dreadnaughts initiative 1?

[Pedro]

hey guys, during a game the other day the followong question came up, does a dreadnought go to initiative 1 if "wounded" by a thunder hammer? the rules say that each roll on the damage table counts as a wound for combat resolution purposes so do you think this would apply to thunderhammers?

[Shas'O D'Narb]

The TH description specifically describes reducing the initiative when a model suffers an unsaved wound. Since the Dread isn't suffering a wound, its initiative is not reduced to 1.

[Dan-e]

the rule you are quoting is
"Each roll made on the vehicle damage table against a walker counters a a single wound for purposes of working out who won the combat"

No where does it say that each roll on the table counts as unsaved wounds for general purposes... so no, it wouldn't drop its to Initiative 1

[Nabterayl]

Each roll on the table does count as "Crew Shaken," since a dreadnought is a vehicle. Of course, since Crew Shaken results have no effect on a walker in close combat, that's very rarely relevant (though theoretically it could be).*

* For instance, if a thunder hammer inflicts Crew Shaken on a dreadnought which then proceeds to win combat and Sweep or kill off its remaining foes through No Retreat! wounds, in the dread's turn it will be unable to shoot because it is still Crew Shaken.

[Pedro]

thanks guys, we didnt think it did but just needed some clearing up.

cheers

[Shas'O D'Narb]

Each roll on the table does count as "Crew Shaken," since a dreadnought is a vehicle.
I understood that only applied to vehicles without an initiative value. I don't think the Dread will be affected.

[Nabterayl]

I understood that only applied to vehicles without an initiative value.
I can see how you might find that the natural way to write the rule, but it isn't what's written. Nowhere do the rules suggest that thunder hammers distinguish between units with an Initiative value and units without. They only distinguish between units with wounds and units that are vehicles.

[Tyrsday]

I can see how you might find that the natural way to write the rule, but it isn't what's written. Nowhere do the rules suggest that thunder hammers distinguish between units with an Initiative value and units without. They only distinguish between units with wounds and units that are vehicles.
"Against vehicles with no Initiative value, whenever inflicts any damage result, it also inflicts a crew shaken result." Emphasis mine.

This seems to make a distinction to me. Dreads have an Initiative value, correct? :confused:

[Nabterayl]

Sure, but they don't have wounds, so how are they affected by "all models that suffer an unsaved wound from a thunder hammer and are not killed will be knocked reeling, reducing their Initiative to a value of 1 until the end of the next player's turn?"

Fair point about them not being affected by Crew Shaken, though ... I guess getting hit with a thunder hammer wouldn't prevent a walker from shooting (assuming it got hit by a thunder hammer and immediately got out of combat).

[Tyrsday]

Sure, but they don't have wounds, so how are they affected by "all models that suffer an unsaved wound from a thunder hammer and are not killed will be knocked reeling, reducing their Initiative to a value of 1 until the end of the next player's turn?"
They wouldn't be affected by it in an Initiative altering way.

[Nabterayl]

Which leads us to the conclusion that thunder hammers have no special effect on walkers at all, right?

[Tyrsday]

I concur.