Furioso Dreadnought Librarian force weapon.

[Bob821]

In the Blood Angels Codex it states that the Furioso Librarian has a force weapon... So does this mean it can be an axe for the +1 S and AP2 or a mace for +2 S AP4?
With rules for walkers I would ignore the unwieldy issue with the axe making mu force axe very nasty hitting at I4!

Am I reading this correct?

Many thanks.

[ElectricPaladin]

The one that comes with the model is an axe, come to think of it... I guess it would work that way.

[Maelstorm]

Correct.

You can also insta-kill Tau Riptides, Eldar Wraith Knights, Chaos Daemons, Tyranid MC's etc. with the Force Weapon (Axe).

Plus use Wings of Sanguinius to turn it into a 12" "Jump" Dreadnought that can make Hammer of Wrath attacks (per the BA FAQ)!

As a bonus they are AV13.

Use the Furioso for hunting/herding and killing enemy MC's and Vehicles, DO NOT let it get bogged-down with massed CC - it does not have enough attacks to wade through hordes.

Take 3 Furioso Librarian Dreadnoughts + 3 Baal Predators (TLAC + 2xHB) + 3 Predators (AC + 2xHB) to make a quick and easy Net-Tau/Eldar slaying force. 9x AV 13 vehicles will ignore almost all of your opponents weapons - making for the shortest Tau/Eldar shooting phase you've ever seen. Table the "WAAC" douche who brings the unpainted Tau/Eldar force to your local tournament. Enjoy!

[Bob821]

Correct.

You can also insta-kill Tau Riptides, Eldar Wraith Knights, Chaos Daemons, Tyranid MC's etc. with the Force Weapon (Axe).

Plus use Wings of Sanguinius to turn it into a 12" "Jump" Dreadnought that can make Hammer of Wrath attacks (per the BA FAQ)!

As a bonus they are AV13.



My thoughts exactly!

[Maelstorm]

I've taken 3 "flying" Furioso Librarian dreadnoughts for fun - The panic on my opponents face as he tried to move units up to speed-bump them, only to have them jump over the speed bumps and assault 3 different things in the back field... Priceless.

They are NOT effective in taking down more than 1-2 models a turn against a CC mob. They ARE effective in destroying MC's and vehicles. :D

They will keep the rest of your army safe to wreak merry havoc as your opponent tries to handle 3 angry Flying AV13 Librarians.

[Tynskel]

In the Blood Angels Codex it states that the Furioso Librarian has a force weapon... So does this mean it can be an axe for the +1 S and AP2 or a mace for +2 S AP4?
With rules for walkers I would ignore the unwieldy issue with the axe making mu force axe very nasty hitting at I4!

Am I reading this correct?

Many thanks.

Axe is totally the way to go. There's no point on giving yourself an AP penalty. You are only using the Axe if your Powerfist cannot Instant Death something.

[Maelstorm]

Axe is totally the way to go. There's no point on giving yourself an AP penalty. You are only using the Axe if your Powerfist cannot Instant Death something.

Agree

[Tynskel]

One thing that still confuses me: what Mastery Level is the Furioso Librarian?

[alakard2020]

Tynskel,

On page 29 of the Blood Angels Codex in the Dreadnought section it says:

"A Furioso Librarian is a psyker and has two psychic powers from the list given on page 63 (chosen when the army is picked). He can use one power each player turn, and counts as being Leadership 10 for all psychic purposes."

So being able to only cast 1 power per player turn would make him Mastery Level 1.

[Nabterayl]

Yeah, I think that's pretty straightforward.

[Anggul]

You can give him Shield of Sanguinus and Wings of Sanguinus to fly in your turn and give himself and things around him a cover save in their turn. Great stuff. Probably the best close combat threat to a Riptide with the ability to chase it down.

Riptide, meet flying lightning brick.

[Asuryan]

You can give him Shield of Sanguinus and Wings of Sanguinus to fly in your turn and give himself and things around him a cover save in their turn. Great stuff.


