New Rumoured Release Plans - AKA Sucks to be a DA player

[DrLove42]

via Stickmonkey on Warseer
Just going to leave this here as the DA thread is closed now.

Looks like my sourcing is again off on timelines. So I'm putting in an update on it here, lots of things have changed to me since my last timeline thread. (I want to repeat, these are rumors, almost none of this really "changes" per se, GW's got their plan, I don't, I get information that aligns from a few sources and try to base what I tell you on that)

Was correct on WoC for Nov, as that's in the bag now, moving on to Dec.

Dec:
No DA. Boo. Hiss. Eating crow again. Looks like what we can expect for Dec is a lot of Hobbit as expected, and I believe a little surprise is still in store.
There is an outside possibility of 2 terrain pieces and 3 flyers, but I'm really expecting these now to be in a spring wave.

Jan:
Daemons. Still on track. Vetock doing WFB and 40k books, but I havent had confirmation that the books are actually coming in Jan. Expect Greater Daemons in plastic, a couple new chariots, a new daemon engine, and a couple new characters (well...characters which have never received models) Word is the Daemons update will not be a huge overhaul to the current book. Expect few new units. But the new GD models are phenomenal, love every one of them, especially the new GUO. None of the new units are single system, everything is in both 40k and WFB now.

Feb:
Hobbit/LOTR are the biggest contendors right now.
Might be a splash month for 40k in the form of that missing flyers wave. Still trying to get more info on when it might see light of day.

March:
Rumors point to WoC Army book. But with all the new models coming in Nov, I'm not sure what is left to release with it.

April:
New rumored slot for DA now. Yes, I'm sorry, rumoring sucks, you get told a lot and its very difficult to sort out what is fit to pass on and what is not.
However, I am being told some of those rumored generic SM kits may get released along side the DA codex and DA specific models. So thats something promising.

May:
WFB model wave and army book. High Elves I'm being told.

June:
Nothing hard, rumors range from the flyer wave to Tau to new fortifications to the 40k supplement book (allies?)
Lead contendor is the Flyers if they dont get an earlier slot.

July:
Most likely slot for this rummored 40k supplement book.

Beyond that:
Tau and Eldar are the only codexes with some weight behind it to come late in the year I expect Tau following DA, and right now it does look like Eldar will follow Tau.

I should also add the 2nd Horus Heresy book from FW is being rumored to me to be late Spring/Early Summer.

(...)
Pretty sure we have Vetock doing CD, Ward on DA, Cruddace on Tau, Kelly on Eldar. FWIW


the digital release schedule I had was incorrect, I said it elsewhere way back in August. I was going off what I was told which was that WFB was not going to get any digital releases this year. A lot of work is going into these, more than just copying an existing codex into a PDF. A lot of it is done, and waiting on some new digital assets. There is a digital rulebook that I was told was to be released a week before the HB, then with the HB, then with the SB, and nothing has happened on that front...maddenly frustrating sometimes.

The ork wave is still out there, I still expect it in 2013, but I haven't had any new updates.



So No DA until mid next year, Tau later in the year and no Eldar till 2014 likely. Crap.

Also - Cruddance on Tau makes me sad face. The only ray of sunshine I can find is that Kelly is probably doing Eldar. Happy face

[Kyban]

Whyyyyy??? I was so hoping Tau and Eldar would be sooner than that and DA would be this year. :(

[Cap'nSmurfs]

"Whyyyyyyyyy" is that rumourmongers are working on incomplete information and some deliberate misdirection, and when people put too much faith in them, you get upset.

I doubt the release schedule has actually changed, it was just assumed/purported to be something it turned out not to be.

[Kyban]

Well I wasn't basing it on rumors, just hoping they might get 40k codices out a little faster. I can't speak for everywhere but at the few LGSs that I've been to 40k has been the primary GW product.

[eldargal]

Kelly on Eldar
http://photopostsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/pictures-of-happy-face29.jpg

[Psychosplodge]

I can't imagine there not being a codex space marines in the next six months, unless of course codex da is the new codex space marines/ or a dual release possibly?

