Inquisitorial Allies for Exorcists? (There's an 1850 Exorcists + IG list in here!)

[ElectricPaladin]

I think it might be fun (and fluffy!) to add a detachment of inquisitors as allies for my Exorcists. For those who don't know about the Exorcists (a rare and largely unsupported Forgeworld chapter), the Exorcists are potentially descended from the Grey Knights (and, therefore, the Emperor himself) and have close ties to the Ordo Malleus of the Inquisition, which may have been influential in the decision to found the Exorcists in the first place.

My initial thought was to use the Grey Knights codex. The options for an Ordo Malleus Inquisitor and squad of henchmen were awesome. Daemonhosts! Psykers shooting huge blasts of death! Awesomeness all around!

The only problem was that all that fits in an HQ choice... and I still need to fill that required Troops choice. Grey Knights troops are 1) expensive and 2) not fluffy at all. I want the Inquisition, not actual Grey Knights!

Ok, so, I checked around for a second option.

Looking at my IG codex, I realized that I could field the following and get a pretty similar effect:

HQ
• Primaris Psyker

Elites
• Psyker Battle Squad w/9 Extra Psykers
° Chimera w/Heavy Bolter and Heavy Flamer

Troops
• Veteran Squad
° Chimera w/Heavy Bolter and Multilaser

With this, I get two heavy bolters, two tanks to soak up anti-tank fire (I like to field a mechanized force). I chose heavy flamers on the first Chimera because with the 24'' range of most psychic powers that chimera is going to be getting pretty close to the enemy. On the second, I chose a heavy bolter and multilaser because that chimera is more likely to hang back and use the scoring bodies inside to claim backfield and midfield objectves (with the chimera acting as mobile terrain/giant turret to screen the troops and shoot at the enemy)

One example of a total list (1850 - what usually gets played at my FLGS) would look like this:

HQ
• Captain Silas Alberec

Elites
• 5 Assault Terminators w/Hammers
° Land Raider Crusader
• 5 Tactical Terminators (1 Assault Cannon, 1 Heavy Flamer, 1 Cyclonic Missile Launcher)

Troops
• 10 Tactical Marines (1 Meltagun, 1 Multi-Melta), Sergeant w/Power Weapon
° Rhino w/Dozer Blade
• 10 Tactical Marines (1 Plasma Gun, 1 Plasma Cannon), Sergeant w/Power Weapon
° Rhino w/Dozer Blade

Fast Attack
• Stormtalon w/Lascanons

Allied HQ
• Primaris Psyker

Allied Elites
• Psyker Battle Squad w/9 Extra Psykers
° Chimera w/Heavy Bolter and Heavy Flamer

Allied Troops
• Veteran Squad
° Chimera w/Heavy Bolter and Multilaser

Captain Alberec hangs out with the assault terminators and charges down the enemy's throat, backed up by the Ordo Malleus Inquisitor (primaris psyker), his assistant (overseer), and bound daemonhosts (battle psykers). The rhino tacs and Inquisitorial storm troopers (veterans) manuever, claim objectives, and try to make a nuisance of themselves. The stormtalon gets into dogfights with enemy fliers or harasses my enemy's hapless ground forces if he hasn't got any. The tactical termies are here to take advantage of Captain Alberec's inbuilt teleport homer, which should allow me to place them exactly where I want them to soften up enemy targets before Alberec and his buddies charge into combat, or to screen Alberec after the combat is over.

I think these models would be really fun to make. I would probably just kidnap GW's daemonhosts, but since there are only three official variants, I'd get to do a lot of awesome gribbly conversions. There are also lots of neat models and conversion possibilities for the "Inquisitor" and his "assistant."

The questions I have are this:

1) Do you think most people would accept these counts-as choices, or laugh me out of the store?

2) I like to build lists that are fluffy and fun to play, but I also like to win. Has this list got some cool, or is it doomed to die painfully?

