Avengers: Age of Ultron [Archive] - BoLS Lounge : Wargames, Warhammer & Miniatures Forum

40kGamer

10-23-2014, 07:18 AM

I dunno.

Man of Steel was rubbish. And Ben 'get some acting lessons mate' Affleck as Batman?

Serious concerns about them taking the reverse approach, and leading with the ensemble movie. Do non-geeks, which make up a significant portion of Marvel's audience really know enough about Cyborg, Aquaman, hell even Wonder Woman, to care about the characters without a 'hand holding' intro movie?

I actually think you nailed the reason why they need to do the combo movie. The general movie audience probably does not know all that much about these characters so putting them in with Batman and Superman will help introduce them. Actually clever if you think on it...

Although I still fear DC will find a way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. As much as a person may worry over Affleck, Gal Gadot is an even bigger stretch. I'm still hoping they pull it together in the end.

DWest

10-23-2014, 07:25 AM

More to the point, Zach Snyder is directing it, will there even be time in between the slo-mo goresplosions to *notice* the characters?

Mr Mystery

10-23-2014, 07:27 AM

I actually think you nailed the reason why they need to do the combo movie. The general movie audience probably does not know all that much about these characters so putting them in with Batman and Superman will help introduce them. Actually clever if you think on it...

Although I still fear DC will find a way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. As much as a person may worry over Affleck, Gal Gadot is an even bigger stretch. I'm still hoping they pull it together in the end.

It worked for Marvel! Iron Man, Thor, Hawkeye, Black Widow, Nick Fury - not exactly the best non-geek known characters. Lead in movies showed us who they were, why they're cool, and why they're not good team workers for the best part.

DC's approach could pay off - but I'm uncharacteristically pessimistic about it.

eldargal

10-23-2014, 07:34 AM

Well he did ok with Lois in the first half of MoS so fingers crossed...

Also apparently Gal Gadot can act when she has a script which lets her, so here's hoping that is true.

- - - Updated - - -

https://38.media.tumblr.com/d29c0a08366d59ec2ed81706d19b90a1/tumblr_ndw5980Qto1qbgsmko1_500.gif
GIVE HER HER OWN FILM ALREADY MARVEL!

Mr Mystery

10-23-2014, 07:40 AM

Am I the only one hearing a pooping noise when she gets dropped off?

40kGamer

10-23-2014, 07:50 AM

Also apparently Gal Gadot can act when she has a script which lets her, so here's hoping that is true!

I'll be keeping my fingers crossed! I have to think that she nailed it during the casting to get such a coveted role.

Mr Mystery

10-23-2014, 08:12 AM

I'll be keeping my fingers crossed! I have to think that she nailed it during the casting to get such a coveted role.

Or, being Hollywood, had exported her decolletage for the delctation of the gentlemen therepresent in the most alluring way (not saying she's done wrong or dodgy. Just stating how many female casting decisions appear to be doled out)

Darren Richardson

10-29-2014, 07:39 AM

Marvel has release more footage from the new film, and the second half includes extra footage not seen in the first trailer...

http://www.marvel.com/videos/watch/4843/marvels_avengers_age_of_ultron_-_special_look

Mr Mystery

10-29-2014, 07:44 AM

Certain moment in that......

Also also wik....

Teaser for Agent Carter (http://www.denofgeek.com/tv/agent-carter/32702/first-teaser-arrives-for-marvel-s-agent-carter)

Brakkart

10-29-2014, 07:59 AM

I love the idea of a party game being "Who can lift Thor's Hammer?" and the fact that Cap actually manages to move it (and the look on Thor's face when he does!)

http://youtu.be/eGwuoYKhqx8

Mr Mystery

10-29-2014, 08:02 AM

I love the idea of a party game being "Who can lift Thor's Hammer?" and the fact that Cap actually manages to move it (and the look on Thor's face when he does!)

That's the one! Reckon it's helping set up Civil War a smidge more....

eldargal

10-29-2014, 08:04 AM

I love the idea of a party game being "Who can lift Thor's Hammer?" and the fact that Cap actually manages to move it (and the look on Thor's face when he does!)

