Dire Avenger Exarch options

[Lost Vyper]

Hi,

I´m just wondering, what kind of load out do people use (or do you use Exarch at all?) with Dire Avenger Exarch?
I personally think the Power Sword + Shimmer Shield is the way to go, unless facing Orks or IG or someone with armor save of 4, then i go with Power Maul...
Shield gives that 5+ invl., which can really save your a** in that final round of the game and under heavy fire of AP3/2 weaponry...
I don´t get any of the Exarch abilities, cos they seem to be expensive and if you ever have to use them, you are done already... :D

Your build?

[Tyrendian]

usually no Exarch at all to save points - since the dual catapults are gone, they just don't bring enough to justify the points for me... I mean it's not like with Fire Dragons where you get an Exarch with fast shot for only marginally more than another model in the squad...
sometimes the Shimmershield does find its way in though - if I have nothing better to do with the points, and then usually on a footslogging squad, as rare as that is in my case (usually two squads in Serpents plus assorted Rangers and Jetbikes are my troops [and my contingent of Serpents])

[mattblowers]

With challenges in the 6th I like the Dire sword. I like to have the ability for him to threaten the other champion in a fist fight. If I can't justify those points I don't think the exarch is worth it. I don't take an exarch just to take them, I take them to give the unit an ability it doesn't otherwise have. I like to add hit and run tactics whenever I can so my Eldar don't get bogged down in melee where they typically get wiped out.

[DarkLink]

Pretty sure only Fire Dragon and Dark Reaper Exarchs are the only ones even remotely worth it, and then only on like and Icarus Lascannon. Eldar are terrible in assault, throwing an expensive power sword into the unit will not change that. And it's not like they're very durable, either. I don't really care if you get a save, when you're T3 with a 4+, your only real defense is not getting shot at very much.

[Asuryan]

I run exarch's in almost all my squads, the executioner and Scorpion claw are amazing, The tempest launcher, spinneret rifle, and Fire Pike are beautiful, and having a exarch in the unit to take challenges for my PL, I always try and find pts for the exarchs.

[Lost Vyper]

Yep, on the Warp Spiders Exarch is a must (Fast Shot + Spinnernet Rifle), but if i´m playing with Fire Dragons, not anymore. Same thing with Swooping Hawks, regular six dudes will do. Dark Reapers (if there+s no Maugan Ra) i´ll use an Exarch for Fast Shot on Icarus. CC units haven´t been part of the army in a LOOOONG time...:)

[cebalrai]

Pretty sure only Fire Dragon and Dark Reaper Exarchs are the only ones even remotely worth it, and then only on like and Icarus Lascannon. Eldar are terrible in assault, throwing an expensive power sword into the unit will not change that. And it's not like they're very durable, either. I don't really care if you get a save, when you're T3 with a 4+, your only real defense is not getting shot at very much.


The Scorpion and Warp Spider Exarchs aren't worth it? Huh? And the one redeeming factor for Banshees (if you use them in a casual game) is their excellent Exarch.

Not sure why you think Eldar are horrible in assualt. Their strength isn't good but they have good initiative and either 4+ or 3+ armor and good WS. Against non-CC lists they do okay as well as against weakened MEQs. I assault with my DAs all the time.

[Da Gargoyle]

then i go with Power Maul.. I may be missing something here but there is no power maul in the Eldar weapons list. In the kits DA get swords and an executioner which I presumed to be what the rule was referring to. Is it the consensus of opinion though, that the term "Power Weapon" means any weapon in the 40k verse that is classified as a power weapon, (And not a fist/claw)? If yes does that mean a lightening claw could be used?

Generally, I would not take the DA Exarch because if you are assaulted then he will be challenged and the challenger will have all the pluses. Though the challenge rule may explain why they gave a ballistic unit an Exarch with specialist close combat options. But not why such a weak CC unit has better CC options than the specialist units, like the counter attack ability they took from the Banshee.

DA look a little more attractive now because of Blade Storm, but that does not mean the Exarch is worth the extra points, which you could take 2 more standard DA for. In CC they are over matched by, SM, Orks, Nids, CSM, DE, GK, and even Necron. DE are the only ones in that group whose standard infantry match the DA. Everyone else is tougher and have more attacks at equal or better strength. One dude with a nasty sword wont make up for that. If you don't use them for shooting they should not be there.

