The Black Ark Arrives - Ask Someone With the Dark Elf Book!

[Pariah]

I just wanted to know if some ones Darkelves alredy arrived? I got mine already (DE Army book, 60 Warriors, Hydra, Shadowblade). If you have any Rulequestion i can answer them, I got the ne Armybook.:D

[Bigred]

I'll start:

1) Stats and basics on the Kharibdyss vs the Hydra?

2) Witches vs the Sisters of Slaughter?

3) Bloodwrack Medusa - what on Earth does it do?

[eldargal]

Does the Cauldron of Blood confer a 5++ Ward save? Is it only available as a mount for a Hero?

[Pariah]

I got the German Book so the Specialrule names may vary. (I dont know how the are exactly named, i do a one by one translation and hope it isn't to far off)


1) Stats and basics on the Kharibdyss vs the Hydra?

2) Witches vs the Sisters of Slaughter?

3) Bloodwrack Medusa - what on Earth does it do?
M WS BS S T LP I A LD
1) Hydra 6, 4, 4, 5, 5, 5, 2, 3+*, 6 (* Remaining livepoints)
Special Rules: Terror, Big Target, Scaly Skin (4+),
If you cut of one head... (one Atack per remaining Livepoint *),...another wil regrow (At the end your a Turn roll a die for every missing Lifepoint on a 4+ it is healed).
For Points each you can get a Breathweapon (S4 Flamingattack) and/or a Range attack (Range 8' S* Flaming attack MultyShots(*) buy both.

Kharibdyss 6, 5, 0, 7, 5, 5, 4, 5, 6,
SR: Terror, Poision Attack, Big Target, Scaly Skin (4+), Infernal Howl (every enemy in contact with the Monster must reroll Moraletests, except: Imune to Terror, Fear or Spychologie), Bonefeast (If every attack against a singe target hits it get additional D6 S7 hits).

(no handler profile on both)

2) Witches 5, 4, 4, 3, 3, 1, 6, 1, 8, 11
SR: Murderess prowess, Poison Attacks, Hate (HE), Frenzy, ASF

Sisters of Slaughter5, 6, 4, 3, 3, 1, 6, 2, 9,
SR: Murderess prowess, Hate (HE), ASF, Test of Blade's (+1 to Hit and Wound rolls if the enemy has a higher S or W, Dance of Death (4++ ans one enemy in contact lose Rank bonus and parry saves and)

3) Bloodwrack Medusa 7, 5, 5, 4, 4, 3, 5, 3, 2, (you can also get her on the giant Charriot thing)
SR: Fear, Murderess prowess, Hate (HE), Frenzy, ASF, Agony Gaze ( Range: 12' S4 MultyShots(4) Killingblow), Look away! (at the begin of each combatphase every enemy in basecontact must make a I test or suffer a S4, no armour save, Killing blow hit)


Does the Cauldron of Blood confer a 5++ Ward save? Is it only available as a mount for a Hero?

The CoD has a 4++ for itself a 5++ for any hero on top of it and a 6++ for the unit it is in. It is a mount for the Death Hag 85+190 Points.
The CoD is a chariot driven by "The will of God" it can join Units and must be placed in a the middle of the Unit, only one such thing can be join a Unit each time.

CoD 5, -, -, 5, 6, 5, -, - , -, (Chariot 6+Armour)
Witch -, 4, 4, 3, -, -, 6, 1, -,
SR: Terror, Murderess prowess Poison Attacks, Big Target, Hate (HE), Magicresistance (1), Frenzy, ASF, Bloodshield (the Ward saves see above), Gods Will (they explain why the didnt bother to let the chariot be towed by Coldones) Streang of Khaine (each Murderess prowess within in 6' can reroll all failed to wound, not just 1's) Fruy of Khaine (Augmentspell (3) (Range12' grants Frenzy or if you have it already +1 Attack (works not with Witchbrew, +3 Attack, yes Witches with 4 attacks each)))

I hope i didnt screw up to bad, I was i a hurry so i hope you arent to mad about all the typos.

[Mr Mystery]

Sisters....Sisters.....

http://kolablogradio.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/sisters_of_mercy_1.jpg

OH YES! I THINK SO! Man roll on Saturday!!!