I actually think there is an interesting angle with Black Widow there, she is the onl one apart from Hawkeye who doesn't try to lift it? Yet she has shown she is incredibly selfless on numerous occassions, putting the survival of others ahead of herself. If Marvel were on the ball they could be setting her up to actually have a moment where she is forced to wield Mjolnir and is actually able to do so. It happened in the comics once.

Darren Richardson

10-29-2014, 08:06 AM

Certain moment in that......

Also also wik....

Teaser for Agent Carter (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-29815429)

Um no that's something about gay marrige Mystery...

Mr Mystery

10-29-2014, 08:09 AM

I actually think there is an interesting angle with Black Widow there, she is the onl one apart from Hawkeye who doesn't try to lift it? Yet she has shown she is incredibly selfless on numerous occassions, putting the survival of others ahead of herself. If Marvel were on the ball they could be setting her up to actually have a moment where she is forced to wield Mjolnir and is actually able to do so. It happened in the comics once.

Yep. That would be cool.

As for the Agent Carter link - try it now!

Brakkart

10-29-2014, 09:27 AM

I actually think there is an interesting angle with Black Widow there, she is the onl one apart from Hawkeye who doesn't try to lift it? Yet she has shown she is incredibly selfless on numerous occassions, putting the survival of others ahead of herself. If Marvel were on the ball they could be setting her up to actually have a moment where she is forced to wield Mjolnir and is actually able to do so. It happened in the comics once.

Yeah I love that show of self-confidence on her part where she calmly states that she doesn't need to know if she is worthy. Would be pretty awesome moment in the film if she does pick up the hammer!

YorkNecromancer

10-29-2014, 09:56 AM

Wildeybeast

10-29-2014, 11:08 AM

DWest

10-29-2014, 01:16 PM

Affleck isn't what I would call a "go-to" name for Batman, however, and I don't see him being able to make a good showing with Zach Snyder directing.

Let me make it clear, while I'm not terribly interested in Justice League, I want to see it done well. If nothing else, Marvel is going to get lazy and stupid without some quality competition. I don't believe, based on what information is available, that this movie will be that quality competition.

YorkNecromancer

10-29-2014, 01:39 PM

Marvel is going to get lazy and stupid without some quality competition.

Marvel has competition. It's literally anything else you can spend your entertainment money on. Literally every other film is Marvel's competition. There are people who go to see 'superhero films' and people who go to see 'films'. One of these groups is smaller than the other, and Marvel's success has been appealing to the larger of the two. Saying DC is the only company who can really compete with Marvel is like saying Muhammed Ali in his prime needed to fight a drunk homeless guy with one leg and narcolepsy because they both own coats.

DC is not Marvel's competition in the world of cinema, only in comics. In the world of cinema, Marvel's competitor is everyone else.

Also, who does DC have? Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman... that green naked man with the belts... some girl in a bad hat with wings and some kind of mace... the fruity one...

DC's main problem is that, with the exception of Batman, its characters are basically completely ridiculous and were invented for nine year olds. Which, as 'Batman: The Brave and The Bold' AND 'Teen Titans' proved, can be AWESOME. But DC don't want to make fun films for nine years olds. They can't see why something like 'The Incredibles' works. All they can see is Batman: grim, gritty, darker and edgier. Which on someone like Green Lantern? Is f**ing facile. Some characters can be dark and edgy successfully. But there's a reason people didn't like the fact Superman killed Zod in 'Man of Steel'.

DC should be doing a Pixar with a lot of its properties; choosing tones which match their characters' various personae. But they can't, because they're fixated on Grimdark and hotshotting the films. They want 'Avengers' money now, not realising that kind of payday is earned through the slow burn, not suddenly.

Unless they're very, very clever, they will fail.

Eldar_Atog

10-29-2014, 02:11 PM

Also, who does DC have? Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman... that green naked man with the belts... some girl in a bad hat with wings and some kind of mace... the fruity one...

You are pretty spot on but I have to disagree on this one point. DC has some really good characters besides Batman. Martian Manhunter could be interesting.. if done right. Even Hawkgirl... but they can't give them the gritty treatment.

