A Noob's Decision

[Spark Sully]

Hey everyone,

I am trying to decide which army i want to play with.
I've toyed with grey knights (as in assembled/painted the models), and i don't really like the models.
however, i am really interested i the Tau, and the Space Wolves really excite me.
Which should i pick?
:confused:
Thanks in advance,
Spark

P.S. i am a complete. beginner, as implied in the title.

[Wolfshade]

Pick which one you like the most :)

There are several ways to make a decision.

1) What is the latest army (and buy that)

2) Which army do you like the models the most of

3) Which army do you like the back story of best

Any choice is good :)

[Spark Sully]

Thank you very much, Wolfshade, but i like the grey knights. After actually taking a look at the models, i figured i actually like the grey knights. i reasoned that, if i lavished so much Nuln Oil, (that's a Citadel Wash), i actually ;like the grey knights. and besides GREYKNIGHTS ARE AWESOME!!!! They are so pure, they can stare a Bloodthirster (a greater Daemon of Khorne) in the face and not go crazy!
thanks for your time( and response),
Spark.

[Wolfshade]

You could always collect GKs and some other armies :)

[Spark Sully]

After some thinking, i think i will try to build up the grey knights army at the outset, and build the tau as a 2nd army.
What Do you think of the following:
1 Librarian
2 Strike squads (5 men each)
Justicar has falchions, others have swords
Incinerator (Each squad)
1 razorback
1 dreadnough tw/ assault cannon &missile launcher.
Total:511pts
Thanks,
Spark

[40kGamer]

Sounds like a good plan. When I got rolling in the hobby I did a 1 human to 1 xenos ratio as I collected the various races.

Are you looking for fluffy basement gaming fun type lists or hoping to mine the points to performance ratio meta? :p

[Spark Sully]

Thanks 40kGamer,
Good idea with that one-xenos-to-one-human ratio.
However, I'm really not sure about that second question, but one day, i want to play in a tournament w/ my GKs. On the other hand, i really enjoy the fluff too.
But then again, i think the points-to performance ratio meta sounds cool. What exactly does that mean?
Thanks on advance,
Spark.

[40kGamer]

I forgot to give a proper 'Welcome to the Party' mate! :)

Ours in a very diverse hobby. There are ultra competitive tourney folk, total fluff bunnies and some of us who try to find a happy path between. My favorite way to play is fluffy games with friends where we use most anything out of the codex not because it 'plays goods' but because we think it's cool, looks good or has a neat back story. I find this type of play satisfying and it works well with a smaller group where everyone is looking for the same type of game play experience.

On the flip side I do enjoy going to tournaments to meet new people and to see the wildly converted and beautifully painted armies. However tournament play is a very different environment from one's close group play and it also varies a lot by the event and the organizer. Often abbreviated as TO for tournament organizer, this is the person laying the rules and creating the atmosphere for their event. The best way to think of the TO is as the judge, jury and executioner.

Since people attending events are putting extra effort into winning you need to rethink your army. Things that work great in fluffy fun games can be a serious handicap at an event. For example I love to play Eldar as the army is all about specialization and movement. I also like playing with all the different aspect warriors... at least for fun. However taking Howling Banshees to an event is a terrible idea in the current rules as the points would be better invested in Jetbikes, Fire Dragons or honestly just about anything else.

With points to performance I'm referring to the fact that some things are a naturally better value and therefore more useful at an event where most everyone is mining their own codex for the best value units. I still don't play to the extreme where I only use what people perceive as the best value units (I've never fielded an Eldar army without taking a unit of Swooping Hawks simply because I love them). But I do make serious changes to my event army lists from my fluffy fun lists. So IMO we have to learn to adapt our play to match the environment we are playing in while still having fun. If something isn't fun on some level, it isn't worth doing. :p

[Spark Sully]

I wish to play mostly at my local gaming store, with my GKs, and win most of the time. Not ALL the time, but most of the time. What are the most balanced TROOPS choices for GKs?
Thanks in advance,
Spark.

