And the good guy prize goes to.... Tyranids!

[Renegade]

Out of all the factions, one stands out.

Tau - Join us or die

Chaos - We will take everything

Eldar/Deldar - We are better than all of you

Imperium - This is all ours

Orks - We are the best

Necrons - We want your bodies

However....

Tyranids - We're hungry

Tyranids are no more bad or evil than the most basic of organisms, as they are not fighting a battle conquest, they are after lunch. Okay, so lunch takes the form of 'everything', but waste not, want not.

So in a galaxy full of 'grimdark', there is the faction that is just looking for the next meal, a blameless and natural act.

Thoughts?

[Kevin48220]

I have to agree with that--looking for lunch is totally reasonable. However, if they are not "bad or evil" for what they do, it would follow that it's also not necessarily "good", either. But, regardless, it's an understandable motivation.

As a side note, the way that the Imperium is thoughtlessly wiping out the habitats of these graceful creatures is positively criminal. This program of "exterminatus" is harmful to the environment and robs us of the legacy of these magnificent life forms. That's why I joined the "Adopt-a-Nid" program, and you should, too. For just microcredits a day, you can provide biomass for a tyranid. Each month, you'll receive an update about its growth, evolution, and the life forms it has murdered and consumed for the benefit of the hive. If you join up now, you'll get a plush version of the 'nid you adopt as a special gift.

But, on a more serious level, the need to feed is what makes the tyranids much scarier than most of the other xenos races in 40K. It's like dealing with zombies--you can't negotiate with them, you can't frighten them, and you can't make agreements with them. It's kill or be killed at all times, and they are designed almost exclusively as organic death machines. I've yet to face them on the battlefield, but I'm not looking forward to it.

[Kaiserdean]

Well, Orks are fun guys... (technically, fungi.)

[ElectricPaladin]

The fact that they are blameless doesn't really make them good. Hurricane Sandy wasn't "good," it just was. To be good, one must have the choice to do evil, but deny it. In that sense, everyone BUT the Tyranids is capable of being good, from the most battle-hardened Astartes to the most thoroughly indoctrinated Tau battlesuit commander. Only a few factions - I'd say Orks, most Necrons, and Tyranids - are incapable of making that choice. The history of 40k is peppered with individuals choosing good. When Commander Dante ordered a cease-fire with the Necrons to kill advancing Tyranids, that was good. When Vulkan He'Stan put his Salamanders in harms way to protect innocent civilians, that was good. That's good.

"I'm hungry" is not good. It isn't bad, but it isn't good.

[imperialpower]

Each race is the same, you forge an empire to feed your people and to protect future generations with stability in an enviroment dominated by a single culture, the way I see it tyranids are no different from any other race each is trying to ensure the survival of their species by the means at their disposal.

[Mr Mystery]

Necrons.

It's our galaxy. It always has been. And what happens when our back is turned and we have a quick snooze?

You all go and bugger it all up. Tears in the fabric of reality, stagnation and regression of technology.

Damned kids! Get off our lawn!

[Anggul]

Necrons.

It's our galaxy. It always has been. And what happens when our back is turned and we have a quick snooze?

You all go and bugger it all up. Tears in the fabric of reality, stagnation and regression of technology.

Damned kids! Get off our lawn!

Quiet you, it doesn't even make sense that such a low-population species could control the galaxy, there couldn't have been enough Necrontyr in existence. :P

[Mr Mystery]

Quiet you, it doesn't even make sense that such a low-population species could control the galaxy, there couldn't have been enough Necrontyr in existence. :P

Even with low numbers, we kicked everyone's arse!

And now we don't die! Unlike the pansy Eldars!

[Psyfer]

Now now grandpa, don't get too excited, remember what happened last time?

That's right, you signed that 'too good to be true' deal with those C'tan *insert Necrontyr expletive here*...

:P

[Learn2Eel]

Law of nature. The strong kill/eat the weak. The Tyranids exemplify this. Nothing evil about what they do.