Tynskel,

On page 29 of the Blood Angels Codex in the Dreadnought section it says:

"A Furioso Librarian is a psyker and has two psychic powers from the list given on page 63 (chosen when the army is picked). He can use one power each player turn, and counts as being Leadership 10 for all psychic purposes."

So being able to only cast 1 power per player turn would make him Mastery Level 1.

I would argue it is Mastery Level 2 because warp charges are generated at the start of the players turn, and not at the beginning of each player turn, and since the Furioso can cast powers during the enemies turn, or activate his force weapon, he would have to have at least 2 warp charges. Only reason this matters is if your making a deny the witch roll; and speaking of which can Furioso's can take the librarian hood?

[ElectricPaladin]

The FAQs have not addressed this, except to say that Blood Angels librarians are Mastery Level 1.

I would argue that the intention might well be for the furioso librarian to be Mastery Level 2. It is an honored veteran librarian.

But the safest argument is that it's a librarian, librarians are ML 1 unless upgraded, hence it is a ML 1 librarian.

You can't really use 5th Edition powers as an argument for increasing its number of warp charges, as the 5th Edition powers worked completely differently. The fact that some older codices continue to give us the option to use these weird and outmoded powers is an artifact of the way GW has decided to update the game.

[Katharon]

The FAQs have not addressed this, except to say that Blood Angels librarians are Mastery Level 1.

I would argue that the intention might well be for the furioso librarian to be Mastery Level 2. It is an honored veteran librarian.

But the safest argument is that it's a librarian, librarians are ML 1 unless upgraded, hence it is a ML 1 librarian.

You can't really use 5th Edition powers as an argument for increasing its number of warp charges, as the 5th Edition powers worked completely differently. The fact that some older codices continue to give us the option to use these weird and outmoded powers is an artifact of the way GW has decided to update the game.


This. *sage nod*

[Asuryan]

ok, didn't know there was a faq stating what ML they were, and was just going off of my interpretation.

[Nabterayl]

I thought page 66 was pretty clear.

Psykers are assumed to be Mastery Level 1 unless it states otherwise in their codex entry. The Mastery Level is usually shown in parentheses after the Psyker special rule. For example: Psyker (Mastery Level 2). In older codexes, Mastery level may be written out longhand in the form of a special rule that allows the Psyker to use more than one psychic power each turn - the number of powers that can be used per turn is their Mastery Level. (emphasis added)
A furioso librarian doesn't have anything stating he has a mastery level other than 1, and he can only use one power per turn. He's Mastery Level 1.

[Tynskel]

I thought page 66 was pretty clear.

A furioso librarian doesn't have anything stating he has a mastery level other than 1, and he can only use one power per turn. He's Mastery Level 1.

Is that per player turn or game turn? If it is game turn, the Furioso Libby was nerfed! :(

[Nabterayl]

Is that per player turn or game turn? If it is game turn, the Furioso Libby was nerfed! :(
No, it's per player turn. But the point is, since page 29 of the Blood Angels codex says, "He can use one power each player turn," there's no reason to think he has a mastery level other than 1.

[Tynskel]

No, it's per player turn. But the point is, since page 29 of the Blood Angels codex says, "He can use one power each player turn," there's no reason to think he has a mastery level other than 1.

Actually, it just means exactly that. He's Mastery 1 with the ability to generate a warp charge every player turn. It would be the only way to satisfy both conditions of the rulebook and the codex. It wasn't FAQed.

[Nabterayl]

Yeah, true. But that's what Mastery Level 1 means. You generate 1 warp charge each player turn. As page 66 says:


A Psyker automatically generates his full allocation of Warp Charge points at the start of each turn.
and if we then confer (;)) page 9:


Whenever a rule refers to 'a turn' it always means 'player turn' unless it specifically refers to a 'game turn.'

[40kGamer]

The ability to generate warp charges in the enemy turn has saved Eldrad on many occasions! ;)