[DrLove42]

On this schedule, and not expecting GW to break their Loyalist/xeno/loyal/xenos method;

I predict Tau in August/September then Marines in January (as Dec will be Hobbit Film 2) and Eldar in April 2014 (:()

[Psychosplodge]

It's too far into the edition for their biggest selling range.

[eldargal]

Unless they have figured out that Marine sales are strong without excessive preferential treatment.

[DrLove42]

It does also talk about marine kits (sans codex) with the DA sales.

Maybe a recut generic Tac squad, Terminator Squad and vehicle. Add in a WD expansion and they're hapy for another year

[Learn2Eel]

Thanks for posting this!

Vetock writing Chaos Daemons = not sure, I don't know any 40K codexes that he has done. Apparently though he is a great Fantasy author? It sounds like it isn't a massive overhaul, which is fine as Daemons are now actually competitive again.

Ward writing Dark Angels = hopefully he actually tones his own works back and writes a codex similarl to his Space Marines codex. However, it wouldn't surprise me if he makes another Grey Knights/Necrons codex.

Cruddance writing Tau = WHY!? Seriously though, Tau can't get worse. Right? This guy can't nerf them anymore. Can he? Unfortunately though, this guy is usually the kiss of death for a codex. The terrible Tyranids or the imba Imperial Guard. Jokes aside, I'll give him a chance. All he really has to do is update the codex to current rules and give the codex a general points reduction. He also needs to fix some certain units.

Kelly writing Eldar - no surprises. It just wouldn't be Eldar/Dark Eldar without Phil Kelly. Given that his previous Eldar and Dark Eldar codexes were great when they came out and tend to have aged well, I have nothing but faith that this will be a great release.

[Psychosplodge]

Unless they have figured out that Marine sales are strong without excessive preferential treatment.


It does also talk about marine kits (sans codex) with the DA sales.

Maybe a recut generic Tac squad, Terminator Squad and vehicle. Add in a WD expansion and they're hapy for another year


I suppose they're both possibilities, plus it would push back how long it is till they suffer as everyone elses codex has been newer...

[Kawauso]

Also - Cruddance on Tau makes me sad face.

I dunno...he did IG and Tau are similar enough that maybe he won't pull another Tyranid codex? Please?

[alshrive]

if cruddace is working on Tau prepare for a weapon that gets 20 shots!

[eldargal]

Vetock does good work. Skaven are a good book, but his writing style was somewhat less than lucid, it required quite a bit of FAQing and Errata. He learnt from that though, his next book Orcs and Goblins was very good, nicely balanced. Hist last, Ogre Kingdoms (wrriten with Jerbis Johnson) is considered one of the stronger 8th edition books without being broken or overpowered. Really confident he will do daemons justice.

Ward has been improving. His background hasn't been at all bad since GK, the Necrons tuff was really rather good as was his SoB background. Ditto his rules, Necrons are a strong book but not really broken or overpowered (unless your fighting them with a 4th edition codex that got hit quite hard by 6th...). Really not worried about Ward.

Cruddace has also improved, his Tomb Kings book for WFB was inoffensive, his Empire book quite good and his SoB rules were also inoffensive given the constraints of being a WD book. I can't blame you for being worried, I was when I heard he was doing Empire. But he delivered a good book, so I wouldn't get too morose just yet.

Kelly writing eldar is just great, really hoping this is accurate. As you say the Eldar book has aged well and was very good at the time and the Dark Eldar book is, in my opinion, one of the best codices GW have produced in terms of internal and external balance.

[DrLove42]

More I think about it...Cruddance might do Tau OK.

Big guns, gunline, gunships, gunmen, gunguns, gundams, gunhung, gun, gun, gun gun gun gun gun gun

Basically anything with lots of guns :P and he might be alright. However he also has the potential to **** it completly. Going to be interesting to see them out shoot and under combat the Necrons though....

[Psychosplodge]

Can't they just bring back the proper writers? :D

[Deadlift]

Vetock wrote the last Ork codex, which I think maybe the funniest bit of 40k writing I have ever read. I wonder if he can inject that kind of fun into the Chaos book ?

[DrLove42]

I can see deamons chaning big time. The Deamon USR no longer confers fearless or Eternal Warrior.

Can see most things getting a little more crap, but a lot cheaper.