[Cap'nSmurfs]

Thanks for this. I've got a question!

What does the Bloodwrack Shrine do - the Cauldron variant with the Medusa?

[Mr Mystery]

I got the German Book so the Specialrule names may vary. (I dont know how the are exactly named, i do a one by one translation and hope it isn't to far off)

M WS BS S T LP I A LD
1) Hydra 6, 4, 4, 5, 5, 5, 2, 3+*, 6 (* Remaining livepoints) 160 Points
Special Rules: Terror, Big Target, Scaly Skin (4+),
If you cut of one head... (one Atack per remaining Livepoint *),...another wil regrow (At the end your a Turn roll a die for every missing Lifepoint on a 4+ it is healed).
For 20 Points each you can get a Breathweapon (S4 Flamingattack) and/or a Range attack (Range 8' S* Flaming attack MultyShots(*) buy both.

Kharibdyss 6, 5, 0, 7, 5, 5, 4, 5, 6, 160 Points
SR: Terror, Poision Attack, Big Target, Scaly Skin (4+), Infernal Howl (every enemy in contact with the Monster must reroll Moraletests, except: Imune to Terror, Fear or Spychologie), Bonefeast (If every attack against a singe target hits it get additional D6 S7 hits).

(no handler profile on both)

2) Witches 5, 4, 4, 3, 3, 1, 6, 1, 8, 11 Points Core
SR: Murderess prowess, Poison Attacks, Hate (HE), Frenzy, ASF

Sisters of Slaughter5, 6, 4, 3, 3, 1, 6, 2, 9, 15 Points Rare
SR: Murderess prowess, Hate (HE), ASF, Test of Blade's (+1 to Hit and Wound rolls if the enemy has a higher S or W, Dance of Death (4++ ans one enemy in contact lose Rank bonus and parry saves and)

3) Bloodwrack Medusa 7, 5, 5, 4, 4, 3, 5, 3, 2, 90 Points Rare (you can also get her on the giant Charriot thing 175 Points)
SR: Fear, Murderess prowess, Hate (HE), Frenzy, ASF, Agony Gaze ( Range: 12' S4 MultyShots(4) Killingblow), Look away! (at the begin of each combatphase every enemy in basecontact must make a I test or suffer a S4, no armour save, Killing blow hit)



The CoD has a 4++ for itself a 5++ for any hero on top of it and a 6++ for the unit it is in. It is a mount for the Death Hag 85+190 Points.
The CoD is a chariot driven by "The will of God" it can join Units and must be placed in a the middle of the Unit, only one such thing can be join a Unit each time.

CoD 5, -, -, 5, 6, 5, -, - , -, (Chariot 6+Armour)
Witch -, 4, 4, 3, -, -, 6, 1, -,
SR: Terror, Murderess prowess Poison Attacks, Big Target, Hate (HE), Magicresistance (1), Frenzy, ASF, Bloodshield (the Ward saves see above), Gods Will (they explain why the didnt bother to let the chariot be towed by Coldones) Streang of Khaine (each Murderess prowess within in 6' can reroll all failed to wound, not just 1's) Fruy of Khaine (Augmentspell (3) (Range12' grants Frenzy or if you have it already +1 Attack (works with Witchbrew +3 Attack, yes Witches with 4 attacks each)))

I hope i didnt screw up to bad, I was i a hurry so i hope you arent to mad about all the typos.

Don't worry about the typos skipper!!!

Now, quick one about the Cold One Chariot. I think from the WD pics that the Charioteers have 3 attacks each, but it could be a 1.... Can you clarify?

Also, welcome to BoLs. Make yourself at home. Grab a cup of tea, and a seat in the Oubliette, and enjoy the most pleasant gaming forum on the entire interwebs.

[Pariah]

What does the Bloodwrack Shrine do - the Cauldron variant with the Medusa?

