Necrons Represent?

[Brosef Stalin]

Hey all -

I'm a newbie 40k player, got into it over the summer with the Black Reach Space Marines, and while I enjoy my small army, I really enjoy the idea behind starting a Necron army. I know they haven't had a new codex in ages, but I was wondering if anyone out there is still playing/enjoying Necrons?

I had heard from a couple people that now's not the best time to start playing Necrons, but I can't get over how awesome they seem. So, whaddya think? Are they fun or are they simply too old to be competitive without a new codex drop?

[Artein]

If you really like them, go with them. Of course it'll be rough and hard, painting same miniatures will be boring as hell....
but the feeling when you look at your lovely tiny soldiers and they are starting to look like an army - priceless.
It won't be easy, but when new Codex: Necrons will show on shop shelves, you will already have an army ready to play and you will knew that all this time, all this pain, it was not in vain.
:cool:

[Chumbalaya]

Necrons are just terribad currently, they have an old codex and 5th edition has done them no favors. If you really want to get into it, go nuts, but remember that you're up for a very steep learning curve and pretty much a handicap in every game.

Necrons can work, but it's really specific as to what's good and what's not.

Read this (http://bnhblog.blogspot.com/search?q=necrons), hope it helps.

[Nabterayl]

Also, can you define "competitive?" If you mean, "Are they still powerful enough that they can win games with nothing more than a skilled player?" then the answer is yes.

[Subject Keyword]

I love my Necrons. LOVE my Necrons. I have tried Daemons, Chaos Marines, Eldar, and I still play with my 'Crons the most. We have awesome fluff, great models, and lots of very solid stratagems. Necron lists are very simple to make, so there is less emphases on equipping your squads, forcing you into developing your battlefield strategy more than anything else. They are also very forgiving for new players. They help me A LOT with playing my other armies. They are also badasses. Metal badasses.
It's true that we're hurting in 5th Ed. But most armies in 40k are updated in order of their popularity. More Necron players mean more updates. Also, the only models that are likely to be replaced in the update are Immortals, Pariahs, and Flayed Ones, which are all the units you should avoid taking (with the possible exception of Immortals). There's no WAY they will replace the Warriors, Lord, Monolith, Destroyers, Scarabs, etc. They're just too pretty. I'm a bit too enthused about this.
In short, any time is the right time for the Destroyers of Hope. :D

And they're extremely fun to paint with a bit of creativity. None of that "everything boltgun metal" crap.

[DarkLink]

There are rumors of a new Necron codex around the end of 2010, though it's to far out to know anything for sure. So if you do choose to start them, you won't have to wait forever to get a new codex. Probably. No promises.

[Denzark]

If you like the models and like the fluff go for it. If you want to hear that with average dice and opposition as experienced and skilful as you, but using a 5th Ed codex, that you’ll win all the time, don’t hold your breath.

Personally I'd give them a whirl when they get an update (if I finish all those other armies...)

[Brosef Stalin]

Also, can you define "competitive?" If you mean, "Are they still powerful enough that they can win games with nothing more than a skilled player?" then the answer is yes.

First off, thanks for everyone's responses so far! I really appreciate it.

Competitive to me really just means, "Do I stand half a chance at beating my friends?". I really only play against a small group of guys, and part of the appeal of the Necrons is a fun, different army to play against. I play against two Ork players, three Space Marine players (four, if you count Space Wolves), and an IG player. I don't really win all that much to begin with (working on that part), but I'm in it to enjoy the game, and hopefully off a few greenskins while I'm doing it. I was just worried they would walk all over me, more than they already do.

[Just_Me]

If you like them; like the look, like the fluff, like the "feel" then you should definitely go for it. They have some very awesome looking models (though most of the coolest ones fall in the less useful tier, yeah Wraiths...). In my opinion (as someone who rarely gets to play) the hobby side is more important to overall enjoyment. Just looking at it in terms of numbers, for the all important first few years of your army most of the time you spend with them will be collecting and painting, NOT playing; it takes a little over a day to do a squad, from spruce to final brushstroke, while an average sized game should only take an hour or two. In addition, if you get really frustrated with their outdatedness, you seem to have the advantage of a small gaming group, in which case you can play themed games and or talk to them about house rules to bring your army into line with the current addition while you wait for a new 'dex.

