Tourney 1850 MC/ mech eldar (adepticon style)

[G00dySmiley]

please comment/ tear this apart and give any suggestions to make it better. ntoe this is not really a fun time list and i would not likely play it in a friendly game... that said for an adepticon type tournament i think it will be good.

Avatar 195

dire avengersx5 w/ exarch upgrade 75
wave serpan w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

dire avengersx5 w/ exarch upgrade 75
wave serpan w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

dire avengersx5 65
wave serpan w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

dire avengersx5 65
wave serpan w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

crimson hunter 160

fire prism w/ spirit stones 135

wraithknight w/ suncannon and scatter shield and 1 scatter laser 300

wraithlord 2x bright lance 2x flamer 160

aegis defencce line 100

1850 exactly

[Dragonlv8]

Personally I'd prefer 2 war walkers with a pair of bright lances each over the wraithlord Slightly less durable but more output being the reasoning and you should have 10 points left over after that going from top of my head.

[SeekingOne]

That's a tough list, 100% tournament-worthy and quite well-playable as it is. I think you'll do well with it.

I can make a few minor comments though.

1. Exarchs are supposed to man quad-gun? Not sure it's necessary, BS4 twin-linked hardly ever misses anyway.
2. Personally, I'd say suncannon Knight is grossly overpriced at 300 pts.
3. Since you're planning to have aegis, you're still likely to have some infantry models on the ground anyway. Thus, here's an oddball suggestion to you:
- remove suncannon, dropping WK to generic 240 pts version
- remove 1 squad of DAs, replace them with 3 jetbikes
- replace Prism with a squad of Reapers and re-assign 4th serpent to them
- replace quad-gun with Icarus

Here's what the updated list would look like:


Avatar 195

dire avengers x5 65
wave serpent w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

dire avengers x5 65
wave serpent w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

dire avengers x5 65
wave serpent w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

jetbikes x3 51

crimson hunter 160

wraithknight 240

wraithlord 2x bright lance 2x flamer 160

dark reapers x5 w/ exarch & fast shot 170
wave serpent w/ scatter laser and cannon 130

aegis defence line w/ Icarus 85

1776 points

This leaves you with 74 points to play - you can actually put the suncannon back :) Or you could take one more scoring squad, or add holos to serpents, or upgrade the jet to Exarch, or replace Wraithlord with squadron of Walkers... options are numerous. You could even drop 2 reapers and get an extra full-value firepower squad like 7 warp spiders or 2 dual-cannon Vypers. In fact, if you forgo the suncannon and cut Reapers to 3 models, you can revert jetbikes back to 5-man DA squad in a serpent w/scatter laser.

Anyway, the cool thing about Reapers in a serpent is that they can deploy in it, then jump out, move to man the Aegis and shoot right away. And 2-shot 96" lascannon that fires at BS5 ignoring jink saves is pretty cool too. I personally like these guys more than Prisms, which are, despite looking good on paper, too one-shot to be reliable.

Anyway, just some food for thought...

EIDT:
just realised that in the variant list that I suggested you can drop just 1 cannon from one of the serpents, and you'll have enough points to upgrade your Wraithlord to a second Wraithknight. Might be worth considering as well.

[G00dySmiley]

Personally I'd prefer 2 war walkers with a pair of bright lances each over the wraithlord Slightly less durable but more output being the reasoning and you should have 10 points left over after that going from top of my head.

I like war walkers i really do, I think on paper the wraithlord is just much mroe durable i have never had war walkers last more than 2 turns even taking a 3 man but outflaking them might be worth consiidering.


That's a tough list, 100% tournament-worthy and quite well-playable as it is. I think you'll do well with it.

I can make a few minor comments though.

1. Exarchs are supposed to man quad-gun? Not sure it's necessary, BS4 twin-linked hardly ever misses anyway.
2. Personally, I'd say suncannon Knight is grossly overpriced at 300 pts.
3. Since you're planning to have aegis, you're still likely to have some infantry models on the ground anyway. Thus, here's an oddball suggestion to you:
- remove suncannon, dropping WK to generic 240 pts version
- remove 1 squad of DAs, replace them with 3 jetbikes
- replace Prism with a squad of Reapers and re-assign 4th serpent to them
- replace quad-gun with Icarus

Here's what the updated list would look like:




This leaves you with 74 points to play - you can actually put the suncannon back :) Or you could take one more scoring squad, or add holos to serpents, or upgrade the jet to Exarch, or replace Wraithlord with squadron of Walkers... options are numerous. You could even drop 2 reapers and get an extra full-value firepower squad like 7 warp spiders or 2 dual-cannon Vypers. In fact, if you forgo the suncannon and cut Reapers to 3 models, you can revert jetbikes back to 5-man DA squad in a serpent w/scatter laser.