Except that very evil sounding voice in Dawn of War 2: Retribution.....

[Mr Mystery]

Now now grandpa, don't get too excited, remember what happened last time?

That's right, you signed that 'too good to be true' deal with those C'tan *insert Necrontyr expletive here*...

:P

Then beat the snot out of them too. What's your point? We slew our Gods, and they actually existed in this plane!

Necrons. You're dead mate. We have all eternity to ensure it!

[Kevin48220]

Quiet you, it doesn't even make sense that such a low-population species could control the galaxy, there couldn't have been enough Necrontyr in existence. :P

They sure did control the galaxy, young man, and the Warp was uphill both ways back then.

[Mr Mystery]

Ppfffrtt.

Real men don't use the Warp.

We fold space.

[Wildeybeast]

The whole 'Tyranids are just hungry' idea falls down on the fact that they have sentience. Genestealers and Lictors operating beyond control of the Hive Mind make choices. They don't simply murder every living thing they come across and act purely on instinctive behaviour. Genestealer broods make plans. The Swarmlord has, for want of a better term, a personality. And the Hive Mind itself clearly makes choices for the good of the Hive. Whilst the wee beasties are just dumb animals acting on instinct or the commands of the swarm, Tyranids as a 'race' are not. As soon as you start making choices, you are held accountable for them. They are moral agents and so cannot be absolved of blame. Their desires and motivations are very simple (namely the propagation of their own existence at the expense of all other living things) but no more so than say Chaos (we want to destroy the Imperium) or Orks (we like punching things). The Tyranids are very much evil.

[Mr Mystery]

Nids could be said to be the ultimate expression of 'just following orders'

As for outright evil? Has to be Dark Eldar. Sure some of what they do is survival, but they take a perverse joy in their acts, seeking to ensure they are as cruel and malicious as possible. Not because some God demands it, but because they genuinely get off on it!

[Emerald Rose Widow]

The whole 'Tyranids are just hungry' idea falls down on the fact that they have sentience. Genestealers and Lictors operating beyond control of the Hive Mind make choices. They don't simply murder every living thing they come across and act purely on instinctive behaviour. Genestealer broods make plans. The Swarmlord has, for want of a better term, a personality. And the Hive Mind itself clearly makes choices for the good of the Hive. Whilst the wee beasties are just dumb animals acting on instinct or the commands of the swarm, Tyranids as a 'race' are not. As soon as you start making choices, you are held accountable for them. They are moral agents and so cannot be absolved of blame. Their desires and motivations are very simple (namely the propagation of their own existence at the expense of all other living things) but no more so than say Chaos (we want to destroy the Imperium) or Orks (we like punching things). The Tyranids are very much evil.

I think this pretty much covers it, the little guys are fine if you wanna talk good vs evil, because most of them just do what the hive mind says. There are many sentient creatures in the tyranid, the synapse creatures as a whole need to be able to think and direct the monsters under them as well. Any synapse creature has a very strong intelligence, the hive mind doesn't just control everything like micromanaging, the hive mind puts orders out there and the sentient beasties pass on the information, and firgure out how to do them. This is done through the Norn Queens, down to the Hive Tyrants, down to the other synapsers like tervigons and warriors, zoanthropes, and the like.

[BatMarine]

As for outright evil? Has to be Dark Eldar. Sure some of what they do is survival, but they take a perverse joy in their acts, seeking to ensure they are as cruel and malicious as possible. Not because some God demands it, but because they genuinely get off on it!

Well actually, the more cruel they are about it the more sustaining it is, so yeah they get off on it, just like anyone who gets an excellent meal! It's still a decision made for sustenance.

[Mr Mystery]

Well actually, the more cruel they are about it the more sustaining it is, so yeah they get off on it, just like anyone who gets an excellent meal! It's still a decision made for sustenance.

They can take the soul without the suffering....but they do prefer to add flavour. Goes beyond necessity!

