When is proxy acceptable?

[Soundgear]

Spinning this out of another thread (in the hopes of getting it back on topic), what level of proxy is ok? I am pretty sure that most of us at one time or another has proxied a model or two. Why does a model not become acceptable?

Personally, I have some 2nd Ed scouts (with the leg armor and poofy arms) that I still run as scouts, 1st Ed SH termies spread around (which are really weird looking by today's standards) and a couple of scratch built Baneblades that I use from time to time (from instructions printed in a WD many years ago). I think all of these models are acceptable, even if they are different looking from current models. Is it ok as long as the model is from the same codex? What about the same race? Where do most people feel the line is?

[OnFyre]

Proxies are fine as long as:

A. The proxy is about the same height as what it's supposed to be, and uses the same size base
B. You don't use a similar model to proxy something else in the same force.

So using a Rhino as a Trukk is ok, but don't get another and say it's a Looted Wagon. And really old Termie models need to be changed to have the larger (40mm?) bases.

Proxies are totally fine in my book, as long as no-one gains an avantage from their use.

[Nabterayl]

Proxies are fine as long as:

A. The proxy is about the same height as what it's supposed to be, and uses the same size base
B. You don't use a similar model to proxy something else in the same force.

So using a Rhino as a Trukk is ok, but don't get another and say it's a Looted Wagon. And really old Termie models need to be changed to have the larger (40mm?) bases.

Proxies are totally fine in my book, as long as no-one gains an avantage from their use.
I agree with all of this except for the bit about really old terminators. While in general I think base sizes should be kept updated, I am personally totally liberal about it if the model is already built. If somebody shows up with their ancient terminators on 25mm bases, I'm not going to ask that they re-base their models. If somebody bought some unassembled ancient terminators, I'd ask that they model them on 40mm bases.

[Jackmojo]

They're fine with me so long as I can recall whats what easily enough (to use the rhino example above, if one is red and the other yellow I'm cool with it being two different things).

As to the basing size question, I always respond the same: 40k is not such a finely tuned and balanced ruleset that a few millimeters on a miniature are going to wreck the game.

Jack

[Morgrim]

And if people are going to be really annoying about it, blu tac and spare bases works wonders.

[Bard of Twilight]

Proxies are fine as long as:

A. The proxy is about the same height as what it's supposed to be, and uses the same size base
B. You don't use a similar model to proxy something else in the same force.

So using a Rhino as a Trukk is ok, but don't get another and say it's a Looted Wagon. And really old Termie models need to be changed to have the larger (40mm?) bases.

Proxies are totally fine in my book, as long as no-one gains an avantage from their use.

For instance , if I use some Harlequins instead of a Veteran Squad it would be allright?

[Lerra]

If it fits the army, I'm willing to accept pretty much any proxy that is roughly the same size. I'll let people field darn near anything if it looks good enough.

Harlequins as a vet squad? If it somehow fits the army and looks good, sure.

[OnFyre]

I agree with all of this except for the bit about really old terminators. While in general I think base sizes should be kept updated, I am personally totally liberal about it if the model is already built. If somebody shows up with their ancient terminators on 25mm bases, I'm not going to ask that they re-base their models. If somebody bought some unassembled ancient terminators, I'd ask that they model them on 40mm bases.

I wrote that last night when I was half-asleep, it's a realy bad example. A better one - Sternguard =/= Termies. I wouldn't want someone to mess up their antique models, but if they had a choice of what to use I'd say size matters more that theme.


For instance , if I use some Harlequins instead of a Veteran Squad it would be allright?

You won't see me complaining.

[DarkLink]

There are generally two types of proxies; temporary and permanent ones.

If you want to try out a new unit, but don't own the models, no opponent should have a problem with you using something to test them out, like using eldar to represent SMs or something like that. So long as it is clear what units are what.

Just try not to do a "this squad of guardians is a tactical squad, while this identical guardian squad is a SM captain with a command squad, while this identical guardian squad is a devastator squad."


On the other hand, permanent proxies are trickier. I have a friend who custom made some seekers of slaanesh by mixing some spider models with daemonettes, making drider-like creatures. They're the same size, roughly, and look good. No one ought to have a problem with a conversion like that.

On the other hand, if someone tried using a SM army, week after week after week, using only, say, eldar or IG models... it's just kinda ackward for your opponent to have to keep track of "ok, my autarch is really a CSM Lord, and the dire avengers are berzerkers, and the guardians are plague marines" on a regular basis.

[Melissia]

It's also awkward whenever you get the same guy with the same army trying out each different flavor of the month... one week they're doing wolves, then they get their butts beaten, and the next week they're using the same models, but now they're ultramarines with calgar. They lose again, and so they complain, and then try out a dark angels army. They lose again and then they use the SAME models and say they're a Sisters of Battle army. They lose AGAIN and then they whine that everyone's cheating -.-

*mutters about a certain person...*

[BuFFo]

For instance , if I use some Harlequins instead of a Veteran Squad it would be allright?

Yes, it is, as long as the wargear and weapons on the Harlies do not confuse your opponent in any way, and that they are represented properly.

[privateer4hire]

One of the most interesting and good looking armies around is a Genestealer Cult that a guy made but uses Ork rules to represent. Guy had about six different unit types. Brilliant conversions and painting. People, in general, love that army.

On the other hand, I proposed to play Orks using Space Wolves rules and local players and internet comments were way against it----even though I only had 3 model types to remember (all boyz were gray hunters; all mega-nobz were termies; grots were scouts).

A lot depends on how nice your army looks frankly. Good conversions and painting hide a multitude of sins :)