It would have been sooooo easy to screw up the Thor movie. The odds against that movie were so long.. but they managed to make a great movie. Hawkeye isn't much better. They turned a character most would consider a D-lister and had him filling an important part of the Avengers movie.

The way you treat your characters is just as important as the characters you use. Think about this: Marvel is planning on making an Ant Man movie and it'll probably be great. If Ant Man can have a great movie, then anyone can have a great movie :)

DarkLink

10-29-2014, 08:38 PM

eldargal

10-30-2014, 03:35 AM

I read it that she knows she's not. She's the most bloodstained and previously murderous of all The Avengers after all. It's kind of her gimmick.

So yeah, would be awesome if she was found to be worthy. That would be a serious mark-out moment if written properly.

I think she thinks she isn't worthy, because she thinks worthy = purity. But in Winter Soldier for example she blew her own cover and let all her secrets out and when she was under attack instead of zigzagging which would have put civilians in the firing line she ran away from WS in a straight line and lots of little things like that.

Morgrim

10-30-2014, 05:26 AM

I agree with eldargal. Black Widow knows what she's done and doesn't shy away from it. She admits it and tries to fix things. The way she goes about redeeming herself isn't always the best, and she doesn't seem to actually believe she can do enough to wipe her slate clean, but she tries and that counts for quite a bit.

It's a straight that Iron Man sometimes shares with her. Unfortunately for him he has a monumental ego that frequently gets in the way and sends him sliding backwards. But wasn't there a moment in one of the What-If comics where Stark very briefly snatched up Mjolnir and successfully fended off an attack to defend Thor (much to everyone's astonishment, he was trying to use it to stop a skid) and then got egoistic and promptly had it nearly land on his foot?*

*It is entirely possible I am confusing this was a particularly well made fan comic, I've never regularly followed Marvel and have no idea where this was from

Mr Mystery

10-30-2014, 06:39 AM

That's the problem with DC movies. They keep planning out all this "we're going to copy Marvel and have superheroes face off and have an overarching story and...", but that's not why Marvel has been successful. Marvel has been successful because they consistently put out good movies. Guardians of the Galaxy blew away expectations precisely because everyone seems to think the key to success was introducing heroes and then cramming them into a movie and so they didn't expect unknown heroes to do well.

Yes, yes, yes, a thousand times YES.

The Marvel films are all highly watchable, and usually within the right area of family viewing, without being 'namby pamby nobody dies or actually gets hurt'. They're movies that the whole family can get something out of and enjoy. Much like the original Star Wars trilogy.

Most of all? The Marvel films are fun. Whether by accident or design is immaterial, but Marvel have absolutely nailed it. The fact that what, 10 films in, and their audience continues to grow? That's golden. That is truly golden. There is no sign they've had some early hits then figured 'if we film it, they will come' - something which dragged down Episode 1 of Star Wars, to the point it left enough of a bad taste in the moviegoing collective's mouth that it tainted the next two films (which are actually really rather good for the most part).

DC however have gone a bit 'Torchwood, Season 1'. They've claimed it's dark and gritty - but it just doesn't work that well, because barring Bats, their characters aren't especially dark and gritty by nature - that's one of their appeals as comic books. Why they would try to film something the character isn't is quite beyond me.

YorkNecromancer

10-30-2014, 09:30 AM

I think she thinks she isn't worthy, because she thinks worthy = purity.

Oh, absolutely. Ironically, she's pretty much the most qualified apart from Thor to hold the hammer. I was reading about Beta Ray Bill last night, and came across this:

During a "Thor Spotlight" panel at the Baltimore Comic Con, August 28, 2010, 'Thor' writer Walter Simonson further stated:

One of the cool things about Thor was the enchantment around Mjolnir and the original inscription on it. So I thought, well that means someone else can pick up this hammer and get this power, if they're worthy! So since then, some other big characters, people's favorites, have picked up the hammer, Captain America, Superman, whoever. But at this point, no one had ever picked up the hammer. I liked the idea of Cap walking to the bathroom and seeing it, and grabbing and just tugging, not being able to. So this had to be someone new. This is the most powerful weapon of the Norse gods. This hammer is a killing weapon. It's used to kill Frost Giants and others. So, Superman couldn't pick it up, cause he's never going to kill anyone, and the hammer knows that. Captain America, he's too patriotic. He's too much a symbol of America to be chosen by this Norse artifact. So he couldn't get it. So I created Bill because he's noble, and he's designed to kill. He's got a great purpose as a warrior, and also the noble ability. That makes him "worthy" whatever that may be.