[TB0N3]

I like the idea of usign IG as Inquisitorial allies. In my area, most peopl accepts the count-as as long as it's clear who-is-who
However, you can take GK using Coteaz as your second HQ. The Henchmen squads become troops under him, and you can convert/scrachbuild/kitbash you own inquisitor (as long a he carries a hammer)

[Nabterayl]

However, you can take GK using Coteaz as your second HQ. The Henchmen squads become troops under him, and you can convert/scrachbuild/kitbash you own inquisitor (as long a he carries a hammer)
I was going to suggest that too. Having However, your IG idea has its merits too - not least of which, in my mind, is that your Exorcists and their Inquisitorial allies will be Battle Brothers rather than Allies of Convenience. Not a big tactical decision, maybe, but it's fluffier. And I think those counts-as are quite reasonable.

I think the list you outline looks reasonable, though I'm not sure how you got all those special weapons on a terminator squad. Did I forget something about Alberec?

[ElectricPaladin]

However, you can take GK using Coteaz as your second HQ. The Henchmen squads become troops under him, and you can convert/scrachbuild/kitbash you own inquisitor (as long a he carries a hammer).


I will totally have to check that out. I missed that special rule. I also agree that converscratchbashing my personal inquisitor so I can field him as either Coteaz or primaris psyker adds lots of fun flexibility.



I was going to suggest that too. Having However, your IG idea has its merits too - not least of which, in my mind, is that your Exorcists and their Inquisitorial allies will be Battle Brothers rather than Allies of Convenience. Not a big tactical decision, maybe, but it's fluffier. And I think those counts-as are quite reasonable.


As mentioned earlier, I'll get a model that can go either way.



I think the list you outline looks reasonable, though I'm not sure how you got all those special weapons on a terminator squad. Did I forget something about Alberec?


Unless I've been reading the rules wrong for a while, you can field up to one of each special weapon (and as many chainfists as you like) per 5 members in the tactical terminator squad. So, 5 tactical terminators + spending some extra points = 1 assault cannon, 1 flamer, 1 cyclonic missile launcher (and one normal guy, and the sergeant).

[Nabterayl]

Unless I've been reading the rules wrong for a while, you can field up to one of each special weapon (and as many chainfists as you like) per 5 members in the tactical terminator squad. So, 5 tactical terminators + spending some extra points = 1 assault cannon, 1 flamer, 1 cyclonic missile launcher (and one normal guy, and the sergeant).
You have been, then. "For every five models in the squad, one Terminator may choose one of the following options" means that for every five models in the squad, you may have one of the following options. It does not mean that for every five models in the squad, one terminator can choose an assault cannon, and one terminator can choose a heavy flamer, and one terminator can choose a cyclone missile launcher.

Cf. tactical squads, which also have options structured as "if X, one <model> may <choose from the following list>." A ten-man tactical squad does not let one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a flamer, one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a meltagun, one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a plasma gun, one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a heavy bolter, etc.

[ElectricPaladin]

You have been, then. "For every five models in the squad, one Terminator may choose one of the following options" means that for every five models in the squad, you may have one of the following options. It does not mean that for every five models in the squad, one terminator can choose an assault cannon, and one terminator can choose a heavy flamer, and one terminator can choose a cyclone missile launcher.

Cf. tactical squads, which also have options structured as "if X, one <model> may <choose from the following list>." A ten-man tactical squad does not let one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a flamer, one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a meltagun, one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a plasma gun, one Space Marine replace his boltgun with a heavy bolter, etc.

Holy sh*t. You're right.

I have to go home and check my terminator collection. I may have totally screwed this up... I don't think I actually have enough terminators to field ten anymore.

I mean, if by "screwed up" I mean "need to buy a few more new vanilla terminators." Black Reach terminators are still pretty cheap on eBay, so this isn't actually much of a problem...

