1850 Ultramarines+Eldar

[Kunstmann]

As the title hints I'm trying to put together a slightly special armylist for a local tournament that will be running over a few weeks. Nothing super hardcore and we'll be playing with fairly standard rules (one ally, no Escalation or Stronghold etc).

The reason I'm putting my Ultramarines together with Eldar is a modelling issue as I don't have enough marines to field any proper army size and I would therefore like to use some of my newly bought Eldar. Since my opponents will be selected at random I need to try and have a list that can take on most things... I know it will never be a super effective list, but I would still love some inputs on potential changes to load-out, composition etc.

Space Marines (Ultramarines)
HQ (165p):
Chief Librarian Tigurius

Troops (370p)
5x Scouts with Sniper & Camo Cloaks (70P)
5x Tactical Marines (Flamer, Meltabomb, Powersword) (95p)
10x Tacticals (Flamer, ML with Flakk, Rhino) (205p)

Elite(175p)
5x Sternguard (2x Combi-Melta, Rhino) (175p)

Fast Attack (70p)
Land Speeder (Multimelta, Heavy Flamer)

Heavy Support (260p)
Land Raider (with Multi-melta)

Fortifications (100p)
Aegis Defense Line with Quad-Gun

Eldar
HQ (70p)
Spiritseer

Troops (465p)
5x Wraithguard (Wraithcannons) (160p)
5x Wraithguard (Wraithcannons) (160p)
1x Wave Serpent (Holo-field, Shuriken Cannon, TL Scatter-laser) (145p)

Heavy Support (175p)
Wraithlord (Ghostglaive, Brightlance, Eldar ML)

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Apart from the above models I also have the following in my cabinet:
3x Centurions (all weapons)
1x Droppod
5x Terminators
5x Assault Terminators (either LC or TH/SS)
1x Wratihknight (need to be built)
1x Wraithlord
5x Wraithguard/blades

And off course load-out can be changed on most unites (Wraiths, tacticals etc). Thanks in advance and look forward to hearing from you...
\Casper

[Dave Mcturk]

landraider ... excellent somewhere for the wraithlord to hide behind...
at 1850 or higher i am tending to think that small units can be really vulnerable ! ... even wraith who are v hs shooting only really souped up marines...

if your boards tend to be 'reasonable' with terrain i mite b tempted to put the blades in instead of the gunwraith, keep them oos and use them to protect rear/flanks/objectives

and seriously in 6th wraithlords with 3 wounds are well dodgy... why they cant go in units of 3 or 4 who knows !? .. ie easy first kill to decent long range firepower... and they REALLY hate poison !

good luck

[xTHExCLINCHERx]

I can really only comment on the marine detachment, since I don't play Eldar, but here goes:

Your troops are kind of all over the place in terms of their effectiveness. I would take the Sternguard out of the rhino, into the pod with 5 melta shots and use them as a turn 1 tank busting suicide squad. Fill the rhinos with tactical squads that share a range amongst the weapons inside (plasma & combi-plas, etc.) I'd take two plasma & combi-plasma squads so when using your Doctrines you can potentially get close enough to hit with 8 shots, re-rolling misses (and 'gets hot' results!)

I would drop the land speeder and put the points towards filling out the tac squads in rhinos. Also, I'm not sure who was manning the quad gun (scouts?)

Maybe use Tigurius to either Gate of Infinity the grav centurions around, or in a landraider with TH/SS terminators?

I'm not too familiar with Eldar but I think of you had a wraith knight and centurions (or a land raider) moving up the field it would be pretty scary.. And aren't d-scythes on the wraith guard AP2? Those in a wave serpent sounds good. Can the spirit seer ride with them? Also can't she heal wounds on the wraith knight or something too?

Anyway, what about a list like this (using what you said you currently own):

Tiggy
Grav Centurions w/Omni-scope
Aegis & Quadgun
Scouts (camo cloaks for better cover)
10 Tacticals, Rhino, Plasma, Combi-plasma
10 Tacticals, Rhino, Plasma, Combi-plasma

Spiritseer
Wraithknight
Wraithguard w/D-Scythes
Wave Serpent

That leaves a few point left over for whatever else you need. Just some thoughts. Good luck!

[mrjjourden]

Marines should never be allied to Eldar scum. You can have an amazing list without polluting it with these Xenos degenerates. Spend the points wisely. All Marines...All The Way!

[Dave Mcturk]

the marines are so deluded they think the allies are helping them, the truth is they are just pawns in the web of time...

[unityvybe]

[QUOTE=Kunstmann;398332]As the title hints I'm trying to put together a slightly special armylist for a local tournament that will be running over a few weeks. Nothing super hardcore and we'll be playing with fairly standard rules (one ally, no Escalation or Stronghold etc).

The reason I'm putting my Ultramarines together with Eldar is a modelling issue as I don't have enough marines to field any proper army size and I would therefore like to use some of my newly bought Eldar. Since my opponents will be selected at random I need to try and have a list that can take on most things... I know it will never be a super effective list, but I would still love some inputs on potential changes to load-out, composition etc.[QUOTE]

Okay I am gonna just change up your list a bit: So here I go.

