Fun with Eldar!

[DrWobbles]

So the new dex is finally in our sweaty little palms, What goofy combos have you guys discovered? any new juicy eldar tactica?

Here are some I enjoy;

Night Spinner with star engines and crystal targeting matrix. Thats a S7 rending lite template (S8 on vehicles and slowpokes!) in your face from 48" away, move 12"+flat out 24"+torrent 12". Surprise!

Illic Nightspear attached to wraithguard. This honestly seems broken. You can plop all that S10 death behind any armored rear, or use wraithscythes to take out... well i guess anything. Fire Dragons actually might be a better fit here using Illic's warlord trait to split fire. If you give the exarch a dragons breath flamer and fast shot you have two heavy flamers roasting troops while the dragons do their thing.

Seer council w/renewer and Fuegan. Now this one isn't very practical but think of the possibilities! Fuegan's unquenchable resolve special rule lets him gain +1 Strength and +1 Attack for every lost wound. As long as you keep replacing those wounds with your warlocks Feugan could have a WS7 S10 I7 A10+ monster! Striking at AP1!!! FUEGAN THE FIRE GOD!!!! now only to find a way to take those wounds of yourself....

[Sonikgav]

The only thing about B is that Illic may give a unit the Infiltrate USR, but he doesnt pass on his special infiltrate rule so if hes taking a unit of anything with him, he has to obey the standard infiltrating distance rules which tbh, isnt nearly as good/worth what Illic costs.

[DrWobbles]

So its not broken! I also like Karandras with Wraithblades. Just a good, tough, choppy unit that can get dug in quick.

[DarkLink]

Farseers can take both Guide and Prescience. Hope for Fortune, Misfortune, or Doom for your third power, and buff two full scatter laser War Walker squads. That's 12 dead Marines per turn on average dice with just Guide and Prescience. And, yes, I know scatter lasers get some rerolls, but only on subsequent weapons. Also, Aegis Defense Line and Holofields mean those War Walkers get a 3+ cover save automatically.

[Vallen]

Eldrad using Divination and hoping for the No cover power...put him with a group of dark reapers....TW with ignore cover = many dead marines.....at that point I'm not sure if I prefer 20 str 5 shots or 10 str 8 shots :)

[DarkLink]

With reroll to hit, str5 by far. You get a lot more hits, and the only difference is a 3+ vs a 2+ to wound. Str 5 will cause about 12 wounds. Str 8 will only do 7-8.


Str 8 ignores cover is great against vehicles, though, so it's got its place.

[Carstens]

Keep in mind that ICs don't transfer infiltrate until after they've been deployed/put in reserves. So it's only really usefull for giving outflank.

[Vallen]

Keep in mind that ICs don't transfer infiltrate until after they've been deployed/put in reserves. So it's only really usefull for giving outflank.

What is your logic on this? The rule says "Units that contain at least one model with this special rule.." At the bottom of the rule it does say that units don't give this to ICs but I would think that given the wording an IC would give it to the unit.

I've play against some annoying Huron armies so if you have a good reason why giving the IC infiltrate does not confer to the unit I'd love to hear it :)

[DarkLink]

It's actually a pretty valid question. You can only join ICs to units during deployment, so you can't actually stick the IC in the squad that isn't deploying to give them infiltrate so that they can infiltrate... yeah, GW kinda sucks at writing rules. This problem's actually been around for a long time, I'm pretty sure they've even FAQ'd it before. It's kind of a fuzzy loophole.

[Kyban]

It's actually a pretty valid question. You can only join ICs to units during deployment, so you can't actually stick the IC in the squad that isn't deploying to give them infiltrate so that they can infiltrate... yeah, GW kinda sucks at writing rules. This problem's actually been around for a long time, I'm pretty sure they've even FAQ'd it before. It's kind of a fuzzy loophole.
I always read it as, first you attach the IC to the unit then decide how to deploy the unit.

Speaking of pertinent, poorly written rules though: Ignore cover only says wounds so it doesn't work on vehicles. It's probably supposed to work for vehicles too but the way it's written...

[Xenith]

Autarch, jetbike, fusion gun, laser lance/power spear, Mantle of the Laughing God.

*drops mic*

[LittleMen]

DrWobbles, I love the crystal targeting matrix on your Night Spinner but I like it even more on my Warp Hunter! I can't believe the Illicit thing will stand up in court, it is just too nuts. Fuegan Death Star is hilarious!

Also, since it hasn't been mentioned: Guardian Jetbikes with Warlock casting Conceal get a 3+ cover save. Not to shabby.

[Carstens]

The reason why infiltrate doesn't work, is not that it doesn't transfer, but that it transfers to late to have any effect (apart from giving outflank).

There's only 2 ways for an IC to join a unit during deployment;

1. place both unit and IC in resserves and declare they are joined.

