Ork FAQ updated by GW

[Bigred]

The juicy part: Deffrollas can now tankshock vs vehicles...

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m970066a_2010_Orks_FAQ

[Melissia]

Mmmm....

[Drew da Destroya]

Deffrollas are now finally worth the plastic they're printed on.

[andrewm9]

Now they are ridiculous. It seems my sisters have little chance of surviing a ork horde with a few deffrollas since my cans can be rolled over then my suruving girls can be BBQ's or slaughtered in the ensuing assault.

[Cryl]

I'm inclined to agree with andrewm9 but at least GW finally made a ruling on this, even if it is an FAQ rather than an errata most players don't make a distinction.

[rbryce]

i dont really mind this. the more powered up other dexs get, the more my sisters will be upgraded when the time eventually comes...

[Old_Paladin]

Have to agree; makes them overpowered now.
The ablity to ram, do the extra hits, probably keep moving, maybe shock the unit aboard (with extra hits), shock/ram units further away...

Walkers don't stand a chance against them anymore.

[MarshalAdamar]

You still get a death or glory for walkers, and a S10 hit is nothing to sneeze at. And the side armor on the battle wagon is only 12 so it’s not exactly a juggernaught.

On the other hand, ouch d6 S10 hits will make a mess out of just about any vehicle, LR included.

[andrewm9]

You still get a death or glory for walkers, and a S10 hit is nothing to sneeze at. And the side armor on the battle wagon is only 12 so it’s not exactly a juggernaught.

On the other hand, ouch d6 S10 hits will make a mess out of just about any vehicle, LR included.

The wagon gets 1 auto hit on teh front armor whereas the the walker will now receive 2d6 STR10 hits. Still I suppose a small chance is better than none for the poor walker. If the walker fails to immobilize, wreck, or explode it however its auto-removed whatever the outcome of those 7 (on average) STR 10 hits.

[MVBrandt]

They are not overpowered, at all.

Side armor shots on battlewagons are easy, b/c of how long a rectangle they are, with a relatively narrow front. Exorcists are still their worst nightmare, unless the sisters player just sticks all 3 together and directly centered on the board across from all the wagons.

Orks needed this, and honestly it was the clear RAW ... omg you're kidding, the thing that says ramming is a tank shock was right ... ramming is actually a tank shock? ****, if only the rulebook said as much .. owait.

[Melissia]

Right, I just won't let them get into ramming range to begin with :P

[Drew da Destroya]

Right, I just won't let them get into ramming range to begin with :P

Seriously. I don't understand the uproar against this, considering the Rollawagon actually has to make contact with another vehicle first.

[andrewm9]

Right, I just won't let them get into ramming range to begin with :P

So all of your units stay out of a 13" circle of the wagon? Suppose thier are 3 with 2 Mek's with KFF then what? The fact that they can lug around their portable cover is pretty awesome.

[Kesher]

Better late than never....

[rbryce]

on a 4x6 table, you should easily manage to stay away. and the proliferation of melta in the metagame at the moment, heck, you can destroy one with most units available. and if you let anything get within 13" of your exorcist, somethings wrong.

[Xas]

The wagon gets 1 auto hit on teh front armor whereas the the walker will now receive 2d6 STR10 hits. Still I suppose a small chance is better than none for the poor walker. If the walker fails to immobilize, wreck, or explode it however its auto-removed whatever the outcome of those 7 (on average) STR 10 hits.

does ignorance hurt?

really, you should read the book...

[Absolutionis]

I wonder how this works regarding skimmers. Does one save dodge the whole slew?

This doesn't affect me too much as my armies either have all-fast or no vehicles, and the prevalence of DethRollas on Battlewagons means there's less Orks for me to care about.

Overall, on the bright side, mechanized lists got something that hurts them bad.
On the downside, Orks got yet another gimmick.

[andrewm9]

on a 4x6 table, you should easily manage to stay away. and the proliferation of melta in the metagame at the moment, heck, you can destroy one with most units available. and if you let anything get within 13" of your exorcist, somethings wrong.

Oh sure of course.I guess I'm just playing wrong. Nevermind that Orks can literally have a hundred + models in a 2000 point game.

[andrewm9]

does ignorance hurt?

really, you should read the book...

No need to be insulting. Perhaps I should insult your parentage in reply. I guess I will pass.