So one of the definitions of 'worthy' is:
1.) Noble of heart.
2.) A killer.

That's a really interesting idea - the fact that in his opinion Superman couldn't lift it because he'd never use it to kill with. I mean, yes, I know this happened:

http://geek-news.mtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/jlaavengers4.jpg

but still. Of all of them, I think Black Widow is the most qualified. She's not got Stark's ego, she's not dedicated to a single country like Cap, she's not got Hulk's lack of focus, and she's significantly less of a jabroni than Hawkeye (who, and let's be fair here, is basically making up the numbers). I could get behind Widow armed with the might of a god.

In fact, I wonder if that's the narrative reason why she refuses to pick up the hammer? That the little clip isn't just a charming comedy scene but a Chekov's Gun, and that actually, she's the only other person who can raise the hammer? So when all the 'heavy hitters' are out, she picks up the hammer and whomps on Ultron with it?

That would be f***awesome.

Mr Mystery

10-30-2014, 09:57 AM

That could be the reason for the tender 'fist bump' bit between her and Hulk......

bfmusashi

10-30-2014, 09:58 AM

I read it that she knows she's not. She's the most bloodstained and previously murderous of all The Avengers after all. It's kind of her gimmick.

So yeah, would be awesome if she was found to be worthy. That would be a serious mark-out moment if written properly.
Thor's a big blonde murder machine, as is Cap. Black Widow may just not have the body count to slake it's blood lust. Or, the motive for grabbing the hammer matters, it's never been clear how it works.

Mr Mystery

10-30-2014, 10:10 AM

Thor's a big blonde murder machine, as is Cap. Black Widow may just not have the body count to slake it's blood lust. Or, the motive for grabbing the hammer matters, it's never been clear how it works.

Well, Thor's hammer didn't have Odin's enchantment when he was a git - indeed it was his attempted invasion of wherever Ice Trolls lived that lead to the enchantment being put on it.

It is a weapon of war, and construction - Odin covers that in the first film :p

So, Black Widow could well be found worthy, as she is on a path of personal redemption and self sacrifice - both of which I would largely consider pretty noble.

eldargal

10-31-2014, 06:42 AM

I think Black Widows kill count rivals Captain America, if not Thor perhaps.

bfmusashi

10-31-2014, 09:04 AM

We don't know for sure though and she's in espionage, a field that tends to frown on kill counts but values efficiency of action. She is also, I think. the only character not shown making a mistake. Cap is a weapon of war that got dropped like a bomb and Thor, well he didn't get the hammer back until there was an immediate episode of violence.
Besides, it won't be fun if they show her lifting it before the plot can make it rad.

eldargal

01-13-2015, 08:02 AM

New trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZoO8QVMxkk

Darren Richardson

01-14-2015, 06:42 AM

ohh Can't wait it looks AMAZING!

eldargal

02-28-2015, 05:11 AM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-3eCNgUEAAGjoQ.jpg:large
Marvel finally gets a BW poster right, one that isn't photoshopped to hell or showing off her bum.

Mud Duck

02-28-2015, 12:57 PM

I would question the Photoshop, some of the shadows on her neck and chin questionable. Plus the glow, why oh why must everything white glow? Oh and there's the background. And what's wrong with her bum? :)

Darren Richardson

02-28-2015, 05:46 PM

it possibley is a photoshop job, because she was pregent while filming this one..... they had to use body doubles during filming for long shots.

eldargal

03-01-2015, 03:31 AM

Of course it's photoshopped, I mean they haven't photoshopped her into an impossibly thin waisted waif

Darren Richardson

03-01-2015, 03:58 AM

Of course it's photoshopped, I mean they haven't photoshopped her into an impossibly thin waisted waif

That is true, her waist and bust are much more in keeping with a lady who works out and keeps herself in good shape on a regular basis rather then being 'airbrushed' into a cartoon.

