Carlos Tevez

[Wolfshade]

In 2006 Carlos Tevez came to the UK to play football.

Coming for Argentina he is required to get a Provisional UK Driving licence after 1 year, e.g. 2007.

Today he was fine £1,540 which is a pittance compared with his basic salary of £408,397 pcm.
He failed to understand the word Constabulary on a police notice.

His car was caught speeding (39mph in a 30mph zone) near Morecambe a claim he denies, it must just be coincidence that he was playing in the reverse game earlier. 28th March

His car was caugt speeding (66 mph in a 50mph zone) near Crew, again he denies. 8th May

In November his car was impounded as he could not provide a proper driving licence.

In 2011 he was fined for speeding in his Bentley

In 2010 his Bentley was impounded as he could not provide a proper driving licence.

And as you go back in time there are more accounts of him speeding and driving without licence as far as I can tell reading the various reports.

Surely, it is known that he cannot drive as he does not have a licence and obtaining one would be "problematic" as the theory test is administered in English which he apparently has issues reading.

Of course the problem is that in order to impound his car(s) he has to be caught driving them not just owning them.

If he were not so famous would he have such an experience?

[Kirsten]

of course if he wasn't famous he would have been locked up for so many driving offences and have a long term ban on driving :P

does make you wonder if fines should be means tested. Like John Terry illegally parking every week outside a shop because a fine of a few hundred pounds was so utterly meaningless he didn't care. Personally I don't think that huge wealth should allow people to just ignore the law and its' outcome. Either raise the fines for repeat offences, means test, or with john terry for example ban him from driving for a while. A penalty has to actually mean something.

[Wolfshade]

Exactly, it is less than 1% of his monthly salary.

Given an average salary of £26.5k (using BBC stats, and make that net as Carlos's figure is) it works out as £5.31 to pay the same proportional fine.

[Wildeybeast]

of course if he wasn't famous he would have been locked up for so many driving offences and have a long term ban on driving :P

does make you wonder if fines should be means tested. Like John Terry illegally parking every week outside a shop because a fine of a few hundred pounds was so utterly meaningless he didn't care. Personally I don't think that huge wealth should allow people to just ignore the law and its' outcome. Either raise the fines for repeat offences, means test, or with john terry for example ban him from driving for a while. A penalty has to actually mean something.

No. Never ever ever ever no. A thousand times no. The only possible way justice can operate is if the punishment fits the crime, not the criminal.

I'm more puzzled about why the club hasn't done something about it. Back in the day, managers would have given them a kick up the arse for being so stupid (figuratively and literally in some cases). Half of them now just let them do whatever the hell they want the moment they leave the ground. It baffles me. They give young, mostly stupid and uneducated men all this money and fame and then just assume they will be able to handle it in a mature fashion. Yeah right.

[Wolfshade]

But wouldn't it be more just if the proportional effect of the fine were the same?

For someone earning average salary 1k fine would effectively wipe them out for that month a serious deterant. For someone on £400k it is a factional amount and has no impact on them and is not a deterrant.

[Kirsten]

No. Never ever ever ever no. A thousand times no. The only possible way justice can operate is if the punishment fits the crime, not the criminal.

where is the justice exactly if the law is no deterrant? Teves and his ilk could be fined on a daily basis and it would make no difference to them whatsoever. Why should they obey the law if it has no impact on them exactly? The legal system needs to be able to penalise lawbreakers, at the moment they are powerless against these footballers. If you don't want to change the penalty, then by all means lets cap their insane wages, I would rather do that. Nobody should be paid £100,000 a week for kicking a ball around. pay them a normal decent wge like everyone else, then the law works. But that wont happen, so do we just let them do whatever they want?

If you shoplift once you might get a fine and nothing more. If you do it again, you might well expect to go to prison. Yet tevez can speed over and over with nothing ever more than a fine, terry broke the law on a weekly basis again with only a fine. As a repeat offender the punishment should increase like it does with other crimes, fine once, ban second time, imprison third time for example.

[Wildeybeast]

I think you both may be missing the issue that we are dealing with criminal offences here. You can't have different sentences for murder based on the persons profession. Equally you cannot have different fines available based on salary. I say again, the punishment should fit the crime, not the criminal. There are a range of punishments available for repeat offenders, including driving bans and jail if they continue to flout said bans. There is no need to change the penalty. The issue here is more that the law is perhaps not being applied in an entirely...'consistent' fashion.

[Wolfshade]

Same penalty, 90% of monthly income.