Blood Wrack Shrine 5, -, -, 5, 6, 5, -, -, -,
Shrineguard (2) -, 4, 4, 3, -, -, 5, 1, 8,
Medusa -, 5, 5, 4, -, -, 5, 3, -,
Chariot (6+)

SR: Terror, MP, Gods Will (same as with the CoD), Big Target, Hate (HE), Magicresitance (1), ASF, Aura of Agony (Range 6' all Darkelfs get +1 to LD and every other Modell -1 to LD), Agony Gaze (same as above), Look away! (same as obove)

Coldone Chariot -, -, -, 5, 5, 4, -, -, -,
Chariotknight (2) -, 5, 4, 4, -, -, 6, 1, 9,
Coldone (2) 7, 3, -, 4, -, -, 2, 2, -,
Chariot (3+)

SR: Fear, Stupid, MP, Hate (HE), ASF (only the Knight)

The Chariot shoul have 6 atacks and D6+1 Impact hits.
I will send you Pics of my new Xbows Elves as soon as i find the cabel.

[Cap'nSmurfs]

Thanks a bunch, dude.

[Mr Mystery]

Oooh oooh!

What do the new Cavalry do??

[Havik110]

i would pull points off of posts before you face wrath of the gods...

[Pariah]

What do the new Cavalry do??

Magic
They are Black riders with a 4++ and instead of weapons teh can cast 2 spells (they are wiz lvl 2). I dont think they will find use, as you need to fuel them with dice. Maybe when you dont have any "real" wizards.

[Pariah]

I need your help. What should i do build the Hydra or the Kharibdyss. Spear or Sword Warrior.
At the moment Its Kharibdyss and Spear. I am currentöy working throgh my Heros and the Cosairs. so what do you think.

[Mr Mystery]

I always favour spears over swords.

Extra attack trumps 6+ ward every single time!

As for the other question? Would need to look at the book first, as that's more objective!

[Cap'nSmurfs]

Swords feel like they'd be okay as a supporting unit. Spears are for main blocks.

[Pariah]

After working with the Cosairs it seems like they outmatch any other core choice.

I compare every Unit against each other lets say 20 per Unit

Sword 11 Attacks, a 5+ and a 6++

Spear 16 Attacks (+5 A if they dont charge) and a 5+

Cosair 16 Attacks (+5 even when charing) and a 4+

Witches 16 Attacks, poison, more expensive (4 less for the same points) and nothing.

So from a I want to win and not having fun perspective there is no real reason to take any other than the Cosairs.

[Mr Mystery]

Corsairs only have a 5+ in combat though? Light Armour, Sea Dragon Cloak.

Sea Dragon Cloak grants +2 against shooting only? At least it did!

[eldargal]

Also you throw Witch Elves and a CoB at a unit and it will die. Expensive but it will obliterfry all the things.

[Mr Mystery]

Indeed....

Get my new phone soon. So I can trade it in. £100 for bank account, keep me in the black througout this month (hurrah!) and then the rest? Chinese all you can eat with Claire (just a friend), drinking Saturday night....

Oh, and some shiny new Dark Elves!

[sockhands]

What do the Beastmasters do? Are they Hero or Lord or are there options for both? Can one be BSB? Are Manticores better?

[CiaphasCaine]

Shouldnt witch elves have 5 attacks each if the cauldron buff goes off? I assume they still have 2 base +1 for frenzy +1 for brew and +1 for the CoB, or did they neuter them and give them only 1 attack base?

[Mr Mystery]

Shouldnt witch elves have 5 attacks each if the cauldron buff goes off? I assume they still have 2 base +1 for frenzy +1 for brew and +1 for the CoB, or did they neuter them and give them only 1 attack base?

They've always had one base.

A1, Frenzy, two hand weapons.

[depuce]

Is Malus Darkblade in the book...and does he have a new model ?

[CiaphasCaine]

They've always had one base.

A1, Frenzy, two hand weapons.

but doesnt 2 hand weapons grant them an additional attack?

[CiaphasCaine]

Is Malus Darkblade in the book...and does he have a new model ?

the old malus is stll up on GWs site, so im going to say that most likely no new model, not in these releases anyway

[Pariah]

Seedragoncloack grants ScalySkin (5+) no only range or somthing like that.

Malus is in the book but not his model.
A short round up. Is not stupid and coldones lose Stupid if he joins.
He can unleash the weapon for +1 WS,S,T,I and gets Frenzy every miss thats a "1" hits a friendly model. his weapon ignores armour and you must reroll failed woundrolls, this includes friendly hits.

