Pinning - is it worth it?

[Mr Mystery]

How do?

So kind of seeking people's opinions here on a rule which I like, but have always found to be fairly 'meh'.

As the title reveals, it's Pinning.

In theory, it's really pretty awesome. Shoot up some stuff, and then prevent it doing much in it's own turn. What's not to like!

Well for me? Quite a lot. First up, I need to cause an unsaved wound. Not insurmountable, but can mean the stuff I'd be really keen to pin down (like Terminators) tweak the nose of this particular terror.

Then, my opponent has to fail a Ld test - possibly the most universally reliable test in all of 40k for everyone. Tyranids, Orks, Marines, Necrons, Eldar - they all pretty much just make rude gestures behind that fear's back when it's not looking - they either ignore it completely because of Fearless, have ways out (Mob Rule) or just have decent enough Ld not to worry about it for the most part.

So is it just me, or do others feel that whilst it's a nice little rule, it rarely has much of an impact?

[Path Walker]

How do?

So kind of seeking people's opinions here on a rule which I like, but have always found to be fairly 'meh'.

As the title reveals, it's Pinning.

In theory, it's really pretty awesome. Shoot up some stuff, and then prevent it doing much in it's own turn. What's not to like!

Well for me? Quite a lot. First up, I need to cause an unsaved wound. Not insurmountable, but can mean the stuff I'd be really keen to pin down (like Terminators) tweak the nose of this particular terror.

Then, my opponent has to fail a Ld test - possibly the most universally reliable test in all of 40k for everyone. Tyranids, Orks, Marines, Necrons, Eldar - they all pretty much just make rude gestures behind that fear's back when it's not looking - they either ignore it completely because of Fearless, have ways out (Mob Rule) or just have decent enough Ld not to worry about it for the most part.

So is it just me, or do others feel that whilst it's a nice little rule, it rarely has much of an impact?

I think they've been looking at the potential to ignore leadership a lot in the last few codexes, Orks ability to ignore it took a huge hit, and rightly so for example, and Nids are not punished more harshly for losing synapse on top of the leadership effects, making removing it more important for the opponent.

I've had luck with pinning with Space Marine Snipers in 6th against IG, but they don't cause pinning any more, which is a shame.

[CoffeeGrunt]

Given that Snipers and Barrage weapons don't natively get Pinning anymore, it's pretty tough to get unless you're Eldar or Guard with the Suppressing Fire order. That said, the times I've used Suppressing Fire on say, an Autocannon Heavy Weapons Team and it's actually done something are few and far between. The best weapons are normally tank-mounted, and really you want to be using either Fire On My Target or Take Aim on these guys against Infantry, because Precision Shot will actually do something, and Ignores Cover is potent.

[Charon]

As with most things in 40k it can be worth if you are able to stack it so it becomes semi-reliable.
Having one unit with pinning wont do much. Maybe you are very lucky, maybe you are not. It does not hurt you, you dont have to perform weird stuff to make it happen. Most of the time it does not matter.
If you start stacking it (which few armies really can) it can become quite painful as it is no "only once" test like "Fall back".

[40kGamer]

Terrify can give it a small boost and if you are rolling for invisibility, there's a good chance you have it anyhow. overall though my experience has been the same as yours. It's a very flavorful rule on the surface but rarely does much in the game. I like to think of it as a thin glaze of icing on a very thick cake.

[YorkNecromancer]

I think it's great for Genestealers with Broodlords. Infiltrate them so the target unit is at -2 Ld, then drop The Horror on them - holds them nicely in place. MSU broods of 'Stealers taken en masse can force more Pinning checks at lower Ld than expected, preventing the enemy from doing the shooting necessary to deal with the 'Stealers, then keeping them down so they can't claim the Inititative modfier to assault if they're in cover.

The nice thing is that you can then switch your Broodlords to Dominion, giving yourself lots of little pockets of Synapse for when your foot-slogging Carnifexes arrive to start supplying the enemy with new a**holes.

Of course, even at -2 Ld with MSU tactics, it's not as reliable as I'd like, but at least it's an option Tyranids have.

I don't think I'd build a strategy around it with any other army, though. Which is a bit mad, seeing as supress-and-flank tactics are kind of the core of modern military skirmish tactics. Shame there's no 40K army that can operate like that.

[Charon]

You can try it with Eldar. Nearly everything can force a pinning test, Hemlocks force rerolls on successful tests and Seers can pick Telepathy. Problem is that pinning alone wont win you the game, you need units to utilize it.

[DETHMOKIL]

Put it like this. Shooting a unit and killing 25% and forcing a moral test basically can result in the same thing, that said unit loses out on doing stuff for a turn.

Units that can fail morale tests and are in range for the turn are already very vulnerable to heavy shooting. so pinning is really just good for adding on damaging effects to a unit already being targeted.

Pinning does not really open any new doors except when snipers had it, because snipers are harassment shooters, and pinning helped them do that job. Now they can't and snipers are basically just poison bolters. but thats another topic.

I can see a heavy weapon designed around pumping alot of shots into infantry to pin the in place. But I'm not sure if a weapon like that exists.

[CoffeeGrunt]

Worth noting that Pinning negates your ability to fire Overwatch, and is not nullified by Know No Fear. Thus it can be very useful on paper, but given the at least decent leadership of Marines anyway, it's not too amazing. Perhaps as the setup to a charge, the Blastmaster would be good for this.

[Mr Mystery]

You can try it with Eldar. Nearly everything can force a pinning test, Hemlocks force rerolls on successful tests and Seers can pick Telepathy. Problem is that pinning alone wont win you the game, you need units to utilize it.

Yup. That's another reason that I'm a bit 'meh' about it's practical uses.

Don't get me wrong folks, when it works on a good target, it's pretty tasty - say you pin a nasty assault unit - buys you time not only to dakka it up a bit more, but get stuff out it's way, making it work that little bit harder.

But as above, it's not something you can really depend upon.

[Hal]

I once tried a double hemlock list with lots of pinning units back in 6th, and it wasn't too overwhelming.. I did win, but barely. (it just doesn't go off as much as you would expect from a dedicated pinning list)
I was thinking of trying it again in 7th now when terrify reduces ld by 1, but since snipers don't pin anymore i gave up on that idea for now.

[Edwin Heapy]

For low armour, units / armys trying to get in to close combat pinning is an essential tool. If you are using Orks or Tyranids overwatch can be devastating especially if your opponent had multiple flamers in their units. With the poor saves Orks and many Tyranids effective overwatch can stop a charge dead or kill so many models that the unit that makes it in is no longer combat effective. With armys with good saves this is less of a problem so I doubt space marine players will have much use for it, but for Orks it can be a game changer. The trick for me is to have plenty of units with the pinning ability and to target where you use it wisely.