Eldar experiences in the 7th edition?

[Lost Vyper]

Hi ya´ll!

What has been the best things, that you think happened to Eldar in the 7th edition and the worst things? I would like these to be from an actual gaming situation you have faced and not a speculation.

IMHO after three games...

BEST
- Psychic phase...no more thinking about when,what,where,how...it´s GOOOOOOD...
- Allies, we now own assault vehicles, yei! Altough, made from paper...:)

WORST
- Jink...BUT...you get it now in the first turn without movement...so, meh
- This goes both ways, but the vehicle damage chart hurt every weapon, except Melta,D-Cannons and Lances...no more Scatter/Bright Lance on Walkers, just Lances...
- a MINOR thing, but as a War Walker -player, the Walkers took a hit with the positioning in the movement phase --> firing arc. It didn´t matter in the 5th/6th...

But mostly positive, i just need to get more games under my belt

- Lost Vyper

[Charon]

PSI Phase depends on your playstyle. If you go overboard with psykers (jetsser) then it is better as the warlock powers are pretty reliable. If you play a "support psyker" list wher the power comes from a few force multipliers, then you just waste points.
DE vehicles are fun and are of much better use to Eldar (who have more reliable and better equiped units) than to Dark Eldar. A squad of Dark Reapers on a Venom is hilarious. It doesnt matter if the vehicles are made from paper as the Eldar T is worse. Yes the venom/raider will pretty much get destroyed when facing any S7+ Weapon. But is still gives immunity to S3 and makes S4 "wound" on a 6+ instead of a 3+

Jink is kinda ok. Strong units remain strong. It sucks for "weaker" units. Vypers are even worse now and Falcons, Fire Prisms and Nightspinners are basically useless when jinking... otherwise the serpent remains strong. Twinlinked, 3+ cover, secure objective.
The Hemlock could be a new secretly strong unit as he gains the primaris now too and the better jink will help to survive better.

[Lost Vyper]

Never thought about the Hemlock! That´s interesting...possibilities arise :) Invisible Hemlock! :D

[Charon]

He cant be invisible as his power is fixed. But he gains the primaris which means he has a pretty good witchfire, even when using jink.
Also invisibility would not really benefit him as you need to snapshot flyers anyways. His problem was never AA but getting into rapid fire range to use his abilities.

[vonDietdrich]

Psykers for Eldar are now basically one of two things: battery units (that feed charges to your big psykers) or casters (who have two or three good powers apiece that you want to use each turn). Being able to drop all four of a Farseer's powers in one turn is fantastic (Eldritch Storm, Guide, Mind War, Doom are all game winners, and Fortune's not bad.. and of course the whole Divination tree minus Scrier's Gaze is gold.), and then you can drop whatever Warp Charges are left over on your Warlocks. Warlocks are also fantastic now, because you don't have to choose between Conceal and one of the others. A full Warlock Council plus two farseers can do some serious heavy lifting, especially if one takes Runes of Fate and the other Divination.

Shooty tanks have lost their mobility because if they jink their main advantage is nullified. As Charon said, Wave Serpents are better than they were.

Crimson Hunters got more useful because FMCs are harder to ground, Interceptor no longer allows effective shooting against ground targets (meaning that aside from shooting flyers all Skyfire weapons are useless unless the skyfire can be turned off or switched to a different firing mode) so killing them air-to-air is the more effective tactic. Interceptor being nerfed also means we'll see a drop in dedicated Skyfire weapons being taken (goodbye, Aegis and Imperial Bastion Quadgun).

I don't know why everyone's so shocked by the vehicle damage chart. Rolling an Explodes result is nice when it happens, but I never built my lists around hoping for it. Stripping hull points has been and remains the most effective way to kill vehicles, and if anything dual Bright Lances is a worse choice now because they're even less likely to get an Explodes than they were before while doing less Hull Points on average than a Scatter Laser + Bright Lance combo. Against AV13 and 14 they're a bit better than Scatter Laser + Bright Lance. But Dual Bright Lances are worse against AV12, and they also inflict less casualties on infantry and monsters. My vehicle hunters usually survive and have to do double duty against infantry afterwards, so I'm certainly not going to change their loadout. Besides, I usually have a squad of Wraithguard or Fire Dragons in a Wave Serpent handy to kill landraiders.