[Learn2Eel]

The whole 'Tyranids are just hungry' idea falls down on the fact that they have sentience. Genestealers and Lictors operating beyond control of the Hive Mind make choices. They don't simply murder every living thing they come across and act purely on instinctive behaviour. Genestealer broods make plans. The Swarmlord has, for want of a better term, a personality. And the Hive Mind itself clearly makes choices for the good of the Hive. Whilst the wee beasties are just dumb animals acting on instinct or the commands of the swarm, Tyranids as a 'race' are not. As soon as you start making choices, you are held accountable for them. They are moral agents and so cannot be absolved of blame. Their desires and motivations are very simple (namely the propagation of their own existence at the expense of all other living things) but no more so than say Chaos (we want to destroy the Imperium) or Orks (we like punching things). The Tyranids are very much evil.

Tyranids consume because they are hyper-evolved predators. Lictors, Genestealers and other 'sentient' beings do what they do so that worlds can be consumed. They are merely following the will of the Hive Mind, and that is to feed and grow - the simplest and most basic innate desires of any creature. A lion has evolved to match its environment and survive. A Lictor is grown to disrupt enemy communications, supply lines and assassinate key targets. New Tyranids are spawned not of any 'will' but as a natural response so that they adapt to their environment - each Hive Fleet does this independently and at an alarming rate. An analogy; humans have evolved to prey on other species, though over the process of millions of years. As hunters, we follow a pack leader that directs and organizes the many different cogs of the pack. A Tyranid synapse creature is no different; it directs those around it with the stated goal of claiming the kill, and feeding. Tyranids merely evolve over the process of months, not millions of years.

Tyranids don't have the stated goal of killing everything. They want to feed and grow, just like humans do at their most fundamental level, even though it means they will wipe out all other life in the process. There is a major difference when discussing the very black and white concept of good or evil.

A Lictor or Genestealer makes choices because it was evolved to do so as to increase the chances of a successful 'hunt', not because it consciously decides the morally 'right' or 'wrong' course of action. Tyranids likely have no concept of 'morality'. Just because a being has intelligence does not mean it understands anything more than 'feeding'.
The only real possible exception is the Swarmlord. But even then, it is still dominated by the will to 'feed'.

Your example with Chaos Space Marines and Orks is also quite a stretch. Chaos Space Marines chose to commit their actions. A Tyranid has no choice, does not understand the concept of 'good' or 'evil', and is merely birthed so that the species can survive. As stated, 'sentient' Tyranids can only perceive the hunt - there is literally nothing else to them. A Warrior only knows to direct others of its kind and fight viciously. It literally knows nothing else. Orks aren't even really evil, when you think about it. They just want to fight. That isn't 'evil' in any sense of the word. Going off that logic, and this also applies to Tyranids, is a shark evil because it kills and eats others in horrifying attacks? Orks are naturally tough - that is either a result of their constant fighting or the cause. In either case, like Tyranids, they have merely evolved to match their environment.

That is just the way I see it anyway. I think you are assuming that just because Lictors/Genestealers/Synapse creatures can make the equivalent of "choices" that they understand the consequences and thus can be held accountable. A Hive Tyrant is evolved to direct other parts of the swarm and react to opposition tactics. It doesn't want to, it doesn't think about it. It just 'does', because it was created to do so. Tyranids have no free will outside of reacting and adapting to their prey. The Swarmlord is unique in that it can act independently of the will of the Hive Mind, but that is only so that it can develop its own means of consuming its prey.

[Diagnosis Ninja]

Well, Orks are fun guys... (technically, fungi.)
Just like us at our workplace: Kept in the dark (about everything) and fed ****.