I thought the last Ork codex was Kelly?

[alshrive]

the last Ork codex was Kelly, the last Orc Army Book was Vetock

[Defenestratus]

Kind of bummed about PK doing the Eldar codex. As much as people say that the DE and Eldar book have aged well, I disagree. The DE lists I see are getting homogenous and the Eldar book is just riddled with worthless units like Swooping hawks and shining spears and points costs that even at the time didn't make sense. The thing about Ward's codexes is that there are often several different viable units in it and combinations that are fun to play. I know that my BA codex has so many different builds that are fun to play with and at the same time won't get you ROFLStomped on the table.

The only silver lining to the Eldar codex not being released until 2014 is that I will continue to enjoy the gnashing of teeth as I watch my friends roll 12+ on 3D6 for their psychic tests for at least another year and a half, maybe two at this point, who knows.

[Deadlift]

the last Ork codex was Kelly, the last Orc Army Book was Vetock

My mistake, either way it was hilarious :)

[DrLove42]

I agree with you Def about the aging. My Eldar are now cupboard bound for the next codex. They just cant compete.

Kelly codexes are brilliant, especially when they come out for sheer choice, variety and flavour. But after a few years you stop using certain things as it gets harder to compete. They're still masterful books but they suffer over age a lot.

in contrast Ward and Cruddance books are powerful and stay powerful but only with specific units and builds all the way through their life

It suprises me for PK to do Eldar. WHen i spoke to him at GD a few years back he said it would be wierd and difficult to go back and redo his own work

[gcsmith]

cruddance on tau? well hello being being made worse...

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Ward has been improving. His background hasn't been at all bad since GK, the Necrons tuff was really rather good as was his SoB background. Ditto his rules, Necrons are a strong book but not really broken or overpowered (unless your fighting them with a 4th edition codex that got hit quite hard by 6th...). Really not worried about Ward.

Sounds like a reference to my many successes. :p

POWERSWITCH.

Dark Angels put back again? Poster boys my arse, f*ck you GW. *angry*

[Emerald Rose Widow]

idk, I find it hard to believe that just after release of the 40k book they will only be putting out the one codex for it for such a long period of time. It just seems utterly moronic to have something new that people are excited about, and then ignoring it like the red headed stepchild in favour of lord of the rings stuff which historically only sells a little bit around the release of the movies then gets ignored forever and a day. Seems really stupid to ignore the golden goose just to get some quick sales out of the stinky pile of poo.

[lattd]

I really don't understand the hate for lord of the rings. It gave GW a much greater brand name and had really tight rules (surprisingly) for GW. Yes it didn't work well in big battles but i could play a 700pt game of lotr in a faster time than 2000pt 40k and i've had much more interesting games with lotr. But nothing for me in these rumours :/ eldar tau are the two im waiting for.

[inquisitorsog]

I'm clueless on the Dark Angels. I don't really get why Dark Angels are different enough to merit a separate Codex. They've got a few differences in what units fall into what FOC slot and a couple of special rules and chars. But, are they really that different otherwise?

[Darnath Lysander]

With all due respect to professional rumormongers and such, it is terribly hard to imagine Dark Angels not being on the immediate horizon.

[Kirsten]

I still think Cruddace is a great book writer, the tyranid hate is just silly. I look forward to h doing Tau (or possibly having done Tau by now, given the schedule) I look forward to there being a hammerhead with a heavy 15 gun, inevitable really :P

[Kyban]

I really don't understand the hate for lord of the rings. It gave GW a much greater brand name and had really tight rules (surprisingly) for GW. Yes it didn't work well in big battles but i could play a 700pt game of lotr in a faster time than 2000pt 40k and i've had much more interesting games with lotr. But nothing for me in these rumours :/ eldar tau are the two im waiting for.

I really like the models and have started using them for counts-as and conversions.

It's really disappointing and seems kind of counter intuitive that they'd put off releasing some new codices sooner rather than later.