Nothing about Eldar got worse or changed substantially. Wraithlords are better because inflicted wounds carry over in challenges now, so you can Challenge their squad leader and also inflict a couple more casualties on the rest of their squad. Dark Reapers are even scarier because the new powered up Jink is something they ignore, still. Wave Serpents still counter Stealthed/Jink units pretty well with the Serpent Shield shots and sheer weight of twin-linked fire.

Assault is still bad, and assaulting out of Dark Eldar transports doesn't really fix it. Personally I wouldn't bother investing in Raiders when you could be taking Wave Serpents. Raiders are really cool models, but I'm going to stick to using them for my Dark Eldar.

Our melee troops are more for countering close-quarters lists than taking the fight to the enemy. For example, Striking Scorpions especially are really useful for dealing with Drop Pod objective-grabbing lists, and I've always found a kitted out Wraithlord (Scatter Laser + Bright Lance and Ghost Glaive with flamers has worked best for me) is great to have when your opponent Deep Strikes a squad of Terminators/Assault Marines or Drop Pods a dreadnought behind your lines.

Overall, Eldar got better in a lot of ways, and the only thing that got worse is that dedicated skimmer shooting platforms can no longer take Jink Saves. Small price to pay considering all the advantages the army got.

[Lost Vyper]

Does the Ghosthelm use just one Warp Charge to cancel perils? It wasn´t in the FAQ...cos, that´s a beautiful thing if it works like that!

[Charon]

Nobody really knows. You can argue it both ways. Either just remove a dice from pool or remove X dice and try to get a 4+
Ghosthelm doesnt stop perils btw, it just stops the wound you get (no effect on lost powers for example)

[Lost Vyper]

We have played in our FLGC, that (if you still have) a Warp Charge, you just "Expand a Warp Charge point to cancel the wound"...but the perils are different now, yep, gotta take that in play also...

[Da Gargoyle]

(meaning that aside from shooting flyers all Skyfire weapons are useless unless the skyfire can be turned off or switched to a different firing mode) Am I missing something given the number of skimmers out there? I would imagine that Quads are still handy against Tau, Eldar, DE and Necron skimmers as well as their flyers. Havn't looked at the new codex yet, but I believe Hydra batteries used to negate Jink in the old one. As I understand it, Jet Bikes are fair game also because they are skimmers as may be Chariots. I don't see quad guns disappearing just yet.

[Charon]

Yes you are missing something. A huge part of the rules you are commenting on.
Yes, quadguns still work against skimmers. Not a big deal as you pay a good price for it and most eldar skimmers are at a 12 front/side anyways.
Hydra doesnt negate jink. It didnt even do thatz in 6th edition as the hydra was completely changed via errata (as it did not have skyfire, got it in the same errata). Jetbikes are no skimmers. They are jetbikes.

[Dave Mcturk]

". Wraithlords are better because inflicted wounds carry over in challenges now, so you can Challenge their squad leader and also inflict a couple more casualties on the rest of their squad.
...and I've always found a kitted out Wraithlord (Scatter Laser + Bright Lance and Ghost Glaive with flamers has worked best for me) is great to have when your opponent Deep Strikes a squad of Terminators/Assault Marines or Drop Pods a dreadnought behind your lines."

you must play some really generous opponents. most times - even with the new codex modz - wraithlords are just a fire magnet! and even if you get one in combat [by not killing the nearest target by choosing to shoot at it!] you are only likely to kill one or two marines.[per turn] so tarpitted nicely. against terminators you should just be scrap wraithbone! imo the sword should grant re-rolls to ALL attacks and an extra wound wouldnt have hurt the balance. imo. for 125/115 pts a basic fire support tank with 48"/60" threat range is a much better option!

