Helldrake Vs. Aegis w/Quad Gun (or Icarus)

[Caitsidhe]

Here is an interesting interaction. The Helldrake can possibly take out the gun emplacement before it gets to fire interceptor shots.

1. Both Interceptor Shots and Vector Strike Attacks take place after the movement phase.
2. Order of resolution tends to go to the person whose turn it is first, i.e. controlling player decides order.

3. Helldrake inflict D3+1 STR-7 Vector Strike on Quad Gun (which is Toughness-7 w/2 Wounds). The attacks are AP-3 and deny cover. There are decent odds the incoming dragon will destroy the gun. Two incoming dragons all but assure it.

[DrLove42]

So....whats the question?

I always do Vector Striking when i move the model, not at the end of movement and no ones ever complained. Interceptors are done at the end.

I don't know if its a guarentee to kill it. Statistically is low. Probability says you get 3 hits, needing 4's to wound....so you're looking at 50 50 chance.

Factor in the dragons maximum range of 36", you'll never reach your opponents deployment zone where the gun is, likely so you won't fly over it the turn you arrive....

[Caitsidhe]

So....whats the question?

I always do Vector Striking when i move the model, not at the end of movement and no ones ever complained. Interceptors are done at the end.

I don't know if its a guarentee to kill it. Statistically is low. Probability says you get 3 hits, needing 4's to wound....so you're looking at 50 50 chance.

Factor in the dragons maximum range of 36", you'll never reach your opponents deployment zone where the gun is, likely so you won't fly over it the turn you arrive....

It wasn't a question so much as me attempting to make sure I'm reading it correctly. It depends a lot on the type of Deployment and how far forward they place it.

[Mr Mystery]

Stuff like that I'd always dice for out of sportsmanship. But that's just my take, and not meant to be a solid stand point. Adds drama to the game!

The turn break down is done for sanities sake only!

[robrodgers46]

The whole idea of the interceptor shot is that they intercept. They are shooting before the enemy aircraft arrives overhead. I would be quite derisive of any chaos marine player who tried to make the point that the helldrake's vector strike would go off first. That is, if I was stupid enough to put my gun within 36" of the opposing board edge.

[Caitsidhe]

I suppose it depends on how you view "meteoric descent" which implies the thing comes down like a bat out hell literally on top of whatever it hits. A fluff argument could easily be made that it could do exactly that on a Quad/Icarus and take it out before it could fire. This assumes someone put it far enough forward. Never forget that there are several different types of deployment besides Dawn of War.

I do concur, however, with Mr. Mystery that it should be diced off as a matter of sportsmanship. I was merely musing on the rules as written and what it would mean if/when I run into it at a tournament. I own Helldrakes but up until now I've not been using them. My issues with a few bad match up against which the Helldrake is particularly well-suited may change this preference.

[Sly]

It wasn't a question so much as me attempting to make sure I'm reading it correctly. It depends a lot on the type of Deployment and how far forward they place it.

Seems like a correct interpretation of the rules. Both take place at the same spot in the turn, the active player chooses the order of actions that take place at the same spot, thus the player who is bringing in units from Reserve gets to pick which happens first.

[Nabterayl]

Seems like a correct interpretation of the rules. Both take place at the same spot in the turn, the active player chooses the order of actions that take place at the same spot, thus the player who is bringing in units from Reserve gets to pick which happens first.

I agree that Vector Strike can happen before Interceptor if the player whose turn it is so desires.

Re: this being cheesy ... remember that Interceptor has never actually fired as if it interrupts the target's movement. The rule is quite clear that the gun has to have line of sight to where the target model ends its Movement, which means it is totally possible for a unit to arrive from reserve within range of an Interceptor gun and escape being fired upon, because it landed behind cover, even if the Interceptor gun could see the entire line of travel until the end point.

[DrLove42]

Also factor in a scenario.

You have a unit close to my deployment zone.
My dragon comes in from reserve.
It flies over your unit and Vector Strikes them. But your unit is out of range of your interceptor weapon (maybe its a Mortis Contemptor or long table deployment)
I then end my movement in range of your gun.

Here the Vector strike makes sense to happen first, as you didn't have the range to shoot at me

[Caitsidhe]

I'm finding the Vector Strikes more and more interesting in my theoryhammer and in my testing. The Baleflamer is, without a doubt, a wonderful weapon and the bread and butter of the model, but the Vector Strikes aren't tactically far behind.

[sfshilo]

I'm reviving this thread as I have found something in the 40k digital codex that they updated and i'm not sure it's in the written book.

The stats for gun emplacements are AMAZING.
S5, T10, W10, 2+ save with three attacks in cc?

The lascannon just became an auto include in my armies now...I had thought it shared the artillery profile.

[This Dave]

Ummmm what? That really sounds like a mistake.

[sfshilo]

Ummmm what? That really sounds like a mistake.

If I could screenshot it I would, don't want to piss off GW's lawyers, but it is there lol. (Latest updated download)