Scorpions and Wraithblades are the CC troops of choice,(Yeah I know Elite units both, though slip in a Spirit Seer)

[Anggul]

If in a transport, I don't take an Exarch.

If on foot, I take the Shimmershield. The ability to worry a lot less about cover and get a save against everything is very handy, usually well worth the points. The Power Sword is just a nice bonus, the Shimmershield pays for itself. That said, the Power Sword has been great for finishing off Deep Striking units that I've just Bladestormed down to the last few guys, and has a fair chance of winning challenges due to high WS, I and three attacks on the first round regardless of who charged due to Counter Attack. Prescience helps of course, and Doom if you have it, but obviously Prescience is more likely and combined with high WS means you're pretty likely to hit with all three attacks, so you should get that 5+ you need.

An important part of Dire Avengers is Battle Focus-ing in and out of appropriate ranges, but you also have to be very careful to make sure you still have decent cover while you do so, which can make it a lot harder. Shimmershields largely remove that problem, and let you do whatever you want and still have some decent protection. I don't bother with them when they're in Wave Serpents though, as they usually only jump a bit further along in the game to deliver the killing blow or to shore up a weakened line and cut the enemy down, so they don't take as much fire.

I commonly run four units of them as my main troops (Biel-Tan), two on foot and two in Wave Serpents, so I've had a fair bit of experience with them and I think the Shimmershield is worthwhile on foot-sloggers. I, too, go for a Power Sword. It's annoying when you do go up against certain armies and you wish you had the Maul, but I find myself in more situations where I want the Power Sword. I'm sure at some point one of them will end up in a fight with an Ork Nob and I'll wish I had the Maul. :P

[Pssyche]

I may be missing something here but there is no power maul in the Eldar weapons list. In the kits DA get swords and an executioner which I presumed to be what the rule was referring to. Is it the consensus of opinion though, that the term "Power Weapon" means any weapon in the 40k verse that is classified as a power weapon, (And not a fist/claw)? If yes does that mean a lightening claw could be used?
Generally, I would not take the DA Exarch because if you are assaulted then he will be challenged and the challenger will have all the pluses. Though the challenge rule may explain why they gave a ballistic unit an Exarch with specialist close combat options. But not why such a weak CC unit has better CC options than the specialist units, like the counter attack ability they took from the Banshee.

DA look a little more attractive now because of Blade Storm, but that does not mean the Exarch is worth the extra points, which you could take 2 more standard DA for. In CC they are over matched by, SM, Orks, Nids, CSM, DE, GK, and even Necron. DE are the only ones in that group whose standard infantry match the DA. Everyone else is tougher and have more attacks at equal or better strength. One dude with a nasty sword wont make up for that. If you don't use them for shooting they should not be there.

Scorpions and Wraithblades are the CC troops of choice,(Yeah I know Elite units both, though slip in a Spirit Seer)

Yes. You are both missing something.

Firstly, the Executioner is a type of weapon that Dire Avengers do not get in their kit, nor do they have access to, unlike say, Howling Banshees.
Dire Avengers receive a Power Weapon.
The kit comes with both a Power Sword and a Power Spear.

Secondly, the Codex refers you to look for the Rules for Power Weapons in the Big Rulebook.
(Codex Eldar: Page 64: Sub Paragraph - Melee Weapons)

Looking up Power Weapons in the BRB Page 61.
Types of Power Weapons
(Looking specifically at the Spear, we're not going to argue that the Power Sword is anything other than what it is, are we?)
"If it's a blunt weapon like a mace or staff, it's a Power Maul; if it's a spear or lance, it's a Power Lance."

And, just so we're all in agreement, look at BRB Page 59, Right Hand Side.
A picture of an Eldar Power Spear looking remarkably like the Power Weapon that the Dire Avengers Exarch has and a Power Spear is a Power Lance.

Hence, the Dire Avenger Exarch has a Power Lance.
So NO Concussive +2 Strength Hits for you Lost Vyper.
Unless of course, the person you bought your Exarch from had been modelling for advantage.

Power Maul indeed...

[cebalrai]

Yes. You are both missing something.

Firstly, the Executioner is a type of weapon that Dire Avengers do not get in their kit, nor do they have access to, unlike say, Howling Banshees.
Dire Avengers receive a Power Weapon.
The kit comes with both a Power Sword and a Power Spear.