[Wildeybeast]

Tyranids consume because they are hyper-evolved predators. Lictors, Genestealers and other 'sentient' beings do what they do so that worlds can be consumed. They are merely following the will of the Hive Mind, and that is to feed and grow - the simplest and most basic innate desires of any creature. A lion has evolved to match its environment and survive. A Lictor is grown to disrupt enemy communications, supply lines and assassinate key targets. New Tyranids are spawned not of any 'will' but as a natural response so that they adapt to their environment - each Hive Fleet does this independently and at an alarming rate. An analogy; humans have evolved to prey on other species, though over the process of millions of years. As hunters, we follow a pack leader that directs and organizes the many different cogs of the pack. A Tyranid synapse creature is no different; it directs those around it with the stated goal of claiming the kill, and feeding. Tyranids merely evolve over the process of months, not millions of years.

Tyranids don't have the stated goal of killing everything. They want to feed and grow, just like humans do at their most fundamental level, even though it means they will wipe out all other life in the process. There is a major difference when discussing the very black and white concept of good or evil.

A Lictor or Genestealer makes choices because it was evolved to do so as to increase the chances of a successful 'hunt', not because it consciously decides the morally 'right' or 'wrong' course of action. Tyranids likely have no concept of 'morality'. Just because a being has intelligence does not mean it understands anything more than 'feeding'.
The only real possible exception is the Swarmlord. But even then, it is still dominated by the will to 'feed'.

Your example with Chaos Space Marines and Orks is also quite a stretch. Chaos Space Marines chose to commit their actions. A Tyranid has no choice, does not understand the concept of 'good' or 'evil', and is merely birthed so that the species can survive. As stated, 'sentient' Tyranids can only perceive the hunt - there is literally nothing else to them. A Warrior only knows to direct others of its kind and fight viciously. It literally knows nothing else. Orks aren't even really evil, when you think about it. They just want to fight. That isn't 'evil' in any sense of the word. Going off that logic, and this also applies to Tyranids, is a shark evil because it kills and eats others in horrifying attacks? Orks are naturally tough - that is either a result of their constant fighting or the cause. In either case, like Tyranids, they have merely evolved to match their environment.

That is just the way I see it anyway. I think you are assuming that just because Lictors/Genestealers/Synapse creatures can make the equivalent of "choices" that they understand the consequences and thus can be held accountable. A Hive Tyrant is evolved to direct other parts of the swarm and react to opposition tactics. It doesn't want to, it doesn't think about it. It just 'does', because it was created to do so. Tyranids have no free will outside of reacting and adapting to their prey. The Swarmlord is unique in that it can act independently of the will of the Hive Mind, but that is only so that it can develop its own means of consuming its prey.

Some interesting points. The idea of things which can make choices but have no conception of the consequences of them or indeed any sense of right and wrong isn't something which really comes up in moral philosophy. Animals don't make choices, they act on instinctive behaviour and whilst children might not fully understand the implications of their actions, they do have a basic sense of morality.

The problem comes for me in two areas; stealers and the Hive Mind. When out of synapse control, stealers don't revert to instinctive behaviour and hide or run around munching stuff like the little gribblies. They make conscious choices and act in a very 'human' fashion. Whilst their biological urges are always their over riding goal, they are no different to you in that. We have evolved to be able to control those desires and make choices about how and when we fulfil them. Stealers are no different. Whilst they may not have a sense of morality in the same way we do, they understand the consequences of their actions. They understand that acting like a predator and simply eating when hungry will have negative repercussions. It goes beyond simply being selective of your prey (as their prey is everything). They understand how the prey behaves and are capable of reacting to that and even controlling and manipulating that for their long term benefit. Personally I don't see how you can have a creature which makes active choices understanding the consequences of them and yet is not morally responsible for their actions. I see stealers as amoral in that they are completely incapable of caring about the consequences of their actions. This does not make them free from blame though.