Anyway, the cool thing about Reapers in a serpent is that they can deploy in it, then jump out, move to man the Aegis and shoot right away. And 2-shot 96" lascannon that fires at BS5 ignoring jink saves is pretty cool too. I personally like these guys more than Prisms, which are, despite looking good on paper, too one-shot to be reliable.

Anyway, just some food for thought...

EIDT:
just realised that in the variant list that I suggested you can drop just 1 cannon from one of the serpents, and you'll have enough points to upgrade your Wraithlord to a second Wraithknight. Might be worth considering as well.

The main thing from stopping me from fielding another wrtaithknight is... my wallet, bought a wraithknight, a fire prism, 2 wave serpants, and 20 dire avengers this weeked... mor models means my wife might kill me.

I am going to try this weekend, I actually think you make some valid points here. I had not considered the lasgun and reapers with exarch and fast shot. I usually field them. I might try a variation droppping the monstrous creature aspect and just do a wraithknight bone stock, his heavy cannons can eat up vehicles, though against horde armies he will be of limited use, but the wave serpant x 4 will eat up horde along with all the dire avenger catipults. The prism is probably going to win over the war walkers for durability (will experiment with both this weekend in practice games) and it is just so much more universal of a tool, but the wraithlord can probably go. dropping a cannon from a wave serpant is however not in the cards, mass str 6 shots is what really makes this list i think.

any left over points might go to a fast attack, as there is one mission where fast attack score. warp spiders are awesome but i have so much medium str fire that shining spear might bea them in usefulness. (plus i have the models i can proxie for warp spiders it is a friendly tourny but i would probably blue tack space marine jump packs to fire dragons... which actually might look cool) any left over points can go to maybe another troop and avatar is nice but maybe an hq swap to a cheaper farseer or even in a pinch spiritseer. roll telepathy and hope for invisibility(possibly others depending on what i am playing) if not take the withfire psychic shriek, take primarus for divination for precience. and one roll on the runes of fate. it might even be worth it to find a way to swing eldrad actually.. not sure how though as i have to cut 10 points.

will post later with some playing around

[Garradh]

Who is manning the Aegis gun? Why are you spending points on Exarchs w/o any other upgrade?

[Power Klawz]

I'm guessing the wraithlords will be chilling in the back with the aegis defense line, they're built to shoot at long range and take a charge with flamers. I'm also guessing he had 20 points leftover and couldn't find anywhere else to put them. Could have made one of those DA squads a 6 man and had 7 points leftover, but you probably end up with more bang for your buck by getting 2 exarchs instead of one extra body. Higher I in case they win a combat and sweep, higher bs to kill more dudes, higher armor to soak more shots. If he had 26 points left I'd suggest making 2 squads six man units instead, but with only 20 I think it was his best bet.

Also this is really bugging me, it's a "serpent" not "serpan."

[Garradh]

I'm guessing the wraithlords will be chilling in the back with the aegis defense line, they're built to shoot at long range and take a charge with flamers.

I hope not! No cover save from the Aegis line, shooting the gun keeps them from firing their bright lances, and not using such tough monstrous creatures offensively . . . the very notion!

[Power Klawz]

Ah, I guess they are a bit too tall to get cover from an aegis defense line aren't they? Heh.

It was just a guess, and I'd guess that since they're MC's they can shoot one lance and the quad gun in the same turn, although they'd both have to be at the flyer. And they'd only have to use the quad gun against flyers, which won't be on the table the entire game.

The more logical guess would probably be that one of the Exarch squads stays behind while its serpent runs around causing hate and discontent.

[G00dySmiley]

Ah, I guess they are a bit too tall to get cover from an aegis defense line aren't they? Heh.

It was just a guess, and I'd guess that since they're MC's they can shoot one lance and the quad gun in the same turn, although they'd both have to be at the flyer. And they'd only have to use the quad gun against flyers, which won't be on the table the entire game.

The more logical guess would probably be that one of the Exarch squads stays behind while its serpent runs around causing hate and discontent.

that is it exactly, exarch and dire avengers on the gun. others in transports. back u exarch and wave serpant near lin in case i need to reman the gun... though leaning towards reapers instead of wraithlord now, exarch with fast show on an icarus lascannon. 2 shots bs5 and no jink save

[G00dySmiley]

I hope not! No cover save from the Aegis line, shooting the gun keeps them from firing their bright lances, and not using such tough monstrous creatures offensively . . . the very notion!


Ah, I guess they are a bit too tall to get cover from an aegis defense line aren't they? Heh.

It was just a guess, and I'd guess that since they're MC's they can shoot one lance and the quad gun in the same turn, although they'd both have to be at the flyer. And they'd only have to use the quad gun against flyers, which won't be on the table the entire game.