2. Deploy the IC in coherency with a unit, in order to do that the unit must already be deployed. It's would now be to late to use infiltrate. You could argue that deploying a unit in coherency with an IC would work aswell. You have no way of keeping the unit undeployed until the infiltrate phase, with out having infiltrate (or going in reserves, but that doesn't help either).

short version; An IC isn't joined to a unit until they are both deployed. (Or in reserves)

[Tynskel]

If an IC grants Infiltrate to a unit, then you just deploy them altogether.

So, hard!

[DrWobbles]

@carstens "an independent character can begin the game already with a unit..." -40k rule book pg. 39.

@littlemen I too have a warphunter and thought the same thing but i'll wait for the forgeworld faq to go up before i roast my opponents backfield.

[DrWobbles]

Has anyone noticed any little tweaks here and there might be missed in a quick glance? here's a few i noticed;

Singing spears are not two handed. that was really the only drawback to them in the old book.

shimmershields are 5+ invuln for cc and shooting.

Wraithlords are characters. useful for sniping with starcannons and curb-stomping powerfist wielding sergeants.

Phoenix lords don't have to lead their own aspect anymore. Maugan Ra with Dire Avengers seems much more compatible than joining him with reapers, Bahharoth with banshees gives them hit and run, Jain Zar with scorpions can give them more anti meq/teq, krandras with dragons make them infiltrating, stealthy and more survivable in cc....

[DarkLink]

You're ignoring half the rule. If you continue reading, it explains how the IC can begin the game with a unit. It specifies that the IC must either be deployed normally, or placed in reserves with the unit. So either you can attach the IC and not infiltrate, or you can not attach the IC and infiltrate only the IC. It helps a lot when you read the whole rule instead of cherrypicking quotes.

[DrWobbles]

sigh...

nowhere does the word 'normally' show up. "an independent character can begin the game already with a unit, either by by being deployed in unit coherency with it or, if the unit is in reserve, by informing your opponent of which unit it has joined." that's the full sentence. Infiltrators are still 'deployed' just like other units only a little later.

"Being deployed in unit coherency" does not mean one unit must be deployed then deploy your independent character. they are deployed simultaneously and in unit coherency.

"while an independent character is part of a unit, he counts as part of the unit for all rules purposes..."

Does the IC have infiltrate? yes.

Can the IC begin the game already with a unit? yes.

Does a unit gain the infiltrators rule if at least one model has this rule? yes.

Can the unit infiltrate? YES.

[DrWobbles]

ooh, here's another one;

dire avenger exarchs and autarchs can have power weapons. meaning S5 AP4, or S4 AP2, etc...

[Ben Brown]

so far the codex is awesome. some of the exarch options are brutal for making small squads really powerful and relatively cheap. the warp spider exarch with spineret fast shot and marksmen eye is very cheap and effective and with all the extra chances for movement afforded by battle focus and jetpacks plus the small unit footprint and size is really effective

[Baron.roboto]

On Monday I'll be trying the following in a wave Serpent:
Karandras
10 Dire Avengers
Exarch with Power Weapon and Shimmershield

That combo seems to compliment each other well in my mind - Karandras' s warlord skill can increase the rends when they first fire, as well as giving the unit stealth and move through cover; in return he gets Counterattack and his much needed 5++....

[zenBen]

On Monday I'll be trying the following in a wave Serpent:
Karandras
10 Dire Avengers
Exarch with Power Weapon and Shimmershield

That combo seems to compliment each other well in my mind - Karandras' s warlord skill can increase the rends when they first fire, as well as giving the unit stealth and move through cover; in return he gets Counterattack and his much needed 5++....

Sounds like a nice combo, plus the whole unit can Infiltrate...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...BOLS thread.

Here's one: First turn denial. Now with the 6th ed rules for Reserves that isn't normally possible - but with Hawks I can haz?
3 units of Hawks, plus Baharroth makes 4 units (and up to ~800 pts). You also need a single unit that absolutely can't be killed in turn 1: maybe a Solitarch. Whatever you choose, you'll deploy 4-5 units so can buy 9-11 units and reserve the non-Hawks, leaving the Hawks deployed on table out of LOS. If you get first turn, Skyleap and clean the board of your troops - all except the Solitarch you've left in a corner to prevent auto-lose. Opponent does nothing for 1 turn. Solitarch fixes reserve rolls so everything comes back in turn 2, scatterless deep-striking, maybe you bought War Walkers they're outflanking, maybe WS+Guardians to grab objectives, as you like.

If you don't get first turn, just hope they don't have any barrage :D

[cebalrai]

Sounds like a nice combo, plus the whole unit can Infiltrate...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...or maybe they can't...or maybe they can...BOLS thread.