A word to the wise, the whispers seem to suggest that the C'tan will be moving into Apocalypse territory with the next codex (nothing firm, but all signs seem to indicate this), so you might want to avoid investing in one of those bad-boys right off the bat (unless you just like the really cool models, in which case more power to you).

[Subject Keyword]

I was just worried they would walk all over me, more than they already do.

Yeah, they might walk on you, but then you'll just GET BACK UP!

(Sorry. I couldn't resist.:o)

[Brosef Stalin]

Yeah, they might walk on you, but then you'll just GET BACK UP!

(Sorry. I couldn't resist.:o)

Oh man. Mind if I borrow that one? I don't mind losing if I can counterattack with puns. "I'll be back!"

[RocketRollRebel]

Do it up sir. There need to be more Necrons shambling around. At my new store IG have been popping up everywhere and its bumming me out. (At my last place I was the only IG player damn it! haha) BUt it will give you a neat army that you don't see a lot of on the table top either. I don't think we have any Necrons where I play.

I've considered it since they seem like an army that you can either bang out in a weekend or take on the challenge of giving them some identity and uniqueness. But as other people mentioned you will have a bit of an uphill battle but its certainly not impossible to win with them at all.

Good luck!

[Subject Keyword]

Do it up sir. There need to be more Necrons shambling around.

Agreed. And it's nice to be the thing lurking in the darkness rather than always being the one on the lookout for the bogyman. Necrons really have that feel.

[sirrouga]

Just keep in mind that Necrons kinda have to be played defensively to really get mileage out of them. If you are looking to play them as a get up in their face aggressive style, you are going to be hit hard. Also Necrons have little in term of options, but every necron can affect anything they shoot at so that helps balance it a bit.
However the most important thing

Also an other thing I should mention, Necrons do better as the game size increases. If your group plays around 1000 or under you might want to wait off on the necrons, 1500 is where Necrons start seeing some decent builds and continue growing as the points increase. As more options to avoid Phase Out and keeping WBB become available in higher point games.

It is true that Necrons are pretty low on the competitive gaming scene, how much that matters depends on how your group plays through. Still its not like Necrons are unable to ever win games like so many people out there believe, you may not have any of those neat new toys but Necron's old stuff does the same job, just not as flashy.

The most important thing about Necrons is Phase Out, not only does this change the game for the necron player and for your opponent as well. Phase Out gives your opponent an alternate mention of winning every game out there, and its not really hard to achieve that. Once your opponents learn this, expect every game to turn into an annihilation style game, where even objectives aren't very important any more. Phase Out also makes team games a pain for necron players as they either have to completely hide (which why bother playing then?) or be focused fired on to get phase out.

Now I like my necrons, but I miss games focused on objectives and being able to play team games without leaving the table due to not playing. To me Necrons make a great 2nd army where you have something else to play for such occasions. Now I do win games with Necrons, yes even against IG and the new SW codex, but they are a bit of an up hill struggle but that is part of the fun for me.

This all depends on how your opponents play and how they will react to the necrons so about 75% of what you read may not matter a single bit, this is all just generalized information now.

[Brosef Stalin]

Also an other thing I should mention, Necrons do better as the game size increases. If your group plays around 1000 or under you might want to wait off on the necrons, 1500 is where Necrons start seeing some decent builds and continue growing as the points increase. As more options to avoid Phase Out and keeping WBB become available in higher point games.

We usually play about 1500-2000. They keep buying stuff and keep wanting to play bigger and bigger games, but I'm trying to keep it in that range (much more than that gets... expensive).

[BuFFo]

Hey all -

Hey you -


I know they haven't had a new codex in ages, but I was wondering if anyone out there is still playing/enjoying Necrons?

There is not a single Necron player on the planet, and for good reason. Stay away from the army. The army is not balanced at all for use under 5th edition rules. You can say, Necrons are the worst army currently available.


So, whaddya think? Are they fun or are they simply too old to be competitive without a new codex drop?

They are simply too old to be any FUN and COMPETITIVE.

[Cryl]

I play necrons (amongst other things) I like the army, I enjoy playing them. Granted 5th ed did them no favours at all and they are certainly one of the 'worst' books out there in competitive terms but it's up to you if that's the kind of thing that puts you off collecting an army... there's lot of aspects to this hobby and the competitive gaming part is just one.

