Regarding Grenades

[herigonz]

Hey guys,

I am at work and was thinking about a list over lunch and had some questions.

1. Say you have an independent character with Assault Grenades in a unit that doesn't have them. If they were to assault into cover, would the whole squad gain the benefit, only the IC, or none of them?

2. How about vice versa where you might have a unit of Plague Marines with Blight Grenades joined by a Lord (with no Blight Grenades). When assaulted does it mean everybody benefits? In this case I would imagine so.

3. I also am not completely sure but wonder if two units were to charge a single unit of Plague Marines, would the Blight Grenades go off against both? Just the first? My inclination is that only the first unit is affected.

Thanks for any clarification on the issue.

[Nabterayl]

Hey guys,

I am at work and was thinking about a list over lunch and had some questions.

1. Say you have an independent character with Assault Grenades in a unit that doesn't have them. If they were to assault into cover, would the whole squad gain the benefit, only the IC, or none of them?
Assault grenades only require that one model in the unit have them, so the entire unit would gain the benefit.


2. How about vice versa where you might have a unit of Plague Marines with Blight Grenades joined by a Lord (with no Blight Grenades). When assaulted does it mean everybody benefits? In this case I would imagine so.
Defensive grenades also only require that a single model in the unit have them, so the entire unit would gain the benefit.


3. I also am not completely sure but wonder if two units were to charge a single unit of Plague Marines, would the Blight Grenades go off against both? Just the first? My inclination is that only the first unit is affected.

Thanks for any clarification on the issue.
As I recall, defensive grenades require that you not be locked in combat, so only the first unit would suffer the effects. Similar to Overwatch, which would only be suffered by the first unit charging.

[DarkLink]

Assault grenades only benefit the model.

Defensive grenades always work, because the assaulters (all of them) are assaulting a model with the grenades and thus lose their attack bonus, regardless of whether other models are also being assaulted or not.

[Nabterayl]

Wow, did I miss that? Tell me that's an edition change, at least.

EDIT: Okay, it isn't an edition change. I guess I'm just lame that way :P So yeah, assault grenades benefit the model only.

[Paul]

Similar to Overwatch, which would only be suffered by the first unit charging.

Unless the first unit charging is an empty chariot, in which case you are still not locked even though it charged first.

[Houghten]

Unless the first unit charging is an empty chariot, in which case you are still not locked even though it charged first.

Uh, no. You can only fire Overwatch at one target per turn. It doesn't have to be the first one, either - while you can't fire Overwatch if you're locked in combat, you're not locked in until the fight sub-phase begins.

[herigonz]

In general all those explanations make sense (RAI), but I've come across times in the past where it wasn't the case. Thanks for the clarifications!

[Anggul]

Uh, no. You can only fire Overwatch at one target per turn. It doesn't have to be the first one, either - while you can't fire Overwatch if you're locked in combat, you're not locked in until the fight sub-phase begins.

Nope, the only way to fire Overwatch at something other than the first thing to charge you is if they fail their charge.

[Nabterayl]

Anggul's right on that point. The rulebook defines being locked in combat as "hav one or more models in base contact with enemies" (p23). Nothing says that only happens during the Fight sub-phase.

Indeed, contrast this with the phrase, "locked in combat from a previous turn," which is used of defensive grenades, but not of Our Weapons are Useless (p26), Disallowed Sweeping Advances (p27), Counter-Attack (p35), Moral Support (p65), and so forth.

So though you don't have to fire Overwatch at the [i]first enemy to charge you, Anggul is right that the very first enemy to actually reach you prevents you from firing Overwatch.

On the other hand, you can lob defensive grenades at multiple enemy units charging you in the same phase, because we only ask if you were locked in combat last turn.

So to re-answer your questions correctly:

Assault grenades benefit only the model carrying them.
Defensive grenades benefit the entire unit.
Defensive grenades work against all units charging you in a given phase, as long as you were not locked in combat to begin with.

[Houghten]

Nope, the only way to fire Overwatch at something other than the first thing to charge you is if they fail their charge.

I thought of that interpretation and then decided it was silly.