Secondly, the Codex refers you to look for the Rules for Power Weapons in the Big Rulebook.
(Codex Eldar: Page 64: Sub Paragraph - Melee Weapons)

Looking up Power Weapons in the BRB Page 61.
Types of Power Weapons
(Looking specifically at the Spear, we're not going to argue that the Power Sword is anything other than what it is, are we?)
"If it's a blunt weapon like a mace or staff, it's a Power Maul; if it's a spear or lance, it's a Power Lance."

And, just so we're all in agreement, look at BRB Page 59, Right Hand Side.
A picture of an Eldar Power Spear looking remarkably like the Power Weapon that the Dire Avengers Exarch has and a Power Spear is a Power Lance.

Hence, the Dire Avenger Exarch has a Power Lance.
So NO Concussive +2 Strength Hits for you Lost Vyper.
Unless of course, the person you bought your Exarch from had been modelling for advantage.

Power Maul indeed...



Dire Avenger Exarchs can get any power weapon actually. Mauls, axes, etc. Just because it's not in their kit doesn't mean their rules change.

[Master of Asgard]

You're well within your rights to give a DA Exarch either a power axe or power maul. There is no rule stopping you from making a conversion to give him either one. It's not modelling for advantage, it's just... modelling. You're not at all limited to the options given in the box.

The codex says "power weapon" (page 96) and doesn't specify which type of power weapon. Compare this to the Harlequin entry which specifically lets the Troupe Master upgrade to a "power sword". Then add pg 61 of the BRB, "look at the model to tell which type of power weapon it has". Therefore you can give your Exarch whatever power weapon you like, it just has to be represented on the model.

[daboarder]

Yes. You are both missing something.

Firstly, the Executioner is a type of weapon that Dire Avengers do not get in their kit, nor do they have access to, unlike say, Howling Banshees.
Dire Avengers receive a Power Weapon.
The kit comes with both a Power Sword and a Power Spear.

Secondly, the Codex refers you to look for the Rules for Power Weapons in the Big Rulebook.
(Codex Eldar: Page 64: Sub Paragraph - Melee Weapons)

Looking up Power Weapons in the BRB Page 61.
Types of Power Weapons
(Looking specifically at the Spear, we're not going to argue that the Power Sword is anything other than what it is, are we?)
"If it's a blunt weapon like a mace or staff, it's a Power Maul; if it's a spear or lance, it's a Power Lance."

And, just so we're all in agreement, look at BRB Page 59, Right Hand Side.
A picture of an Eldar Power Spear looking remarkably like the Power Weapon that the Dire Avengers Exarch has and a Power Spear is a Power Lance.

Hence, the Dire Avenger Exarch has a Power Lance.
So NO Concussive +2 Strength Hits for you Lost Vyper.
Unless of course, the person you bought your Exarch from had been modelling for advantage.

Power Maul indeed...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA


http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?21435-Tynskel-s-Guide-to-Interpreting-Rules

And troll less please

[Pssyche]

As a matter of interest Lost Vyper, could you please post a picture of your Exarch and its Power Maul?

[DarkLink]

I'll point out two things. First, the DA sprue has both a power sword and a halberd option, not a spear/lance. So you have the choice of a sword or an axe. Though you could probably argue that the halberd is a spear, it's kind of a toss up, so really you have the choice of a spear, axe, or sword.

Secondly, and more importantly, the power weapon rules do not limit you to what is available on the sprue. This is just one more case of a weapon option that they haven't necessarily provided the model for. Take a maul or whatever off of any other sprue and stick it in a DA Exarch and you've got your maul, perfectly legally.

[Tyrendian]

that we´re on it... anyone got decent ideas where to get eldary looking power mauls from?

[Cpt Codpiece]

i dont think this would be too hard to sculpt

http://static2.nexusmods.com/15/mods/110/images/3354-1-1324401555.jpg

[Pssyche]

"First, the DA sprue has both a power sword and a halberd option, not a spear/lance."

6573


This Eldar Power Spear remind you of anything?

Still would love to see a photo of the Original Poster's Power Maul, though.

[DarkLink]

Yes, it reminds me of a glaive or naginata, which are both in the same class of weapons as the halberd, not a spear. I guess if they call it a spear... who actually cares. GW doesn't know what it's talking about. Spears are thrusting weapons, halberds, glaives, etc are cutting weapons. My point is, if you are telling your opponent, 'nuh-uh, you've modeled him with a mace and that's illegal', you're wrong.