Also, penalties are different you only have to look at how car drivers are treated differently when they kill cyclists to how gun men kill people.

[Psychosplodge]

There are country's in Europe that do assess a persons income for things like motoring fines, to ensure it hurts. Can't remember if it's one of the Scandinavian ones or Switzerland. I don't think I'd be chuffed if I was on the receiving end, but then again if I was on £100k a week I'd pretty much park where I wanted because what's difference between a fiver to park or maybe £70 to park? it's still pocket change to you...

[Wolfshade]

A question was asked by the opposition in the House of Commons this morning along the lines of given Tevez's difficulty in reading should the theory test be available in more languages. The reply was short, that the UK has its theory test available in more languages than most of the rest of the world and that the Government is considering reducing the number of languages available as if they cannot read a test they may have difficulty understanding traffic signs.
Since spanish is the official and indeed de facto language and the test is availble in said language you have to wonder if his issue is not comprehending the test but comprehending the written form generally.

[Psychosplodge]

What's more questionable is if they are driving on a licence that doesn't meet the UK's standards for a test, which I'm assuming is why you can't do a straight swap after twelve months, why do we let them drive on it for twelve months?
Fair enough I can accept it would be inefficient to penalise visitors on these types of licence, but surely as soon as you take up residency in the UK if your licence isn't up to standard you should do our test?

[Wolfshade]

You should do yes but the issue is that the person with the licence must be caught driving for it to be imposed. Since there is nothing wrong with having a licence invalid in a certain country if you are not using it, similiarly, a lot of nationals end up living in London and may not have a car so they do not need a licence to drive.

[Wolfshade]

Both Finland and Denmark have fines levied based on income, the highest recorded is $200,000 back in 2002 (based on $11.5million salary)

Norway it is 10% of income plus 18 days in prison

[Wildeybeast]

Also, penalties are different you only have to look at how car drivers are treated differently when they kill cyclists to how gun men kill people.

Although it matters very little if you are the victim, the difference here is between negligence and deliberate actions. Though I agree sentences for death by dangerous driving should be increased.

As for Tevez not being able to read, I think that is more a BS excuse than anything else. I would be amazed if any judge believed it. If he had an official looking letter and didn't know the word 'constabulary' he could have just whacked it into google translate or asked one his many English speaking colleagues. More like he knew exactly what it was and didn't give a toss.

[Wolfshade]

It wasn't a cheque he wasn't interested

[Wildeybeast]

Ah money, the truly global language.

[Wolfshade]

I am unfortunately not fluent enough in it...

[Psychosplodge]

Aren't we all in need of more fluency considering our chosen hobby? :D

[Wolfshade]

Threadnomancy:

He's at it again!


Manchester City footballer Carlos Tevez has been arrested in Cheshire on suspicion of driving while disqualified, the BBC understands.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-21716343

[Denzark]

Trying not to write a comment about him and his compatriots that will get me an infraction...

[Wildeybeast]

I saw this at work and was wondering if someone would resurrect the thread. He's either colossally stupid or colossally arrogant. Hard to judge which.

[Denzark]

mix of both...

[Deadlift]

I can't ****ing stand most premier league footballers, most believe their own hype and behave like their **** dont stink. This is just another example of the arrogance of the premier league footballer who thinks the law doesn't apply to him.

We need more managers like Brian Clough from years ago, Fergies ok but the rest seem to treat the players like they are gold plated.

[Wolfshade]

I saw this at work and was wondering if someone would resurrect the thread. He's either colossally stupid or colossally arrogant. Hard to judge which.

Your humble servant, sir.


mix of both...


Ding ding! We have a winner!


I can't blooming stand most premier league footballers. Most believe their own hype and behave like their evacuations don't stink. This is just another example of the arrogance of the premier league footballer who thinks the law doesn't apply to him.

We need more managers like Brian Clough from years ago, Fergie's ok but the rest seem to treat the players like they are gold plated.

Yup, and it does make me think that they need a % penalty, or an escaltion of the charge since he is cleary undettered by the penalties levied against him.

Also, did you see: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21719322 ?

[Psychosplodge]

At what point are you earning enough to get away with it?

[Wolfshade]

When you earn more money reading the fine than the fine is

[Psychosplodge]

Yeah I suppose that could be one definition.

[Wolfshade]

Also heard in the office today

"Well you can be expected to be pulled over 2 or 3 times a year for driving without insurance, so if the total fines are less than your insurance than you are quids in, though you don't gain your no claim bonus that way..."

