Wolfie's Guide to Army List Posting

[Wolfshade]

Hello! Wolfie here, you may remember me from such guides as "Derailment: A Beginners’ Guide" or "Depleted Uranium Dice: The Hidden Killer". I'm here today to give you my uninformed opinion of how to post army lists.

Rule 1: Post it in the correct area in the Forum. You're 1589pt Dwarf army may be exciting but does it need to be in "Warhammer 40k General"? No.

So you have found the right section, then what is next, ah yes create a new thread, first things up: Title.

Title
This is very important; you may find it useful that this relates specifically to your list. "My Army List" while an accurate descriptor will probably attract less attention that "2,500pt Imperial Guard".

The next important part is an introduction. This is often omitted but when used can be very useful. Things to include:

Is this against a specific army or an all comers list?
If it is against an all comers list, provide some information on the local meta
Is there a specific theme to your army?
Is there a particular unit you wish to use?

There are many more items that could be included, but anything that can be useful to help place the army in context. But it may be useful in explaining that you are taking no anti-air as you are playing someone without fliers.
Also include what sort of advice you are after, a complete re-jig, and tips on how to use it, where to save points, what are the strengths/weaknesses

list

Then the list itself, make sure we know which codex you are using.

6 Scouts, Cammo Cloak, Sniper Rifle, Homing Beacon
Might not be enough to let us know if you are using C:SM, C:DA, C:BA or an army from the I:A series.

Try to keep units grouped together as per the Force Organisation Chart, and if playing with an allied contingent keep that separate.
We do not need the point cost of every upgrade, just totals.
Also try and keep your list below your stated list, unless you are specifically asking what to remove/streamline as detailed in your introduction. After all if you post a 2,016pt list for a 2,000pt army the obvious criticism is that it is over the points limit and if you are playing 2,016pt game then play that. (But that is another discussion to be had elsewhere).
Keep the list neat looking as this will make it easier to read and easier to comment on.

A Note on HQs (and ICs)

Make it clear who your warlord is.
Give an indication of which discipline your psykers will be rolling from.
Any IC that will be attached to a squad, make it plain in the list

Warboss: PK, BossPole, Attack Squig [Warlord, attached to Nobz]
Also, a number of vehicles that are not dedicated transport have a transport capacity, if a unit is starting embarked, let us know.

How you intend to use it
The final part of the list should be a brief description of how you intend to use the list. Yes, sometimes it is self-evident but not always.

And there it is.

[Wolfshade]

Feedback
In terms of receiving feedback, just because a list has no comments on does not mean anything. It is either the list is fine, or it could be that the list is very similar to a number of others that have also been commented on previously.

Rule 2: There is no "right" way to play 40k, if there were there would only be 1 army list per codex.

Rule 2 is very important, it is saying that there is more than one way to skin a cat, or blow up a tank. Most codecii have multiple redundancies of how to do a certain job so you don't necessarily need to take some ones re-write.

Also, don't expect all the advice to be useful, I recall being told that I should take a magna grapple for one of my dreads after saying I was facing Tyranids, and not an all comers list.

Try and remain calm if your list is ripped to shreds, instead think of what is being said and weigh up if the person has a valid point, if they do so then try to tweak your list to address it.

Also at low points it is very difficult to make a genuine all comers list.

Providing Feedback on a list


The best way to give advice is not to care if it is followed

Firstly, it is not your list and just because you play a certain way doesn't mean everyone else should. Certainly you can point out the merits of the way you do, but don't just expect everyone to follow your advice.

There are two main ways to provide feedback, either provide list tweaks/changes/wholesale re-write or questioning. Whichever way you do make sure that you address the list in terms of how the poster plays and the sort of feedback that they want.

Also remember the weakness of a particular list are very apparent if you know what the list is, so after reading a list it is easy to think of the perfect counter to it.

Tweaking

Explain what changes you would make and why. The why in this case is very important as it explains the thinking behind the change. This might lead the list owner to consider what you are saying and figure how they could incorporate what your change is addressing in a different manner.