DrLove42

03-05-2015, 01:59 AM

http://youtu.be/JAUoeqvedMo

Sploooosh

Mr Mystery

03-05-2015, 02:07 AM

Yep.

It really is looking damned fine!

Darren Richardson

03-05-2015, 02:53 AM

yeah looka amazing, but who the heck is that at the very end?

Mr Mystery

03-05-2015, 02:55 AM

The Vision

Psychosplodge

03-05-2015, 05:37 AM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-3eCNgUEAAGjoQ.jpg:large
Marvel finally gets a BW poster right, one that isn't photoshopped to hell or showing off her bum.

But butt.... :confused:

So will this have Thermoman in it then?

Insert_nickname_here

03-05-2015, 02:56 PM

exported her decolletage for the delctation of the gentlemen therepresent

Raffles?

Mr Mystery

03-05-2015, 06:30 PM

Yes. Raffles The Gentleman a Thug.

Darren Richardson

03-22-2015, 01:48 AM

April can't end quick enough.....

http://www.marvel.com/videos/watch/5003/marvels_avengers_age_of_ultron_-_tv_spot_2

New Trailer out......

Mr Mystery

03-22-2015, 03:16 PM

31 days for us in the UK. Give or take.

eldargal

04-15-2015, 06:49 AM

8 days or so now.

Mr Mystery

04-23-2015, 05:20 AM

Aaaaaand got me tickets booked for to see it on Saturday night, at 21:30 hours.

Luvverly.

Tyrendian

04-23-2015, 05:26 AM

for me it's today, half past eight with a bunch of friends - so yay! :)

Psychosplodge

04-23-2015, 05:52 AM

woohoo! only six to eight months for the dvd/bluray release :D

Tyrendian

04-23-2015, 04:24 PM

well that was brilliant - one of those cases where the hype is totally justified in my opinion! Only complaint is that it's too short....

Darren Richardson

04-24-2015, 01:57 AM

well that was brilliant - one of those cases where the hype is totally justified in my opinion! Only complaint is that it's too short....

Amazing film, the end set piece was totally stonking, pity not everyone will be in the next one, I chuckled when Thanos showed up in the credits and moaned about having to do it himself LOL

Mr Mystery

04-24-2015, 02:00 AM

No spoilers.

Or I'll spoil your face with a ride-on lawnmower :p

Tzeentch's Dark Agent

04-24-2015, 03:00 AM

I saw it last night, very good. I don't know why a few of the things were in the film, they kinda broke the pacing of the film for me, but overall, a pretty good film.

Mr Mystery

04-26-2015, 05:30 AM

I was impressed.

Best bit? When punch ups are going on, the action is easy to follow - none of the BLUROFACTION nonsense Hollywood usually seems to favour.

Paintingplasticcrack

05-04-2015, 06:20 PM

I went to see it last night on 3D IMAX. Very good, but a bit lacking in the Hulk dept though. Sets up Civil War and the Infinity Wars nicely.

eldargal

05-09-2015, 04:29 AM

Saw it last night, really enjoyed it, can see why people are upset about Black Widow's characterisation but honestly I don't think it was as bad as some people were saying. Scarlet Witch was great, Vision too.

Also saw the Ant-Man film trailer, my reaction being:
http://media.giphy.com/media/b9lPSw48AzRFm/giphy.gif
It looks so bad lol, so very, very bad. Even putting aside the fact they are killing off the female founder of the Avengers off screen to give angst to a male character who isn't even the main star of the film it just looks awful.

Mr Mystery

05-09-2015, 05:37 AM

I'm kind of looking forward to Ant-Man now. Looks like it might be good fun.

eldargal

05-09-2015, 07:59 AM

I'm not, thought it looked terrible lol. dull, unfunny and just really really dumb.