The hive mind is another matter though. Whilst it has the over riding goal of propagating it's species, it's the way it goes about that which is troubling. It isn't necessary for it to consume all available biomass it comes across, since most of that is wasted fighting said biomass. It isn't actually necessary for it to consume any biomass - they could simply create happy little worker drones and then recycle them when they die without the need to collect any further biomass. It doesn't have to grow, it could just exist without being a threat to any other species, which would probably be better for it's long term survival. The question is whether the Hive Mind understands this. If it does and has made a conscious choice that eating other things is the best course of action for its survival, then it is evil. If it has simply evolved down this route and is incapable of understanding any other way of fulfilling its innate survival desire then it's probably fair to say it is morally neutral. it's hard to know one way or the other really. I find it highly unlikely that any species would evolve naturally to the point where it's existence is dependent on the destruction of all other life forms since that would ultimately destroy them once they have consumed all available resources. Evolution is about adaptation. Then again, why would you make a conscious choice that your best long term survival plan was to kill everything else since you still end up with the same problem? It is all very puzzling and I think we are falling into the trap of trying to apply real world rationale to a sci-fi universe.

[Anakzar]

Orks were genetically engineered as a fighting race according to the older fluff. They were programed with the tech Knowhow to build weapons ect to fight with. It was not explained who built them but given their basic shape and culture, such as it is its not a stretch to believe they were a weapon that got away from their human creators back in the dawn if time...

Tyranids are basically a race that uses bio-tech as humans use machines.... were they a hive mind before or after merging with their tech? Some of the older fluff was speculating wether the warrior or the termagant was the original species.

[imperialpower]

I thought the Orks were made by the grots to protect them but then siezed power for themselves and the grots then de-evolved as time went by under the control of the Orks? I am sure I read that.

[Learn2Eel]

That was what I was getting at. As much as Synapse creatures seem not to be acting under instinct, the way I see Tyranids is that everything is conforming to the natural instincts of the collective whole - but rather than sating natural survival instincts of their own forms, they are sating the instincts of the species itself. Synapse creatures provide direction for the others so that they do not revert to their own basic desires, but I don't think synapse creatures understand anything more than the will to hunt. The idea that something can make a choice and have no idea of the consequences isn't considered because humans are implanted or born with a natural perception of morality - it is hard for us to understand anything that is different, and this idea might be a stretch but I think it is valid when concerning Tyranids.

A Genestealer has no choice - it must follow the over-riding will of the Tyranid species. Their 'reaction' to changing circumstances is largely the same as actual Hive Fleets themselves - evolve and adapt. Hive Fleets - despite being living organisms - do not consciously change themselves to complete their stated goal. They evolve as a natural response, like many Tyranids are capable of. Perhaps they are amoral creatures, but I simply don't believe they - or indeed any Tyranid - can understand consequences or repercussions beyond the over-riding goal of the hunt. All Tyranids are created with a purpose, which regardless of whether they devolve into instinctual behaviour (which has also been engineered as a natural response when synapse creatures are slain) still dominates their existence. A Genestealer is designed to do what it was made for - if it fails, the Hive Fleets evolve and adapt new sub-species, or the Genestealers themselves evolve rapidly. Considering that all Tyranids are not 'born' and are rather engineered, my perspective is that they know nothing more than what is necessary - would the Hive Mind consciously create creatures that could understand morally positive or negative actions? Personally, I don't think so - remember that Tyranids can evolve in incredible and unlikely ways when left unchecked. Hive Fleets aren't known for engineering weak or unworthy bio-forms - if they understood the concept, but didn't care, then that would be the other logical conclusion.

I think you hit the nail on the head. My theory is the cliche that "aliens are unknowable" - or, to be more precise, we will not always be able to apply human logic or human rationale to other species, whatever their origin. Whilst we can understand the creatures on earth to some degree, as soon as one starts involving themselves in the infinite possibilities lying beyond our atmosphere, it simply becomes too confusing. If we ever encountered an alien species, would we be able to understand them; their motives, their mental capacity, their sense of morality, their perceptions, et al? Ultimately, that is what I think of Tyranids. My impression of them is that they have merely evolved as the ultimate predators, and are similar to certain species. The Hive Mind is in reality just a metaphor for the idea of a collective consciousness. The Tyranids consume all in their path, likely as a survival instinct - why else do they consume everything? In that sense, Tyranids could be feasibly compared to a species such as ants - now, whilst ants adopt an equilibrium with other species and their natural environment, the key difference is that the Tyranids evolved to dominate and consume everything.

