Adapting - 1850 List with 2 options

[Halollet]

After my first game ( I really need to play more Warhammer.... anyways) I've learned quite a bit so here's my new adaptation to this new codex.

So here's what I'm taking for sure

Fyrant - Wings, Toxin Sacs, Bonesword, Whip
Tyrant - Heavy Venom Cannon, TL Devourers
Tyrant Guard x2

Genestealer Brood x7 + broodlord
Termagaunts x18 - Devourer x5
Warriors x3 - Deathspitter, Venom Cannon (Mans quadgun and holds home objective)
Warriors x3 - Devourers

Venomthrope x1

Carnifex Brood x2 - Spinebanks, Bio-plasma, Adernal Glands

Aegis Line with Quadgun

Option 1

Hormagaunts x16
Carnifex - Heavy Venom Cannon, Bio Plasma
Exocrine

Option 2

Haruspex - Regeneration
Mawloc
Biovore x2



The whole idea with nids is to move up as much as possible, while things like warriors, biovores, exocrines, etc, they will hold the mid table.

Problem with option 2 is that I don't own a mawloc or any biovores. :(

Thoughts?

[Gleipnir]

its a slow moving force, you will need almost all of it on the move, Option 1 is more appealing for the options and because you don't have the other models.

If you can find 5 more points swap the ADL for 50 points with a Bunker for 55, you can use the Quad gun as an emplaced weapon on its battlement that way and AV14 is a lot tougher to crack than a 2 wound 3+ armor gun emplacement, and it can use automated fire as well as manual fire, slap three bare bones Warriors inside for Synapse midfield and they can always exit the building within 6" and immediately charge if something approaches it.

That pretty much frees up the rest of your army to move downfield together with the Venomthrope hopefully hidden behind the monstrous critters to give the entire group shrouded and what hopefully would be at least a 3+ cover save as long as possible(unfortunately probably not long enough), which you can use since its slogging across on foot with a couple of exceptions. If he holds back a lot of his army in Deep Strike or Outflank reserve you can always hang back with the exocrine. Keep in mind the Exocrine 25% obscured by the bunker can get a 3+ cover save. Infiltrate or Outflank the Genestealers depending on the mission

[Halollet]

Here's a list that I'm pretty happy with with my current collection. I'm just wondering where to go from here. I think its still weak at long range tank hunting. But maybe that's something that Nids can't do?

-HQ-
Fyrant - Wings, Toxin Sacs, Bonesword, Whip (Hold in reserve and then comes in and assaults)
Tyrant - Heavy Venom Cannon, TL Devourers (Warlord. Tanks the middle and sits behind Aegis next to venomthrope for a 2+ cover save!)
Tyrant Guard x2

-Troop-
Genestealer Brood x5 + broodlord (infiltrates and horrors people and then joins an assault)
Termagants x15 - Devourer x5 (Screens for tyrant and hangs out midfield)
Hormagaunts x17 (Runs up with CC Fexes)
Warriors x3 - Deathspitters x2, Venom Cannon (Mans quadgun and holds home objective)
Warriors x3 - Devourers x2, Barbed Strangler (Filler synapse and skulks around and grabs other objectives)

-Elite-
Venomthrope x1 (Hides behind tyrant and does his thing)

-Fast Attack-
Sporeminds x6 (Deep strikes and makes the opponent go "oh crap")

-Heavy Support
Carnifex - 2 TL Devourers
Carnifex Brood x2 - Spinebanks, Bio-plasma, Adernal Glands
Exocrine

-Fortification-
Aegis Line with Quadgun

1850 points
59 Models
95 Wounds

That's a lot of wounds.... :D

[Gleipnir]

what opponent are you planning to fight with this? While hanging back something Synapse is going to need to move up with hormagaunts and fexes, and if its just the flyrant don't expect it to last too long, nids really aren't a gunline army for squatting behind cover.

6 Deep Striking spore mines aren't really going to scare anything unless they are accompanied by a lot of other stuff arriving via Deep strike at the same time where they can at least arrive behind other models for intervening cover saves.

[Halollet]

what opponent are you planning to fight with this? While hanging back something Synapse is going to need to move up with hormagaunts and fexes, and if its just the flyrant don't expect it to last too long, nids really aren't a gunline army for squatting behind cover.

6 Deep Striking spore mines aren't really going to scare anything unless they are accompanied by a lot of other stuff arriving via Deep strike at the same time where they can at least arrive behind other models for intervening cover saves.

Its an all comers list. Maybe Guard/Blood Angels will be my next opponent, maybe not.

Right, I should have mentioned that I'm positioning the Aegis line in the middle of the board. Yes you can do this, it just has to be on your side of the table. That way I'm still advancing, but I get some sweet cover when I get there. So, my list defiantly isn't' a gunline in that sense. I'll want everything but the exocrine, warriors and the walkrant to get into assault at some point.