Anyway, on to the main point of this thread:

Even though they are now only Allies of Convenience, the advantage of the Grey Knights/Coteaz option is that I get a lot of the same effect (a powerful unit of Inquisitor-flavored psychics that I can use as mobile artillery) at a smaller cost (150 points vs. 360 points) and a smaller "footprint" on my main army. By that I mean that it's a single inquisitorial chimera, versus two IG chimeras. It lets me feel like my army is still basically space marines.

It also means that I can experiment with this option a lot sooner.

This allied detachment, btw, would look like this:

HQ
• Inquisitor Coteaz

Troops
• Inquisitorial Henchmen (6 Psykers, 3 Daemonhosts, 2 Crusaders).
° Inquisitorial Chimera w/Heavy Bolter & Heavy Flamer, Dozer Blade

I'll post a full list once I've had a chance to build it...

[ElectricPaladin]

Here's a new list, employing both my new and better understanding of the rules, and Coteaz's special powers:

HQ
• Silas Alberec
• Chaplain

Elites
• 6 Assault Terminators w/Hammers
° Land Raider Crusader
• 5 Tactical Terminators (1 Assault Cannon, 3 Chain Fists)

Troops
• 10 Tactical Marines (Meltagun, Multi-Melta), Sergeant w/Power Weapon, Meltabombs
° Rhino w/Dozer Blade
• 10 Tactical Marines (Plasma Gun, Plasma Cannon), Sergeant w/Power Weapon, Meltabombs
° Rhino w/Dozer Blade

Fast Attack
• Stormtalon w/Lascannons

Allied HQ
• Inquisitor Coteaz

Allied Troops
• Inquisitorial Henchmen
- 6 Pskyers
- 3 Daemonhosts
- 2 Crusaders
° Inquisitorial Chimera w/Heavy Bolter & Heavy Flamer, Dozer Blade

Like I said, I like that this list is less Grey Knights and more Exorcists, so that the Inquisitors feel more like allies and less like almost half my army. I like the combination of a Chimera's five fire points, so that Coteaz, the psykers, and (if I roll right) the daemonhosts can all throw psychic death out the hatch on the back.

The tactics of this list are more or less unchanged, except that Alberec and his guard are more potent thanks to the addition of a chaplain. Because of the crusaders and their storm shields, I'd feel a lot more comfortable using the henchmen/Coteaz chimera aggressively. Once the chimera dies, they stand a good chance of standing and fighting, possibly holding or contesting an objective in the process. Though the idea of using them this way makes me wonder if I might not want to replace the crusaders with warrior acolytes: two warrior acolytes, each with a flamer and a chainsword, so that when the chimera is inevitably destroyed and the unit charged, they can unleas 2d3 automatic flamer hits in Overwatch...

Anyway, as I wrote earlier, I prefer this list because it's something I can build to much more quickly.

Thanks for the help so far - any further thoughts?

[Nabterayl]

Did you actually drop the Land Raider Crusader, or was that a typo? I'm not sure I agree with that choice, simply because it makes the tactical terminators less placeable. [EDIT: ah, a typo]

I don't know much about using tactical terminators, so I can't comment on assault cannon vs. cyclone missile launcher etc., though just on paper I prefer the cyclone. I feel like it's actually very similar firepower, since you still get your storm bolter, and if you're forced to drop your terminators somewhere away from Alberec or they otherwise need to engage targets at long range, you have the option to do so.

As for crusaders vs. flamer acolytes, I'm going to tentatively vote for crusaders. I don't know what your games are like, but I would not be confident that the Chimera was going to get popped and the passengers charged, as opposed to popped and the passengers shot. Crusaders I think will keep the unit going longer thanks to their storm shields.

[ElectricPaladin]

Did you actually drop the Land Raider Crusader, or was that a typo? I'm not sure I agree with that choice, simply because it makes the tactical terminators less placeable.


How so? It's the assault terminators who ride in the land raider.