The more logical guess would probably be that one of the Exarch squads stays behind while its serpent runs around causing hate and discontent.

actually I think my wraithlords (and avatar would get cover saves from a wall... they are the old smaller vertions, metal models on square bases. compared to new ones they are pretty small but i am not buying new ones when i already have them. I do agree thinking abotu it that I need something different on the gun but to keep the 2 dirs avengers squads. the previously mentioned reaper exarch on the gun is pretty awesome as he ignores jink saves.

Here is how i panned it out not (also realised i needed more troops)

Avatar w/ fast shot 205

farseer 100

DAx5 65
WS cannon and scatter laser 130

DAx5 65
WS cannon and scatter laser 130

rangers x7 84
rangers x5 60

jet bikesx3 1 cannon 61

crimson hunter 160

reapersx4 w/ exarch and fast shot 140
WS cannon and scatter 130

fire prism with spirit stones 135

wraithknight suncannon/shield with 1 scatter laser 300

aegis line with lascannon 85

reapers on the line with exarch on cannon, farseer goes with them. hope for invisibility on telepathy

avatar will depend on opponent if they are coming to me he might be with reapers behind line as well, if i am going to them liek with IG then full speed ahead.

2x DA play keep away kiting things in the middle.

2x rangers infiltrate and hope to plink off special guns or just hunker down in cover with stealth holding something (possibly going to ground)

jet bieks reserved hopefully late game objective grabbers.

fire prism in the back doing what it does best trying to kill the highest priority target.

wraithknight jets around scatter laser to get twin linked str 6 AP2 x3 blasts

thoughts?

[SeekingOne]

The new list looks a bit less focussed than the older one. Still, looks playable.

I'd make rangers 2x6 instead of 5 and 7, but that's just me :) Also, don't see much use in giving bikes a cannon.

Also, not sure if Farseer is worth it... Chance of getting Invisibility is small, and otherwise the army doesn't look like being in need of random buffs. If you're firmly set on taking a farseer, use one power slot for Guide to use it on Fire Prism or Reapers.

[Garradh]

Reapers on the Aegis line, I like it!

[40kGamer]

Reapers on the Aegis line, I like it!

I used to use Fire Dragons with a tooled up Exarch but now Reapers are better hands down!

The list does feel unfocused but looks perfectly playable. I would even out the rangers as well... just kinda crazy that way. :)

[G00dySmiley]

I am open to suggestions on how to make it better, can do the 6 rangers, that does make more sense

I agree the cannon on the jet bikes was kind of pointless, but more of a 10 point and nowhere to put it syndrome.

I decided after math hammer that dark reapers exarch is better on a lascannon than a quad gun for more pens and possible explotions.

I just really wanted to protect them so i brought a farseer, he was going to stay with them and buff them and other things in back line. might debate spiritseer as he can get conceil for 2+ cover in case they case hit by ap 2-3 it is less points but what to change it for.

I am playing around with the idea of dropping the bikes, a ranger squad, and avatar for a ork or gk ally

gk ally

inquisitor coteaz w/ a 10 servitor squad, all with heavy bolters, 2 jeriko weapon smiths total 270... but its alot of shots, 2 weaponsmiths mean my guns will get aty least 2 buffs, possibly all buffs. likely shoot their weapons as las cannons or multimeltas depending on where things land near them

offers better chance of getting first turn or keeping first turn i cna reroll to seize or make my opponent reroll sucessful seize.

also him and his group can fire at things deep strike within 12 inches with lots of bolter shots and multimelta/lascannon should make for a bubble around reapers to avoid rapid fire and such. also they are troops due to the inq. it goes almsot without saying but divination would be the table for exchangin the 2 powers, one would be swapped for precience


also take a 5 man grey knight strike squad take a psy cannon and use warp quake to prevent deep striking iwthin 12 inches of the squad

costs 380 so as said 8 rangers3 bikes and the avatar goen and lose no troops.

othe opthin is orks

warboss on a bike with cybork and power klaw 135

goes with a def copta for 35

5 lootas at 75 points

2 units of 10 gretchin w/ runt herd 40 points each

again not losing troops and actually gaining some points. get a super fast close combat monster in the warboss and lootas which are the bane of medium armor, flyers, and infantry so good all around

total 325 orks.

the ork one i like the speed and lootas but will still have to worry about deep strikes (though warboss means you are brave to deep strike nearby from drop pods turn 1). the orks do seem to only replace the avatar and the 2 troops though with worse troops and about even close combat but with a better delivery system (also avatar will be more likely to catch (hell he basically always catches in a combat).

the GK do add mroe tactics and scare things out of risking to scatter near the inquisitor or near warp quake.with good spacing I can possibly control where things that auto come in at a spot would deploy as well... and turn 1 is always a huge advantage .. tactically I think gk would be better, on the field though the orks speed might make the difference in some games.. thoughts?