[Kartr_Kana]

That's a tough question Spark as GK troop choices are very expensive. Which unfortunately means that while they are better than normal Marines you can't take as many and each one that goes down takes more points with it. Terminators are slightly harder to kill, but also cost more as well.

Since you already have two squads of justicars and a Rhino chassis I would start there for troops. Fill out both squads to 10 and put both squads in Rhinos. The rhino is cheap gives mobility and protection to your valuable squads.

Dreadknights seem to be very good and versatile so a couple of those are probably a good idea. Psycannons and Incinerators.

Librarian is a solid HQ, ML3 and give him a terminator bodyguard.

You might also think about allying in some other forces for heavy support, AA and cheap troops.

Oh and a cheeky little trick, if you combat squad your troops they count as two squads for all game purposes. So a 10 marine squad in a Rhino counts as 1 psychic dice, the same squad in the same rhino counts as two squads and generates two psychic dice if combat squaded.

[40kGamer]

I'll second the combat squad option. It is often underused but it's really cool!

[Kartr_Kana]

I'll second the combat squad option. It is often underused but it's really cool!

It's cool too because if you're facing an army that doesn't really do psychic stuff (Tau, Necrons, IG, Orks) you don't combat squad because you don't need the extra points and you want the extra survivability. If you're facing Demons or any other army that use lots of psychic power, you combat squad and hide from the ap3 flamers by keeping both squads in the rhino!

Ok I'm not a GK player, but here's what I think would be decent for a GK army:
+++ Grey Knights (1850pts) +++

++ Grey Knights: Codex (2014) (Combined Arms Detachment) ++

+ HQ +

Librarian [Nemesis warding stave, Psyker [ML 3], Storm bolter]

+ Troops +

Strike Squad [7x Grey Knight (sword), Rhino]
····2x Grey Knight (incinerator) [2x Incinerator]
····Justicar [Nemesis warding stave]

Strike Squad [7x Grey Knight (sword), Rhino]
····2x Grey Knight (incinerator) [2x Incinerator]
····Justicar [Nemesis warding stave]

Terminator Squad
····4x Terminator (falchions) [8x Nemesis falchion]
····Terminator (psycannon) [Psycannon, Two Nemesis falchions]
····Terminator Justicar [Nemesis warding stave]

+ Fast Attack +

Interceptor Squad
····9x Interceptor (falchions) [18x Nemesis falchion]
····Interceptor Justicar [Nemesis warding stave]

Stormraven Gunship [Extra armour, Searchlight, Twin-linked lascannon, Twin-linked multi-melta]

+ Heavy Support +

Nemesis Dreadknight [Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon, Nemesis greatsword and power fist, Personal teleporter]

Nemesis Dreadknight [Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon, Nemesis greatsword and power fist, Personal teleporter]

Created with BattleScribe (http://www.battlescribe.net)

[DarkLink]

Terminators are a far, far better troops option than Strike Squads. The main reason to take a Strike Squad would be to fill troop slots at minimal points. Otherwise, very meh.

[Kartr_Kana]

I did Strike Squads because he already has two min size units of them so this minimizes the extra stuff he has to get.

[Spark Sully]

I have only 1 strike squad, but I could buy another one, then my HQ. And so on.

[Kartr_Kana]

I have only 1 strike squad, but I could buy another one, then my HQ. And so on.

Well as Dark Link said, terminators are better troops. 2+ armour 5+invul and you can buff that to a 4++ as well.

[jenkatron]

The strike squads and termies are both solid troop choices.
Psychic Termies at 165 per squad with ObSec are very survivable and A LOT more cost effective than other marine books.

BUT I am all about the strike squads, at 20pts a dude. That is 6pts over a space marine and you get ...
deep strike
preferred enemy against a power dex in daemons
psychic powers
combat squad option for even more extra dice for attack and defence
psykout grenades
a storm bolter and a
FORCE WEAPON.