[Tepogue]

I thought the Orks were made by the grots to protect them but then siezed power for themselves and the grots then de-evolved as time went by under the control of the Orks? I am sure I read that.

Snotlings known as Brainboyz, had extremely advanced knowledge as long as they ate "Brain Fungus" The Brainboyz then genetically engineered their whole race. Gretchen as slave labor, Orks as a Warrior caste. Special boyz - Docs and Meks which come with inborn knowledge. Throw in the whole fungus spore reproductive system and Orks can survive anywhere.

But apparenlty - there was an accident/revolution and the Brain Fungus was destroyed. Brainboyz reverted to childlike Snotlings and Orks rose to power.

So no real evil, just sicience gone wrong.

[Wildeybeast]

That was what I was getting at. As much as Synapse creatures seem not to be acting under instinct, the way I see Tyranids is that everything is conforming to the natural instincts of the collective whole - but rather than sating natural survival instincts of their own forms, they are sating the instincts of the species itself. Synapse creatures provide direction for the others so that they do not revert to their own basic desires, but I don't think synapse creatures understand anything more than the will to hunt. The idea that something can make a choice and have no idea of the consequences isn't considered because humans are implanted or born with a natural perception of morality - it is hard for us to understand anything that is different, and this idea might be a stretch but I think it is valid when concerning Tyranids.

A Genestealer has no choice - it must follow the over-riding will of the Tyranid species. Their 'reaction' to changing circumstances is largely the same as actual Hive Fleets themselves - evolve and adapt. Hive Fleets - despite being living organisms - do not consciously change themselves to complete their stated goal. They evolve as a natural response, like many Tyranids are capable of. Perhaps they are amoral creatures, but I simply don't believe they - or indeed any Tyranid - can understand consequences or repercussions beyond the over-riding goal of the hunt. All Tyranids are created with a purpose, which regardless of whether they devolve into instinctual behaviour (which has also been engineered as a natural response when synapse creatures are slain) still dominates their existence. A Genestealer is designed to do what it was made for - if it fails, the Hive Fleets evolve and adapt new sub-species, or the Genestealers themselves evolve rapidly. Considering that all Tyranids are not 'born' and are rather engineered, my perspective is that they know nothing more than what is necessary - would the Hive Mind consciously create creatures that could understand morally positive or negative actions? Personally, I don't think so - remember that Tyranids can evolve in incredible and unlikely ways when left unchecked. Hive Fleets aren't known for engineering weak or unworthy bio-forms - if they understood the concept, but didn't care, then that would be the other logical conclusion.

I think you hit the nail on the head. My theory is the cliche that "aliens are unknowable" - or, to be more precise, we will not always be able to apply human logic or human rationale to other species, whatever their origin. Whilst we can understand the creatures on earth to some degree, as soon as one starts involving themselves in the infinite possibilities lying beyond our atmosphere, it simply becomes too confusing. If we ever encountered an alien species, would we be able to understand them; their motives, their mental capacity, their sense of morality, their perceptions, et al? Ultimately, that is what I think of Tyranids. My impression of them is that they have merely evolved as the ultimate predators, and are similar to certain species. The Hive Mind is in reality just a metaphor for the idea of a collective consciousness. The Tyranids consume all in their path, likely as a survival instinct - why else do they consume everything? In that sense, Tyranids could be feasibly compared to a species such as ants - now, whilst ants adopt an equilibrium with other species and their natural environment, the key difference is that the Tyranids evolved to dominate and consume everything.

Fair points. I suppose the key is free will. Whilst stealers and the Hive Mind recognise the suffering they inflict on others and they do make choices on micro level, do they have any choice on a macro level? Can they do anything other than follow the overriding goal of eating everything? I guess we'll never know.


