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Mr Mystery
12-30-2014, 09:33 AM
How do?

So, I want to discuss the two rumours doing the rounds, and what they might bode for the future assuming of course, that they're true.

In short - apparently/allegedly/hopefully (delete to preference) we're getting Harlequins and Adeptus Mechanicus as Codecies. And that has quite a lot of excitement attached to it. Spesh for me, as I really want plastic Ad Mech stuff! Rumours are that the Codecies are around 85pp. Which isn't many.

But before we look at the future, let's squizz in Histor's Eye... Since 6th Edition came out, GW have managed to update all the existing armies barring SoB. That's no mean feat in a single two and a half year period. Especially given their previous release rate, where some armies languished on Codecies two editions out of date. And to boot, pretty much everyone got spangly new toys to play with (sole exception so far being Grey Knights).

Which is great - except, well - where the devil do the go from here?

And this is where the rumours come in. The two mentioned above, whilst certainly nothing to be sniffed at in a bout of fisticuffs, aren't exactly noted for launching their own protracted campaigns. Harlequins simply don't have the numbers, instead tending to jump into already active warzones for their own inscrutable reasons (and given their deity, 'having a laugh' is almost certainly one, even if nobody else finds that joke funny). Ad Mech? Well, they've got the toys sure, but even during the Great Crusade, they played a much more supporting role, lending their Battle Automata to the efforts of others, rather than efforts their own.

Net result? I think we might be seeing an expansion of allies into the game. Smaller armies which, in the style of Imperial Knights, are probably at their best being allied or having allies, but can still field a full army of their own, albeit one of more limited variety.

And that got me thinking - where else might this go, if of course I'm right?

In short - anywhere. Let's consider the Chaos Legions - very much wanted. Very much. They're the big bad of 40k, but right now aren't really all that Legionny. Not just in the background, where they fragmented into much smaller warbands, but in the game. Sure I can field Khorne Beserkers - but where's the other snacky World Eater toys? Anyone can be a Khorne Beserker - but World Eaters are something apart. And an ally type Codex might just do the trick for them. No need for an extensive and slightly genre stretching list. Just a few units, four or five, who sum up what it is to be a blood crazed, semi-lobotomised post-human psychopath who has spent the last 10,000 years angrier than something very angry... Enough that you could field them as a full army, if you didn't mind it being somewhat single purpose (ok, triple purpose of Killing, Maiming and Burning), but with enough flavour to represent them going for a jolly in real space, and other Warbands knowing a good fight when they see one.

Likewise the other three of the 'big four'. It's an immediate way to give them some nice models and new rules, without making them completely central to the Chaos Space Marines.

Genestealer Cults - well, why not. Sure they don't tend to fight alongside their benevolent Tyranid Overseers once the Hive Fleets rock up, instead getting down to the nitty gritty of willingly getting scoffed - but as an 'ally' for say IG? Yep that could work. New codex, some new units, add in Genestealers to the book, and you're pretty much rocking.

Anyone else got thoughts? Would the game benefit from fractional factions predominantly there to be allies?

Charistoph
12-30-2014, 10:05 AM
Sisters were updated to 6th. Not in hardback, but they WERE updated.

Harlequins are supposed to be coming after Necrons.

Room in my mind for Genestealer Cults and Kroot Mercs.

JMichael
12-30-2014, 11:53 AM
I think adding smaller codices that are Ally minded is a great idea and can often be done with few new models.
Eldar Craftworlds! So far we just have Iyanden and that book only has 1-2 pages of actual rules.
As you said, lots can be done with CSM and I would love to see a Word Bearers chapter. As I recall they are the only CSM chapter that still has Chaplains...I want some Chaos chaplains!
Genestealer cults would be amazing and sell really, really, well I think.

I also really like the Campaign book series model they are pushing out. And that they are finally releasing models and datasheets that are not int he codex. It shows their willingness and ability to 'fix' or rather expand an army without having to spend the time and money on whole new book.

Asymmetrical Xeno
12-30-2014, 01:37 PM
I've wanted them to do stuff like this for a very long time now so I am all for it.

It opens the possibility of introducing new xenos races too, allows them to test the waters and reduces the risk that comes with introducing a "full" army - especially since the allies makes it appeal to X amount of collectors. Kroot mercs would be the most obvious choice, but if it leads to some proper alieny aliens I'm all for it.

I've always found the endless codex cycle to be rather boring, especially in the last several years - unlike most people i don't care about the rules and power levels and i didn't even mind waiting several years for a new codex for my main army - it's the kits and backround I am excited for and I would rather see new and exciting things (like the Knight, that was exactly the stuff I was wanting to see) than stuff for existing factions but I know I am likely in the minority in that regard but this way of having fringe factions is the perfect middle ground and compromise.

Bring it on.

Mr Mystery
12-30-2014, 04:14 PM
Xenos races is an interesting one.

