Eldar vehicles hull

[pigei]

During some games with my friends we ended up with some doubts about how to treat eldar vehicle boundaries. Since this is something that cannot be solved just by reading the rulebook I would like to know how other players threat them.

In particular, here are our doubts:

All Eldar vehicles are skimmers that stand on transparent bases and thus leave some space underneath them.

1) When a unit disembark from an eldar transport, can I put models underneath the vehicle (provided that the models fit there).

2) If yes, can I have model standing on the transparent base?

3) When I move the vehicle I should stay 1 inch away of any enemy model. Does the 1 inch relates to the hull? Or to the transparent base?

4) When I assault an eldar vehicle should I move it in contact with the hull or the transparent base?
Can I move assaulting unit underneath the vehicle?

5) Is it possible to move an eldar vehicle on top of narrow piece of scenery, smaller than the vehicle and possibly smaller than the transparent base (provided that the vehicle does not fall)?

Actually a similar question can be made for other tank skymmers (such as the Necron Monolyth)

[Jwolf]

During some games with my friends we ended up with some doubts about how to treat eldar vehicle boundaries. Since this is something that cannot be solved just by reading the rulebook I would like to know how other players threat them.

In particular, here are our doubts:

All Eldar vehicle are skimmers that stand on transparent bases and thus leave some space underneath them.

1) When a unit disembark from an eldar transport, can I put models underneath the vehicle (provided that the models fit there).

2) If yes, can I have model standing on the transparent base?

3) When I move the vehicle I should stay 1 inch away of any enemy model. Does the 1 inch relates to the hull? Or to the transparent base?

4) When I assault an eldar vehicle should I move it in contact with the hull or the transparent base?
Can I move assaulting unit underneath the vehicle?

5) Is it possible to move an eldar vehicle on top of narrow piece of scenery, smaller than the vehicle and possibly smaller than the transparent base (provided that the vehicle does not fall)?

Actually a similar question can be made for other tank skymmers (such as the Necron Monolyth)

1) No, you cannot put models under Eldar vehicles.

2) No.

3) Both.

4) Either.

5) Possible, yes.

[Lerra]

As far as I know, the hull of the vehicle is used for all game mechanics. The base is unimportant, so if you decide to add a second small flying base for stability or whatnot, that's legal. If you decide to replace the plastic disk with something with more weight, that's also legal. The base is only there to keep the vehicle elevated.

[BuFFo]

1) When a unit disembark from an eldar transport, can I put models underneath the vehicle (provided that the models fit there).

No.


2) If yes, can I have model standing on the transparent base?

No.


3) When I move the vehicle I should stay 1 inch away of any enemy model. Does the 1 inch relates to the hull? Or to the transparent base?

Hull.


4) When I assault an eldar vehicle should I move it in contact with the hull or the transparent base?
Can I move assaulting unit underneath the vehicle?

Hull.


5) Is it possible to move an eldar vehicle on top of narrow piece of scenery, smaller than the vehicle and possibly smaller than the transparent base (provided that the vehicle does not fall)?

Yes.

[pigei]

Thanks for your quick replies.

May I ask you to argument your answers? In particular why you do not allow model under a skimmer?
Because of an home rule or because of a sentence found on the rulebook?

[Caldera02]

I'd like to know as well. Not that I disagree, merely curious.

[BuFFo]

Because the vehicle has a Hull you use. The stand really does nothing but give the model a flying look/feel.

If your vehicle is within an inch of an enemy model trying to touch your flying base, you are now tank shocking the unit.

If units are trying to assault the vehicle, you assault the Hull, not the stand.

The only vehicle I know of that you need to assault the stand is a Valk/Vendetta.

[SeattleDV8]

If units are trying to assault the vehicle, you assault the Hull, not the stand.

The only vehicle I know of that you need to assault the stand is a Valk/Vendetta.

That is incorrect for assaults, althought the base is generally ignored.
BRB pg.71 "...except when assaulting a skimmer, in which case models may move into contact with the vehicles hull, its base or both."

[Jwolf]

My answers are because that's what the rulebook says.

[crazyredpraetorian]

My answers are because that's what the rulebook says.


Could you provide page #s for those answers?:D

[Lerra]

In practice, it would be difficult for a model to move underneath a skimmer, although theoretically possible if the model is short enough. The top of the model would need to have an inch of clearance from the bottom of the vehicle. A swarm may be able to do it.

For assault, you ignore the 1" rule, and so you can assault underneath a skimmer as long as you can fit.

[BuFFo]

That is incorrect for assaults, althought the base is generally ignored.
BRB pg.71 "...except when assaulting a skimmer, in which case models may move into contact with the vehicles hull, its base or both."

True, yes, but haven't seen a Tau or Eldar vehicle that models can comfortably move under, in my local area.

This is something I have never seen, nor am I used to!

[Jwolf]

Models in the way, p.11.

[pigei]

The top of the model would need to have an inch of clearance from the bottom of the vehicle. A swarm may be able to do it.

This is what actually happens with eldar units disembarking from the transport. And they do fit under the hull of the transport.

In the last game I sow for instance, the transport had is rear side touching the edge of the table. The eldar player managed to place all the disembarking models in such a way that all were 2" from the entrance point, but most of them where actually underneath the transport (close to the base). The placement was correct in all aspects but for the fact that some models were under the transport.

Jwolf wrote that this is not possible, but I cannot find the rule that contradict this.

[Jwolf]

The basic rules of the game.

[crazyredpraetorian]

Models in the way, p.11.


Is that under the assault rules or the vehicle rules?:cool:

[pigei]

Models in the way, p.11.

This rule states two conditions that limit the movements of models with respect to friendly units:

1) I cannot move a model in the space occupied by another model (the eldar transport). The space occupied by the eldar transport is represented by its base or its hull.

2) I cannot move a model through a gap between friendly models that is smaller than the moving model base


But

1) an eldar model might fit under the vehicle without occupying the space of the transport hull (which is anyway physically impossible)

2) there is no gap since we are dealing with a single eldar transport model (not two or more)

[Jwolf]

The space under the hull is occupied by the hull, pigei.

[Robdaddy73]

So kind of on the same topic. Do the disembarking troops get a cover save from the skimmer?

[Nabterayl]

In most cases, yes. It's theoretically possible for disembarking troops to be so short, and the skimmer base so tall, that they wouldn't, but most of the time they'll get a cover save.