Snotlings known as Brainboyz, had extremely advanced knowledge as long as they ate "Brain Fungus" The Brainboyz then genetically engineered their whole race. Gretchen as slave labor, Orks as a Warrior caste. Special boyz - Docs and Meks which come with inborn knowledge. Throw in the whole fungus spore reproductive system and Orks can survive anywhere.

But apparenlty - there was an accident/revolution and the Brain Fungus was destroyed. Brainboyz reverted to childlike Snotlings and Orks rose to power.

So no real evil, just sicience gone wrong.


Hang on, the snotlings deliberately genetically engineered a race whose overriding goal is punching stuff and you say no evil? I say very much evil in that case.

[imperialpower]

@Tepogue, thought I had read somthing like that at some point.

If the snotlings created a race to protect themselves then there would be no point in making a race of flower picking hippies, it makes sence that they would engineer an agressive species to defend their weaker species.

[Wildeybeast]

@Tepogue, thought I had read somthing like that at some point.

If the snotlings created a race to protect themselves then there would be no point in making a race of flower picking hippies, it makes sence that they would engineer an agressive species to defend their weaker species.

In that case they could have created a race which is violent only when provoked, rather than one which is overtly aggressive. They created a race of galactic domination, they just went overboard and made them so aggressive they fight each other as much as everyone else. Evil. Cack handedly executed evil, but still evil.

[imperialpower]

Well the best way to protect your own species is to wipe out the competition, I suppose the arguement would be that evil is only an opinion, if a race of space cows came to visit humans I would imagine they would think our species to be evil (thot that eating beef is the worst man kind has to offer).

[Wildeybeast]

Well the best way to protect your own species is to wipe out the competition, I suppose the arguement would be that evil is only an opinion, if a race of space cows came to visit humans I would imagine they would think our species to be evil (thot that eating beef is the worst man kind has to offer).

Possibly, though we don't try to wipe out cows. We actively breed them to eat. Orks would wipe out all life were it not for the fact that they fight each other all the time.

[imperialpower]

Possibly, though we don't try to wipe out cows. We actively breed them to eat. Orks would wipe out all life were it not for the fact that they fight each other all the time.

In your opinion to wipe out all life is evil where as the Orks would not see it as evil at all it is only your Human perspective that makes it evil, not forgetting that Humans have wiped out many species on this planet and continue to do so yet we do not see ourselves as evil.

[Wildeybeast]

In your opinion to wipe out all life is evil where as the Orks would not see it as evil at all it is only your Human perspective that makes it evil, not forgetting that Humans have wiped out many species on this planet and continue to do so yet we do not see ourselves as evil.

I'd probably say we were evil in that regard. Since we as humans are the ones making the moral judgements, by our standards, Orks are evil. If we follow your train of thought then none of the races in 40k are evil.

[imperialpower]

I'd probably say we were evil in that regard. Since we as humans are the ones making the moral judgements, by our standards, Orks are evil. If we follow your train of thought then none of the races in 40k are evil.

Yes like I said being evil is a matter of opionion so you could say that none of the races in 40k are evil or you could say all of them are the fact is that a species or a different culture of the same species would not concider what they are doing as evil it would only be others with different morals that would.

[Wildeybeast]

Yes like I said being evil is a matter of opionion so you could say that none of the races in 40k are evil or you could say all of them are the fact is that a species or a different culture of the same species would not concider what they are doing as evil it would only be others with different morals that would.

Just because the people doing it don't consider it evil doesn't mean it isn't. Was slavery fine because white Europeans thought it was fine?

[imperialpower]

Just because the people doing it don't consider it evil doesn't mean it isn't. Was slavery fine because white Europeans thought it was fine?

So in your opinion slavery is evil just becuase you think it is does not mean that it is evil, it is your opinion, if slavery is acceptable in a culture who are you to say that the culutre is wrong or evil? You have been brought up with certain morals those morals will differ from one culutre or species in your view slavery is evil from the slavers perspective it is not.