What - no...

[Denzark]

...Oscar Pistorius thread???

[Wildeybeast]

What is there to start a thread about? He shot his GF, he's gone to trial and as one would expect from a third world country, the police seem to have handled it with a healthy dose of ineptitude mixed with a faint whiff of corruption. We simply have to wait for what passes for justice down there to take it's course and the 'truth' to be revealed.

[Denzark]

Um - its not unknown for us to discuss current affairs down here?

[Psychosplodge]

yeah but short of doing the jokes theres not a lot to discuss?
He either shot under false assumption or shot and claimed false assumptions and considering the police seem to have three stories at least who knows?
I think odds are about even if he gets bail he'll top himself, cause he does look genuinely upset. but who knows?

[Wildeybeast]

Oh course, I'm just not sure what there is to discuss beyond idle and unfounded speculation based on the rather sketchy details that both sides have bizarrely released before the trial even started. But if that's what you are looking for I'll speculate away - he's a chump. He's either a chump for not noticing his GF wasn't in bed next to him before opening fire at an intruder or he's chump for carrying out a murder in such a cack handed fashion. Either way, that level of stupidity deserves some form of custodial sentence for the protection of society.

[Chronowraith]

This case seems like it should be on a TV sitcom or soap opera... it just gets more ridiculous as time goes on. I'm certain we'll find out that the judge was sleeping with the girlfriend and prosecutor is Pistorius' long lost son who is taking out his daddy issues on his unsuspecting foe...

Regardless... (and not that it matters) but I concur... nothing really to talk about.

[YorkNecromancer]

Don't care avbout the Pistorius case, but I am a little concerned by this comment:


as one would expect from a third world country, the police seem to have handled it with a healthy dose of ineptitude mixed with a faint whiff of corruption.

I have several friends from South Africa. Let me assure you, it isn't a third world country; it's very close to first world in terms of wealth and education. The Pretoria district in particular is very well off. What South Africa IS, is a nation with massive social and class divisions, huge inequality between the rich and poor, an insane crime rate, and far, far too many guns. It's basically a lot like any area with extreme poverty and high-crime parts in America cities.

[Psychosplodge]

It seems pretty third world unless you're white or rich...

[Denzark]

Don't care avbout the Pistorius case, but I am a little concerned by this comment:



I have several friends from South Africa. Let me assure you, it isn't a third world country; it's very close to first world in terms of wealth and education. The Pretoria district in particular is very well off. What South Africa IS, is a nation with massive social and class divisions, huge inequality between the rich and poor, an insane crime rate, and far, far too many guns. It's basically a lot like any area with extreme poverty and high-crime parts in America cities.

Apparently (wikipedia) the concept of 3 worlds emerged in the Cold War - 1st being the US and Western European NATO allies, 2nd being Communist bloc, and 3rd being non-aligned. By this definition, SA would comply.

[Kirsten]

I think he is rather guilty personally, but if he is innocent of the premeditated part, honestly what sort of total fecking idiot would wake up and fire through a door at an unknown person? I don't buy the 'I thought it was a burglar' bit. If you live with someone and wake up in the middle of the night hearing someone in the bathroom, nobody thinks it is an intruder without checking the bed for your partner. He hasn't got a leg to stand on. Dismissing the neighbour's statement about hearing the argument because she is 600m away is absolute nonsense, it is perfectly reasonable to hear shouting over that range when the area is so flat and open.

On a seperate issue I was in the supermarket looking at wine the day before this came out, and an older gentleman beside me with his wife said "I think we should get a South African bottle, they know feck all about most things, but they do know wine."

[Psychosplodge]

I'm not sure they lived together...

[Kirsten]

well they were a couple, even if one of them didn't technically live there I am sure they spent a lot of nights together, doesn't really affect my point.

[Psychosplodge]

I thought the defence was she came in unannounced he wasn't expecting her?

[Kirsten]

no she went to the toilet, the defence stated that he only checked to see if she was in bed with him after he opened fire, so she must have been there already.

[Wildeybeast]

Don't care avbout the Pistorius case, but I am a little concerned by this comment:



I have several friends from South Africa. Let me assure you, it isn't a third world country; it's very close to first world in terms of wealth and education. The Pretoria district in particular is very well off. What South Africa IS, is a nation with massive social and class divisions, huge inequality between the rich and poor, an insane crime rate, and far, far too many guns. It's basically a lot like any area with extreme poverty and high-crime parts in America cities.

Denzark is indeed correct in his definition of third world. 'Developing nation' or 'emerging economy' are the more politically correct buzzwords I gather. Call it what you will. The facts are that 25% of the population is unemployed, 50% live below the poverty, it has the highest rate of HIV/AIDS in the world (due in no small part to having an AIDs denying president as recently as 2000) and an average life expectancy of just 50. That's without touching the hot potatoes of crime, racial inequality and frankly backwards social 'beliefs'. Comparisons to the US on a small scale may apply, but not on a nationwide basis. SA is doing a lot better than most of Africa, true, and is probably on a par with the likes of India and Brazil, but it is a long way from being a 'developed' nation and won't get there any time soon without significant government reform to address the staggering levels of inequality.