So Witches base A1 +1 "two Handweapons" +1 Frenzy +1 Brew or CoB (doesent stack). I suppose my CoB summary was miss leading, I included the 2 Handweapons already.

518851895187

[CiaphasCaine]

hmm the CoB not stacking with the witchs brew is disapointing but it makes sense balance wise, Dont really see a reason to run the cauldron now in a khainite army thou.

[Daniel Jonathan Roy]

I have a question. There's a lot of talk here, but are the Datk Elves loosing their "hatred" special rule against everyone and are now only having hatred against High Elves???

[Pariah]

I have a question. There's a lot of talk here, but are the Datk Elves loosing their "hatred" special rule against everyone and are now only having hatred against High Elves???

Yes with one exception. Black Guard still hates every one all the time. Wich is more bad than good if you ask me, with ASF you already got a reroll most of the time so in 70% of the cases there is no Bonus but you have to pursue all the time.

[hebbish]

hmm the CoB not stacking with the witchs brew is disapointing but it makes sense balance wise, Dont really see a reason to run the cauldron now in a khainite army thou.

If your meta has any type of a ranged game in it, I think the cauldron will be all but required for the 5++ save that it grants to khainites.

[depuce]

theres no model for malus on the Uk website not been for months, so love the new rules for dark elves :-)

[Pariah]

I just want to add that a dark elf wizard can use Blackmagic and every of the eight common Lore.

[Malachi]

Harpies - do they still NOT cause any sort of Panic checks for other DE units?

[HERO]

I just want to add that a dark elf wizard can use Blackmagic and every of the eight common Lore.

I don't understand your point earlier about Corsairs being the best core. I don't think so?

[CatachanDevil]

Do witches still need crone hellebron to be core or are they just core now? Also would an army of witches be a decent force or would it not be effective? Thanks :)

[HERO]

Do witches still need crone hellebron to be core or are they just core now? Also would an army of witches be a decent force or would it not be effective? Thanks :)

Witches are just core. Crone doesn't need to be there for them to be core.

If you like your core to be Frenzy, then sure.

[Pariah]

I don't understand your point earlier about Corsairs being the best core. I don't think so?

They cost as much as the Warriors but have better armour and attacks.

As already sayed, they are core. Without a CoB they dont have any saves and only the Death Hag can get the special Witch stuff.
Witch brew: +2 for Frenzy but -3 on LD for holding back a charge and remember if you lose Frenzy witch brew is useless.
Warcry of Khaine: Modell causes Frear and enemys in conatct get -3 on LD for Fear checks.
Rune of Khaine: The Modell get +D3 Attacks, roll before each attack.

I think with two big units and two CoB could make a core of an Army.

Harpys are fully integrated in the DE Army. No checks of any kind.

[elvendarkness]

Thank you for the information and for teasing us with your "purchases" ;) I get my boxes tomorrow, one of each minus the single character. Interesting that you would suggest the Corsairs as being the best option for core. What about the repeater crossbows? From the images you showed it seems as if you choose them as your core with your regular infantry...?

Thomas

[colinsherlow]

which units are Core/Special/Rare?

Do dark riders seem good?

if corsairs are indeed better and the same points a spearmen/swordsmen then that will make it cheaper for me to build my army.

which monster seems better to you? I am thinking the hydra is still better for killing power, but the reroll LD thing on the other monster seems like it could be quite powerful.

[Pariah]

I dont think that Corsairs are overpowerd, they dont let the other look like trash. Its just they have the edge in every catergory. The Witches need a lot of stuff to make them the main body of an Army. I would use 30 Witches a CoB and a Death Hag witch Warcry of Kaihne. The main reason I think that Cosairs are so strong is the 4+ armour save. Thats what the witches dont have. Frenzy+Poision+2 Points vs 4+ Armour save in the end its your choice, I will use Witches .

My 1500 Point DE Army so far:

Noble + DragonCloack + Hvy Armour +Shield + Coldone
2x LvL 2 Wizards
20 Spearman full cmd
20 Corsairs full cmd
2x 10 Xbows musican
Hydra
Coldone Charoit (played by my Carnosaurus)
5 Coldone Knights full cmd


In the game that i had so far, every thing went as expected. At first I was disappointed by the Blackmagic, not a singel buff for my units. But I can choose the Lore of live. I would prefer Regen for the Hydra but too late now:p , poor ting got eaten by a Dragon.

Dark Riders are your standart light cav nothing fancy there, I think they do their job.They come with Spear and light Armour, for a Point they can get Shields (they dont lose light cav). A very fast cav with a better than the usual light cav, in my eyes a very potend unit. Especially with ASF and MP.

Hydra vs Kharibdyss. In a duel i bet my money on the Kharibdyss. I realy love the Hydra, but S7 is brutal. I guess i have to field both :rolleyes:. They are pretty similar, comes down what you need "Horde" army the Hydra seems better but if you need a can opener I would take the Kharibdyss.

[colinsherlow]

does MP work for shooting attacks and spells as well? or just combat?

[Pariah]

Lords

Dreadlord
Supreme Sorceress
High Beastmaster
Fleet Master of the Black Ark



Heros

Sorceress
Noble
Death Hag (CoB)
Assasin



Core

Dreadspers
Bleacksword
Darkshards
Corsairs
Black Riders
Witches



Elite

Coldone Knights
Black Guard
Shadows
Coldone Chariaot
Executioner
Boltthrower
Harpys
Skid Scourge Chariot (?) (Geißelkufen-Streitwagen ger.)
Hydra



Rare

Cursefire Sourcer
Bloddwrack Medusa
Kharabdyss
Bloddwark-Shrine
Sister of Slaughter

[Pariah]

does MP work for shooting attacks and spells as well? or just combat?

Just combat.

[colinsherlow]

I've heard about black guard, but not executioners. What do they do? How many points for each?

[jadelantern]

What about magic items... whats in and whats out?

[Mr Mystery]

I've heard about black guard, but not executioners. What do they do? How many points for each?

Previously? Cheap for a Great Weapon wielding unit with Killing Blow....

I've got about 40...

[Richard Wiltshire]

Do the exec. get ASf aswell?

[Cap'nSmurfs]

I believe they do, which means they strike at initiative. Very tasty.

It seems to be part of the Elves' Thing these days that they have Always Strikes First as a racial characteristic.

[Mr Mystery]

Yes....and no....

I'm sure they will have the ASF rule, as it appears to be army wide.

However, their Great Weapons negate it, meaning they simply strike in I order. However, from memory (not played my Dark Elves in yonks...went all Ogre!), that I5, so it's still pretty damned nasty, and ideal for mashing up Cavalry!

[Cap'nSmurfs]

The only downside is that you miss your ASF and higher initiative reroll. But that's not too much of a downside when you're talking about I5 Great Weapons, is it? ;)

[Mr Mystery]

True.

I'm also expecting a points jump for them. They used to be dirt cheap for their hitting power, because of the GW negating their naughty Elfy Initiative value! Given that's no longer a concern, I'd be happy with as much as 25% points jump!

[Pariah]

Mr Mystery is 100% correct. 12p

Magic Items, Blackdragon Egg and sacrefice Dagger are the only familiar names, the dagger works a bit different. No magical amour. There are only 3 Items that i would use regulary, the rest is either to expensive or dosent seem that good.

Frostblade: Automatic wounds, if you lose a live against it make T test or you get -3 attacks.
Black Amulett: grants 4++ and if make a save in a duel the enemy gets a wound without armour saves.
Twilightcloack: 3++ againts shooting and magic and in the 1st round og combat you get Killingblow and Multywounds (D3)


The last is made for a flying Supreme Sorceress or a Noble assasin on a black Pegasus.

[angrybear]

Is it possible to get executioners to 3 attacks? I am thinking 40 executioners including Tullaris and a Death hag with witchbrew.

[Pariah]

Not with the things you named, witch brew only works with frenzy.

[colinsherlow]

You could add the executioner character who gives the unit frenzy and a death hag. Pricy, but if you really want it

[Pariah]

Sry Angrybear I mixed Tullaris and Kouran up. I guess this could work.