[magickbk]

Looking at 8th Edition Fantasy, which was released in July 2010, the first Army Book came out in March 2011, and was followed by only 2 more books that year. I know that looking at past for precedent is not all that reliable, but one could assume that the release of an edition doesn't really factor into the plans for Codex releases, other than the switch to the new hardcover full-color format. It seems like some coordination of availability of model production, completed books, Studio army painting time, photography, and now digital book production all have to come together to create a release, and it doesn't seem like GW is all that motivated to crank out any more books than they have in the past in any given amount of time.

We all hoped that the conversion to a digital design process would speed up the release rate, but that doesn't seem to have happened. It has resulted in some ridiculous new unexpectedly good models when they come out, but with the release of new units in the recent past in WD and these Official Update packets that are coming in WD, I would tend to think that GW is actually now more comfortable with a slower pace of book release(all of which would tie in with rumors regarding changes in the way things were going to be done in the Chapterhouse lawsuit aftermath).

@inquisitorsog - Don't take away our Dark Angels Codex! In the past, not only FOC differences, but also changes in options and load-out, and sometimes Special Rules. In the 3rd edition codex, every unit had to roll each turn to see if it would become Intractable, where the unit couldn't move, but would count as Stubborn until the beginning of your next turn, in addition to the Hunt the Fallen rules. So, there were as many differences as Blood Angels.

[inquisitorsog]

I'm not trying to take it away. I just was wondering as they look far less different than others. I wouldn't mind a new DA codex, but I also wonder why we couldn't just have a double sized Marine codex that actually allowed for some variation. Yeah, I'll stop smoking the crack now.

If they come out with a new DA codex, my decision to use crossed swords as my custom chapter's insignia will be instantly validated as I can just refluff them to be a DA successor and use the new codex.

[Emerald Rose Widow]

I still think Cruddace is a great book writer, the tyranid hate is just silly. I look forward to h doing Tau (or possibly having done Tau by now, given the schedule) I look forward to there being a hammerhead with a heavy 15 gun, inevitable really :P

The tyranid hate comes from the fact that even with the most competetive build you can make, they still don't fare well unless you are lucky. Their monstrous creatures are FAR overcosted for how much survivability you get, because Tyranid MC's are definitely not difficult to take out if you know what you are doing. Then there was the doubling of the cost of the carnifex, making them an almost unusable unit except for specific cases. Then there is the lackluster effect of many of their troops, that while useful and the like, can be killed off rather handedly by a fart in a stiff wind.

Sure nids have some great benefits, but to counter that we get swift kicks in the chest while we are still thanking our great master cruddace for giving us such amazing high cost things that in the end just become priority targets that no matter how you protect them they die easily within the first turn or two.

So really, if I see Cruddace's name on the next tyranid codex, I might just say F*** it to my bugs much as I love them.

I am of course being hyperbolic, but really, the things that tyranids use for their bread and butter in the end kind of suck and are average at best. Because so far in this edition, vehicles and their hull points have a better chance to survive than my massive monstrous creatures.

[Wildeybeast]

Vetock does good work. Skaven are a good book, but his writing style was somewhat less than lucid, it required quite a bit of FAQing and Errata. He learnt from that though, his next book Orcs and Goblins was very good, nicely balanced. Hist last, Ogre Kingdoms (wrriten with Jerbis Johnson) is considered one of the stronger 8th edition books without being broken or overpowered. Really confident he will do daemons justice.

Ward has been improving. His background hasn't been at all bad since GK, the Necrons tuff was really rather good as was his SoB background. Ditto his rules, Necrons are a strong book but not really broken or overpowered (unless your fighting them with a 4th edition codex that got hit quite hard by 6th...). Really not worried about Ward.

Cruddace has also improved, his Tomb Kings book for WFB was inoffensive, his Empire book quite good and his SoB rules were also inoffensive given the constraints of being a WD book. I can't blame you for being worried, I was when I heard he was doing Empire. But he delivered a good book, so I wouldn't get too morose just yet.

Kelly writing eldar is just great, really hoping this is accurate. As you say the Eldar book has aged well and was very good at the time and the Dark Eldar book is, in my opinion, one of the best codices GW have produced in terms of internal and external balance.

I second all of this, especially the stuff about Cruddace. He gets hammered simply because he writes books which don't have an 'auto win button' and actually require a bit of thought and balanced list writing.