I like the background to the necrons, I like the "all boltgun metal" robot look for the army, the simplicity of rows of robot killers is part of what appeals, I even enjoying playing with them and I do occasionally win with them.

Of course you're asking people for opinions which is why you'll get both ends of the spectrum, Buffo's post before mine couldn't be further away from what I'm saying. That doesn't make either of us wrong, in fact I think we're both saying that you aren't going to be attending a lot of medal ceremonies for your glorious victories, the difference is that I still like the army and Buffo doesn't. Should you like them? That's your call...

[tjkopena]

You should definitely go for it if you like them.

I wouldn't wait for the new codex to start playing Necrons. Even if it comes out late in 2010 as rumored, that's still a solid year building and playing your army before it hits, and that's assuming it hits then---a big "if" in my book. At that point you'll already have experience and models for the army, so you'll be in front of the bandwagon wave as everyone jumps on the hot new army. If it doesn't come out in 2010 then if you start now you won't miss out on an army you like while you wait for vague rumors to come true.


It's true Necrons are currently poo-pooed on the Internet by "master tacticians," but what does that mean? Does it mean anything? I tend not to think so. Sure, Necrons may not be showing up in a lot of high profile tournaments. But I'm pretty sure most people playing them in local games are doing basically as well as they would with any other army. In my local gaming club (~16 players, the occassional other small tournament), the Necron player can definitely beat about a third of the guys, definitely can't beat about another third, and is competitive with the middle third. If he brought out another army, it'd be exactly the same way, which is proven when he plays his 'Nids. Until everyone in a group is playing at extremely high levels, differences in skill trump any potential army imbalances, every time. I also wouldn't say that the newest lists are so overpowered that you'll definitely be beaten every time or that you won't have fun. You'll just have to figure out what makes Necrons work well, and what's a bad idea. Those are probably less obvious than for Marines, Orcs, IG, etc, but the army still has a lot of strengths that you can figure out and capitalize on.

The one thing I do see about the Necrons is that there just aren't a ton of units in the codex. But if you're stoked about what's there, then that's not a problem, and you have only good things to look forward to when a new codex does hit shelves.

[Asymmetrical Xeno]

Necrons are actually the most popular army in my gaming-group. Pretty much all of us have fallen prey to the stargods at some point. Necrons VS Necrons isnt even that uncommon :D

[Lerra]

You can always proxy up an army and test it out a few times to see if you like the playstyle of Necrons. They are actually not as bad as people say, especially in casual play, but they require very specific builds to be competitive. Locally we have one Necron player who consistently finishes in the top third at tournaments (he struggles against heavy mech lists but does well otherwise). The Necron codex is pretty small, and at least half of the units in there are lousy, so you end up with a very small pool of units to choose from. I'm sure the unit choices will be at least doubled in the next codex, though.

Some basic tips: Don't take a monolith below 1750 points. It's tempting, but you need to get the basics solidly covered first. Stock up on Destroyers and Heavy Destroyers - these are some of the best units in the codex. One unit of scarabs is always useful. At 1500-2000 points, you'll want 3-4 squads of warriors. If do you take a C'tan, take the Deceiver, never the Nightbringer! The Deceiver is a "noob stomper" who will do very well against people who haven't seen him before and don't know how to handle him, but he's pretty decent even against skilled players. (He's overpriced, but so is the Necron Lord imo).

If you want to test out a 1500 point list to see how the army works, here's a quick list that shows how the basics of the army work, along with a fun trick ;)

Necron Lord with destroyer body, warscythe, phylactery, lightning field
who attaches himself to:
Scarab bases (11)

Warriors (10)
Warriors (10)
Warriors (10)

Destroyers (3)
Destroyers (3)
Destroyers (3)

Heavy Destroyers (3)

Note: This isn't meant to be a tournament list, just an example of a good starting list that's fun in casual play and competitive enough to win. Read the codex to see why this HQ is called the "Bugzapper Lord" ;)

[Subject Keyword]

Necrons VS Necrons isnt even that uncommon :D

Your gaming group sounds like mine.

And Buffo, not everyone games to win. The rather large contingency of DE players are testament to that. Some of us are just in it to have fun. :eek:

And, again, more Necron Players means more support for Necrons.