I would love to get a second spore mine cluster, but I'm not sure where to get the points. When I mean, oh crap, it just means that the enemy has to shoot it then and not something else. The way I play, I think I can use this to my advantage.

I could drop 2 gaunts and then make two clusters of 4.

[Gleipnir]

Its an all comers list. Maybe Guard/Blood Angels will be my next opponent, maybe not.

Right, I should have mentioned that I'm positioning the Aegis line in the middle of the board. Yes you can do this, it just has to be on your side of the table. That way I'm still advancing, but I get some sweet cover when I get there. So, my list defiantly isn't' a gunline in that sense. I'll want everything but the exocrine, warriors and the walkrant to get into assault at some point.

I would love to get a second spore mine cluster, but I'm not sure where to get the points. When I mean, oh crap, it just means that the enemy has to shoot it then and not something else. The way I play, I think I can use this to my advantage.

I could drop 2 gaunts and then make two clusters of 4.

So seeing your army makeup and going on what you just said my initial strategy for my own gunline is to place is 22" back from your Aegis gunline in the middle, heavy weapons or long range weapons that ignore cover are placed for good sightlines to the rear out of all but Cannon ranges, if you move first I focus heavy fire on your Exorcine, unless I can get a shot at removing the Venomthrope(its usually pretty easy to give at least one ranged attack the ability to ignore cover these days, and use the troops holding the line to focus on opposing troops after any potential cover has been removed. in the ensuing turns I focus on removing Synapse with Heavy fire and my own Deep Strikers, and allow the gunline to place its shots where they are most effective. When a deep striking Spore Cluster lands I simply task a single squad of troops with a flamer or in rapid fire range to remove them.

Ideally I move back a little if your CC carnifexes get in charging range(they are more manageable than the Hormagaunts and Genestealers, but with only two small groups of them to deal with nothing a little focused fire can't remove), as I am better off charging them than allowing them to charge me, if I have the assault units(If I don't I make myself a moving target for his slower moving assault units like fexes, biggest wildcard is when does that Flyrant arrive, if its turn 2 at the same time I am trying to remove Synapse from the advancing assault forces then I potentially need to force it to ground, if it arrives turn 3 or 4 all the better.

Seems to me you would be better off spending the 30 points on spore mines on more Hormagaunts and maybe splitting them into two groups, also why hold the flyrant in reserve when he can be the one that jumps forward to man your Aegis Gun, if he starts out gliding that's one less grounding check and he is hardly modeled to take advantage of his Swooping profile anyhow until you need him in the enemy's backfield(preferably when the opponent is already occupied with the rest of your army) Now your opponent has to choose between a cover ensconced Flyrant that can potentially be in the middle of his deployment zone or assaulting his front lines turn 2, or the exocrine, or your walking Tyrant with accompanying Tyrant Guard(or if you prefer deploying your Aegis line 8" into midfield you can put the Tyrant guard with your Flyrant turn 1 and have them switch over to the Walkrant when the flyrant jumps/swoops away from them turn 2 to increase the flyrants turn 1 survivability) Warriors can continue to provide homefield objective and backfield synapse, take over manning the Aegis line once you are ready to advance the Walkrant forward.

[Halollet]

So seeing your army makeup and going on what you just said my initial strategy for my own gunline is to place is 22" back from your Aegis gunline in the middle, heavy weapons or long range weapons that ignore cover are placed for good sightlines to the rear out of all but Cannon ranges, if you move first I focus heavy fire on your Exorcine, unless I can get a shot at removing the Venomthrope(its usually pretty easy to give at least one ranged attack the ability to ignore cover these days, and use the troops holding the line to focus on opposing troops after any potential cover has been removed. in the ensuing turns I focus on removing Synapse with Heavy fire and my own Deep Strikers, and allow the gunline to place its shots where they are most effective. When a deep striking Spore Cluster lands I simply task a single squad of troops with a flamer or in rapid fire range to remove them.

Ideally I move back a little if your CC carnifexes get in charging range(they are more manageable than the Hormagaunts and Genestealers, but with only two small groups of them to deal with nothing a little focused fire can't remove), as I am better off charging them than allowing them to charge me, if I have the assault units(If I don't I make myself a moving target for his slower moving assault units like fexes, biggest wildcard is when does that Flyrant arrive, if its turn 2 at the same time I am trying to remove Synapse from the advancing assault forces then I potentially need to force it to ground, if it arrives turn 3 or 4 all the better.