Space Marines (Ultramarines)
Chief Librarian Tigurius

No Brainer here keep Tigurius

Troops
Cut your Scouts I don't really like Scouts but then this maybe your personal experience.

10x Tactical Marines (Flamer, Missile Launcher, Powersword Vet Sgt Upgrade, Rhino)
10x Tacticals (Plasma, ML, Vet Sgt Upgrade, Rhino) changed flamer to plasma

Cut your Sternguard so you can have two full ten man Tactical Squads. 2x Combi Meltas arent gonna do a thing. If you gonna go Combi Melta go full combi Melta and drop them in that extra drop pod you have with Tigurius.

Cut your Random Landspeeder. One random fast attack choice isn't gonna do much so save some points there as with the cut from the Sternguard.

Now you do have a Land Raider why not make it a transport of your TH/SS Termies or go full grav with your dev centurions, grave with Tigurius is nasty and you have a nice boat to drive up to something with. Since I assume it is a god hammer pattern is is a great fire base and it can also spit out some of the best assault based models in the game or it can transport those dev cents later once you blast away the threats and with Tigurius you can Gate the whole gang deep into something they can smash face with.

Aegis Defense Line with Quad-Gun

I would keep this. If you don't have stormtalons or a stormraven or a fllyer of your own like I run then this is an auto include to deal with an opponents flyers. So camp a ten man tac squad behind it.

I would suggest with your Eldar that your run Iyanden for them this is a major boon to Wraith style armies and allows the Spiritseer to give Wraithguard battlefocus within a twelve inch bubble not just to the unit he is attached too. Also he can "heal" a wraithlord or knight if you purchase the specific remnant of glory. (off the top of my head I don't remember which one it is)

Eldar
HQ

Spiritseer

KEEP and buy him the remnant of glory upgrade that allows him to heal wraithlords and wraithknights.

Troops
10x Wraithguard Wraithcannons

I made your troops into one unit the reason being is that now you have a wraith wall. If you had another Serpent then I would suggest you split the unit into two but you do not. So now your Serpent is free to massacre anything at range before your wraith wall marches up and unleashes str 10 ap2 death at 24 inches.

1x Wave Serpent (Holo-field, Shuriken Cannon, TL Scatter-laser) KEEP

Heavy Support (175p)
Wraithlord (Ghostglaive, Brightlance, Eldar ML) Keep

He can hide behind your wave serpent and assist the wraith wall as well as be buddies with your Spiritseer who will "heal" him.


Well I hope this helps.

[unityvybe]

Okay I can offer some real help here since I actually play the same combination of Novamarines and Eldar but our lists are vastly different. So here are my suggestions for your list.

Tigurius (keep him)

As for your troops I would suggest your make the two tac squads ten men each and buy the vet sgt upgrade. Also give them both rhinos to hide in if a hell drake is flying around. On the squad with Flakk missiles get rid of it and change the flamer to a plasma gun. Also drop melta bombs from the other squad.

Also I don't prefer scouts so you can drop them to but it's your choice.

So since we used your sternguard to fill for Tacticals we already got rid of them also we used their rhino as well in the Tactical department so we saved points there. If you do use Sternguard especially with Combi Melta go full Combi Melta, two aren't gonna do anything also if it's full Combi Melta you might as well drop them from the drop pod as well, maybe even stick Tigurius in there.

Okay now drop that lone land speeder. It isn't doing anything at all and is basically a free kill point to your opponent. I have had experience with using a lone attack bike because I needed to fill up the points in my list and it ended up not really doing much and getting blow to bits. If you really want to use speeders get another one. For now it goes.

Okay I see you have shelved Termies but why not give them that Land Raider or even better you have Dev Cents give them full grav and put them in that Land Raider. With Tigurius Dev Cents with full Grav are just brutal.

Okay onto your Eldar list. I hope your running Iyanden because Wraith lists love Iyanden. Plus there is a remnant of glory that allows your spirit seer to "heal" wraithlords and wraith knights.

Spiritseer

Keep him obviously you need him to turn wraithguard into troops buy him the iyanden remnant of glory as well that heals wraithlords and knights.

Make your wraithguard one single ten man unit. If you had another serpent I would suggest you split them but for now you don't so make a wraith wall for your serpent to hide behind. Use your Serpent to assist in blasting anything that threatens your wraithguard at range also don't forget that your Iyanden Spiritseer can grant battlefocus to your wraithguard so that makes them twice as evil.

Keep your wraith lord. He is great as he is. Hide him behind your serpent and have him assist the serpent by shooting ranged threats that shoot at your wraith guard. Also have him hang with your spiritseer who should be hiding behind the serpent. Plus your Seer can heal the wraithlord and allow his twelve inch bubble of battle focus to affect the wraithguard.

[Kunstmann]

Thanks for all the input guys, way more than I expected :) I'll take it all into consideration and try and put together a modified list... I'll try and get it play-tested next week and will get to you with updates :D