I thought if you death or glory the deff rolla you suffer 2d6 hits. I don't have my rules in front of me right now and I have never seen anyone ram a walker, so I assumed a death or glory worked as any other done by infantry.

[Lord Azaghul]

OMG!!!!! Orks are so broken now! I better sell my 1200 vendettas, 14,000 hydras, 2250 manticores 2750 medusas and 15,000 melta vets squads in chimeras and buy me an Ork army. :eek:

[MarshalAdamar]

No need to be insulting. Perhaps I should insult your parentage in reply. I guess I will pass.

I thought if you death or glory the deff rolla you suffer 2d6 hits. I don't have my rules in front of me right now and I have never seen anyone ram a walker, so I assumed a death or glory worked as any other done by infantry.

You are correct if a walker elects death or glory it IS subject to 2d6 S10 hits because its a unit that is making a death or glory stand. In addition a walker takes those hits to its REAR armor because the rules for walkers states that if a walker elects to death or glory against a vehicle ram and fails its hit on the rear armor.

So, you assumed correctly

[slxiii]

No need to be insulting. Perhaps I should insult your parentage in reply. I guess I will pass.

I thought if you death or glory the deff rolla you suffer 2d6 hits. I don't have my rules in front of me right now and I have never seen anyone ram a walker, so I assumed a death or glory worked as any other done by infantry.

if a walker fails its death or glory, it is hit on rear armour. Just as good as being auto removed as a death roller will literally do 2d6 penetrating hits.

[SombreBrotherhood]

Doesn't the squad/vehicle tank shocked STILL get mauled even if it stops the B-wagon? (no ork 'dex in front of me ATM)

[Nabterayl]

Yes, it does. The act of tank shocking inflicts d6 hits, and the act of a tank shock victim electing Death or Glory inflicts another d6 hits, whether or not the Death or Glory succeeds.

[Rapture]

Yes, it does. The act of tank shocking inflicts d6 hits, and the act of a tank shock victim electing Death or Glory inflicts another d6 hits, whether or not the Death or Glory succeeds.

This is what I don't like. The problem I have with this whole death roller situation is that it causes serious damage no matter what happens.

[Nabterayl]

I can understand that, although it raises an interesting balance issue for the deffrolla. Because it can only be used in a tank shock, a deffrolla necessarily places a minimum 110-point investment at risk. If the deffrolla didn't cause hits regardless of Death or Glory outcome, its expected lethality against many targets would be extraordinarily low. In fact, the only time I've ever successfully gotten a deffrolla to its target, the battlewagon was meltabombed into oblivion, leaving the passengers at the mercy of an infantry platoon. Didn't even manage to kill the entire Rough Rider squadron, despite the 2d6 hits (which is expected; 2d6 hits should only kill about 4 guardsmen).

Really, I think this has less to do with the deffrolla and more to do with the bizarre fragility of walkers in certain situations, personally. This isn't the first time that walkers have seemed more fragile than they seem like they should be.

[Melissia]

Yeah, I'm thinking that GW should really rework walkers...

[MVBrandt]

I may have missed some in this whole discussion, don't know, but this really isn't game breaking at all. It's practically necessary. Seriously. We've *always* used deffrollas as affecting vehicles, and if you can't deal w/ it you've got bigger issues in your game in general.

Orks really needed this.

[Cthulhu]

Walkers have been in need of a rework for years. I haven't fielded a CSM dreadnought in years, even thought I have 3 of them. I have always hated the fact that the Eldar dreadnoughts are not vehicles and have felt that it's a huge inconsistency in the game. Why not make all dreadnoughts like Wraithlords (at least in terms of their statline)? As it stands I have little respect or concern for any non-eldar/dark eldar dreadnought I see on the table these days.

[Nabterayl]

Oh, totally. My gaming group is in the same situation as yours, and has had the same experience. I do agree with Rapture, though, that it is odd that a squad of Guardsmen can Death or Glory a deffrolla wagon and come out more or less intact, whereas a walker that does the same will almost certainly get pancaked.

[MVBrandt]

Well, yes. It's also IMO far worse for a monstrous creature to death or glory a wagon than a guard squad.

I don't think death or glorying AV14 is EVER a wise idea no matter what, especially when it has a KFF against that lovely meltagun (though not the meltabomb, heh).

A single turn 1 vendetta is often adequate solution for a Battlewagon, as are any number of other vehicles with long range anti-AV12 that can move more than an inch and fire.