

Anyway, if you like Orks, I'd say by all means, play Orks and have fun! They are, at the worst, fine. At their best, they're genuinely scary.

[gilchrist]

This is my biggest complaint about 40k. I am a huge scratch builder, so I like orks a lot for that alone, but people go and spend a TON of money for hundreds of models, paint them all, which Gira horde army takes forever, and then take their army to the game so and get stomped into the ground 2/3 the time simply because their codex is inherently weak. The orks are funny, and that is awesome, but they should be able to stand toe to toe with other armies, with their own unique way of doing things. Instead, their function in the world of 40k is to be a green clown. Frustrates me.

[crkdltr]

Not sure on Ork tournament lists. Some Ork player got to the heady position of eighth in one of the big tournaments recently, but I haven't found his list anywhere. And that's about as high as they go. I think you'd probably have to get extra cheeky with Orks to run them well in a tournament, to the point that if you're big on Ork fluff, it might not be a fun time for you.


Think this is the list:


Green Tide Formation

94x Boyz

6x Nobz with Klaws

Warboss warlord ('Eavy Armour, Power Klaw)

Combined Arms Detachment:

HQ

Warboss (Gift: Da Lucky Stikk, 'Eavy Armour, Bosspole, Power Klaw)

Painboy

Elites

9x Tankbusta

10x Tankbusta

Troops

10x Gretchin + Runtherd

10x Gretchin + Runtherd

Fast Attack

Deffkopta (Choppa, Twin-linked Rokkits)

Heavy Support

Gun Wagon Squad:
Gun Wagon (1x TL Big Shoota, Boarding Plank, Reinforced Ram)

Gun Wagon (1x TL Big Shoota, Boarding Plank, Reinforced Ram)

Mek Gunz (3x Ammo Runt):

2x Kustom Mega-kannon w/ Grots

1x Traktor Kannon w/ Grots

Mek Gunz (3x Ammo Runt):

2x Kustom Mega-kannon w/ Grots

1x Traktor Kannon w/ Grots

Fortification Detatchment

Void Shield Generator (3 Shields)

[Grampa]

I have always had fun with the Orks and will start playing them in Tournaments starting this weekend :-)

[DontEatRawHagis]

i play in 2 metas. One is very much a fluff let's have fun one. The other is a Tournament style.

I am unbeaten with Orks in the fluff meta vs the tournament meta where I am 2nd to last in that group.

Mostly I could point to bad army match ups, but I'll admit that a few guys I play are really tactical and can think 20 moves ahead.

[Robert Morris]

Don't be discouraged. Orks are a good army and compete against all the top builds. However most of the internet plays them wrong. The secret sauce of the codex is even if you build a deathstar you still have lots of points for loads of models. I prefer obsec so dont bother with any of the other formations . My build is a unit that they can not ignore ( NOb bikers , painboy, boss) and is fast, 2-3 other units that are fast ( I like ard boyz and tankbustas in trucks) and hit hard, a 30 man mob with painboy ( takes the middle is hard to dislodge), grots cause they when games, tractor cannons cause they make flyrants cry and 2 minimum squads of lootas ( most people run 15 but i feel they do better as squads of 7 cause if they die oh well and hitting multiple targets.) Another army that give's people fits is the WAAAgh wing which uses the Bully boyz formation ( 15 fearless meganobs in truks) with MSU bike troops via forgeworld boss. Remember its your hobby and in a objective base game you always have a chance to win.