Question about the manticore and storm eagle rockets.

[fade_74]

The Storm Eagle rockets on a Manticore are d3 barrage right? So....Do when attacking with it, do I use the multiple barrage rules for a salvo from main rulebook pg 32? or do I resolve them one at a time....like multiple blasts pg 30 main rulebook.

The multiple barrage rule states "if a unit has more than one barrage weapon, they are all fired together in a salvo." Is a single missle "more than one barrage weapon" because of the d3?

I have yet to use my manticore, but I want the rules clear in my head before I do. So what do you all think? What rules do you use? Please give me clear answers with quotes and page numbers please

Thanks!

[acuk]

I use the multiple barrage rules when firing indirectly and roll individually if firing direct.

[Nabterayl]

Treat it just like any other multiple barrage attack.

I think the profile on page 54 is pretty clearly that of a single Storm Eagle rocket. Each rocket is an ordnance barrage weapon. Now, it's true that we do not technically have rules for a single ordnance barrage weapon that can place multiple templates (the main rulebook technically covers units with multiple barrage weapons, which is plainly not the case here), and the codex does not technically provide any.

Nevertheless, I think the best reading is to treat each individual Storm Eagle rocket like a multiple barrage attack. The only alternative is to treat it like a multiple non-barrage attack, and it seems ridiculous to me to say, "Well, the Storm Eagle is a type of ordnance barrage weapon we don't have rules for, so instead of treating it like all the other ordnance barrage weapons, we should obviously treat it like an ordnance non-barrage weapon!"

[acuk]

But you do have the option of firing direct with barrage weapons, i find this very useful when targeting big armor like a land raider, and barrage when targeting a hoard behind some cover, i find it a very useful multi role platform, even though it only has 4 shots it still does enough damage for me to never leave it out.

[fade_74]

After looking things over again Im kinda thinking this. pg 32 of the main book says that "All barrage weapons use blast markers and consequently use the rules for blast weapons with the following exceptions" The bullets listed after have no bearing on the question....they are about cover, min range, pinning, and firing at a unit out of LOS.

It seems to me that following the Regular blast rules a couple pages back....this is a single unit, firing a single blast weapon. it isn't firing d3 missles....its firing one. So Im thinking that you would resolve each "warhead" singley ie. roll for scatter once for each of the d3, add up all the hits, then roll for wounds.

Does line of site really have anything to do with it? why should you roll them all as a salvo when you cant see the target, and singly when you can?

[Nabterayl]

I'm drawing a total blank on this, but ... where does it actually say that barrage weapons can be fired directly? I remember that rule too, but I can't find it in my rulebook, and I wanted to re-read it for purposes of this discussion.

[Culven]

Page 58, top right, first paragraph under "Ordnance Barrage weapons".

As for how to treat a single weapon firing multiple Barrage shots, the precedent has already been set by the Eldar. The Tempest Launcher is a Barrage 2 weapon. It is resolved as a multiple Barrage. This was addressed in the Eldar FAQ.

[fade_74]

Thanks Culven....I was digging lol. I'm at work, so it takes a little bit to thumb through a pdf.

DOH! Eldar faq......Never looked at it because I have never played eldar lol.

[Sam]

After looking things over again Im kinda thinking this. pg 32 of the main book says that "All barrage weapons use blast markers and consequently use the rules for blast weapons with the following exceptions" The bullets listed after have no bearing on the question....they are about cover, min range, pinning, and firing at a unit out of LOS.

It seems to me that following the Regular blast rules a couple pages back....this is a single unit, firing a single blast weapon. it isn't firing d3 missles....its firing one. So Im thinking that you would resolve each "warhead" singley ie. roll for scatter once for each of the d3, add up all the hits, then roll for wounds.

Does line of site really have anything to do with it? why should you roll them all as a salvo when you cant see the target, and singly when you can?

It isn't LOS, it is whether you are firing directly or indirectly. If firing indirectly, you are using it as a barrage weapon, and since it is firing multiple shots it follows the rules for multiple barrage weapons, which do not allow you to scatter each shot individually.

Because it is an ordinance barrage weapon, however, it has the option to fire directly. If it fires directly it functions as a normal ordinance weapon, and therefor scatters each shot individually.

[Nabterayl]

Because it is an ordinance barrage weapon, however, it has the option to fire directly. If it fires directly it functions as a normal ordinance weapon, and therefor scatters each shot individually.
After reviewing the rules on page 58, I concur with this assessment. I also agree that the eldar FAQ is a good analogy for how to treat a single weapon that fires a multiple barrage.

So I agree with other posters that:
If fired directly, a Storm Eagle rolls scatter for each template separately
If fired indirectly (with or without line of sight), each template generated by a Storm Eagle is treated as part of a single multiple barrage.

[fade_74]

Cool. I'm glad to get that all sorted out. It still seems a little weird, but I'm thinking you guys are right. What GW should have done is written a rule entry for blast, and one entry for barrage, totally seperate from one another, and not dependent on one another. My confusion usually comes from rule b that was based off rule a which refers to rule c etc etc etc lol. Thanks for the help!

[Eyespy]

While we're talking Manticores, can anyone tell me what you need to complete the Forgeworld Manticore kit? Is it just a Chimera kit?

[Jwolf]

While we're talking Manticores, can anyone tell me what you need to complete the Forgeworld Manticore kit? Is it just a Chimera kit?

Just the Chimera, yes. It's cheaper to buy the whole Manticore, by the way.