Here's one: First turn denial. Now with the 6th ed rules for Reserves that isn't normally possible - but with Hawks I can haz?
3 units of Hawks, plus Baharroth makes 4 units (and up to ~800 pts). You also need a single unit that absolutely can't be killed in turn 1: maybe a Solitarch. Whatever you choose, you'll deploy 4-5 units so can buy 9-11 units and reserve the non-Hawks, leaving the Hawks deployed on table out of LOS. If you get first turn, Skyleap and clean the board of your troops - all except the Solitarch you've left in a corner to prevent auto-lose. Opponent does nothing for 1 turn. Solitarch fixes reserve rolls so everything comes back in turn 2, scatterless deep-striking, maybe you bought War Walkers they're outflanking, maybe WS+Guardians to grab objectives, as you like.

If you don't get first turn, just hope they don't have any barrage :D


Wow, clever. I'll have to try that since I have a lot of Hawks and Baharroth.

[El_Davo]

Cast quicken on a unit of banshees with jain-zar. now your banshees will run D6+7 inches with a reroll on the d6. talk about super fast banshees.

[Kyban]

Cast quicken on a unit of banshees with jain-zar. now your banshees will run D6+7 inches with a reroll on the d6. talk about super fast banshees.

They still can't charge after so they'll get shot up. :(

[Lightbot]

Hi,

Has anyone considered putting a Pheonix Gem and Faolchu's wings on an IC, and them having them fly into the midst of an opponent's elite troops to cause havok?

Or even just an Autarch with Swooping Hawk wings and a Gem?

[rle68]

So the new dex is finally in our sweaty little palms, What goofy combos have you guys discovered? any new juicy eldar tactica?

Here are some I enjoy;

Night Spinner with star engines and crystal targeting matrix. Thats a S7 rending lite template (S8 on vehicles and slowpokes!) in your face from 48" away, move 12"+flat out 24"+torrent 12". Surprise!

Illic Nightspear attached to wraithguard. This honestly seems broken. You can plop all that S10 death behind any armored rear, or use wraithscythes to take out... well i guess anything. Fire Dragons actually might be a better fit here using Illic's warlord trait to split fire. If you give the exarch a dragons breath flamer and fast shot you have two heavy flamers roasting troops while the dragons do their thing.

Seer council w/renewer and Fuegan. Now this one isn't very practical but think of the possibilities! Fuegan's unquenchable resolve special rule lets him gain +1 Strength and +1 Attack for every lost wound. As long as you keep replacing those wounds with your warlocks Feugan could have a WS7 S10 I7 A10+ monster! Striking at AP1!!! FUEGAN THE FIRE GOD!!!! now only to find a way to take those wounds of yourself....

if im not mistaken you cannot use fast shot on a template weapon page 30 so that one is out

[G00dySmiley]

if im not mistaken you cannot use fast shot on a template weapon page 30 so that one is out

re-read crystal targeting matrix... probably the only time that upgrad eis ever worth it... still no somthing i would use in a competative game, but for fun it seems ok

[rle68]

re-read crystal targeting matrix... probably the only time that upgrad eis ever worth it... still no somthing i would use in a competative game, but for fun it seems ok

i did .. what does that have to do with you cant use fast shot on a template weapon?

[z3r05k1ll]

farseer presciece/guide, warlock conceal, vaul's wrath, aegis+quad gun
325 points

14 wounds at T7 with a 2+ cover save 3 of which are throw away wounds
2 reroll to hit buffs
a quadgun operated by farseer with BS5
potentially 3 las cannons from the vauls

[DrWobbles]

if im not mistaken you cannot use fast shot on a template weapon page 30 so that one is out

Thanks for the heads up. Fire dragon exarchs don't really seem worth the investment.

[DrWobbles]

farseer presciece/guide, warlock conceal, vaul's wrath, aegis+quad gun
325 points

14 wounds at T7 with a 2+ cover save 3 of which are throw away wounds
2 reroll to hit buffs
a quadgun operated by farseer with BS5
potentially 3 las cannons from the vauls

Its pricey but tough. As far as aegis lines go i like reaper exarchs with fast shot and night vision on an icarus lascannon. That extra shot makes the lascannon a better anti-air weapon, plus you can guide it. pew! pew!

[rle68]

Thanks for the heads up. Fire dragon exarchs don't really seem worth the investment.

fast shot giving the fire pike 2 shots at 18" tho is a good one to me

[Sonikgav]

Im enjoying my Allied Tau force.

Commander Shadowsun + Warpspiders (I call them ShadowSpiders). Marginally slower than Spiders alone (no Battle Focus/Warp Jump) but Shadowsun's Warlord Trait adds a little extra speed not to mention Stealth/Shrouded and if you have the points, her Drone that gives you the rerolls to hit is always handy.

[AM-254]

Alternatively, if you're in a distinctly apocalyptic mood then you can field an Ulthwe strike force and give the farseer carrying the wraithgate the Faolchu's Wing Remnant of Glory. The farseer can then fly across the board and deploy his wraithgate, so your shorter range units can be unleashing their fury by turn two.

Not to mention the fact that the avatar can get stuck in without facing the enemies heavy weapons.