YorkNecromancer

05-09-2015, 10:51 AM

Saw 'Avengers 2' last week when it came out. Thought it was lovely. No real themes, it's not about any big ideas, it's not remotely close to literature. It's just a fun, switch-your-brain-off piece of destruction porn.

I have to say as well, I'd honestly watch an entire film of the Avengers sat around doing nothing and chatting. All the best scenes were the ones where they weren't fighting; the party scenes were easily the best bits of the film for me. These are some really interesting people, and their interactions are a lot more fascinating than any explosion.

Ultron was a fine villain as well, which is something Marvel films often miss (Looking at you, Malekith the Generic. HOW do you waste Christopher Eccleston's infinite capacity to be terrifying, Marvel? Have you not seen 'Shallow Grave' or '28 Days Later'?!). Have to say, though, I did keep comparing Ultron to Samaritan from 'Person of Interest'; got to say, the Avengers are bloody lucky they weren't dealing with Samaritan. They'd have no chance if they were.

Also, I really liked the Widow/Hulk scenes. Johannsen and Ruffalo have the most incredible chemistry, and the relationship actually made sense for both of them. Yes, there's some severely problematic issues with Widow's SPOILER'I am incomplete without a child' angst arc, and even more with SPOILER Hulk becoming her sort-of surrogate baby, but they actual gave her quite a lot of things to do, and more of a personality this time.

I think the film also had a few issues with its black characters (namely reducing War Machine to a punchline and including Falcon to 0.04 second cameo) but hopefully that's something which will be remedied in future films SPOILER especially given the final line-up of Avengers at the film's close.

So yeah, I basically really liked it; the issues that were there seem to largely be part of the systemic problem of Hollywood issues as much as anything else.

'Ant-Man', on the other hand, looks like an absolute piece of sh!t. How is that crap getting made instead of 'Runaways' or an actually GOOD 'Punisher' film? It's beyond me. The Avengers have The Vision now. They need more fruity heroes like they need Ben Affleck playing Tony Stark.

Mud Duck

05-09-2015, 04:34 PM

York, is that what the problem that everyone is having with the way she was/ is written? I guess that I see it more as a SPOILER 'she's had the one thing that made her female, the ability to create new life, and replaced with only the 'ability' to kill, or a more 'male' trait.' Remember the guy that she shot in the flashback, I'm guessing that he was her father or a close male relative that she may have been ordered to kidnap in the first place, think of it as a 'breaking of ties' too everything and everyone outside of the Academy (whatever the name). You are no longer a person, you are a tool. Everything that you do is in the interest of the State. The State is Mother. The State is Father. The State is Everything. If that makes any sense.

DarkLink

05-09-2015, 04:53 PM

And considering that they brought it up right as contrast to Bruce Banner was being emotionally distraught over not being able to have kids... The movie had very strong themes about whether or not the fighting the Avengers did was a good or bad thing, or if they deserved the chance to have a home and raise a family. Captain America's bad dream was all about how he didn't think he could return to a home life with family and kids after so many years of fighting. Stark's whole motivation was to allow the Avengers to all retire. Given that context, and the fact that most people would probably consider it to be pretty messed up to sterilize people to make them more "efficient" at their job and that being raised in such a manner might have long-lasting emotional impacts, I would say that you're reaching a bit. A Michael Bay movie this is not.

The all-white guy thing is definitely standard hollywood status quo, though.

YorkNecromancer

05-09-2015, 05:22 PM

is that what the problem that everyone is having with the way she was/ is written?

In a nutshell. This article (http://io9.com/black-widow-this-is-why-we-can-t-have-nice-things-1702333037) is pretty fantastic, and basically sums up all the issues with Widow. I can't find a single thing in it I disagree with, and it made me notice a lot of stuff I hadn't while my brain was just going 'wheeeeee, explosions!' at the cinema.

Bottom line, Widow's done fairly well in A:AoU, but there are still deep, deep problems.