[Psychosplodge]

I think I'd get pulled more than that if I attempted it.
It's probably down to police density and distance from police stations.
I certainly think you'd get pulled more than that if you used motorways and major A-roads.

[Wolfshade]

I'm not so sure, Police don't like pulling people over on Motorways (as it is very dangerous to do so), I would imagine that city centre roads would be more. It's not worth it though.

[Psychosplodge]

I had a colleague who used to drive an uninsured/taxed/mot'd/and not registered to himself car. And he was forever pulling "police aware" stickers off it. As they used to see it parked up, obviously do some sort of check on it and stick this big pink or orange sticker on it, but never tow it. He'd just come along and pull the sticker off and off he'd go...

[Wildeybeast]

Did you not report him to the police? Given that he is clearly a very significant danger to the public, not to mention it's knobs like him that jack premiums up for the rest of us honest types I'd have gladly shopped him.

[Deadlift]

Not tempted to buy an old banger and drive into the side of his parked car ?

[Psychosplodge]

Did you not report him to the police?

I wish I had, but I don't know if I could have kept a straight face at work.

@DL, he'd have just abandoned it and got another, that's what he'd do when it broke...

[Wolfshade]

Melt it down and sell it for scrap!

Or strip the functional parts and have the ready for the next failure

[Wolfshade]

So from the latest arrest 7th March we have this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-22014002


Manchester City footballer Carlos Tevez has admitted driving while disqualified and without insurance.

Macclesfield magistrates heard Tevez has not yet got a UK driving licence, partly because he has struggled to pass the theory test which is in English.

He entered a guilty plea in his native Spanish with the aid of an interpreter.

Though as a Point of Interest

You can ask for a voiceover in one of 21 languages if:
your first language is not English
you can’t read or understand written English well

A voiceover lets you to hear the theory test instructions and questions through headphones. The questions will be read out to you automatically.

You can get voiceovers in:
Albanian
Arabic
Bengali
Cantonese
Dari
English
Farsi
Gujarati
Hindi
Kashmiri
Kurdish
Mirpuri
Polish
Portuguese
Punjabi
Pushto
Spanish
Tamil
Turkish
Urdu
Welsh

Not really much of an excuse....

[Mr Mystery]

No, but lets remember he does apparently kick a ball VERY well, which means all sins, including rape and that, are auto-forgiven. (not saying he's a rapist btw...just reminding that many footballers are...)

[Psychosplodge]

Don't most people caught driving while disqualified go inside for a bit?

[Wolfshade]

Not if you are famous...

[Mr Mystery]

250 hours of community service? Pathetic. Especially as it will no doubt be touring schools or some other soft stuff.

[Wildeybeast]

He's been in England for nearly 7 years, if he hasn't bothered to learn English properly in that time he has no one to blame but himself. What a knob.

[Wolfshade]

More over his excuse is pitful as you can get the theory test in many languages, including Spanish.

This came up in PMQs a little while back and it was asked of the prime minister if the DVLA could do more to help people who do not have English as their first language pass the test. The Prime Minister responded that Spanish, is available, and had been for a long time and that in the UK the driving test is available in more different languages than the majority of Europe.

[Wolfshade]

Woop Woop.

Foreign international star from Manchester City gets a driving ban....and this time it's not Tevez!

French international Samir Nasri was fined £2,100 and gave him a six-month ban after his car was clocked speeding three times.

Obviously speeding is a worse fine than driving while disqualified...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-22026447

[Wolfshade]

And then there were three...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-22123136

Manchester City defender Micah Richards has been banned from driving after failing to respond to speeding notices.

He was given six penalty points, putting him over the 12 point limit and triggering an automatic ban, and a £600 fine.

Apparently, he didn't get the notice as he was rennovating his house which affected the post...

[Psychosplodge]

oh those wacky footballers, what will they do next?

[Wildeybeast]

Affected.

[Wolfshade]

Affected.

Fixed :D

Thank you.

[Wildeybeast]

No worries. It's one the kids frequently get wrong and it bugs me that they have no idea why. That one and using 'of' rather than 'have' really annoy me for some reason.

[Wolfshade]

I completely understand where you are coming from. :)

My big bug bear is people using "due" as a preposition, and people not using "similiar to", "different from" and "compared with".

[Mr Mystery]

oh those wacky footballers, what will they do next?

I think we're overdue a 'just for fun' gang rape?

[Psychosplodge]

I'd like to think you're joking, but sadly you're probably right.

[Mr Mystery]

Indeed :(