[eldargal]

It's very sad really, she was very intelligent, very friendly and very beautiful and not at all fitting the model stereotype (not all do but enough to keep it going...). He was quite inspirational too. The case itself is a good example of why trials cannot be conducted by the media or public opinion, the amount of contradictory nonsense being spewed out by the press in incredible.

[Psychosplodge]

no she went to the toilet, the defence stated that he only checked to see if she was in bed with him after he opened fire, so she must have been there already.

Fair enough, missed that bit, weird then.
I don't know about you but the SO getting out of bed disturbs me by her absence...

[Wolfshade]

3rd world yup.

South Africa is a very divided nation, the divide between rich and poor is staggering, and more commonly this is a divide between white and black and educated and uneducated. Walking around one of the large out of town pristine air-conditional malls you could be forgiven to think you were in any european city, get in the car and drive and there are shanty towns a sprawling mass of corrigated carboard as far as the eye can see where entire families live in areas half teh size of a standard shipping container.

What is fascinating about this case is that in South Africa there is no trial by jury, indeed, the abolished it during apartitide because they felt that black defendants were not given a fair trial. Consequently, we have more information as the judge himself makes the decisions and not the jury who could be swayed by media pressures.

Indeed we only have to look at the Vicky Pryce case where the judge dissmised the jury for a "fundamental deficit in understanding" of its role. (Here are teh questions/answers http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21521460)

[alshrive]

sorry to lower the tone but I really don't feel that Oscar Pistorius has a leg to stand on

[Psychosplodge]

I think Kirsten inadvertently did that one...

[alshrive]

well, like Pistorius, I'm stumped!

[Wolfshade]

There was speculation at the time he might have been legless, blood alcohol levels have shown this not to be so

[eldargal]

John Cleese already used legless.:p People got offended, For ****s sake, the man is Python, I for one was relieved to see he still had it.

[Wolfshade]

John Cleese (real name John Cheese). I never heard him say it. But these jokes are obvious. Bad taste? Perhaps, but a lot of humour is based on someone elses suffering/misery.

I like puns.

Such as a takeaway name I heard on Russle Howards Good News: "Poppadum preach"

[eldargal]

You didn't hear him 'cos he tweeted it.;)

[Wolfshade]

To quote me from another thread today.

"The PM and I have share the same view on Twitter"

[eldargal]

Tax it? I don't even have an account myself.

[Wolfshade]

Tax it? I don't even have an account myself.

"Too many tweets make a tw..."

I do not twitter, if I have something worth telling people I will do so in more than 140(?) characters.
Usually I dn't.

[Wildeybeast]

Getting back on track, I'm listening live to the bail summary from the judge and the frankly laughable 'investigation' carried out by the lead detective (who has now been removed due to minor matter of multiple charges of attempted murder). Some gaffs include: failing to verify who a mobile found at the scene belonged to; possibly contaminating the crime scene by not wearing protective footwear; omitting to mention that the witness who heard arguing could not see where it was coming from nor identify the house the shouting came from; omitting from his report the presence of a spent cartridge which the defence found; having to retract his unfounded allegation that needles found at the scene contained steroids. My comment about 'incompetent and possibly corrupt' is looking pretty well founded now.

[Wildeybeast]

Also, this magistrate is so in love with the sound of his own voice. He's being going for at least twenty minutes and has basically given his opinion on the entire case (good luck getting a fair trial after that Pistorious) and still hasn't actually told us whether he is granting bail.

[eldargal]

I was at university with a South African girl who was gang-raped by a pack of ten year old boys. One of the boys fathers knew the lead police officer and it just got buried. It's a messed up country. I remember one of the earlier, more rational media reports saying the police seemed out for his blood, I guess arresting and prosecuting a national hero is a good way of raising your image.

[Wildeybeast]

So after nearly two hours of waffling, he got bail. Apparently he's not a flight risk nor a threat to the public. As to your point EG, I'd agree that sort of corruption is no doubt commonplace. However, I'm not sure they had much choice but to prosecute here. Pistorius admitted shooting her and there are a number of inconsistencies with his story which raise reasonable grounds to suspect it may not be the accident he suggests it was. It just seems to have been incredibly badly investigated by a man who should be all rights have been suspended for the charges he is facing.

[DrLove42]

He may not be a risk to the public or a flight risk, but i think hes a risk to himself.

I know its an outsider incomplete, media driven perspective but i believe him and his guilt over it means he might not make it to court again

[Wildeybeast]

Well, you never know what is going on inside someone's mind, but if I was indulging in some pop psychology I'd suggest that his intensely competitive nature would drive him to prove his innocence to everyone.

[alshrive]

Well, you never know what is going on inside someone's mind, but if I was indulging in some pop psychology I'd suggest that his intensely competitive nature would drive him to prove his innocence to everyone.

my competitive nature drives me to prove that i don't feel it necessary to kill my wife.....