1850 UM+DA: Fly Like a Butterfly, Sting like an 800 pound Grav Centurion

[The Shrike]

I wanted to put together a list that wasn't 'the usual' but that could also compete at the highest levels. Here goes:

Primary Detachment: Ultramarines

Tigurius

Ironclad Dreadnought: x2 Heavy Flamer, Drop Pod- 180
Ironclad Dreadnought: x2 Heavy Flamer, Drop Pod- 180

Scouts x5
Scouts x5

Assault Marines x5: x2 Flamers, Drop Pod- 95

Centurion Devastators x6: Omniscope, Gravcannons+amps, hurricane bolters- 500
Centurion Devastators x3: Omniscope, Gravcannons+amps, hurricane bolters- 260
Stormraven: LC, MM- 200

Secondary Detachment: Dark Angels

Librarian: Powerfield Generator, Auspex, Mastery Level 1 (Prescience)- 100

Scouts x5: Sniper Rifles- 60

Total: 1850

So, how does this work? Well, like any Deathstar list it lives and dies on the efficacy of one unit. That unit is: Tiggy+DA Libby+6 GravCents. The DA Libby grants the unit twin-linked and a 4++, which frees Tiggy from having to roll for prescience and forewarning. That allows him to go for things like Perfect Timing, Gate of Infinity, and/or any of the leadership shenanigans; opponent depending. I don't need to waste any time explaining how devastating the unit is in the shooting phase. It's a 30" death bubble that will dominate the middle of the field. Critically, it is strong enough, with the aid of the additional 3 centurions, to deal with other Deathstars like Jetseer and O'Vesastar.

Deathstars, however scary, will fail if not properly supported. So what does the rest of the list do?

The Ironclads drop in T1 and pin the opponent back. Hopefully they can get their flames over enemy scoring units. If one survives to get into combat T2, all the better but they are primarily distractions. My Deathstar (and additional cent unit) needs time to get upfield.

The Stormraven, with 5 scouts inside, will likely be on T2, because of Tigurius. It can aid in the disposal of Riptides, TMCs, FMCs or Wraithknights. It also keeps a scoring unit of mine safe in its belly provided I can protect the raven. The assault marines also drop T2, and burn more scoring units.

The rest of my troops are held in reserve. Because of Tiggy being able to reroll reserves, I will keep them off as long as possible.

Basically, the Ironclads and assault marines work like jabs while my centurions advance for the knockout uppercut. If I can keep my opponent's first two shooting phases occupied with these units, he will be overwhelmed by my heavy hitters. In addition, I should have enough backfield threats to eliminate his scoring so that if my own feeble scoring is wiped out, I'll still be able to win on secondaries.

Any good list today needs to be able to best Jetseer, Screamerstar and O'Vesastar (with up to 5 Riptides). This army has enough grav to deal with 1 and 3, and enough tarpitters (Ironclads) to deal with number 2.

So, what do you think?

[TauBoss]

Nice list, really in your face. I do like the drop pod assault, well not as a Tau player. I do think it is a bit vulnerable if you don't go first. Leaving your scouts a bit exposed. Great list though. I would not want to meet it.

[The Shrike]

Thanks for the comment and compliment. The scouts certainly aren't a robust scoring option...they're about as weak a scoring element as you can have actually. But they won't be vulnerable T1...they'll be in reserves.

[KAPcom]

It's really lacking in scoring units. You're really relying on the centurion's ability to kill units (which is great, but the unit is slow and will really hurt against anything mobile, such as jetseer councils and the like), also the unit doesn't ignore cover saves, which is another strike against eldar and the like. Maybe consider Tau allies with a buff commander to join to the death start, giving it Tank hunter, ignores cover, twin linked, etc.

[The Shrike]

I think the buffmander is the common denominator of most gravstars. I do have a crapton of tau models because I play enclaves primarily. Before I commit going with conventional wisdom, I want to try this way. The DA Libby gets me a 4++, so I don't need to roll for forewarning. He also auto-takes prescience, so tiggy doesn't need to roll for that either. And I won't always need Gate.

So, tiggy will mainly be rolling or perfect timing and gate. And when I don't need the latter, I've got a 75% chance at ignores cover.

Thoughts? Am I being unrealistic?

[KAPcom]

I've found anytime I really need a psychic power, I never roll it. Yes, it's a %75, but do you want to be severely hindered in %25 of your games just because you didn't get a power you need? Out of curiosity, where does the 4++ come from? I'm not familiar with the DA codex.

[The Shrike]

The Power field Generator. 30 PTS; 4++ to every friendly model within 3". In that way it's better than forewarning. It can't fail and can benefit more than one unit with careful placement.

I know what you mean on playing the percentages. The thing about gate is, I only need it against Tau and Eldar, and only then when not in Dawn of War. So not rolling it won't always or even often be a hindrance. AND, perfect timing, while nice, is totally superfluous. 6 grav centurions paste almost anything; even 5+'s with the reroll to wound and hurricanes. AND I actually have 9 of them.

I think my pitiful lack of scoring is a bigger problem than not having ignores cover. I just can't figure out if losing the extra gravcent unit is worth more scoring. The age old offense versus defense debate. What do you think?

[Katharon]

I really have to say that Centurions should always be armed with lascannons+missile launchers. If GW had given them an invul save or have their massive fists count as some form of power weapon, then I'd be all fine and dandy in getting within 24" to let loose with grav-guns. But they didn't and I don't.

[The Shrike]

Well that's why the DA Libby is there, he gives them 4++ besides prescience. I need the hurricane bolters for the nids now running around in addition to the incumbent IG and Orks releases. However, I am thinking of maybe going 3-3 on lascannons and grav cannons considering I have the extra unit of grav.

[KAPcom]

As far as troop count is concerned, I've lost a lot of games simply based on the fact that I had no scoring units left on the table. Nowadays, I always run 30-40 troop models, espesially in games @1850 and above, or 20-30 in durable transports. Investing in good troops is one of the best things you can do for an army, and sacrificing a little bit of killy to do so is worth it.