Wonder if we'll see them introduced as Tau allies, to be Battle Brothers, but available to others as Mercs of some kind.

There's a lot of potential there. After all, the galaxy is a huge old place!

We might even get specialised IG regiments - those that excel in specific fields of war (not that they're guaranteed that in the IG)

Asymmetrical Xeno
12-30-2014, 04:49 PM
Allies or Mercs of the Tau is the obvious choice for sure (Kroot), but theres also potential with Dark Eldar (they have Sslyth ect), and to a lesser extent Eldar, Necrons (since they arent all anti-fleshythings now ect) and Orks (?)

Honestly, my biggest pet peeve is the lack of xenos in general. It's a huge galaxy but theres only like six alien races in the entire game that are playable as armies, I don't have a problem with the amount of imperial stuff like other people either - i just think there should be more aliens and I think fringe armies are arguably the best way to go aobut it. We know there are others that have a great deal of military power like the Hrud Migrations too.

Personally I believe in the designers and think whatever they put their minds to they could make even the most odd ideas appealing - especially if Jes Goodwin is involved. S**t I'm being really positive about GW! my bad...

I guess kroot would be the obvious choice to begin with (and fair play) but Id' rather have some squiggly things.

Mr Mystery
12-30-2014, 04:51 PM
Well, from seminars we know that the Design Studio Team have lots of stuff on their personal wishlists - and we may be about to see some of the more commerically viable ones come out to play.

After all, there's 'I want to do Ad Mech, Kroot and Harelquins', and there's 'I want fartywindbagaliens and some that are pure energy' which might be a bit on the tenuous side when it comes to models!

Asymmetrical Xeno
12-30-2014, 05:02 PM
Well, from seminars we know that the Design Studio Team have lots of stuff on their personal wishlists - and we may be about to see some of the more commerically viable ones come out to play.

After all, there's 'I want to do Ad Mech, Kroot and Harelquins', and there's 'I want fartywindbagaliens and some that are pure energy' which might be a bit on the tenuous side when it comes to models!

They can always hire me for guidance on that ;)

But in seriousness, I believe they could do energy based creatures really well i think - look at those recent Nagash undead Spirit hosts. They look super cool.

windchild
12-30-2014, 09:20 PM
I'd love to see more campaigns, focused on expanding on certain events in the lore.

However, campaigns could instead be used to add minor forces in, with the campaign book containing their full codex.

Also, Sisters were updated during 6th edition.

Mr Mystery
12-31-2014, 07:24 AM
Campaigns would be a good way to showcase the role each force plays in a wider conflict. Stormclaw one did this for the Imperial Knights with aplomb if you ask me. Really got across that whilst an ally to a given Imperial Ally, they really are under their own steam!

Battle 1-2
12-31-2014, 07:47 AM
Another thing that we're all missing out on is the ability to test the waters on these ideas. Dark Vengeance was a boxed set with Dark Angels and Chaos forces, right? They added two subsequent expansions for each side, right?

Imagine giving the next boxed set a limited run expansion that includes Adeptus Mechanicus forces with a rulebook for AM allied formations. How many want to bet you could sell that boxed set out in 5 minutes? Of course, you'd have to give something similar to the other side, too.

Just thinking off the wall here, imagine a Space Marines vs Tau boxed set. 5 Assault Marines, a chaplain with a jetpack, a tac marine squad with ML and flamer, and either a Dread or a Terminator squad with AC. For the Tau, a Crisis suit commander, 10-man Kroot squad, Fire Warrior squad, Stealth team, and a pirhana or something. So, take that as the basic boxed set, it's like 450 points for each side, and not a perfect HQ + 2 troops for the Marines, but whatever.
Then add an expansion. Limited release. Add your Kroot mercs to the Tau side as one limited run boxed set, and add Adeptus Mechanicus to the Space Marine side. Just maybe two units for each of these boxed sets - sell 'em at $90USD with 7-10 models (at least one of which is unique, or has unique options), and with special rules for the detachment, just like in the new SM vs Tyranid boxed set.

Or you could make it Imperial Gua... Astra Militarum vs Tau, and add Imperial Assassins as the boxed set for the Imperial side. Not like you need a whole rulebook for that, but you could sell 5 models and a rulebook for $90USD really easily if you were including all your assassin models and rules. EASILY. Especially if it has rules for a detachment that can be attached to any Imperial army? Who has an Imperial army that wouldn't jump all over that boxed set?

Best of all, you could do Sisters or Grey Knights vs. Chaos and add your highly sought after Chaos expansion with detachment rules, and add an Inquisition expansion. I always assume that GW wants to keep the number of models in the boxed set down in order to maximize the profit, so going with expensive (points-wise) armies like Grey Knights would make it feasible to sell a boxed set that included just 12 models per side for $125USD.

Anyway, that's just me sharing my early morning, post-breakfast thoughts.