[DarkLink]

Your gaming group sounds like mine.

And Buffo, not everyone games to win. The rather large contingency of DE players are testament to that. Some of us are just in it to have fun. :eek:

And, again, more Necron Players means more support for Necrons.

If you're talking about Dark Eldar, then Buffo will be quick to point out how often he ruthlessly slaughters his opponents with his Dark Eldar:p.

Seriously, though, Dark Eldar are still competitive. They just have a limited variety of competitive lists.

[Subject Keyword]

If you're talking about Dark Eldar, then Buffo will be quick to point out how often he ruthlessly slaughters his opponents with his Dark Eldar:p.
Seriously, though, Dark Eldar are still competitive. They just have a limited variety of competitive lists.

Really? Buffo,(or anyone else) could you show me one of your lists? I'm not being sarcastic in any way, I'm actually genuinely interested in playing DE, but can't find any decent advice on building an army list. Other than spamming Dark Lances that is... :D

[ssylyss]

I started playing and collecting necrons a few years back. The one thing I can say about the codex is that its very simplified. There are not many options and it's easy to get board of the army after creating several variations.

I still really like necrons because the models are cool, and 15 destroyers are fun to play with.:)

[Asymmetrical Xeno]

Your gaming group sounds like mine.

And Buffo, not everyone games to win. The rather large contingency of DE players are testament to that. Some of us are just in it to have fun. :eek:

And, again, more Necron Players means more support for Necrons.

we'ere a very weird gaming group, like our recent adoption of epic to do war in heaven battles and our obsession for doing minor-race factions :D but necrons are our "space marine" equivilents (i.e. dominate faction).

[Melissia]

Lord with orbs, and use the monolith for its transport and resurrection properties, not for its weapons (which are nice, but NOT as nice as not phasing out). Essentially, maximize your WBB potential and survivability of your Warriors and other infantry.

[Subject Keyword]

necrons are our "space marine" equivilents (i.e. dominate faction).


Ditto.
Well... Everyone in my group seems to play Nids too. Nids Vs. 'Crons is our most common game.

[Brosef Stalin]

Ditto.
Well... Everyone in my group seems to play Nids too. Nids Vs. 'Crons is our most common game.

Man, it is good to hear that there is a world outside of Space Marines and Orks. Here I was thinking that my group of friends was representative of the population, when I was totally wrong. Sweet.

[Necrontyr]

I used to love the hell out of my Necrons. I still think they're the most badass fluff-wise. However, they're not competitive enough for me on the standard game. For Apocalypse battles, busting out your 3-Monolith nodal grid is friggin sweet, and sending in the Undying Legions is fun. I still maintain a strong collection of Necrons, but I haven't used them lately. Maybe someday the GW people will favor us with a new codex and most especially of all some better Pariahs. I love the Pariah concept, but they are terrible at winning.

[Subject Keyword]

Man, it is good to hear that there is a world outside of Space Marines and Orks. Here I was thinking that my group of friends was representative of the population, when I was totally wrong. Sweet.

We do have ONE Marines Player. Granted, he plays Space Wolves, which doesn't really count. :D

[Bedroom General]

My 'crons used to hit the table more often in the last ed. Beware of phase out and necron warriors in reserve will be destroyed if you have a reserved mono that isn't on the table when the warriors make their reserve roll. Wow , what a crap sentence, sorry. Also they get mugged in sweeping advances by most other armies due to their initiative being that of a wheelie bin.

They are tasty models though (I love wraiths and destroyer lords) and expensive points wise which makes for a cheapish (for GW) army in $ terms

[Subject Keyword]

My 'crons used to hit the table more often in the last ed. Beware of phase out and necron warriors in reserve will be destroyed if you have a reserved mono that isn't on the table when the warriors make their reserve roll. Wow , what a crap sentence, sorry. Also they get mugged in sweeping advances by most other armies due to their initiative being that of a wheelie bin.

They are tasty models though (I love wraiths and destroyer lords) and expensive points wise which makes for a cheapish (for GW) army in $ terms

Uhg. Warriors waiting for a portal that never opens. I friggin' HATE it when that happens.

I like thinking of Necrons as tasty, though.:cool: