Imperial Guard Rumor Roundup

[Mr Mystery]

Don't suppose the source mentioned a page ref?

[bfmusashi]

The Arbites are a separate branch, not part of the Administratum.

Blech, that raises questions on its own. Like are the scribes that work on Arbites files members of the Arbites or Administratum? Does the Arbites have its own contracts and resources? I don't remember any of this coming up in the rpg supplements, and that's a pity, because it's pretty ripe for a campaign.

[Defenestratus]

Don't suppose the source mentioned a page ref?

Page 9 artwork. Page 13 in the digital version.

[Mike Lawler]

That's Flak armor. I think they make it huge to trick the Guardsmen into thinking it does something. :) Carapace armor covers a bit more of the model, like on the Kasrkin or the Storm Troopers.

If you don't want to sculpt Carapace you could have just used Scout arms and/or legs with normal Cadian torsos/helmets.. Maybe not the cheapest though..

[deinol]

Blech, that raises questions on its own. Like are the scribes that work on Arbites files members of the Arbites or Administratum? Does the Arbites have its own contracts and resources? I don't remember any of this coming up in the rpg supplements, and that's a pity, because it's pretty ripe for a campaign.

No one ever claimed the Imperium was an efficient bureaucracy.

For all that I love Dark Heresy and the other RPGs, they've still never been good at detailing the ins and outs of actual imperial life.

[Arkhan Land]

Page 9 artwork. Page 13 in the digital version.

If its what im thinking of, less distinct tank in panel 1 behind the russ, it looks more like a malcador to me

[Katharon]

That's Flak armor. I think they make it huge to trick the Guardsmen into thinking it does something. :) Carapace armor covers a bit more of the model, like on the Kasrkin or the Storm Troopers.

This is Flak Armor
http://www.displacedminiatures.com/images/0.img.1291151832Cadian_Vet.JPG

This is Carapace Armor
http://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2009/2/19/20385_sm-Cadians,%20Camouflage,%20Imperial%20Guard,%20Infan try,%20Warhammer%2040,000.jpg


There is a reason why the old saying "a t-shirt save" or "sweater save" was used when addressing the IG armor save throw.

[DWest]

I thought part of the reason "T-shirt save" was popular was the Catachans, or did they accidentally mix up their training manuals with "chainmail bikini" type lad's mags and decide less is more?

[Mike Lawler]

No one ever claimed the Imperium was an efficient bureaucracy.

For all that I love Dark Heresy and the other RPGs, they've still never been good at detailing the ins and outs of actual imperial life.

That's sort of the crux.. Any time an author goes about detailing these types of things, another author or supplement or whatever comes along after and invalidates it.

[Mike Lawler]

This is Carapace Armor

There is a reason why the old saying "a t-shirt save" or "sweater save" was used when addressing the IG armor save throw.

Uh.. no.. those are the old and new versions of the exact same model.
These are examples of Carapace Armor
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1241734_99060105170_IGKasrkinPlasandmeltamain_445 x319.jpg
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1251744_99110105230_StormTrooperssqd1main_873x627 .jpg
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1252494_99120101036_SMScoutSquadmain_873x627.jpg

[azoner]

For me it's not that the Taurox is "ugly" as aesthetic beauty is very subjective.

It's that it doens't match any of the existing aesthetic cues, design hallmarks, or theme with anything the IG have fielded so far. Like it or not, even the recent new Space Marine kits like the Hunter and StormTalon share the Marine visual design cues.

The Taurox just looks jammed together from a bunch of GW bits attached to a GI-Joe base chassis.

As a thought experiment, if such a vehicle was first out of the gate as a transport for a new stout, tough race (say the Demiurge), It would feel a lot better. But to me it's just a bit too cartoony for the no-nonsense quasi-"realistic" army vehicles that are the core of the IG range.

Its not that the design itself is horrid (which I do personally think it is), its more like if the Riptide kit as it, was released as part of the Grey Knight range. It just wouldn't feel right.
http://watchfree.me/60/w.png

[This Dave]

This is Flak Armor
http://www.displacedminiatures.com/images/0.img.1291151832Cadian_Vet.JPG

This is Carapace Armor
http://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2009/2/19/20385_sm-Cadians,%20Camouflage,%20Imperial%20Guard,%20Infan try,%20Warhammer%2040,000.jpg


There is a reason why the old saying "a t-shirt save" or "sweater save" was used when addressing the IG armor save throw.

T-shirt save came from the old Catachans in their wife beater undershirts. Flak armor is strange stuff. It can look like a t-shirt, a band leader's uniform, or a flak jacket and it works exactly the same, ie not well. The Emperor protects but only a third of the time and all that. :)

Carapace adds some more pieces like knee pads and usually a more solid chest protector like the Kasrkrin or DKoK Stork Troopers have. The original Guard officers actually wore breastplates like the old curriasers did, which did help them to stand out from all the guys in the quilted jackets.

[Katharon]

I one time made a joke to my other IG friend who has over 4K points of painted Steel Legion that if we were counting everything as "truly" WYSIWYG, his men wouldn't get any armor save at all.

The look of horror and hatred that sprang upon his face was priceless.

[Arkhan Land]

I always wondered the same for my Val gaurdsmen but it turns out flakk vests are worn on the inside of the coat. I do kind of wish though it was a life is cheap, cheaper unit with lower save kinda deal if you wanted, moreso in the spirit of the WWII in space theme

[Mike Lawler]

Yeah, for the Catachan army I'm working on, all the torsos will be either the vests from the weapons teams or the vests from the actual sprue.. the only exceptions are the heavy and special weapons are wearing lighter clothing. While the idea of the Ahnold shvauahuahuah get to da choppa army is pretty novel, I'm finding that having a slightly more practical look is allowing me enjoy models I normally don't care for.

[This Dave]

I one time made a joke to my other IG friend who has over 4K points of painted Steel Legion that if we were counting everything as "truly" WYSIWYG, his men wouldn't get any armor save at all.

The look of horror and hatred that sprang upon his face was priceless.

At least they have helmets on. Other than the Cadians and one or two Valhallans no one else in the old metal line looked like they had any armor at all on.

[bfmusashi]

Well, back then it was a 6+ save (5+ if hit by a blast weapon), so it made total sense.

[Lord-Boofhead]

For me it's not that the Taurox is "ugly" as aesthetic beauty is very subjective.

It's that it doens't match any of the existing aesthetic cues, design hallmarks, or theme with anything the IG have fielded so far. Like it or not, even the recent new Space Marine kits like the Hunter and StormTalon share the Marine visual design cues.

The Taurox just looks jammed together from a bunch of GW bits attached to a GI-Joe base chassis.

As a thought experiment, if such a vehicle was first out of the gate as a transport for a new stout, tough race (say the Demiurge), It would feel a lot better. But to me it's just a bit too cartoony for the no-nonsense quasi-"realistic" army vehicles that are the core of the IG range.

Its not that the design itself is horrid (which I do personally think it is), its more like if the Riptide kit as it, was released as part of the Grey Knight range. It just wouldn't feel right.
http://watchfree.me/60/w.png

Didn't you already say this? Cut and paste much?

[Lord-Boofhead]

Uh.. no.. those are the old and new versions of the exact same model.
These are examples of Carapace Armor
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1241734_99060105170_IGKasrkinPlasandmeltamain_445 x319.jpg
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1251744_99110105230_StormTrooperssqd1main_873x627 .jpg
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1252494_99120101036_SMScoutSquadmain_873x627.jpg

Add to that this:

7864

This:

7865

This:

7866

and this:

7867

[Mike Lawler]

At least they have helmets on. Other than the Cadians and one or two Valhallans no one else in the old metal line looked like they had any armor at all on.

Aren't Steel Legion all wearing helmets? Tallarn have shoulder pads and potentially could be wearing some sort of thing under the turban.. Mordians and Catachans are the only normal infantry that don't seem to be wearing armor oh.. and pith head guys.. arg.. can't remember their names..

[This Dave]

Aren't Steel Legion all wearing helmets? Tallarn have shoulder pads and potentially could be wearing some sort of thing under the turban.. Mordians and Catachans are the only normal infantry that don't seem to be wearing armor oh.. and pith head guys.. arg.. can't remember their names..

That's who I was referring to from The other post. And the guys in the pith helmets are the Praetorians.

[magickbk]

In one of the old books, maybe the Codex Imperialis or the Wargear manual from 2nd, it gave a pretty good explanation for the variation. Basically, flak was meant to protect from frag grenades and other light weapons, and carapace was meant for more protection. Flak was flexible, and carapace had stiff plating of some kind. The main part was that these designations referred more to the style or protection offered, but the appearance was dependent on where the armor was made. Carapace from high-tech worlds had layers of themo-plas or ceramite over mesh, whereas from a feudal world it might resemble a suit of knight's armor with thick metal plates.

[Mike Lawler]

In one of the old books, maybe the Codex Imperialis or the Wargear manual from 2nd, it gave a pretty good explanation for the variation. Basically, flak was meant to protect from frag grenades and other light weapons, and carapace was meant for more protection. Flak was flexible, and carapace had stiff plating of some kind. The main part was that these designations referred more to the style or protection offered, but the appearance was dependent on where the armor was made. Carapace from high-tech worlds had layers of themo-plas or ceramite over mesh, whereas from a feudal world it might resemble a suit of knight's armor with thick metal plates.

3rd edition rulebook had something like that as well.. Not that it's uber important but I have all of the old books if anyone is interested in hearing the quote..I could run it down.

[Mr Mystery]

If its what im thinking of, less distinct tank in panel 1 behind the russ, it looks more like a malcador to me

They're both Chimera. Trick of perspective makes them look differen sizes.

Mid ground is driving forwards, with turret to starboard.

[SquigBrain]

That's who I was referring to from The other post. And the guys in the pith helmets are the Praetorians.

Well, they used to be. From now on, they are definitely the Pith Head Guys. :)

[bfmusashi]

Add to that this:

7864


That's power armor.

[Haighus]

That's power armor.
and the Crusaders were in flak armour too, but it doesn't really matter for them, cos they have a storm shield which over rides the armour save in almost all cases.

[RGilbert26]

Has anyone considered the possibility that what we've seen so far is in fact a brand new army and not IG?

[GuyFella]

Has anyone considered the possibility that what we've seen so far is in fact a brand new army and not IG?

On that same note, anyone else notice that the camo scheme is totally new. I can't think of any current IG regiment that paints their tanks in a 2 tone blue camo. If I remember correctly the Bullygruns, or whatever the heck they are called, had similar colors on their shields. I wonder if GW is going to introduce a new regiment, or they are using the colors to make a distinction between human regiments (Cadian, Catachan, etc...) and ab-human auxiliaries.

[GuyFella]

Has anyone considered the possibility that what we've seen so far is in fact a brand new army and not IG?
On that same line, has anyone else noticed that this vehicle is painted up strangely? What guard regiment paints their vehicles in a two tone blue camo scheme? I wonder if this is the first sign of a new Guard regiment to be release with the book, or if GW is using different color schemes to differentiate between human regiments and ab-human auxiliaries.

[Mike Lawler]

Has anyone considered the possibility that what we've seen so far is in fact a brand new army and not IG?

It was discussed but the consensus is that both the IG codex AND the supplement are being released at the same time with many units from the supplement having a more generic version in the primary army book (Astra Militarum or whatever)

[Gutzmek]

I'm just really hoping they bring back the Valhallan's, loved the minis when I was younger and still would like to make an actual IG company with these great coated little jerks.

[RGilbert26]

It was discussed but the consensus is that both the IG codex AND the supplement are being released at the same time with many units from the supplement having a more generic version in the primary army book (Astra Militarum or whatever)

Ah but how do we know that that codex is the new IG book? Could be a brand new army.

[Dimitrios]

Ah but how do we know that that codex is the new IG book? Could be a brand new army.

Time to wear our tin hats....

[RGilbert26]

Don't leave home without mine :P

[Lord-Boofhead]

That's power armor.

Nope pretty sure thats the default Inquisitorial Carapace, if yo look closer it doesn't cover enough. What Cortez has on is Power Armour.

And I think the Crusader were supposed to have Carapace and they do have it in Dark Heresy but someone had a special moment in the design team when C:GK was written

[bfmusashi]

Nope pretty sure thats the default Inquisitorial Carapace, if yo look closer it doesn't cover enough. What Cortez has on is Power Armour.

And I think the Crusader were supposed to have Carapace and they do have it in Dark Heresy but someone had a special moment in the design team when C:GK was written
It is Ignatus Pattern Power Armour. The model is further described as being in power armour in the old daemonhunters book.

[bfmusashi]

double post.

[Mike Lawler]

All Warrior Henchmen came with 4+ armor in the old WH/DH books.. Crusaders additionally came with Shields.

[Harley]

All Warrior Henchmen came with 4+ armor in the old WH/DH books.. Crusaders additionally came with Shields.

Which was rather important when psycannons used to ignore invulnerable saves... Now only a Vindicare can still break a Crusaders shield, leaving them defenseless, which doesn't make much sense.

[bfmusashi]

Bwahahahaha dropping an Incinerator on a seer council! Good times.

[George Labour]

Coming in a bit late to the Carapace armor thing. But Vostroyans are all wearing Carapace Armour with the exception of the standard bearer who is basically so macho and tattooed he gets a 4+ anyways. Their carapace was mostly chainmail seeming body armor with rigid plates on the upper arms and some legs.

Kind of hoping this Astra Militarum codex will let me revisit them as an elite regiment of carapace wearing CQC specialists again while still having a useable army.

[DarkLink]

Well, they'd still get a rerollable 2+ armor save, because no one seemed to realize that basically everything with a good invuln had a good armor, yet they decided to keep the Incinerator at AP4, so that rule basically never got used... but, yeah.

[bfmusashi]

They didn't have a 2+ re-rollable save back when the Incinerator ignored invulnerable saves. They were always one brassy deep strike away from elimination.

[Katharon]

Nope pretty sure thats the default Inquisitorial Carapace, if yo look closer it doesn't cover enough. What Cortez has on is Power Armour.

And I think the Crusader were supposed to have Carapace and they do have it in Dark Heresy but someone had a special moment in the design team when C:GK was written

Coteaz is wearing artificer armor. Sadly he is the only Inquisitor who has it. Something for which I'd like to have a long conversation with the writer of that supplement.

EDIT: My mistake, I mean the intern that they had copy-paste sheise from the GK codex to a PDF format.

[Harley]

Coteaz is wearing artificer armor. Sadly he is the only Inquisitor who has it. Something for which I'd like to have a long conversation with the writer of that supplement.

EDIT: My mistake, I mean the intern that they had copy-paste sheise from the GK codex to a PDF format.

You think with all that requisition ability they could get a few more suits, or at least pick up a Rosarious from a dead Priest, but noooo. Oddly, Terminator armor is perfectly easy to come by for the Ordo Malleus.

[Arkhan Land]

because of the inquisitions age ide assume theyde have fewer artificer armour suits and more later mark power armour and terminator suits. and while the inquisition doesnt allow rosarius as a chooseable wargear option they do give it and several higher invuls to almost every choice in the whole dex. joakeros, crusaders, death cult assasins and dhosts all sport nice ones. i do admit that t does seem weird that ministorum priest gets one but they dont.

[Katharon]

because of the inquisitions age ide assume theyde have fewer artificer armour suits and more later mark power armour and terminator suits. and while the inquisition doesnt allow rosarius as a chooseable wargear option they do give it and several higher invuls to almost every choice in the whole dex. joakeros, crusaders, death cult assasins and dhosts all sport nice ones. i do admit that t does seem weird that ministorum priest gets one but they dont.

Inquisitors -- besides maybe a few Lord Generals, Tech Magi, Segementum Commanders, of Terran High Lords -- are able to and have the authority of requisitioning anything they damn well want. Artificer armor is regularly being made by the likes of Mars and even the Salamanders Space Marine Chapter. So, I mean, come on!

[Katharon]

.............

[Tynskel]

Well, they'd still get a rerollable 2+ armor save, because no one seemed to realize that basically everything with a good invuln had a good armor, yet they decided to keep the Incinerator at AP4, so that rule basically never got used... but, yeah.

worked great against legion of the damned.

[Harley]

7887

The Taurox hasn't gone unnoticed by other game companies haha...

[SquigBrain]

7887

The Taurox hasn't gone unnoticed by other game companies haha...

Well played, Mantic. Well played!

[Mike Lawler]

Funny.. I follow Mantic on FB and never saw that.. Very nice either way.. I'm glad they're not shy about the jabs :)

[Bigred]

via lordbeefy on Warseer (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?391279-Imperial-Guard-Rumours-March-April-2014&p=7099380&viewfull=1#post7099380):


Heard a small rumour today from GW staffer....ogryns shields act as mobile aegis line type defence....4+ cover save, but they forgo their move in the subsequent phase. The weapons are a cross between grenade launchers and a mortar with specialist shells. Sounds very feasible from what i have seen of the model. He also said that the moustachiod ogryn is indeed neddog and has some interesting rules. On a par with the Kell rule with Creed.

[Alexander Jones]

via lordbeefy on Warseer (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?391279-Imperial-Guard-Rumours-March-April-2014&p=7099380&viewfull=1#post7099380):

Heard a small rumour today from GW staffer....ogryns shields act as mobile aegis line type defence....4+ cover save, but they forgo their move in the subsequent phase. The weapons are a cross between grenade launchers and a mortar with specialist shells. Sounds very feasible from what i have seen of the model. He also said that the moustachiod ogryn is indeed neddog and has some interesting rules. On a par with the Kell rule with Creed.


I find this one hard to believe, purely on the basis of the 4+ cover save. With so many weapons now that ignore cover, giving up a turn of movement is completely ludacris. I'd believe if it provided an invulnerable save, but even then, only providing a 4+ in lieu of movement on the following turn is weird. Perhaps a 4+ invulnerable, with the option to turn it into a 3+ with the sacrifice of movement?

I also find the statement it came from a GW staffer suspect.

[A.j. Heiskell]

I really like that Ogryn w/shield. Pretty cool mini!

[MajorWesJanson]

via lordbeefy on Warseer (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?391279-Imperial-Guard-Rumours-March-April-2014&p=7099380&viewfull=1#post7099380):

Sounds like rumor reverb on the rules, and Nork is not the mustached one, but the green one with the commissar cap.

[bfmusashi]

I thought Nork would be the one with the hat on a speaker.

[DarkLink]

I find this one hard to believe...

This is GW we're talking about.

[Mike Lawler]

The Wilfred Brimley Ogre is definitely not Nork.. He's got all the look of a (poorly assembled) multipart kit and none of the personality of Nork.

[Lord-Boofhead]

he moustachiod ogryn is indeed neddog

Your source is wrong.

its the guy on the end with the Cigar, It has Norks signature Carapace armour and the Hat the Comisar gave him as a Gift.

I'm sure I said it earlier.

The mustache guy is just the Bullygrn Bonehead.

[Lord-Boofhead]

via lordbeefy on Warseer:

Ah warseer the home of the gulible.

[daboarder]

Man, I must be one of the few people that actually like the taurox.

I mean I wouldnt stick it in an IG army, but I would LOVE to have that for my gangs to run around on in necromunda, probably swap out the chain guns for an heavy flammer and go spider hunting. I'll be buying 1 or maybe even 2...

[Lord-Boofhead]

All Warrior Henchmen came with 4+ armor in the old WH/DH books.. Crusaders additionally came with Shields.

Yeah don't know why they bumped it down to 5+ in the new GK and Inq book, also makes them a less satisfying option to represent Arbite Riot Suppression Squads.

And I stand Corected on the power armour ,even though I'm sure Ignust Armour has arms and the backs of the legs.

[Lord-Boofhead]

Man, I must be one of the few people that actually like the taurox.

I mean I wouldnt stick it in an IG army, but I would LOVE to have that for my gangs to run around on in necromunda, probably swap out the chain guns for an heavy flammer and go spider hunting. I'll be buying 1 or maybe even 2...

I like it too but one of my IG armies is a Squat Sapper regiment and all the vehicles in it are repurposed Mining machinery....

[bfmusashi]

And I stand Corected on the power armour ,even though I'm sure Ignust Armour has arms and the backs of the legs.

It really doesn't, even in the pictures they used for the RPG (I think it's in Accession) which makes the strength bonus very difficult to wrap your head around.

[Lord-Boofhead]

It really doesn't, even in the pictures they used for the RPG (I think it's in Accession) which makes the strength bonus very difficult to wrap your head around.

It does I'm holding the book in my hand its vacuum sealed too.

[MajorWesJanson]

Ah warseer the home of the gulible.

No, you are thinking Faeit.

[Mike Lawler]

As an IG-Player turned Ork player turned multi-army player.. I don't dislike ALL of the Taurox.. There are elements of the kit that I find appealing.. but not for IG. Everyone keeps saying MRAP and all of the other things the design is inspired from.. well.. no crap.. pretty sure most people picked up on that when they saw it.. but the core of it really looks like a souped up Ork vehicle or some strange flyer hull.
My hope for the kit, is that those stupid hotrod pipes are separate.. that it comes with wheels, that the overly-ornate plating is separate, and that there are turret options that would allow me to put something a little smaller and more aesthetically balanced up top. If I have to come up with all of that outside of what's provided from the kit, then I'll just stick to the 1/48 Land Rover Defenders I had ordered to use as Tauros for drop troops.

Otherwise, I can see parts of the kit being used for a lot of things.. I have a few Ork Trukk Chassis that are sitting around gathering dust and they would love some of the parts.. Likewise for the cab.. I could easily see that being the center of a cab for a blastabomma that I've been putting off. The track units are the right size for a ton of builds.. everything from half-tracks to various gun tractors, war-tracks, even imperial builds that would be fun. So yeah.. there are virtues to the kit. If the configuration from that White Dwarf is the only possible build from the kit though, I'll be ordering those virtues through various bits retailers as I need them :/

[George Labour]

Man, I must be one of the few people that actually like the taurox.

I mean I wouldnt stick it in an IG army, but I would LOVE to have that for my gangs to run around on in necromunda, probably swap out the chain guns for an heavy flammer and go spider hunting. I'll be buying 1 or maybe even 2...

Actually I like it too and plan to pick up a few for my 'Tejasian' IG to represent the vehicles they went dinosaur ranching in alongside their Knight suit wearing overseers. Then I can use chimeras for the command squads, and the space trucks for the grunts.

Provided of course that is is available to the IG and not just whatever this tempestus thing is.

[Mike Lawler]

Actually I like it too and plan to pick up a few for my 'Tejasian' IG to represent the vehicles they went dinosaur ranching in alongside their Knight suit wearing overseers. Then I can use chimeras for the command squads, and the space trucks for the grunts.

Provided of course that is is available to the IG and not just whatever this tempestus thing is.

We need some dinosaurs for real.

On another note..
ROUGH RIDERS ARE GONE.. I have no idea how long they've been absent, but they're not in the online store anymore.

[Nothanow]

In the Grim Darkness of the Far Future, humanity finally realizes that running beasts of burden into automatic/biological/shuriken weapon nests is a bad idea?

[This Dave]

We need some dinosaurs for real.

On another note..
ROUGH RIDERS ARE GONE.. I have no idea how long they've been absent, but they're not in the online store anymore.

This really annoys me as a good friend of mine just made and painted a whole units of Praetorian Rough Riders for me. Guess they'll just be an honor guard in the cabinet now. :(

[Arkhan Land]

Rip Tilla

[Mike Lawler]

In the Grim Darkness of the Far Future, humanity finally realizes that running beasts of burden into automatic/biological/shuriken weapon nests is a bad idea?

While I agree that it's a really really dumb idea.. I am a bit put off by the fact that I had purchased the stuff to make a unit and just haven't gotten around to it.
On the other hand.. if they're replaced by IG on motorcycles.. I'll be pretty excited... I've never liked the idea of running guys on bikes as rough riders but always thought IG should have bikes of some sort. IF we get them, I'll probably be using quads though :P

[George Labour]

Hoping to get new plastic ones due to recent rumors about such a thing. And if they look something like the ones on the cover of the new Apocalypse book they should fit well into both an Attilan and Vostroyan themed list.

[bfmusashi]

In the Grim Darkness of the Far Future, humanity finally realizes that running beasts of burden into automatic/biological/shuriken weapon nests is a bad idea?

I'll believe that when we stop running them in to hit stuff with swords.

[Lord-Boofhead]

We need some dinosaurs for real.

On another note..
ROUGH RIDERS ARE GONE.. I have no idea how long they've been absent, but they're not in the online store anymore.


look again! (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440251a&prodId=prod1130550)

[Lord-Boofhead]

No, you are thinking Faeit.

Where do you think faet gets most of his fake rumours?

[Lord-Boofhead]

I've also heard that the pictures of the truck we've seen are at a weird perspective. And look better in other picture/in the flesh(plastic?).

[Ang56]

This really annoys me as a good friend of mine just made and painted a whole units of Praetorian Rough Riders for me. Guess they'll just be an honor guard in the cabinet now. :(

Most important, the codex isn't out yet. So, who knows. Even if they are gone you can just field them as something not cavalry like a command squad if you really want to. I wouldn't care if my opponent was fielding painted good looking models as infantry even though they were mounted as long as he played them that way.

Always thought they were weird anyways. Bikes or Jetbikes (after lore adjust) would be better. Same thing for ratlings / ogryn. Never really thought they had a place in IG seeing as the humans in the 40k universe are very anti anything not human. That would include mutations in most the books.

Just think it's odd that those units have always been there when Bikes, Human sniper unit, or light armor suits would fill all those roles just fine and fit better. Not saying I think they ought to be removed since I know others do like them. Just thought it never really fit, and I personally wouldn't run them.

[Mr Mystery]

This really annoys me as a good friend of mine just made and painted a whole units of Praetorian Rough Riders for me. Guess they'll just be an honor guard in the cabinet now. :(

Or they're getting a new kit.

Atillan Rough Riders were out first in 1996......

[generalchaos34]

Most important, the codex isn't out yet. So, who knows. Even if they are gone you can just field them as something not cavalry like a command squad if you really want to. I wouldn't care if my opponent was fielding painted good looking models as infantry even though they were mounted as long as he played them that way.

Always thought they were weird anyways. Bikes or Jetbikes (after lore adjust) would be better. Same thing for ratlings / ogryn. Never really thought they had a place in IG seeing as the humans in the 40k universe are very anti anything not human. That would include mutations in most the books.

Just think it's odd that those units have always been there when Bikes, Human sniper unit, or light armor suits would fill all those roles just fine and fit better. Not saying I think they ought to be removed since I know others do like them. Just thought it never really fit, and I personally wouldn't run them.

But you gotta give the riders credit that they at least have a convincing background. Theres plenty of feudal level or even primitive level Imperial Worlds out there with an abundance of mounted troops. While they could take those troops and give them motorcycles they would not be nearly as effective as they are on the mount they were practically born and raised to fight on. You can give them lasguns to replace the bows or flintlocks theyve been using but its a whole different move from a living mount to a mechanical one. Besides, lots of time the IG invades unpopulated planets with rough terrain and a living mount will be far more adept at traversing that terrain then a motorcycle. I assume units like rough riders are more of a scout style unit who is pressed into heavy combat roles when the need arises. Also, don't forget there's a very gothic allure to the mounted knight that would stir any emperor fearing soldier, so it could be just as much of a psychological weapon as well as a traditional one.

Or at least thats my take on them (i think they are awesome!)

[deinol]

They still have Rough Rider models (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440037a&prodId=prod780923).

[Ang56]

My issue is actually way less with rough riders (human riders make them okay!), I personally would prefer bikes. But living mounts are fine. Just was saying regardless whether they are in the codex or not he could field them still, just as something else.

What I don't really like is ogryns and ratlings. In the case of ratlings would much prefer a human sniper unit (something like the old sniper team in the 3rd? ed catachan dex). When I do field ratlings, I use Cadian sniper models. The stat line bothers me but I can deal with it. Though I typically just field them in a special weapons team or command squad if I want to field them.

[Wolfshade]

I have seen some very cool bikes counts-as rough riders.
Space marine bikes look too large, the scout bikes are better. Though these are very sweet:


http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x160/gravisblog/Forum%20Pictures/BikeinStock_zps3ca22fdf.png (http://curiousconstructs.theslowcentury.com/ocart/index.php?route=product/category&path=73_76)

[This Dave]

I love the idea of Rough Riders because of the very 40Kness of it. You have tanks, giant stompy mechs, automatic weapons, even attack aircraft. Yet the best idea you have is to ride at something on a horse (or equivalent) and stab it with a spear wrapped in explosives. This is like the tank commander saying "drive closer I want to hit them with my sword. " What's not to love? :)

I also love Ogryns, though my favorites are still the original metal figures with the shades and beer can grenades. Sure they're big thugs but they have style. I have a set of all five poses they made as the Brute Squad for my Tank Police IG army. I can see why the Imperium would overlook a bit of genetic deviance just to have these guys in the Guard. Brute force and ignorance is the Imperial way of war after all.

Ratlings I've never been a fan of though. They were originally included to get halflings into early 40K and have been kind of a legacy thing since. I would like to see more human sniper squads in the new Codex personally.

- - - Updated - - -

I love the idea of Rough Riders because of the very 40Kness of it. You have tanks, giant stompy mechs, automatic weapons, even attack aircraft. Yet the best idea you have is to ride at something on a horse (or equivalent) and stab it with a spear wrapped in explosives. This is like the tank commander saying "drive closer I want to hit them with my sword. " What's not to love? :)

I also love Ogryns, though my favorites are still the original metal figures with the shades and beer can grenades. Sure they're big thugs but they have style. I have a set of all five poses they made as the Brute Squad for my Tank Police IG army. I can see why the Imperium would overlook a bit of genetic deviance just to have these guys in the Guard. Brute force and ignorance is the Imperial way of war after all.

Ratlings I've never been a fan of though. They were originally included to get halflings into early 40K and have been kind of a legacy thing since. I would like to see more human sniper squads in the new Codex personally.

[AirHorse]

Ratlings I've never been a fan of though. They were originally included to get halflings into early 40K and have been kind of a legacy thing since. I would like to see more human sniper squads in the new Codex personally.

But who else would cook the dinners for the armies of the emperor? :(

[eldargal]

Ramsey pattern servitors.

[generalchaos34]

Ramsey pattern servitors.

Those things are defective. Despite their advanced cooking programs they constantly spew heresy

[eldargal]

The results are overrated as well to be frank.

[This Dave]

The battle cry of the Imperial Culinary Corps is "death from within!"

[generalchaos34]

The battle cry of the Imperial Culinary Corps is "death from within!"

Nooo no, they don't advertise like that, they feel as though they are the most important part of the regiment! And not because they are feeding the men, but because they are weeding out weakness by killing off the soldiers who can't cut it in the field. Preferably this is done long before they arrive in the field. They also help build up immunity to disease in the troops.

[SquigBrain]

The battle cry of the Imperial Culinary Corps is "death from within!"

"Allez Cuisine! And Death!"

Or for the orks "You have been Choppa'd!"

- - - Updated - - -


The battle cry of the Imperial Culinary Corps is "death from within!"

"Allez Cuisine! And Death!"

Or for the orks "You have been Choppa'd!"

[Lord-Boofhead]

In the case of ratlings would much prefer a human sniper unit

Special Weapon Squad not good enough?

[Mike Lawler]

They still have Rough Rider models (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440037a&prodId=prod780923).

Yeah, the GW site has been acting weird from my connection.. they weren't there when I posted that. I also have been seeing scenery from WHFB appearing and disappearing... then the castle set was showing up as $99 for a long time in my browser then suddenly it's almost $180.. No clue what's going on but it's really annoying..

EDIT: Wait.. did you mean to link to knights?
Someone else linked to actual Rough Riders..

[This Dave]

Special Weapon Squad not good enough?

Not really. Three guys with BS 3 aren't terribly effective, even with Sniper Rifles. And six Guardsmen have the staying power of a box of Kleenex. A Veteran Squad is pretty good, but I usually don't want to pay the points for them to keep them in the back with only three of them shooting.

- - - Updated - - -


Special Weapon Squad not good enough?

Not really. Three guys with BS 3 aren't terribly effective, even with Sniper Rifles. And six Guardsmen have the staying power of a box of Kleenex. A Veteran Squad is pretty good, but I usually don't want to pay the points for them to keep them in the back with only three of them shooting.

[deinol]

Yeah, the GW site has been acting weird from my connection.. they weren't there when I posted that. I also have been seeing scenery from WHFB appearing and disappearing... then the castle set was showing up as $99 for a long time in my browser then suddenly it's almost $180.. No clue what's going on but it's really annoying..

EDIT: Wait.. did you mean to link to knights?
Someone else linked to actual Rough Riders..

I did, I was half mocking and half serious. At this point if I were making some rough riders, I'd either go Forgeworld or I'd convert some fantasy models.

- - - Updated - - -


Yeah, the GW site has been acting weird from my connection.. they weren't there when I posted that. I also have been seeing scenery from WHFB appearing and disappearing... then the castle set was showing up as $99 for a long time in my browser then suddenly it's almost $180.. No clue what's going on but it's really annoying..

EDIT: Wait.. did you mean to link to knights?
Someone else linked to actual Rough Riders..

I did, I was half mocking and half serious. At this point if I were making some rough riders, I'd either go Forgeworld or I'd convert some fantasy models.

[lomaxxdurang]

Not really. Three guys with BS 3 aren't terribly effective, even with Sniper Rifles. And six Guardsmen have the staying power of a box of Kleenex. A Veteran Squad is pretty good, but I usually don't want to pay the points for them to keep them in the back with only three of them shooting.

- - - Updated - - -



Not really. Three guys with BS 3 aren't terribly effective, even with Sniper Rifles. And six Guardsmen have the staying power of a box of Kleenex. A Veteran Squad is pretty good, but I usually don't want to pay the points for them to keep them in the back with only three of them shooting.

I love SWS you just have to equip them right and give them the right mission. SWS squads need to be equipped one of two ways with either 3 flamers or with a combination of flamers and demo packs. I usually use 1 demo pack and 2 flamers. I like to toss them out the back of a valkyrie or vendetta at speed as suicide troops. If they survive they can hold an objective if not they almost never fail to pay for themselves (exceptions being the limited occasions you mishap on the deep-strike, or the demo pack hits you in the face). Even when you deep strike off course you can usually use them to draw fire due to the fact nobody wants to deal with them getting close to a useful unit.

- - - Updated - - -


Not really. Three guys with BS 3 aren't terribly effective, even with Sniper Rifles. And six Guardsmen have the staying power of a box of Kleenex. A Veteran Squad is pretty good, but I usually don't want to pay the points for them to keep them in the back with only three of them shooting.

- - - Updated - - -



Not really. Three guys with BS 3 aren't terribly effective, even with Sniper Rifles. And six Guardsmen have the staying power of a box of Kleenex. A Veteran Squad is pretty good, but I usually don't want to pay the points for them to keep them in the back with only three of them shooting.

I love SWS you just have to equip them right and give them the right mission. SWS squads need to be equipped one of two ways with either 3 flamers or with a combination of flamers and demo packs. I usually use 1 demo pack and 2 flamers. I like to toss them out the back of a valkyrie or vendetta at speed as suicide troops. If they survive they can hold an objective if not they almost never fail to pay for themselves (exceptions being the limited occasions you mishap on the deep-strike, or the demo pack hits you in the face). Even when you deep strike off course you can usually use them to draw fire due to the fact nobody wants to deal with them getting close to a useful unit.

[Ang56]

Special Weapon Squad not good enough?

I was more thinking of the old sniper unit when catachans had their own codex. Currently when I field snipers I put them in a command squad. and really it's fine.

If you could put camo cloaks on a special weapons team I'd think differently about them. as is tho command squad or just using human models as ratlings is the way to go.

If I were to wishlist a bit would be awesome if a special weapons team could be given camo cloaks and the sniper was a 2 man weapon team, one model as spotter providing +1 BS while it was alive. I'd be a bit more apt to field my sniper models then :P

[Renegade]

Is there any news at all on the malcador like tank?

[Lord-Boofhead]

I was more thinking of the old sniper unit when catachans had their own codex. Currently when I field snipers I put them in a command squad. and really it's fine.


Started doing the same, I running the MoA who is heavy anyany.


If you could put camo cloaks on a special weapons team I'd think differently about them. as is tho command squad or just using human models as ratlings is the way to go.


If I were to wishlist a bit would be awesome if a special weapons team could be given camo cloaks and the sniper was a 2 man weapon team, one model as spotter providing +1 BS while it was alive. I'd be a bit more apt to field my sniper models then :P

If the whole army could have Camo Cloaks it would rock.

- - - Updated - - -


I was more thinking of the old sniper unit when catachans had their own codex. Currently when I field snipers I put them in a command squad. and really it's fine.


Started doing the same, I running the MoA who is heavy anyany.


If you could put camo cloaks on a special weapons team I'd think differently about them. as is tho command squad or just using human models as ratlings is the way to go.


If I were to wishlist a bit would be awesome if a special weapons team could be given camo cloaks and the sniper was a 2 man weapon team, one model as spotter providing +1 BS while it was alive. I'd be a bit more apt to field my sniper models then :P

If the whole army could have Camo Cloaks it would rock.

[RGilbert26]

Guard pre-orders up on Saturday...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euIor5qdbhc

[Haighus]

Im not sure if that is actually guard- it may be the tempestus faction that keeps coming up in leaked pictures- more of a stormtrooper based force from the name. The soldier in the vid certainly has a hotshot lasgun and seems to be wearing carapace armour.

[Mr Mystery]

You wouldn't get a Supplemental Codex before the Parent one.

Seems like it is indeed a name change.

[RGilbert26]

Unless it's not IG and a new army :P

Where's my tin foil hat?

[Eberk]

You wouldn't get a Supplemental Codex before the Parent one.
That would be illogical indeed... but then again the book in the preview picture is marked as 'online only' and I haven't seen a single parent codex sold only online. Strange things are about to happen



Why is every post posted double in the same post ??

[Wolfshade]

Why is every post posted double in the same post ??


Legacy issues from lounge migration. Try clearing your cache.

[Eberk]

Try clearing your cache.
Aaaaarghhhh. Do you know how much I hear that every day ? I'm an Analyst/Tester in a Webteam that builds/maintains several corporate website and each time some new development doesn't go according to plan the developpers say "have you cleared your cache ?" They use it so often it became a running joke (for example when the printer has run out of paper -> "have you cleared your cache ?")

That aside ;) I will try what you suggest, thanks

- - - Updated - - -


Try clearing your cache.
Aaaaarghhhh. Do you know how much I hear that every day ? I'm an Analyst/Tester in a Webteam that builds/maintains several corporate website and each time some new development doesn't go according to plan the developpers say "have you cleared your cache ?" They use it so often it became a running joke (for example when the printer has run out of paper -> "have you cleared your cache ?")

That aside ;) I will try what you suggest, thanks


Edit: Nope, didn't work

[Wolfshade]

Pop it down here: http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?42531-HEADS-UP-Lounge-Migration-within-24-hours

[Bigred]

Faeit (http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/03/militarum-tempestus-taurox-and-scion.html#more)says:


I can confirm the reports of Astra Tempestus and Militarum leaks inside. Full stat pages and lore for the Taurox, Taurox Prime and Scions. Scions are WS 3 BS 4 Str 3 To 3 with Hot-shot Lasguns and Carapace armor. They can upgrade a number of models to have Plasma Guns, Melta Guns or Overcharged Lasguns. May take a Taurox or Chimera as dedicated transport. There is also a Scion Command Squad, but I forget the difference, they have the option of taking the Taurox Prime as dedicated transport instead.

Taurox is approx. the cost of a lone marine in a Rhino, 11 10 10 for armor and rerolls failed terrain rolls, comes mounted with an Autocannon and can hold 10 models. Taurox Prime is approx. 2 more marines in that rhino but comes with your choice of Taurox Missile Launcher, Battle Cannon or Gatling Cannon. Same armor and transport capacity as the regular model.

[Mr Mystery]

So hot-shot lasguns.....or 'overcharged lasguns'. Which in current background is precisely the same thing?

Taurox - Sounds like a weedier Chimera, unless it's the Prime in which case it suddenly and inexplicably gets more guns?

Very hmmm.

- - - Updated - - -

So hot-shot lasguns.....or 'overcharged lasguns'. Which in current background is precisely the same thing?

Taurox - Sounds like a weedier Chimera, unless it's the Prime in which case it suddenly and inexplicably gets more guns?

Very hmmm.

[Overlord Krycis]

Faeit (http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/03/militarum-tempestus-taurox-and-scion.html#more)says:

The Prime can get a battle cannon...a dedicated transport with a BATTLE CANNON?

wow. :D

[Bigred]

more (http://natfka.blogspot.com/2014/03/scion-and-taurox-weapon-upgrade-details.html#more):


The battle cannon on the Taurox Prime is a 'Taurox Battle Cannon'. I don't want to rain on anyone's parade but it is just Str 7 Ap4 Blast. It can be upgraded for the price of a sergeant to the Gatling Cannon which is Heavy 10 Str 4 AP - or a further sergeant to get the Missile Launcher which is your standard Heavy 2 Frag/Krak combo. The Prime also comes with a mounted Hotshot Volley Gun like the Scions can take which is TL Salvo 2/4 Str 4 Ap 3. Both the Taurox and Taurox prime have 2 additional firing points.

Scions also come with Deep Strike and Move Through Cover. 5 of them come in at the same cost as a 5 man marine tac squad, additional models are 1 Eldar Ranger each. The Scion command squad is the same cost as a 5 man Assault squad, can be upgraded with a Medic, Vox Caster and Banner. The Tempestor is Ldr 9 and all Tempestus squads within 18 inches can use his leadership for morale, pinning, etc. In addition, the Tempestor is considered a junior officer and can give 1 command as per current IG rules. Any command squad models not upgraded may replace their Hotshot Lasguns with Hotshot Volley Guns, Meltaguns or Plasma Guns.

And the Taurox Prime can be taken by regular Scions

[Houghten]

ohmigosh that missile launcher it's beautiful i want three

[Bambi]

Has anyone else noticed that the pictures of the Taurox with the missile launcher and Gatling cannon also appear to have side mounted autocannons?

Still think they are ugly but perfect for a battlewagon conversion. The Tempestus Scions look great, particularly liking the helmeted heads and the one with an eye patch.

[Mr_Johnson]

Really not convinced about the rules of the Taurox. It seems incredibly expensive point-wise and will die horribly in no time. Is that Gatling cannon twin-linked? It seems like in the picture.

[spagunk]

Still say they should of made the taurox a half-track.

[Mr Mystery]

Taurox now seem pretty dinky.

Strike me as tracked Land Rovers. Which I know my (non-gaming) friend Uncle Si is going to love.

[StraightSilver]

Still not sold on the Taurox, don't think I ever will be but reckon I can come up with something better as the rules actually look "ok". Annoyingly it fits my army style, mechanised assault IG so re-rolling terrain tests actually appeals.

The Scions on the other hand I will be getting, and probably lots of them. The bitz alone make them worthwhile, that powerfist is lovely.

Nice of the Design Team to paint them up in my Macragge PDF colour scheme too... right down to the red berets.....

[Asymmetrical Xeno]

Those Scions look very nice, great to see some modern plastic IG Infantry! Like the choice of helmets and berets too.

[The Sovereign]

For some reason, I like the old Kasrkin models better. The scions just don't look like what I expected. Maybe it's the color scheme.

[Arkhan Land]

Maybe theyll salamander that chimera later.

I had just made a whole set of smaller shoulder pads for my SOB/INQ crusaders but looks like ill just be putting them on my old beret stromtroopers

[Defenestratus]

That Taurox seems like a good way to have half of your squad die in a vehicle explosion turn 1.

[Mr Mystery]

Nah. S3 hit on each, 4+ save. You're statistically losing 25% tops.

[Nicholas Sacco]

From my source

So, it seems MILITARUM TEMPESTUS is only an expansion for the imperial guard and not the real imperial guard.. the codex (released the same week as direct only) will be only in english and it'll have only the extra unit seen in the wd photos and maybe something else.

MILITARUM TEMPESTUS TAUROX PRIME Plastic Box 38€
MILITARUM TEMPESTUS SCIONS Plastic Box 27€
WARHAMMER: VISIONS 3 (ENGLISH) 9€
ASTRA MILITARUM CADIAN HEAVY WEAPON Plastic Box 12.5€
ASTRA MILITARUM CATACHAN HEAVY WEAPON Plastic Box 12.5€
CODEX: MILITARUM TEMPESTUS Book (HB) 39€
ALTAR OF WAR Book (HB) 39€

BLACK LIBRARY
HORUS HERESY: SCARS (C-FORMAT) Novel 15.95€
HORUS HERESY: SCARS (AUDIOBOOK) Audio Book 35€

[Patrick Boyle]

From my source

So, it seems MILITARUM TEMPESTUS is only an expansion for the imperial guard and not the real imperial guard.. the codex (released the same week as direct only) will be only in english and it'll have only the extra unit seen in the wd photos and maybe something else.

MILITARUM TEMPESTUS TAUROX PRIME Plastic Box 38€
MILITARUM TEMPESTUS SCIONS Plastic Box 27€
WARHAMMER: VISIONS 3 (ENGLISH) 9€
ASTRA MILITARUM CADIAN HEAVY WEAPON Plastic Box 12.5€
ASTRA MILITARUM CATACHAN HEAVY WEAPON Plastic Box 12.5€
CODEX: MILITARUM TEMPESTUS Book (HB) 39€
ALTAR OF WAR Book (HB) 39€

BLACK LIBRARY
HORUS HERESY: SCARS (C-FORMAT) Novel 15.95€
HORUS HERESY: SCARS (AUDIOBOOK) Audio Book 35€

Interesting they're reboxing the heavy weapons, but looks like this at least confirms that Catachan plastics aren't going away like some people were worried. From the text in the leaked pics it sounds like Codex: Militarum Tempestus will have three units entries; The Scion Command Squad, the normal Scion squad, and the Taurox.

I'm really curious what the range and cost of those hotshot volley guns is. 2/4 S4 AP3 sounds really nice, but will likely only be 18" like the normal hotshot lasguns, which is to say they're essentially useless on infantry unless you can somehow give them relentless. Does give an interesting idea for a Kill Team list though...

[Darren Richardson]

seriously, a chainblade on a lasgun, WTF were the designers thinking of when they designed this kit?

I still think with wheels the Taroux will look good....

And is it me or do others think the soldier with the eye patch kindda looks like Charles Bronson from the Magnificent Seven (amongst other classic western and warfilms)?

[BunkerBob]

GW needs to get their heads out of their rears and release the codexs on the same days and not forcing LGS owners to force their customers to wait an extra week. Sorry I just used logic with GW.

[Mr Mystery]

No you applied wonky logic.

Selling direct via own website has the lowest overhead.

Welcome to capitalism and 'market forces' and that.

[The Emperor]

From my source

So, it seems MILITARUM TEMPESTUS is only an expansion for the imperial guard and not the real imperial guard.. the codex (released the same week as direct only) will be only in english and it'll have only the extra unit seen in the wd photos and maybe something else.

MILITARUM TEMPESTUS TAUROX PRIME Plastic Box 38€
MILITARUM TEMPESTUS SCIONS Plastic Box 27€
WARHAMMER: VISIONS 3 (ENGLISH) 9€
ASTRA MILITARUM CADIAN HEAVY WEAPON Plastic Box 12.5€
ASTRA MILITARUM CATACHAN HEAVY WEAPON Plastic Box 12.5€
CODEX: MILITARUM TEMPESTUS Book (HB) 39€
ALTAR OF WAR Book (HB) 39€

BLACK LIBRARY
HORUS HERESY: SCARS (C-FORMAT) Novel 15.95€
HORUS HERESY: SCARS (AUDIOBOOK) Audio Book 35€

Your source is pretty far behind the curve, as pretty much all of that has been known for days, weeks, and even months. 40k Radio announced a long time ago that the Imperial Guard would be renamed Astra Militarum, and product pages have confirmed that name change, as well as a leak of the cover of Codex: Astra Militarum (Nevermind the small size and low price point of Codex: Militarum Tempestus, which is nowhere big enough to contain an Imperial Guard update).

[MajorWesJanson]

seriously, a chainblade on a lasgun, WTF were the designers thinking of when they designed this kit?

Well, Gears of War stole the idea of chainsaw bayonettes from 40K, so 40K is stealing the design right back. I really like that part, and the powerfist bit is awesome as well, up there in style with a few of the FW versions of the power fist.

[Katharon]

Horus Heresy models and the old 1st-3rd edition marine models had chainblades on the boltguns. It's not quite that difficult to imagine that a few lasgun models might have them too.

[Wildcard]

What i've been wondering is that is the Militarum Tempestus going to be Standalone Codex? In a sense that it can be wielded with a hope of success without any help from other imperial forces?

Three vehicles mentioned: Taurox (Front av 11), Taurox Prime and Chimera
Two units: Scion command squad and Scions themselves

Weapons available:
Vehicles: typhoon missile launcher clone, Battlecannon Lite, Gatling, autocannons and that new hotshot volley gun
Infantry: Hotshots, hotshot volleys, plasmagun, meltagun and probably flamer + grenade launcher

Even with very cool sounding gear and play style available to them, it does sound a bit thin considering all the potential 2+ saves, monstrous creatures jump infantry and cover ignoring long(ish) range firepower (everything with ignore cover and even more all the torrent flamers)

Am i completely of the track, or missing something here?

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

GW needs to get their heads out of their rears and release the codexs on the same days and not forcing LGS owners to force their customers to wait an extra week. Sorry I just used logic with GW.

Now, from the words of my good manager friend.

"We're releasing the models before the codexes as it is a chance for the painters to pick up the models on release day too. Those who really want to get hold of these models can, before the rules come out. Then, when the rules come out, the gamers who just want them to play with can buy them too."

In my opinion this is a sound strategy.

[RGilbert26]

Now, from the words of my good manager friend.

"We're releasing the models before the codexes as it is a chance for the painters to pick up the models on release day too. Those who really want to get hold of these models can, before the rules come out. Then, when the rules come out, the gamers who just want them to play with can buy them too."

In my opinion this is a sound strategy.

I agree, makes perfect sense.

[Darren Richardson]

Horus Heresy models and the old 1st-3rd edition marine models had chainblades on the boltguns. It's not quite that difficult to imagine that a few lasgun models might have them too.
yeah I know some of really old space marines had them, and you do see it a lot on chaos models, but IG, come on, I don't rememeber ever seeing any on IG before.

I do agree though the Powerfists look great....

[deinol]

Now, from the words of my good manager friend.

"We're releasing the models before the codexes as it is a chance for the painters to pick up the models on release day too. Those who really want to get hold of these models can, before the rules come out. Then, when the rules come out, the gamers who just want them to play with can buy them too."

In my opinion this is a sound strategy.

Yeah, I have no sympathy for the people who rushed to get Imperial Knights for their Chaos army and were shocked and amazed that the rules didn't allow them to use them with non-Imperial armies. If you are concerned about the rules, wait a week and look at them. If you just enjoy building and painting, do what you want.

I for one like the more spread out releases. Means there's always something interesting to look at when I pop by the store. Even if I don't play the relevant army, it's still nice to see. It also means they can squeeze things like a Hellbrute in the schedule between Imperial Knights and Imperial Guard. How can that not be good for everyone?

[George Labour]

Few things I saw there.

1) The Taurox may actually be nice as a replacement to the chimera in some lists. For five fewer points (assuming the chimera remains 55), you that status as a tank, lose a point of front armor, a Heavy bolter or flamer in the hull, ONE firepoint and 2 transport spaces. Also the firepoints are a bit more restricted than the chimeras top hatch one. But you gain a twin linked autocannon, free dozer blader equivalent, and it's slightly cheaper. Considering how many people often choose to take the forgeworld autocannon upgrade on their chimeras this is a pretty big thing. I don't even mind the loss of the hull weapon as my transports move so often they're usually not hitting much anyways.

2) Take a gander at the vehicle upgrades list. Lots of the stuff that's standard issue on tanks in the current codex I think got a bit cheaper. Notably the pintle stubbers and storm bolter. This means we're either losing them as standard issue on some vehicles, or they've simply adjusted the cost to reflect their limited usefulness.

EDIT: That Taurox and Prime both have more access points. This can prove handy for disembarking shenanigans and even make it easier to bring your guns to bear on targets.

3) The Taurox prime is also a fast vehicle, is BS:4 and none of its guns are ordnance. So there's also that.

[Kgatch113]

Another thought on why the release schedule is why it is:

When I worked for Battlefront, we had a book due to be released on X day in the fall. Well the publisher and shipper ended up getting behind schedule, and we got the book on day W. We unloaded the truck and then packed all the books to be sent out in time for sales on Saturday. Right at the last minute, just in the nick of time...

GW might have a similar situation....the books are due on a certain day, and they didn't want to not have a release on the days before it, so they arranged the release schedule as such. Shipping issues happen all the time. Don't think that companies have product just waiting around a warehouse ready to go....Oftentimes they aren't there till the week of release!

[Bigred]

Taurox & Taurox Prime Summary:


Taurox
AV: 11/10/10
BS:3 HP:3
Fire ports:2 per side, Access points: side, rear
Reroll Difficult Terrain tests
Transport Capacity: 10
Linked Autocannon
May be used by any IG squad who can access a Chimera
50pts

Taurox Prime
AV: 11/10/10
BS:4 HP:3 Fast
Fire ports:2 per side, Access points: side, rear
Reroll Difficult Terrain tests
Transport Capacity: 10
Taurox Battle Cannon (S7 AP4, Blast), Linked Hot-shot Volley gun
Upgrade Taurox Battle Cannon to:
Taurox Gatling Cannon (S4 AP-- Heavy10) +10pts
Taurox Missile Launcher (Cyclone clone) +20pts
May be used by any Scions or Scions Command Squad
80pts

[Harley]

Was hoping for a heavier armored transport for IG, not a more flimsy one. The Taurox seems weaker than a Rhino, but much more expensive. While the mounted gun is nice, it will be snap firing most often considering as a transport the thing will be moving top speed most of the time.

[Bigred]

Scions & Scion Command Squad Summary 3-26-2014

Scion Platoons
Elite choices for Codex Imperial Guard
1-3 Scion Squads
0-1 Scion Command Squad

Scions Squad (5 -10 models): WS3 BS4 S3 T3 Ld: 7 (Serg:8)
Hotshot Lasguns, Carapace, Hotshot Laspistols, (frag/krak - Serg. only)
Squad upgrades: 0-2 models: Plasma, Melta, Hotshot Volleyguns, Grenade Launcher, Flamer
Deep Strike, Move through Cover
Dedicated Transport: Chimera, Taurox Prime
70pts

Scions Command Squad (5 models): WS3 BS4 S3 T3 Ld:7 (Serg:9)
Hotshot Lasguns, Carapace, Hotshot Laspistols, (frag/krak - Serg. only)
Squad upgrades: 0-4 Any IG Special Weapon
Deep Strike, Move through Cover
Medic, Vox, Banner Upgrades
Squad leader (Tempestor): 18" Ld bubble for his Scion Platoon. Can issue IG 1 order 12" radius.
Dedicated Transport: Chimera, Taurox Prime
85pts

[Arkhan Land]

anyone whos not excited can go screw themselves

goodbye stormtroopers hello STORMTROOPERS!

[FireHazard]

Interesting how each ruleset seems to refer to a different Codex (Taurox - Astra Militarum, Scions - Codex IG)

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Yeah, I have no sympathy for the people who rushed to get Imperial Knights for their Chaos army and were shocked and amazed that the rules didn't allow them to use them with non-Imperial armies. If you are concerned about the rules, wait a week and look at them. If you just enjoy building and painting, do what you want.

I for one like the more spread out releases. Means there's always something interesting to look at when I pop by the store. Even if I don't play the relevant army, it's still nice to see. It also means they can squeeze things like a Hellbrute in the schedule between Imperial Knights and Imperial Guard. How can that not be good for everyone?

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


This is the attitude to have people.

[Charon]

To be honest thats an attitude lacking empathy and promoting cheap business tricks. But I guess thats ok as many ppl nowadays have that attitude.

[lattd]

I for one do not lament chaos not getting imperial knights, or being imperial on steroids as that cheapens both factions. Had the knights just been called knight titans then yes I would understand the anger. But I feel the new release schedule is the way forward as it will eventually mean something for every system per month rather than the long waits of the last decade.

[spagunk]

Wow, really liking the Scion's rules and models (except the taurox). Thanks to everyone for all the information so far.

[daboarder]

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


This is the attitude to have people.

What? The attitude that you enjoy the misfortune of those who we're deceived by deliberately obfuscated advertisement?

How septic can you get?:eek:

[Charon]

I for one do not lament chaos not getting imperial knights, or being imperial on steroids as that cheapens both factions. Had the knights just been called knight titans then yes I would understand the anger. But I feel the new release schedule is the way forward as it will eventually mean something for every system per month rather than the long waits of the last decade.

Would not mind that either if WD had not promoted Knight Houses fallen to Chaos...
I for my part think that ppl should wait and think (same goes for video games... just dont preorder. Its just a cheap trick, wait for reviews) but on the other hand I also think that companies should not make use of cheap marketing tricks (like saying: "there are houses that have fallen to chaos too!" and then saying to "choas buyers": "LOL you really fell for that? Thnx for the money anyways!")

[Wildcard]

I am also a bit worried if the stormtrooper 'dex will have all the cool things for the scions leaving only the mediocre for IG codex elite slots platoon option.. I so hope i am fearing for nothing here. Although there is the question why use that stormtrooper 'dex if the IG one has all the toys for it as well.

And can you run IG as you main force and Scions as an ally with their own unique possible traits and wargear (mainly relics) (and commands as some rumor pointed out)

[Katharon]

Yeah, I've already decided that I'm not spending one penny until the entire release has been finished. I'm all fine with looking at the window dressings, but I'm not footing a single bill out until I get the full range out *and* the codex! I understand and can appreciate the new release style, but that doesn't mean I fully agree with it. Would still prefer the Codex to come in the first wave.

Oh well.

[Lord-Boofhead]

Considering how many people often choose to take the forgeworld autocannon upgrade on their chimeras this is a pretty big thing.


I was wondering why that was an option in Only War. Wonder if it will pop up in the new dex?


Take a gander at the vehicle upgrades list. Lots of the stuff that's standard issue on tanks in the current codex I think got a bit cheaper. Notably the pintle stubbers and storm bolter. This means we're either losing them as standard issue on some vehicles, or they've simply adjusted the cost to reflect their limited usefulness.

Probably the latter or both.

- - - Updated - - -


Would not mind that either if WD had not promoted Knight Houses fallen to Chaos...
I for my part think that ppl should wait and think (same goes for video games... just dont preorder. Its just a cheap trick, wait for reviews) but on the other hand I also think that companies should not make use of cheap marketing tricks (like saying: "there are houses that have fallen to chaos too!" and then saying to "choas buyers": "LOL you really fell for that? Thnx for the money anyways!")



You act like FW doesn't exist.

- - - Updated - - -


What? The attitude that you enjoy the misfortune of those who we're deceived by deliberately obfuscated advertisement?

How septic can you get?:eek:

Yes damn it how dare he look for the silver linning anand not default to childish hissy fit/insane conspiracies. Damn him, damn his eyes.

[Darren Richardson]

What? The attitude that you enjoy the misfortune of those who we're deceived by deliberately obfuscated advertisement?

How septic can you get?:eek:

Dude it was called an "Imperial Knight" how was it obfuscated?

It's not like it was called a "Chaos Knight" and then turned out only Imperials could have it was it?

:shakeshead:

[Tynskel]

Dude it was called an "Imperial Knight" how was it obfuscated?

It's not like it was called a "Chaos Knight" and then turned out only Imperials could have it was it?

:shakeshead:

Clearly the rules make it sound like it could maybe possibly of some probability near quality of some sort of Chaos rules.

[Charon]

You act like FW doesn't exist.



With the huge amount of gaming groups banning FW rulewise (not modelwise) it might well not exist at all.

[Tynskel]

With the huge amount of gaming groups banning FW rulewise (not modelwise) it might well not exist at all.

Most gaming groups do not ban FW. They might ban a handful of specifics, maaaaybe.

[Patrick Boyle]

Would not mind that either if WD had not promoted Knight Houses fallen to Chaos...
I for my part think that ppl should wait and think (same goes for video games... just dont preorder. Its just a cheap trick, wait for reviews) but on the other hand I also think that companies should not make use of cheap marketing tricks (like saying: "there are houses that have fallen to chaos too!" and then saying to "choas buyers": "LOL you really fell for that? Thnx for the money anyways!")

I don't recall there being any marketing, or what passes for marketing at GW, making that claim, just lots of speculation on the Freeblade name and what it implied before the book was out, then fluff in the rulebook itself that makes it clear who they can and can't ally with in the rules, regardless of what the fluff says.

[Charon]

Most gaming groups do not ban FW. They might ban a handful of specifics, maaaaybe.

You have numbers?
As "most gaming groups" is highly subjective. From 50+ players I know there is only a handful of wich a) actually possess bigger FW pieces or b) dont bother playing against them c) actually have some of the rulebooks.
Oddly enough there are even some who have models and rules but dont want to play with/against FW.

[Defenestratus]

You have numbers?
As "most gaming groups" is highly subjective. From 50+ players I know there is only a handful of wich a) actually possess bigger FW pieces or b) dont bother playing against them c) actually have some of the rulebooks.
Oddly enough there are even some who have models and rules but dont want to play with/against FW.

In three separate cities, I've never had a problem playing with any FW that I wanted to play with.

I have even played a 2500 point game with one model on my side and my opponents were enthusiastic about playing against it.

The people who refuse to play against FW units just because they are FW units, are the players that should be eviscerated on an altar of their own stupidity.

There are so many more broken crazy units in GW codexes than in all the FW rules.

[deinol]

To be honest thats an attitude lacking empathy and promoting cheap business tricks. But I guess thats ok as many ppl nowadays have that attitude.

Cheap business tricks? Can you show me one piece of GW marketing that seemed targeted at tricking Chaos players into buying an Imperial Knight?

Yes, in the fluff (and old epic releases) there are fallen knights. It's quite likely they will someday release one. Eldar got theirs, if the IK does as well (I suspect it did) I'm sure we'll see a Chaos one eventually.

GW is very up front about what armies a new unit is intended for. If the effectiveness per point is a great concern, wait and see.

I like the new release method because they can then fit in more than just a single army in a month. It gives me hope that Eldar may not have to wait another three years for a new kit. And I'm patient enough to read the actual rules before I buy.

- - - Updated - - -


In three separate cities, I've never had a problem playing with any FW that I wanted to play with.

I have even played a 2500 point game with one model on my side and my opponents were enthusiastic about playing against it.

The people who refuse to play against FW units just because they are FW units, are the players that should be eviscerated on an altar of their own stupidity.

There are so many more broken crazy units in GW codexes than in all the FW rules.

At this point, the question has really become: "Do we want to play with D weapons?"

If anything, Forgeworld tends to be too conservative.

[George Labour]

With the huge amount of gaming groups banning FW rulewise (not modelwise) it might well not exist at all.


Not banned by either of the groups I play with in my area. Which is the only opinion that matters in the long run as I'll never ever meet any of these other groups that may or may not exist.

Tournaments see some minor guidelines but nothing as severe as the out of date rule regarding the officialness of forge world units.

[Gleipnir]

I don't recall there being any marketing, or what passes for marketing at GW, making that claim, just lots of speculation on the Freeblade name and what it implied before the book was out, then fluff in the rulebook itself that makes it clear who they can and can't ally with in the rules, regardless of what the fluff says.

They are referring to a facebook posting in response to the lack of an ally table in the White Dwarf that featured the Imperial Knight rules that indicated that Imperial Knights would be available to ally with every army. Again this was a week before the Imperial Knight Codex was even up for preorder and prior to rules leaks from the Codex told folks in fact that Imperial Knights would be limited to Imperium, Eldar/Tau/Dark Eldar.

I personally didn't buy the notion that Imperial Knights would somehow be able to ally with Tyranids so took a wait and buy the rules approach which frankly anyone concerned about the rules and not just wanting a cool looking model should have done, but there is that vocal Chaos Space Marine group on the forums that feel this week of being led to believe they would be permitted to ally, was false marketing to promote Knight sales, rather than a White Dwarf editor responding to a question with what was obviously an incorrect answer.

[Lord-Boofhead]

The people who refuse to play against FW units just because they are FW units, are the players that should be eviscerated on an altar of their own stupidity.

There are so many more broken crazy units in GW codexes than in all the FW rules.

But WAAC power gamers know how to beat those. If they have to deal with FW Units they may have to learn to adapt. And we can't have that can we?

- - - Updated - - -


They are referring to a facebook posting in response to the lack of an ally table in the White Dwarf that featured the Imperial Knight rules that indicated that Imperial Knights would be available to ally with every army. Again this was a week before the Imperial Knight Codex was even up for preorder and prior to rules leaks from the Codex told folks in fact that Imperial Knights would be limited to Imperium, Eldar/Tau/Dark Eldar.

I personally didn't buy the notion that Imperial Knights would somehow be able to ally with Tyranids so took a wait and buy the rules approach which frankly anyone concerned about the rules and not just wanting a cool looking model should have done, but there is that vocal Chaos Space Marine group on the forums that feel this week of being led to believe they would be permitted to ally, was false marketing to promote Knight sales, rather than a White Dwarf editor responding to a question with what was obviously an incorrect answer.

IIRC it was a GW Store Manager or someone else equally not connected to the Design studio.

Also most of those Chaos Players are also convinced that there is an internal GW plot to screw over Chaos, so take from that what you will.

- - - Updated - - -


Clearly the rules make it sound like it could maybe possibly of some probability near quality of some sort of Chaos rules.

The RULES said nothing of the sort. The FLUFF/LORE mentions traitors.

Note that the Imperial Warhound Titan and the Chaos Warhound Titan have SEPARATE rules. 2+2=4 Unless you are part of the Anti GW Hate Brigade.

[DarkLink]

But WAAC power gamers know how to beat those. If they have to deal with FW Units they may have to learn to adapt. And we can't have that can we?The vast majority of people I know (whom I'm sure you would label WAAC because you're judgmental and ignorant regarding that sort of thing) like forgeworld, because for one the vast majority of units are weak, and the handful of good things are convenient for them to exploit. You've got a conflicting definition of WAAC. On one hand, using it in the insulting sense implies that they will immediately do anything they can to win, which logically means taking obscure, powerful units like Sabers or Hornets and springing them on unsuspecting victimes, yet on the other hand you seem to claim that they're not actually trying to win at all costs because they're intentionally ignoring large swaths of the game, as if being competitive somehow makes you less competent and less motivated to try and be good at the game. And for the few individuals I know that are opposed to forgeworld, they are opposed because they feels its few powerful units unbalance the game more than it already is, and that's bad not for the WAAC players, but for the non-waac players, as they become less of a challenge. Not that you'd believe me when I say that, but that's because, again, you're judgmental and ignorant regarding anything involving the word competitive.