I don't know much about using tactical terminators, so I can't comment on assault cannon vs. cyclone missile launcher etc., though just on paper I prefer the cyclone. I feel like it's actually very similar firepower, since you still get your storm bolter, and if you're forced to drop your terminators somewhere away from Alberec or they otherwise need to engage targets at long range, you have the option to do so.


I do see your point. At the moment, I don't own any cyclonic missile launchers, so the point is slightly moot. I'll try the list with them once I've had a chance to buy the bits and the spare termies. Personally, I like units that are designed to perform well in a specific range band.



As for crusaders vs. flamer acolytes, I'm going to tentatively vote for crusaders. I don't know what your games are like, but I would not be confident that the Chimera was going to get popped and then charged. Crusaders I think will keep the unit going longer thanks to their storm shields.


I'm with you, for the time being.

[Nabterayl]

How so? It's the assault terminators who ride in the land raider.
I don't have a copy of IA10 with me at work, but I thought the point was for Alberec to act as their locator beacon, circumstances permitting. You have no way to choose when the gun terminators arrive, but by giving Alberec wheels, you can better position him. Of course, you won't want to drop the tactical terminators on him every game, but I'm pretty sure you will rarely want to drop them on him if he has to walk to the enemy. That or I'm misreading the flexibility you want for them by giving them chainfists.

[ElectricPaladin]

There's no reason that Alberec (and the chaplain) can't just Ride with the assault terminators, is there?

[Nabterayl]

No, there isn't. That's my point - if they ride, then the number of places Alberec and his teleport homer can be on any given turn increases. Thus, the number of places you can safely place your tactical terminators increases. In the real world it won't always matter, but still, all things being equal, by keeping the Crusader (which I see you always intended to do anyway), you increase Alberec's mobility and thus increase your tactical terminators' flexibility in deployment as well.

[magickbk]

I find Henchmen to be a lot of fun. Sometimes they get chewed up like nothing, sometimes they tear things apart.

[ElectricPaladin]

I find Henchmen to be a lot of fun. Sometimes they get chewed up like nothing, sometimes they tear things apart.

Well, I had a bunch of old Catachans in extremely bad shape. They're sitting in simple green as we speak. I'll get 'em stripped and see what I can turn them into.

[Houghten]

1) Do you think most people would accept these counts-as choices, or laugh me out of the store?

I think that, once people have wrapped their heads around the idea of counting Grey Knights as something else instead of the other way around (there will be much "what?" and "but..." and "huh.... buh.... wha... gah") they'll be fine with it ;)

[ElectricPaladin]

New update: I realized that I forgot to actually count the points for the crusaders. Suck. With a little switching around, however (dropping one chain fists - I don't really need three), I was able to build the following allied detachment:

HQ
• Coteaz

Troops
• Inquisitorial Henchmen
- 6 Psykers
- 3 Warrior Acolytes w/Boltguns
- 1 Daemonhost
- 1 Crusader
° Inquisitorial Chimera w/Dozer Blade, Heavy Bolter & Heavy Flamer, Searchlight

The unit has a little more conventional shooting, which will help me take advantage of Coteaz's I've Been Expecting You, and if they fall out of their chimera they have two models with invulnerable saves and a significant melee punch (sometimes, anyway).

[Nabterayl]

Hmmm ... I'd like to see more firepower on those warriors, or another crusader as a backup 3++ save, but ... playing around with the numbers, I don't really see a great way to do that. So I think I like it.

One question - do you prefer the heavy bolter to the multi-laser? I think that's really just a question about your local meta, so I'm not advocating one or the other, but I'd be curious to hear why you chose the heavy bolter.

[Dave Blackmon]

I plan on using one of my war machine war casters as an inquisitor, they work great for that. Use some old arbite figs and a psyker and you have a really cool assault force.

[ElectricPaladin]

One question - do you prefer the heavy bolter to the multi-laser? I think that's really just a question about your local meta, so I'm not advocating one or the other, but I'd be curious to hear why you chose the heavy bolter.

In my experience thus far, I'd rather have those two points of AP than that one point of Strength.