Seems to me you would be better off spending the 30 points on spore mines on more Hormagaunts and maybe splitting them into two groups, also why hold the flyrant in reserve when he can be the one that jumps forward to man your Aegis Gun, if he starts out gliding that's one less grounding check and he is hardly modeled to take advantage of his Swooping profile anyhow until you need him in the enemy's backfield(preferably when the opponent is already occupied with the rest of your army) Now your opponent has to choose between a cover ensconced Flyrant that can potentially be in the middle of his deployment zone or assaulting his front lines turn 2, or the exocrine, or your walking Tyrant with accompanying Tyrant Guard(or if you prefer deploying your Aegis line 8" into midfield you can put the Tyrant guard with your Flyrant turn 1 and have them switch over to the Walkrant when the flyrant jumps/swoops away from them turn 2 to increase the flyrants turn 1 survivability) Warriors can continue to provide homefield objective and backfield synapse, take over manning the Aegis line once you are ready to advance the Walkrant forward.

This has probably been some of the best online advice I have ever recieved. Thank you.

I'm not too worried about synapse. The only ones that really need it are the guants and if my synapse die before them then I'm really doing something wrong! Other then that, loss of synapse doesn't really do much. Fexs just run into combat, which is where I want them. Exocrine will just hang out and shoot which is what I want it to do. Everything else that needs synapse should be dead by that time.

CC fexes are a bit of a risk since the meta of 6th is so shooty. I'll keep playin them to see how they work.

Yeah, dropping those spores might be the way to go. Since you said that you would focus on my Exocrine, I'm wondering if I should put regeneration on him? I think that might be better then 5-6 little gaunts since, as you pointed out, the exo is a target priority.

Okay, the tyrant shuffle that you suggested is hilariously awesome! I'm totally doing that next time. I think that would work REALLY well!

[Gleipnir]

I would focus my heavy weapons on your Exocrine if I didn't have a Flyrant or other Flying Circus to shoot at once grounded.(the example you gave you were holding yours in reserve) Just because it will get into an effective range a turn sooner than your Dakkafex and Walkrant, and even then my preference would be to remove a Synapse monster if its killable in a turn with a lot of focused fire.

Most armies can put out enough sustained fire within 24" to make Regeneration a poor investment of a lot of points, Exceptions I feel are monstrous creatures you plan to leave in the backfield at longer range(Tyrannofexes or Tervigons for me usually) and flyers that are potentially harder to sustain fire on while swooping(Hive Tyrants are a more durable variety than Crones and Harpies), or a Warlord that you are going to allow to take 1 wound per turn then send the wounds to your Bodyguards via Look Out Sir/Shield Wall etc.(Tyranid Prime running in the point for a unit with weaker saving throws, or Hive Tyrants joined with Tyrant Guard where you can rotate which guard is closest behind the Tyrant for wound allocation.)

[Halollet]

I've been wanting to take regeneration on my flyrant. If I do the tyrant shuffle, he'll defiantly be able to survive the first turn and once he's in combat then yeah... that's scary. Okay, so I think I'll run regen on my flyrant and make him front and centre and annoying. I should be able to conga line the guard a bit so that they have shrouded from the venomthrope.

2+ cover, regenerating, flyrant with 2 guard in the middle of the table wielding a quad gun 1st turn. Yeah, I think I'll give that a try. :D

[Gleipnir]

If it were me for deployment, I'd line up your Exocrine for the center with the Venomthrope 4-6" behind it to block LoS, and bring up the rear center 4-6" behind the Venomthrope with your Tryanid Warriors w/ Devuorers.

One flank lined up with your Aegis Gun placed 8" into midfield and at least 16" from his deployment zone your Hive Tyrant w/ two Tyrant Guards extending outwards deploying the Hive Tyrant within 6" to the front of the Venomthrope. Behind them in a line that starts 6" from the Venomthrope then stretches outwards from the center you have a line of Hormagaunts, behind them 12" from base contact w/ the Aegis Gun and 3"-4" from the Venomthrope place your Flyrant with the Close Combat Carnifex Brood with at least 1 model in 6" of the Venomthrope.

Opposite Flank line up the Termagants in front with Devourers to the back of the unit and 1 unit at least within 6" of Venomthrope to the front. Followed by the DakkaFex within 6" of the Venomthrope, followed by Tyranid Warriors w/ Deathspitters and Heavy Venom Cannon with at least 1 model within 6" of Venomthrope.

Genestealers Infiltrate out of LoS

If he goes first this way you have Shrouded for everything and likely no LoS on your Venomthrope and the Flyrant is to the rear out of small arms range and since it is able to jump over intervening models having him behind the others does no harm. If you end up having Onslaught use it to advance your Exocrine up faster while shooting to give the Venomthrope plenty of running room to keep up with the swarm as long as possible and keeping each unit within 6" of the Venomthrope as long as possible, Carnifexes and the flyrant will likely move out of range earlier than the rest as terrain dictates.

For instance LoS blocking ruins in the center of the battlefield, peel off your Assault flank with the Tyrants from the Venomthrope and use the Venomthrope to provide cover to the Dakka center units and shooty flank.