[The Emperor]

What? The attitude that you enjoy the misfortune of those who we're deceived by deliberately obfuscated advertisement?

How septic can you get?:eek:

There was ZERO advertisement even remotely hinting that the Imperial Knight would be available to Chaos. All there was were a whole lot of Chaos players deluding themselves, something which GW's not responsible for.

[LordGrise]

Okies, just waded thru the entire string, and wow. Lot of good points. Here are my thoughts:

First away, as a Tau player, I guess this is my confirmation that the Tau are indeed genetically inferior to humans. I mean, they spend their entire lives learning to shoot... and here's these humans, barely ten years at it, WS3, BS4... can I get some of those? I mean, I had that back in 5th, if I paid the upgrade, and even then I could only get three to a unit. Base cost thirty five points before weapons, I think... but not now. Oh, wait a minute... that's why I'm looking at IG. I need gue'vasa. Now I really need them.

As for the Taurox, I got an ork-playing buddy who's gonna go nuts on those... me, I'm going to get one, and mess with it...

[LordGrise]

There are houses that have fallen to chaos, they've been in the fluff for 20 years, but the model released was an IMPERIAL Knight, it looked nothing like any chaos knight and but as far as recall, chaos knights were only mentioned by GW in the fluff of the codex, which also explicitly stated that its not for Chaos.

And on multiple threads, normal, fun loving humans have said that they'll be more than happy to play a well painted and converted Knight allied to a chaos space marine army.

For the record, I play by rule of cool; if it looks good, it's in. Only way I can be, considering the number of customized and kitbashed models I have around here... ::looks at the Tau-refurbed Sentinels...::

[Darren Richardson]

well the cover for the new issue of White Dwarf is up and it gives us a better view and scale of the Taurox

8012

Sourced from the horses mouth http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/wnt/blog.jsp?pid=13800108-gws

[This Dave]

Okies, just waded thru the entire string, and wow. Lot of good points. Here are my thoughts:

First away, as a Tau player, I guess this is my confirmation that the Tau are indeed genetically inferior to humans. I mean, they spend their entire lives learning to shoot... and here's these humans, barely ten years at it, WS3, BS4... can I get some of those? I mean, I had that back in 5th, if I paid the upgrade, and even then I could only get three to a unit. Base cost thirty five points before weapons, I think... but not now. Oh, wait a minute... that's why I'm looking at IG. I need gue'vasa. Now I really need them.

As for the Taurox, I got an ork-playing buddy who's gonna go nuts on those... me, I'm going to get one, and mess with it...

Tau don't need to learn to shoot. They have their Markerlights to do their aiming for them.

[Nabterayl]

To be fair, tau advance through the ranks a lot faster than humans do, in general. You can be promoted to shas'ui after only four years, shas'vre four years after that. I'm pretty sure that IG veterans or stormtroopers are supposed to have more than eight years of service behind them.

[Charon]

To be fair, tau advance through the ranks a lot faster than humans do, in general. You can be promoted to shas'ui after only four years, shas'vre four years after that. I'm pretty sure that IG veterans or stormtroopers are supposed to have more than eight years of service behind them.

And while the Tau try to preserve the lifes of their kin, imperial command doesnt seem to care. So I also guess its "easier" for a Tau to survive these years than for a guardsman.

[George Labour]

Two things. Firstly many IG soldiers do spend their pre military years learning to shoot, and kill. Often in areas that make a fire caste academy look as dangerous as a day care. Yet they too are primarily BS:3

Also a the stats in 40K are a pretty nebulous thing. A 3 seems to run the gamut of just better thsn average to almost but not quite expertly proficient. Heck in the 40k RPGs a stat score in the 30s actually ends up being on the high end for humans.

4 is just about the peak of human ability up to the super human in scale. Especially when combined with high tech enhancements such as those found in a marine, guardians, or stormtroopers helmet and weapon.


Except of course when it's not. This is just a game after all and sometimes that means they get a number just because of 'balance'.

[Charon]

Tech is a big reason here as BF represents many factors. Tech, as in Motion Prediction, dif. vision modes, recoil dampeners, trajectory, scope zoom,... personal skill and genteic enhancements which may work in union with tech or replace tech to make room for other weapon improvements (such as a bigger bang :D )
All in all BF 3 is REALLY GOOD (highly trained solider with some tech) while BF 4 is exceptional (extremely advanced alien technology like Eldar, superhumans supported by better than average tech like Space Marines).

[Tynskel]

- - - Updated - - -
The RULES said nothing of the sort. The FLUFF/LORE mentions traitors.


someone needs to read my sarcasm meter.

[Tyrendian]

All in all BF 3 is REALLY GOOD (highly trained solider with some tech) while BF 4 is exceptional (extremely advanced alien technology like Eldar, superhumans supported by better than average tech like Space Marines).

nah BS4 is elite level (skill or equipment), BS3 is average for the times, BS2 is untrained/doesntgiveasheet - see IG Vets/Eldar vs. Guardsmen/Tau vs. Recruits/Orks

[Charon]

IG already is the "elite". PDF would be average at having BF2 (recruits also do and they are in training, not some cilvillians given a weapon at the start of battle). BF4 is reserved for the uber-elite. A space marine who rarely ever misses his mark (or he is punished after training), an Eldar with highly advanced targeting systems.
Recruit doesnt mean "first time with weapons". Also the rate of fire plays into BF as well (not only into the number of shots, as a heavy stubber would have a ridiculous low rate of fire for a machine gun)

[Dlatrex]

The new items are up for Pre-Order. They are listing the Cadian and Catachan Heavy Weapon squad as 'new'. Is this just a repack as a single base?

[Defenestratus]

So taking a look at the preorder page...

This is NOT the "new" Imperial Guard codex. This is a new race apparently. If you'll notice when you branch out the 40k armies tabs on the GW website, the Militarum Tempestus and the IG have separate sections completely.

Tomfoolery.

Also,

I found the Taurox Mk1 model concept art:
http://gajitz.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/zero-south-biodiesel-hummer-tank.jpg

[Asymmetrical Xeno]

Well, with Imperial Knights and now this, it seems GW want to add some new "mini" factions. I actually love the concept of this, allthough I would of chosen some new alien races instead, but maybe if these do well that might happen. I can see why they'd play it safe with some imperial factions to begin with.

[daboarder]

So....Gw has dropped the LE books from the looks of it? no verision of the tempest available

[FireHazard]

I'm going to say it's a book with an emphasis on the soldiers produced by the Schola Progenium

Excellent call Sir, excellent call.

Loving the Scions. Really not sure about the Taurox now. A lot of the stuff on it seems really lazily done. I don't mind the look of the missiles and the multi-barrelled wotsit cannon, but the battle cannon is straight up awful.

[Gir]

So taking a look at the preorder page...

This is NOT the "new" Imperial Guard codex. This is a new race apparently. If you'll notice when you branch out the 40k armies tabs on the GW website, the Militarum Tempestus and the IG have separate sections completely.

Tomfoolery.

It's a weird one, as it's direct only, and supplement length.

[RGilbert26]

Hmm I think I've found my Veteran Squad models, shame I have to spend £42 for a squad of 10. Or I can just use them as IG Storm Troopers.

[This Dave]

IG already is the "elite". PDF would be average at having BF2 (recruits also do and they are in training, not some cilvillians given a weapon at the start of battle). BF4 is reserved for the uber-elite. A space marine who rarely ever misses his mark (or he is punished after training), an Eldar with highly advanced targeting systems.
Recruit doesnt mean "first time with weapons". Also the rate of fire plays into BF as well (not only into the number of shots, as a heavy stubber would have a ridiculous low rate of fire for a machine gun)

That's why it was odd that Cultists in Codex:CSM have BS of 3. Deranged loons aren't known for their high level of training.

[DWest]

That's why it was odd that Cultists in Codex:CSM have BS of 3. Deranged loons aren't known for their high level of training.
In a way, the Cultists as represented by the CSM unit entry are "veterans" themselves; the strongest, meanest, and most devoted of scum. Your average follower of the Dark Gods most likely is BS and WS 2 . . . and he serves his dark masters in the role of menial labor, armor polishing, and occasionally, dinner.

[Gatadawgs77]

Sorry if I missed this...when is the full IG codex due, exactly? Don't really care much for these new elites or the Taurox...looks kinda dumb to me.

[Arkhan Land]

In a way, the Cultists as represented by the CSM unit entry are "veterans" themselves; the strongest, meanest, and most devoted of scum. Your average follower of the Dark Gods most likely is BS and WS 2 . . . and he serves his dark masters in the role of menial labor, armor polishing, and occasionally, dinner.

Also constant service to the dark gods can have its rewards, you dont think that daemon prince was born a WS9 BS5? hell nah hes been murdering people for millenia trying to do that ****, I figure when they jump you into the cult you have to have killed at least one person already, three or four by the time they give you a decent weapon, and then bam suddenly khorne looks down on you one day and gives you a big ole thumbs up and says, hey universe, modify this jerk's WS and BS for me, thanks

[RGilbert26]

Anyway, Militarum Tempestus are not IG so how about we move them into another thread?

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

They are Imperial Guard (Astra Militarum) though.


Tempestus Scions can be taken as part of an Astra Militarum force, but they can also be fielded as a complete army using the rules in Codex: Militarum Tempestus, which is also available to pre-order today.

[Al Shut]

I know at least one Imperial Guard player who is not quite happy because apparently the scions don't have any heavy weapons and he was planning to use his old beret wearing storm trooper squad.

[Lord-Boofhead]

I know at least one Imperial Guard player who is not quite happy because apparently the scions don't have any heavy weapons and he was planning to use his old beret wearing storm trooper squad.

Who are also under armoured. I know I have a few of the basic Hellgun toting ones..

[RGilbert26]

Cool thing about these models is that you can use them for two different units in the Imperial Guard Codex.

Use the fully helmeted heads for Veteran Squads and the Beret heads with full masks as Storm Troopers.

[nathaneal246]

Can someone make something clear for me, I have storm troopers and commissars in my Guard army, do I need to get this astra tempestus codex or is there another codex coming out which covers everything i.e a Guard codex?

Sorry but I'm just confused on the issue!

[Mr Mystery]

Seems you don't need both.

IG contains Tempstus from what I can gather, but the Tempestus book is just them.

Think Tempestus = SAS and you won't go far wrong.

[The Girl]

"Imperial Guard Rumor Roundup"

Does not include: discussing how great/horrible/stupid/smart WAAC gamers are and slinging personal insults
What it does include: rumors about IG rules, models, etc

I'll let you figure out which one I'd prefer you stick to.

Thank you.

[Chris22]

I just assumed that the Scions would be retconned to replace stormtroopers. GW wants to trademark everything, but Stormtroopers is too generic a name to trademark and GW isn't the first to apply the name stormtroopers to elite forces.

Previously, the stormtroopers were just spread across the Imperium doing various missions and what not. They still do that, but now they can fight as a fully fledged independent force in their own right. The Ordo Tempestus is just another military wing of the Imperium. This new Ordo will be retconned in and given a long and glorious history. I suppose the Ordo Tempestus is independent of the IG, but the Ordo probably still falls under the control of the Departmento Munitorium just like the IG.