Ill say that again. 6pts over a space marine

All that on a troop choice that has excellent melee customisability and 'some' shooting flexibility.
My GK list always starts with one squad of 10 strike squad in a Rhino, making the most of the 20pt Grey Knight (Justicar is 30), with minimal upgrades, probably a daemon hammer on the justicar and one other dude. I'll then have a termie squad, and depending on what Im looking for either a couple of Storm Ravens or a couple of pimped out Dreadknights.

[jenkatron]

After some thinking, i think i will try to build up the grey knights army at the outset, and build the tau as a 2nd army.
What Do you think of the following:
1 Librarian
2 Strike squads (5 men each)
Justicar has falchions, others have swords
Incinerator (Each squad)
1 razorback
1 dreadnough tw/ assault cannon &missile launcher.
Total:511pts
Thanks,
Spark

Nice bread and butter to start from there - and IMO you have picked a great fun army to start with. Less models, easier to paint, store, manage transport, and they can be totally boss when used right.
A few notes on what you got there:
Libby - Nice. Level 3 in termie armor is my go to HQ choice.
Strike squads. Love it, probably want a hammer or two in there though for anti armor. Justicar with a daemon hammer and hammerhand is pretty boss at wrecking vehicles.
Rhino has a lot more flex than the razorback (fitting 10 dudes and with firing ports for them incinerators!)
Dreadnought lost a lot with the new dex and when you flesh out your collection he sadly might not see much use

I reckon your next purchases/ebay sniping should be looking for whatever you can get at a good price:
5 Terminators (again, at least one dude with a hammer!) or a Nemesis Dreadknight (might run the wallet a bit higher than 5 termies but they are MEGA. I run teleporter, hammer and incinerator as standard, psycannon and the force shooter if I have points to spare).

Have fun with em dude, the force power weapons and psychic powers can make you a REALLY REALLY strong matchup for certain armies (nids, daemons, certain dark eldar builds)

[Spark Sully]

I have made a modification to my GKs.
I gave the Justicar a stave, instead of the falchions
Also, should i give my dreadnought a power fist, an autocannon, or a missile launcher?
Thanks,
Spark.

[jenkatron]

Autocannon / Fist or Twin autocannons are my second favorite loadout for GK dreadnought

My first favorite is to make the "NOU" a "KNI" ! Sadly GW has been overcosting dreadnoughts for years.

[xTHExCLINCHERx]

Take a look at the 'Nemesis Strike Force' Formation and see what you can fit in there... one nice trick would be to turn your Strike Squad into Interceptors (they're the same kit anyway), start them on an Aegis line or Bastion with comms relay to better-guarantee your stuff arrives turn 1 from deepstrike... then shunt them up to join the party!

Terminators are way better than Strikes as troops... unfortunately when the psicannon got made salvo, Strikes lost a lot of utility.

Don't forget you have Draigo... he's out of control.

Paladins aren't worth it in my opinion anymore, especially because the Dreadknight is so much cheaper, can DS turn 1 as part of the special formation, and Terminators got so cheap. I'd take as many of these as you can. If you don't like the way they look (which is sorta the camp i'm in...) that stinks... perhaps opt for some Inquisition allies or something to scout-up the field (liber heresius) and join the turn 1 strike?

[Spark Sully]

Thanks to all who responded!
I purchased my librarian!
next on the list is a razorback with lascannons, dozer blade,an a storm bolter.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Spark

[Wolfshade]

Build it with magnets so you can have a razorback or rhino and then also swap the weapons out :)

[Spark Sully]

Sorry, Its been FOREVER!!!!
But i have purchased my razorback!!!
I have left the turret, and the top doors, unglued following WolfShade's advice.
Next on the list is a dreadnought.
what should i equip my dreadnought with?