As for the issue you discuss, one of the comic writers' who is most directly responsible for the modern version of Widow was talking in this also excellent article (http://io9.com/how-to-make-black-widow-truly-awesome-according-to-ric-1703159410) and summed up that SPOILER the issue isn't that she wants children but can't have them; basically she's not really interested in having them, so she's not angry about that. She's angry that her choice was taken away; that she was made subservient to others. It's a subtle difference, but it's really really significant. So yeah, problems as far as she's been written so far. The nice thing about the MCU though is that it's basically a work in progress, and as the Marvel short 'Hail To the King' showed, they're happy to retcon stuff that fans don't like.

Even though I bloody loved The Mandarin in 'Iron Man 3'.

As for Tony Stark wanting to give the Avengers a chance to just live normal lives and go home through his preemtive planning, well. Villains act, heroes react. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VillainsActHeroesReact) It's one of the central tenets of almost all superhero stories, so much so that there have been all kinds of interesting comics which look at what happens when the heroes start acting instead of reacting.

My favourite is probably The Authority (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ComicBook/TheAuthority) by Warren Ellis, which poses the question 'What would happen if the Avengers/ Justice League basically decided to stop fighting supervillains and start taking on real-life villains like dictators and other undesirables?'

They become a fascist world-police of terrifying efficiency. The thoughtlessly grotesque Mark Millar version from later on is complete crap with Millar's signature 'and now for a pointless rape scene because that's edgy' style (obviously) on account of Mark Millar is a knuckledragging, woman-hating, no-nothing f**kwit whose work it is literally impossible to hate too much, but the Ellis run is superb. All through the comics, the Authority are wracked with doubts and issues about right and wrong, and in every way it reads very much like a typical superhero team narrative... Apart from the fact they're imposing their political systems on a world to which they allow no say. Ellis explicitly said that he wrote them as a supervillain team for this exact reason.

Hopefully, this is where 'Civil War' will go: with Stark convinced that security is more valuable than freedom, and Cap convinced that freedom is more valuable than security. Actually acknowledging that those two things exist on a continuum and that you can't have both at the same time. It would make for some genuinely excellent moral/ethical discussions about real things that matter amidst all the explosion.

Psychosplodge

05-15-2015, 02:34 AM

http://40.media.tumblr.com/0fd57956a31453c8addafa71cc5c10b4/tumblr_nobj77dltU1sqs40uo1_1280.jpg

Wolfshade

05-16-2015, 05:21 PM

I watched this yesterday :)

Wolfshade

05-18-2015, 03:33 PM

http://www.buzzfeed.com/jamiejones/the-avengers-compared-to-the-original-comics#.id0kzX0xL

Psychosplodge

05-19-2015, 02:48 AM

https://41.media.tumblr.com/cbab320f43c2ee259a5d6381ed37d3f5/tumblr_nk9q4hVem41rz64nto1_540.jpg
https://40.media.tumblr.com/047708bb629436cdf6354ef092e1f771/tumblr_nk9q4hVem41rz64nto6_540.jpg
https://41.media.tumblr.com/6639072d11492d7544b07bdb2fc9ef36/tumblr_nk9q4hVem41rz64nto7_540.jpg
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eldargal

05-19-2015, 03:00 AM

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Kirsten

05-19-2015, 03:36 PM

went to see The Avengers tonight, which was totally awesome.
highlight of the film, twenty five minutes in to it, when the man sat next to my mum tapped her on the shoulder and said "excuse me, is this Mad Max?"

Wolfshade

05-19-2015, 03:59 PM

Kirsten

05-20-2015, 03:52 AM

Yup, genuinely.

So they saw the film board classification screen with 'Avengers Age of Ultron 12A'

Then watched the opening fight with the whole gang

then the big Avengers Age of Ultron title, and a good fifteen minutes after that they realised. How long do these people think trailers last?

Houghten

05-20-2015, 04:40 AM

Half an hour... forty-five minutes if you're really unlucky

Kirsten

05-20-2015, 08:10 AM

for a bunch of trailers sure, but not one single half hour trailer. 'coming soon to a cinema near you, the Avengers: Age of Ultron. here is a sneak peek with the first quarter of the film...'