As for people moaning about the DA book being put back, who was actually expecting it this year? November has been pencilled in as a Warhammer month for ages and there was never going to be anything significant to go alongside the cash cow of The Hobbit in December.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I f*cking was! I was expecting it this month! Not this stupid Warriors of Chaos mini release...

[Deadlift]

I f*cking was! I was expecting it this month! Not this stupid Warriors of Chaos mini release...

I was too, now I have got to the point that I couldn't care less.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Rawr, Agent smash!!

[Dalleron]

I think anyone not named Phil Kelly at GW is not allowed to work on Eldar. He is synonymous with eldar, as ward has become with Space Marines

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Sounds fair.

[gresha]

As happy as I am Kelly is doing Eldar, I am a little worried. He could make similar mistakes as last time (such as Hawks and Spears being a bit to expensive), or over look some of the more glaring issues (overpriced weapon options). Sometimes when people look to redo their own work they have a hard time picking out some of the issues with the original.

[Dalleron]

The current eldar codex suffers a common GW problem. That is changing things so that what was good before is not so good currently. For example, star cannons and brightlances. Star cannons were everywhere in eldar armies because they were 3 shot s6 ap2. They were killing everything in sight with ease. Next edition, they get dropped to shots because presumably they were to all purpose. Yet SM's get their all purpose rending assault cannon. I wouldn't be surprised if they got returned to the previous incarnation.

Brightlances weren't quite so expensive last go round either. They were not uncommon in eldar armies either. Now they are less common. If they were brought in line with their Dark cousins, or cheaper, I'd be happy. Dark lances are cheaper, and fired by someone who knows how to shoot it properly, going by stats. I know my friends lances usually miss.

[eldargal]

I'm not worried. His last books have all been excellently balanced with few to no poor units.

As happy as I am Kelly is doing Eldar, I am a little worried. He could make similar mistakes as last time (such as Hawks and Spears being a bit to expensive), or over look some of the more glaring issues (overpriced weapon options). Sometimes when people look to redo their own work they have a hard time picking out some of the issues with the original.

[Emerald Rose Widow]

I'm not worried. His last books have all been excellently balanced with few to no poor units.

The only issue is that when you compare them to Matt Ward's cheesefests they seem kind of less so, but that is more matt ward's fault than anyone else. They really need to forbid that man from space marines.

[eldargal]

Yep, the lack of broken or overpowered units means his books aren't usually that 'competitive'. I can live with that, stuff competitive play.:p Vampire Counts would be the exception but GW seem to be making a concerted effort to keep all teh 8th edition army books on a similar level, one hopes they will do the same with 6th.

[magickbk]

the lack of broken or overpowered units means his books aren't usually that 'competitive'. I can live with that, stuff competitive play

+ 1 million

When a 'competitive' unit starts getting ubiquitous on the netlists, I start to resent that unit and no longer want it in my own army.

[DrLove42]

There is a fine line between "competitive" and "good". And that line is usually spam

A Vendetta is "good". Its competetive cos its good
A Warp Hunter is "good". But i'd argue its not competitive
Nurgle Bikers are good. One squad of them is not competitive though. 3 is.

[Kyban]

With the addition of allies now it seems like most of the netlists are gone, it may just be that the new meta hasn't settled but to me it looks like the massive variety of lists has ironed out most of the broken stuff. There are still a few things that are overpowered though, like Vendettas. Necrons are possibly the most powerful codex but not due to sheer overpoweredness, just because 6th favors them.

[Wildeybeast]

I f*cking was! I was expecting it this month! Not this stupid Warriors of Chaos mini release...

Anyone who keeps an eye on the Warhammer threads (which is about 10 of us) knew they were strongly rumoured for quite a while. :p

[Psychosplodge]

There's a warhammer section as well? :confused:

[Kirsten]

there is nothing with Matt Ward's marine books, they are no more powerful than Space Wolves, or Imperial Guard

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Anyone who keeps an eye on the Warhammer threads (which is about 10 of us) knew they were strongly rumoured for quite a while. :p

Don't really care about Fantasy to be honest. I prefer skirmishing.

[Marius]

by the way, they didn't finish the white dwarf spine dark angels picture...

[Wildeybeast]

Don't really care about Fantasy to be honest. I prefer skirmishing.

