Space Marines as Chaos Space Marines???

[warboss Grotgrim Dakaskab]

Hey all,
I am just wondering: As Space Marines became Chaos Space Marines, can ypu use normal SM in a CSM army, and if so is there a specific way to paint them???
tah to all
warboss Grotgrim Dakaskab
WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!

[Anggul]

No, the allies chart in the rulebook shows that Space Marines and Chaos Space Marines can never ally. They're bitter enemies who hate and despise each other eternally, so they can't ally.

[warboss Grotgrim Dakaskab]

No, i don't mean ally. I probably should have been more specific. Can you use marine models as CSM marine models, in a GW tourney, as recently corrupted CSM?

[fuzzbuket]

as long as the wargear is the same it should be fine. probably taking a knife to the aquillas would be a good idea too

[Aegwymourn]

First thing you will want to do is check with Tournament Organizer. We can give you all the advice we want but it ultimately falls to him/her if it will be allowed. I personally dont see why not if a little effort is put into converting them so it is clear to your opponent they are Chaos SM not imperial SM.

[Tynskel]

besides checking with a Tournament Organizer, check the fluff!

Knights of Blood and Relictors are excommunicated traitorous legions. However, they fight for the imperium!

Relictors even have a librarian that uses a Daemon Weapon.
To help out, you could use Main Rulebook psyker powers. You could also use squads that do not have mutations. The biggest problem you'll have, though, is the Chaos Boon Table.

[YorkNecromancer]

All marine bits are interchangable. As a result, of course you can. As has been noted, you'll need to get rid of the Imperial iconography, paint them an appropriate colour, and visibly make it obvious that they're now just baddies they're worse-ies, but otherwise it's fine.

Are you looking to save money by "recycling" Imperial models, or are you doing this as a modelling project? If it's a case of the former, all you really need are a few CSM bits mixed in, and you're pretty much sorted. I'd avoid trying to use something like GK models for Chaos, unless you fancy a really solid modelling project. Likewise any of the other Marine chapters (although Sanguinary Guard would probably make some nice Slaanesh elites, once you filed off all the aquilas...)

[Tynskel]

you don't need to get rid of the imperial iconography if you are using a excommunicated chapter that still fights for the imperium.

[L192837465]

First thing you will want to do is check with Tournament Organizer. We can give you all the advice we want but it ultimately falls to him/her if it will be allowed. I personally dont see why not if a little effort is put into converting them so it is clear to your opponent they are Chaos SM not imperial SM.

If your TO doesn't allow marines to be used as Chaos, you should probably find a better place to game.

[Xenith]

If your TO doesn't allow marines to be used as Chaos, you should probably find a better place to game.
Agreed.

There is no reason why you cannot use SM models in a CSM army, as long as they are appropriately equipped

[dwez]

I played at Warhammer World against a guy who had a Night Lords painted army who was using the Blood Angels Codex. When the event organiser came over it went a bit like this:
he saw his force and said "so your Night Lords, Chaos Space Marines?" looks at note pad to mark this off

Opponent: "No, I'm playing Blood Angel codex..."

Organiser: Looks confused "So why are you playing that codex?

Opponent: "Well, because I felt..."

Organiser: *under breath* "It was a better codex"

I giggled. Later on I found out the guy had a really low painting score because they weren't painted Blood Angels but other than that they had no problems with it. I did hear last weekend they pulled a mate of mine up on his flying bases. He'd sprayed one unit's bases white and one unit black to differentiate them but having applied paint they then weren't classed as fully painted so he had to remove them! Seems OTT to me, not a fan of that arbitrary ruling about what constitutes fully painted. you may as well have people getting points knocked off for using the stock green Necron rods or unpainted canopies of Storm Ravens and Vendettas, I digress...

[Kevlarshark]

All of my Nightlords are basically imperial models with a different paint job and a few conversions...taken them to 4 tournies (2 GW and 2 independant) no one has mentioned that they are not Chaos models. In fact I probably have more Warhammer Fantasy bits than actual chaos space marine components on them.

I didnt even remove the 'purity' seals on some of the tactical marine legs!

I guess they feel more evil if they dont go look too over the top spikes and skulls ect.

[yoruma]

I'm using my loyalist SM models as Chaos marines all the time, for two good reasons:

1) They're basically the same models. Only thing different is that the CSM ones have more "decorations" in the form of spikes and skulls.
2) I created fluff for them both by creating own chapter, which then split (happened before in 40k fluff, can't remember what chapter though).

And, to further drive my point that it's "legal" I've organized a 40k campaign here, ran couple of Dark Heresy and Black Crusade campaigns and Inquisitor games, all rotating around the "corruption of my chapter."

I guess my point is... As long as the models represent the thing they are supposed to be (Power Axe's are used as Power Axe's and Defilers are left home when playing as loyal) it's all fair and dandy. If you are trying to play Hormagaunt as a Dual-Thunderhammer Chapter Master...... yeaah... no.

[L192837465]

I giggled. Later on I found out the guy had a really low painting score because they weren't painted Blood Angels but other than that they had no problems with it. I did hear last weekend they pulled a mate of mine up on his flying bases. He'd sprayed one unit's bases white and one unit black to differentiate them but having applied paint they then weren't classed as fully painted so he had to remove them! Seems OTT to me, not a fan of that arbitrary ruling about what constitutes fully painted. you may as well have people getting points knocked off for using the stock green Necron rods or unpainted canopies of Storm Ravens and Vendettas, I digress...

Low paint score because his guys weren't painted GWs standard form of blood angel? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

[Kevlarshark]

I played at Warhammer World against a guy who had a Night Lords painted army who was using the Blood Angels Codex.

Weirdly in a recent tournie (before the new edition of Codex Chaos) I played a guy who was using Nightlords as counts as 'Blood Angels' in a similar fashion to the guy you encontered...I played him with my codex chaos Night Lords Army it was a weird game. Later in the Same tournie I encountered another player who was using Codex Space Wolves for Emperor's Children. This was a GW event, if Gw don't have a real problem with doing this then no one really has any grounds to disallow it.