Erik Setzer

05-20-2015, 10:25 AM

In a nutshell. This article (http://io9.com/black-widow-this-is-why-we-can-t-have-nice-things-1702333037) is pretty fantastic, and basically sums up all the issues with Widow. I can't find a single thing in it I disagree with, and it made me notice a lot of stuff I hadn't while my brain was just going 'wheeeeee, explosions!' at the cinema.

Bottom line, Widow's done fairly well in A:AoU, but there are still deep, deep problems.

Having watched the movie, I couldn't figure out what the big deal was. In-movie, anyway. Since I don't usually look at toys, I didn't realize how bad things were along those lines. It seems like Disney said, "Girls don't play with superhero toys, and boys don't want toys that are girls, so we'll leave her out." And that was just stupid.

As to the movie... Huh. Guess I'll have to spoiler-fy the entire next paragraph.

The "I can't have kids" thing, to me, did seem to be more about having a choice taken from her. And not just that, but there's some symbolism to it. If she can't have kids, then she can't have an emotional attachment to kids, and they probably wanted to make sure that wouldn't happen. More attempts to remove any emotional bonds from her. And humans, without emotions or morals to guide them, are monsters. That's what they tried to make her. The "lullaby" thing, I'll admit, was odd, but I think they (SHIELD, the Avengers, all of the above?) were just playing off of Banner being into her in order to have some way to control him (theoretically) if things got bad, and that seemed the safest way, figuring he wouldn't hurt Natasha. I don't think the line about "I'm always picking up after you boys" was her being "motherly," I thought it was a dig at the others. When a man says "girl" about a woman, people assume that's the man looking down on the woman rather than being fatherly... so why doesn't it work the other way? I also don't get the people who might claim she was a "damsel in distress," given that she saved the day repeatedly, and ended up in that position (where she did some good stuff) by completing the bloody mission for them. And given that Ultron was kicking all of the other Avengers around, why would she try to fight him that much and get herself killed? It took all of them working together to finally take him out (and then finally Vision, who was pretty much literally a deus ex machina).

I get that the marketing and some of the talk about the character was done completely wrong, and that should be criticized, yes. But the way people claim Whedon personally ruined Black Widow? I don't get it. I left the movie thinking she was a pretty awesome character all-around, probably the least screw-up of them all (other than maybe Captain America, but he's the Ultimate Boy Scout).

Loved the movie overall. James Spader's voice was perfect for Ultron.

Wolfshade

05-20-2015, 03:12 PM

I think the worst trailer was rise of the silver surfer, which was basically the whole film.

Kirsten

05-20-2015, 03:22 PM

Wolfshade

05-20-2015, 03:31 PM

I enjoyed age of Ultron.

Though it did raise some questions regarding Mjölnir.

Kirsten

05-20-2015, 03:33 PM

we definitely need a clip where Stan Lee picks it up casually.

Wolfshade

05-20-2015, 03:40 PM

I'm confused about Mjölnir.

On the ground it sits, but rotates with the earth.

So, if it were on a volcano would it go up as the ground level changes?

Vision can pick it up, but a truck can't move it, or is the issue that the truck is controlled by a person?
If so could a google car pull it out as it isn't controlled by a person?

Kirsten

05-20-2015, 03:41 PM

the answer is, it is magic and stop asking questions.

Wolfshade

05-20-2015, 03:42 PM

magic is science that we don't understnad

Kirsten

05-20-2015, 03:45 PM

exactly, so stop asking questions.

I did enjoy all the arguments in the film about Mjolnir

Wolfshade

05-20-2015, 03:50 PM

But without questions we don't know

Mr Mystery

05-20-2015, 10:50 PM

yeah I have seen one or two trailers that basically give away the plot twist. you watch it thinking, really? you are going to spoil your own film? I can only assume the trailer was handled by a third party. You sometimes see film summaries on Netflix and the like that actually spoil the film as well.

Valentine, a slightly ropey 'Slasher' flick from early 2000s, with David Boreanaz.

I have no idea if it's well paced and builds the tension, because the blurb on the back reveals not only who the killer is, but why their victims don't recognise them.........

Mind you, does have Denise 'Phwoar' Richards in a bikini, so not a total loss.