Sadly most people on here seem to have the same view. Each to their own, I like both, I just wish we had more of a Warhammer community on BoLS.

[Kyban]

Sadly most people on here seem to have the same view. Each to their own, I like both, I just wish we had more of a Warhammer community on BoLS.

I'd love to play a fantasy army but I still have tons of 40k stuff to paint and more I want to get for my 40k armies first. I think it comes down to picking one or the other for a lot of people and most choose 40k.

[Wildeybeast]

Understandable. I dread to think how much I've spent on two systems

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

It's because I've never been able to have a full army, due to funding.

It takes a lot more to have a fun Fantasy army than it does 40k.

[White Tiger88]

there is nothing with Matt Ward's marine books, they are no more powerful than Space Wolves, or Imperial Guard

......Ya thats the problem there is NOTHING in them......other then Cheese filled goodness and "Wtf does that do" rules.

[Azrael71]

I am a DA player and i am pissed at GW, WoC could have waited till next year. Why realease DV boxset and not have the codex for DA come out this month Gw need to be consistent and not deciding what underwear to wiear this month.

As for the Codexes i think Tau should be 2014, Eldar should be next year as for cruddace i like the way some of the codexes came out like TK as for ward hope he levels the codexes out instead. I believe the SoB, should come out earlier than other codexes as they need an upgrade to be competitive.

thats my rant for now!!!

Azrael71

[Learn2Eel]

In reality, I think Tau need an update more than anyone else. But I really can't wait for the new Chaos Daemons and Eldar codices. On Eldar, given how fantastic Dark Eldar were when they came out, we should be looking at having a great Eldar codex for several years - releasing them early into 6th is a great idea. Hopefully we can still do Wraithstars in the new codex! Also hoping the White Dwarf rules for Flamers and Screamers stay the same in the new codex.

[daboarder]

In reality, I think Tau need an update more than anyone else. But I really can't wait for the new Chaos Daemons and Eldar codices. On Eldar, given how fantastic Dark Eldar were when they came out, we should be looking at having a great Eldar codex for several years - releasing them early into 6th is a great idea. Hopefully we can still do Wraithstars in the new codex! Also hoping the White Dwarf rules for Flamers and Screamers stay the same in the new codex.

eh tau probably get the biggest boost from the new rules. they need a new book and mini's but honestly between say FW and regular GW I'd say they aren't as bad off as say Tyranids, sure nids are newer but they have some chronic problems and still don't have a good chunk of their models available.

though I offer no argument on eldar, they need a new book for sure.

[MajorWesJanson]

I am a DA player and i am pissed at GW, WoC could have waited till next year. Why realease DV boxset and not have the codex for DA come out this month Gw need to be consistent and not deciding what underwear to wiear this month.

As for the Codexes i think Tau should be 2014, Eldar should be next year as for cruddace i like the way some of the codexes came out like TK as for ward hope he levels the codexes out instead. I believe the SoB, should come out earlier than other codexes as they need an upgrade to be competitive.

thats my rant for now!!!

Azrael71


Why release the IoB Box set and not have a new HE codex yet, 2 years later? It isn't fair!!!11!

Tau have a far older codex than Eldar, with a number of wargear elements that simply don't do anything anymore, and gaping holes in the fliers, psykers, and close combat elements of the game. They also have a grand total of 5 unique plastic kits (Fire Warriors, Crisis suits, Kroot, Devilfish chassis, Piranha) in their range, which gives more room to expand kitwise than Eldar, who have more bases covered and many potential kits would be just rehashes of existing models.

[eldargal]

Yep as much as I'm looking forward to a new eldar codex I'd rather Tau get one first. They don't seem to be too bad in 6th but their range is decidedly dated.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I dunno, Krootoxen are pretty brutal.

[smirnoff5656]

I was talking to a customer service representative from GW two days ago about a problem with a finecast i bought and we happened to get on the topic of custom orders and how GW does not do them... well after that he mentioned that before christmas there were going to be a few new models released! So i dont know if this guy was just blowing his horn or wat but i hope he wasnt just bs'ing me. So i think you might be correct in saying there is probably going to be a couple terrain pieces as well as a few models for the holiday season.