Try and incorporate how the list owner plays in your tweaks, if they dislike close combat, including a melee unit to deal with threat X would not be preferable over begin able to deal with that threat at range.

Questioning

This is a more subtle approach and rather than provide the answer to list poster, it gets them to consider how they would deal with a particular threat.


The list looks ok, but with only 2 troop choices you might have difficulty with the numerous objective based missions.

This then prompts the original poster to reconsider their list or explain why this problem is not a problem.


Thanks for the feedback, while it is a concern, the local meta is only to take 2 troop choices.

When taking this approach it is very important to remember the points limit, after all at low points you would not be able to deal with every threat, and if you could it would leave a list that didn't hang together very well.

Also, it might be useful to understand why the list owner actually has chosen a certain unit/tactic.

Feel free to add any more advice to this guide so we can help help each other

[Wolfshade]

Completing the Cycle

This one is entirely optional but I would commend it to BoLS. After you have had your game with your posted list with any advice taken or not then let people know how the list went. Better still drop a battle report in :D.

But that might not be for everyone. I would like to see feedback, like

All that anti-air redundancy was for nought! She didn’t take a single flier!

Or some such.

It just completes the cycle and indeed can help when writing the next list.

For some people they pick a list for each game separate from the previous those players will have a general feel of how different units work but not quite so synchronous. I try and take the same list and make notes about what worked well and didn’t then use that the tweak my list for the next battle.

[Deadlift]

I rate this 9.73 out of 10.13. Well done you :D

[Akaiyou]

There is common sense after all! Bravo!!


Rule 2: There is no "right" way to play 40k, if there were there would only be 1 army list per codex.

Providing Feedback on a list

The best way to give advice is not to care if it is followed
Firstly, it is not your list and just because you play a certain way doesn't mean everyone else should. Certainly you can point out the merits of the way you do, but don't just expect everyone to follow your advice.

There are two main ways to provide feedback, either provide list tweaks/changes/wholesale re-write or questioning.


On that last point tho...while very true that feedback can be 'questioning/evaluating/reviewing' the list at hand, it is worth noting that several people here will NOT accept that fact. They can only ever run with option A..FULL RE-WRITES! Are in order all the time! Even when you simplify it for them and say 'Hey forget option A, I'm interested in option B'

lol ooooh the irony

Release the hounds!! 10 out of 10

Sticky this thread!

[Psychosplodge]

That's just those that you normally find inhabiting the rules threads...

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

*shudder*


Good guide Wolfman.

[Popsical]

Good thread wolfie. Should be stickied.

Akaiyou, when people post criticism of your lists it is not meant as an insult to you, or as a wind up.
You post alot of lists, which unless you are seriously rich, you simply dont have the figs for, and tend to look like spam filled netlists.
This can make them seem dull and "boring". People viewing them will mainly have the opinion of what they would think if they were faced with the said list. Sure you might not care what your opponent thinks of your army, but as most players like variety you will not make too many opponents or reviewers praise you on your selections. There is a thin line sometimes between "theming" an army and spamming the best units to win.
But when you post a stream of uber powerful spam filled lists in a short period of time, your not going to come over as a "theme" player, more likely a WAAC player. No offense meant in any of that ok.

[Popsical]

You seem rather defensive. Its just opinions. You post, you get opinions. You wont always like them, tough luck i guess.
Thats what forums are like. Youve been at it for 8 years, bully for you. I started in 87-88, that doesnt make my opinion greater nor lesser than yours.
Personally i find most people seem to like lists with a variety of units included, and find spam lists dull.
Sorry if that crimps your day.

[Wolfshade]

I would be obliged if both of you would take this discussion off this thread as it seems to relate to a specific army list rather than the topic of army list posting.

I enjoy a good derailment as much as the next person but not while there is still life in the original topic.

[Popsical]

Akaiyou, i understood your meaning. I was poorly trying to confer the fact that its all about opinions.

Sorry wolfie for the derailment.