I think its great that the stormtroopers (now Scions) have been finally giving some love and we can field an entire army of them, which I definitely plan to do. Plastic stormtroopers is a cause for much celebration.

They will not replace the IG as they are definitely just a supplement a la the Space Marine supplements and Codex Crimson Slaughter. I think this is a great move and the new minis look great.

[FireHazard]

It's probably already been said, but I notice that Stormtroopers are no longer available on the GW website (at least under the IG section anyway).

[Houghten]

Kasrkin are gone, too. Glad I got a boxful while I still could.

[DarkLink]

Seems you don't need both.IG contains Tempstus from what I can gather, but the Tempestus book is just them.Think Tempestus = SAS and you won't go far wrong.This is GW. I doubt they'll include these rules in a new IG codex if and when it comes out. You can, however, get the rules for cheap in the current WD/whatever they call the magazine now.

[Mr Mystery]

Possibly. But the website wording


Tempestus Scions can be taken as part of an Astra Militarum force, but they can also be fielded as a complete army using the rules in Codex: Militarum Tempestus, which is also available to pre-order today. This Codex delves deeply into the history of the Tempestus Scions, with brand new information about the Schola Progenium including its harsh training regimes and the dark practices required to turn orphaned youths into stone-cold killers. The Codex is also available to pre-order as an interactive digital version from the Apple iBookstore, more of which you can see below.

Whilst a bit ambiguous, I'm happy they're in both books.

[Gleipnir]

Maybe its been overlooked among the other news but, apparently Heavy Weapons Teams went from 1-3 models to 1 model? Always thought the Battleforce described them as a single unit and not 3 separate teams before. Or is it just supposed to be a more affordable way of buying them if you only need 1 rather than paying for less than double the cost for 1 and getting 3 of them.

[George Labour]

They used to be available as either a single weapons team pack or the three weapon team squad boxes an edition or so ago. So the single weapon team thing is really just an old product with a new box.

AS for the why. It's because most people seem to use them as an addition to normal squads, rather than as a full heavy weapon squad. So being able to buy just one or two instead of having to get the whole box may be a move to both give customers what they want, and keep customers from going to bits sellers for that 1 more autocannon they want to field.

[Gatadawgs77]

So....anybody know when the full IG codex is due?

[Lord-Boofhead]

So....anybody know when the full IG codex is due?

Soon I hope I'm waiting to work on my list for the big local Tourny in August.

[MajorWesJanson]

So....anybody know when the full IG codex is due?

Should be up for preorder on the 5th, or maybe the 12th.

[natfka]

barcode. you should at least credit the information to where it comes from.

[Mr Mystery]

Haven't seen it covered yet, but from WD, the Scion blokes now come as a platoon, rather than a single squad.

Makes them more expensive to field, but man.......all that AP3!

[Lexington]

Not even more, actually - a platoon can consist of a single squad, with a few more and/ or a Command Squad being optional. :D

[Wildcard]

I see absolutely no use to the Wyvern mortar tanks :(

[BunkerBob]

That thing is not even useful, I'd invest the points in lasguns before I bothered with that thing.

[Grey Mage]

I see absolutely no use to the Wyvern mortar tanks :(

S4 with a reroll to wound and ignoring aegis lines isnt enough? Seriously?

For 65pts, 195 for a unit of 3? For six large blasts?

Force gunlines to take wounds on their base saves, remove scouts in cover, cause pinning checks- in true IG fashion hit the biggest target in the middle and hope they scatter everywhere. Itll be a good time.

[Lexington]

Yeah, thar's absolutely ruinous to Orks, other IG and large swathes of both Eldar lists. Even 3+ers end up falling to the weight of saves there.

[Mr Mystery]

I dunno.

Cheap, squadroned - that's some decent barrage against stuff. The low AP is considerably offset by the 'shred'.

[Harley]

Depends on if they can be Squadroned or not. I would still rather go with a Manticore than 3 of these, since it can hit more guys and even potentially take out Landraiders with ease.

[Mr Mystery]

I dunno

The rumoured Wyvern is ridiculously cheap points wise!

[Anggul]

Doesn't the Colossus fill the Ignores Cover artillery role already but at S6 AP3?

[Renegade]

So no news about the alleged new flyer or big tank, just some mortar tank that is neither hear nor there and a horrible looking transport.

I am not exactly getting excited about a new release, and doubt I will get much of anything new.

[This Dave]

Doesn't the Colossus fill the Ignores Cover artillery role already but at S6 AP3?

Yes although it's a lot more points than what the rumors say this thing costs. Still don't see a lot of point to it though since they also have Hellhounds to ignore cover at range.

[Houghten]

Doesn't the Colossus fill the Ignores Cover artillery role already but at S6 AP3?

The Colossus doesn't have a model, not even a Forge World one like the Medusa does or an old metal one like the Griffon. It's the one model from Codex Imperial Guard that hasn't been made at any point. I wouldn't count on it making it through to Codex Astra Militarum.

[The Emperor]

S4 with a reroll to wound and ignoring aegis lines isnt enough? Seriously?

For 65pts, 195 for a unit of 3? For six large blasts?

They're small blasts, not large blasts. And a lot of opponents will still get their base Armor Save against it, so ignoring cover isn't quite as impressive.

[Lord-Boofhead]

The Colossus doesn't have a model, not even a Forge World one like the Medusa does or an old metal one like the Griffon. It's the one model from Codex Imperial Guard that hasn't been made at any point. I wouldn't count on it making it through to Codex Astra Militarum.


You sure? (http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Imperial_Guard/Imperial_Guard_Tanks/IMPERIAL-BOMBARD.html)

[DWest]

You sure? (http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Imperial_Guard/Imperial_Guard_Tanks/IMPERIAL-BOMBARD.html)

Yes, because that's not a Colossus, it's a Bombard; If you look in the current IG codex, the Colossus is built on a Chimera hull, while the Bombard is on a Leman Russ hull.

[Cadian122]

[LI
[/LIST]

Yes, because that's not a Colossus, it's a Bombard; If you look in the current IG codex, the Colossus is built on a Chimera hull, while the Bombard is on a Leman Russ hull.

Except that Forgeworld have updated the rules for the Bombard and renamed it the Collosus Bombard, which does the same thing as th Colossus. The only aesthetic difference is the Leman Russ tracks which doesn't really make a difference. If you look at the picture in the current guard codex, the Collosus is the same actual tank, just with chimera tracks, apart from that it's the same.

[Wildcard]

Rumors did only say its a blast, not large blast

[DWest]

Where did they change this? Because the Bombard is still listed separately in the 6th edition update.

[FireHazard]

The Colossus, in all it's glory... *ahem*... :D

8057

In all seriousness, Imperial Armour Volume 1 - Second Edition - page 161

[DWest]

Huh. I don't have the new IA I, so is it just the Colossus from Codex: IG renamed, or does it still throw the huge blast like the old Bombard?

[FireHazard]

Huh. I don't have the new IA I, so is it just the Colossus from Codex: IG renamed, or does it still throw the huge blast like the old Bombard?

It's exactly the same as in Codex IG

[Houghten]

That's... why would they even...

GOD DAMN IT FORGE WORLD STOP MAKING ARMOUR VALUES MEANINGLESS

[MarneusCalgar]

PianoSam on Reddit posted this:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/21vhw7/new_guard/

Yes, I know you saxon people today are celebrating April Fools, but these pics seem legit for me

[Harley]

wow, I really like the look of that turret. Unlike the Taurox, I find myself wanting a few of these now.

[Kurt Helborg]

I see new plastic commissars!

[RGilbert26]

Where? I don't, plus you can easily make plastic Commissars out of current IG bits.

[MajorWesJanson]

Where? I don't, plus you can easily make plastic Commissars out of current IG bits.

I wouldn't say easily.

[RGilbert26]

I would, most if not all of the parts from the Command Squad can be used. The only thing you won't get is a coat. With the new Storm Stroopers you can use the coat for a Commissar.

[nathaneal246]

Can't wait for this! Hope I don't have to change my army round to much, that being my only concern!

[Harley]

Where? I don't, plus you can easily make plastic Commissars out of current IG bits.

You can make almost everything in the IG out of the 10 man troop box, some plasticard/bits and greenstuff, but why would you want to? A simple guardsmen couple represent anything from a Company Commander (with a fancy hat added) to a Primaris Psyker once you add a forcestaff or even a Heavy Weapon team member with a simple plasticard built autocannon and 60mm base. For one, It could be considered heavy proxying and not be tourney legal or make your army look cheap. And finally, a lot of us enjoy collecting GW models, not just kitbashing some cheap "counts as" model to get us by.

What has kept myself from buying any legit Commisars are the lack of multipart kit for weapon options etc. Metal/resin can be annoying to convert and actually breaks easier due to it's mass/brittleness.

[Patrick Boyle]

I see new plastic commissars!

I don't see a commissar, new or otherwise, in any of those images...

Though given one is gracing the cover it seems like a foregone conclusion we'll see a plastic clamshell at least next week.

[Turner]

How about those new order cards?

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s78/Turner1279/BETTER_zpsf8158868.jpg (http://s149.photobucket.com/user/Turner1279/media/BETTER_zpsf8158868.jpg.html)

[Nabterayl]

I'm a fan. Of the new orders, anyway.

[Mr Mystery]

I'm 'aving me some of that, Bargain Hunters!

I'm a right sucker for limited edition cardy things.

[John Bower]

I don't see a commissar, new or otherwise, in any of those images...

Though given one is gracing the cover it seems like a foregone conclusion we'll see a plastic clamshell at least next week.

Yeah, probably 18 quid like the bloody librarian... A rip off.

[MajorWesJanson]

Yeah, probably 18 quid like the bloody librarian... A rip off.

The SM plastics were overpriced. The later dwarf clampacks seemed to be reduced to more sane levels though.

[Katharon]

I'm sorry, but I kind of think the new Wyvern tank sucks...S4 AP6 heavy 2 blast with shred, barrage, and IC is *OK...kinda* but hardly the artillery piece I was hoping for. I'll be sticking to my thudd guns if its all the same to these new models.

[MajorWesJanson]

I'm sorry, but I kind of think the new Wyvern tank sucks...S4 AP6 heavy 2 blast with shred, barrage, and IC is *OK...kinda* but hardly the artillery piece I was hoping for. I'll be sticking to my thudd guns if its all the same to these new models.

It supposedly has 2 of those weapons, so 4 TL S4 AP6 ignores cover blasts with shred. And they can be a battery of 3.

[Mr Mystery]

That's pretty awesome for their points.

[Rissan4ever]

I think the Wyvern looks like a solid anti-infantry artillery piece. I'm not sure if it's better or worse than the Griffon (large blast with re-rolled scatter vs. 4 small blasts that don't re-roll), but we'll see.

I'm excited about the new book, and I'm even starting to warm up to the name a bit.

[Turner]

It feels like GW tried to create a balanced version of the Forge World 'Thudd Gun. Slightly high points, is a vehicle vs artillery (so all those pro's and con's, rules) but give it it's own little flair or draw that out weighs the 'Thudd Guns themselves. (Shred, ignores cover Str 4 AP 6 vs Str 5 Ap 5)