[Da Gargoyle]

Charon, why the grievous tone?
Yes you are missing something. A huge part of the rules you are commenting on.
Yes, quadguns still work against skimmers. Not a big deal as you pay a good price for it and most eldar skimmers are at a 12 front/side anyways.
Hydra doesnt negate jink. It didnt even do thatz in 6th edition as the hydra was completely changed via errata (as it did not have skyfire, got it in the same errata). Jetbikes are no skimmers. They are jetbikes.

I thank you for the feedback and take your point about the Jetbikes not being skimmers, but as is the way with the 40k verse, you are wrong about Hydra's, (Nobody knows everything:o).

In the previous IG codex they had a special rule "Auto-targeting System" which allowed them to negate the cover save against skimmers moving flat out and bikes turbo boosting. This is where my confusion came in because I lost jet bikes, serpents and falcons to Hydra Squadrons. As you say, when 6th Ed came in, they were given "Skyfire" in the errata, but this did not negate ATS.

I have since seen the entry in the Astra Militarum and ATS does not exist, so they don't ignore cover/jink anymore. The Hydra quads in general are still more dangerous to skimmers than you seem to credit, pumping out 4 TL S7 shots which is like rending on your hull points. And when I have gamed against them they were in Squadrons of 2 or 3. Now at 70 points each they are still a cheap high fire power option.

But I guess the real question is, what can ignore jink on skimmers? Because one inference I can draw from your post is that it is still a better than average risk to Turbo your transports across the table with that holo field upgrade.

[Defenestratus]

Sadly I've only been able to play one game of 7th so far with my Eldar.

What I've found is the opposite experience wrt the psychic phase... I hate it.

Our powers are far less reliable so buffing units when they need it has become a much more difficult proposition. Plus the ability for the opponent to deny blessings really hurts. Against the game with Grey Knights, I got 3 powers off in total out of 10 warp charges per turn. (He started with 12).


The nerf to jink is a wash honestly. Getting a 4+ cover save (+1 for a HF) is not tough to do so the new jink actually helps get serpents across the table where they need to be to drop off Wraithguard.

[Charon]

Charon, why the grievous tone?

I thank you for the feedback and take your point about the Jetbikes not being skimmers, but as is the way with the 40k verse, you are wrong about Hydra's, (Nobody knows everything:o).

In the previous IG codex they had a special rule "Auto-targeting System" which allowed them to negate the cover save against skimmers moving flat out and bikes turbo boosting. This is where my confusion came in because I lost jet bikes, serpents and falcons to Hydra Squadrons. As you say, when 6th Ed came in, they were given "Skyfire" in the errata, but this did not negate ATS.

I have since seen the entry in the Astra Militarum and ATS does not exist, so they don't ignore cover/jink anymore. The Hydra quads in general are still more dangerous to skimmers than you seem to credit, pumping out 4 TL S7 shots which is like rending on your hull points. And when I have gamed against them they were in Squadrons of 2 or 3. Now at 70 points each they are still a cheap high fire power option.

But I guess the real question is, what can ignore jink on skimmers? Because one inference I can draw from your post is that it is still a better than average risk to Turbo your transports across the table with that holo field upgrade.

Auto targeting system was changed in the errata for 6th edition. It added skyfire and you had to cross out the line that allows you to ignore jink. No they did not negate ATS, they changed it completely.
4 TL S7 shots are 1 glance in average and 2 out of 3 will get negated through cover. So on average dice you will need a full squadron to remove a single hullpoint from an 130 points vehicle which can retailate with ignore cover shots against an open topped vehicle.
Better get other tanks who can do the same and are more durable for less points. Also every hydra squad means one less wyvern battery (which is one of the most brutal units).
Orders can ignore cover and psykers can. As you cant order a tank battery, the infantry is the better (and cheaper) option.