1850 Demons w/ CSM allies

[Tepogue]

Here's a list I'm contemplating taking to a 1850 tournament this weekend

Demons

HQ - Tzeentch Herald on Disc 65
- Warlord, joins one of the Flamer Squads

Elite

6 x Flamers
6 x Flamers
6 x Flamers

Troops

5x Horrors - Bolt
5x Horrors - Bolt

Fast Attack
8x Screamers
7x Screamers

Heavy - None

CSM Allies

Dark Apostle, Mark of Khorne
Replace Power Maul with Axe of Blind Fury
Replace Bolt pistol with Burning Brand of Skalathrax

Elites - None

Troops

20 x Cultists, 17 auto guns, 2 Heavy Stubbers

30 x Cultists, equal mix of auto guns and pistol/CCW, 3x Flamers - Dark Apostle attached here

Fast Attack
Heldrake - Bale Flamer

Heavy Support

5x Havoks, 3x Missle Launcher + Flakk Missile

I'm ~50 points short with whats written here and will probably fill it with a nekkid Aegis Defense Line

The general use will be:

Preffered Wave - 3x Flamers+Attached Herald, smaller screamer unit
Hope I don't get it wave - 2x Horrors and larger Screamer Unit.

I play agressive with my Flamers, routinely dropping them within 6 inches of enemy units. Their fast movement and more forgiving mishap chart allows me to do this. The larger base of the Herald sometimes let me squeeze in 1 extra flamer template.

Screamers have been great psychological warfare units, deepstrike in, and turbo boost over any unit thats not in vehicles or has been dismounted by the Havoks/Screamers.

The smaller Cultist unit is to babysit the objective closest to me with the Havoks finding cover and waiting to shoot down flyers.

Larger Cultist unit is joined by Dark Apostle and immediately heads toward whatever I deem as the most difficult to get objective. The mark of Khorne now giving Counter Attack to the unit the Apostle is attached to, combine with the natural Hatred given by the Apostle makes for a nasty surprise.

I just hope for bad luck on my Horrors, so they don't show up until turn 3-4 and get to claim lesser objectives.

I am including the Heldrake just because I won it 2 weeks ago with a Demon/IG list. So I'm swapping out IG for Cultists. The bale flamer and vector strike I think will serve me better than the Flying Demon Prince I used in the previous army list.

[Tepogue]

Well a lot of people looked and no one commented, so here's my Update:

I won best general with the above list.

I did make a few changes

Great Unclean One
Cloud of Flies
Warlord

Herald of Tzeentch on Disc deployed with 6 flamer unit

6 flamers
5 flamers
5 flamers

5x Pink horrors - bolt upgrade
5x pink horrors - bolt upgrade

7 x Screamers
6 Screamers

Allies
Chaos Lord
Axe of Blind Fury
Burning Brand
Sigil of Coruption

20 Cultists
2 Heavy Stubber
17 autoguns

30 cultists
3x flamers
CCW/pistol
*Chaos Lord lead this squad.

Heldrake - baleflamer

5 Havoks
3 Missile
3 Flakk

Heres the missions
http://chattanoogaclassic.blogspot.com/p/scenarios.html

Round 1 - Emperors Will - modified see above link
Vs Dark Eldar

My opponent showed up 20 minutes late and forgot his army list. He scribbled someting down, showed it to the TO and we started.

Biggest thing wasthis board was entirly ruined city terrain and I got " Conqueror of cities Warlord trait. Happy days, I was able to deep strike my demons and not take dangerous terrain tests.

Highlights of game:

6-7 dark Eldar Jetbikes went over the large Cultist unit, dropping crap on them. The Cultsts and Chaos Lord BBQed them all in 1 turn of glorious flamer work.
GUCO vs Talos - Guco smash, poison good. Lack of Grenades on Talos major mistake.
Wyches are good, but 17 autogun cultists can hurt them don't charge small (6-7 men)into large squads with overwatch.
Flamers with Herald didn't come in until Last Turn.

Game ended up tied on main objectives. There was 1 (trueborn?) left within 3 inches of my objective. and his objective was Duke something in combat with 4 Screamers on his objective. With 2 units of Horrors on the sidelines waitig for a chance.

I got warlord and Line Breaker secondary.

Game 2 Purge the Alien - Modified see link

I got to play the Dark Eldar players girlfriend. She brought Orks

Which I didn't realize had an Ork Deathstar in one of the Battlewagons

She got turn 1 and sent here 2 battlewagons 7 inches towards my cultists so she could shoot. . . . Odd for an Ork, but ok,

My turn 2, I dropped the GUCO behind the battle wagons.
1 unit flamers, crispy fries 13 out of 30 gretchen, 2nd unit of Flamers, deep fries 9 grots out of a heavy weapons group, 3rd flamers knock 2 hull points off of Battle wagon.

Her turn 2. 1 battlewagons swing around and deathroller my Guco, who takes 1 wound.
2nd battlewagon rolls over and kills 2 flamers.

She then proceeds to dumpe every single shot in the OrK army into the GUCO, 17 shootas, 2 big shootas, 7 twin linked shootas, 2 of the ork dakka jets shoot. And in the final round of fire my GUCO dies. She gets, 1st blood, warlord and 1 VP all by killing him.

BUT

She didn't shoot at anything else in my army,

Zagstruck did deep strike and assault 1 of my flamer units, taking heavy losses on the assault ( <3 overwatch with flamers)

Turn 2 and on.

I drop horrors behind her Battlewagons, Bolt changed them into rubble. Found out about the Deathstar in one of the BW. 8 Mega Orks, warboss and special ork mad doc character. All with 2+/5++ and FNP.

I ended up BBQing the normal orks, sacrificing large unit of screamers to keep mega orks on her side of table.

Heldrake, burns Gretch artillary unit and later rips 1 ork flyer out of the air. (loving the heldrake at this point)

Thanks to the modified rules I pull out 8 to 4 win and get major victory and all 3 secondary points.

Mission 3 Choot Um

I'm fighting Necrons with chaos. His allies are nearly identical to mine except it's lord on jugger leading his CCW/pistol cultists.
did I mentiong the 3 6xWraiths squads? no, well that was leading his force, with warriors, immortals, lords, crypteks, following.

I manged to break his squad of warrors led by his Overlord(was warlord of army) with my flamers on the first round. So the fell back. My opponent taunted me to dare to drop my GUCO into this little 6x6 open space int he rear of his army. (deployment was vangaurd and my opponenet took the time to spread out all 50 of his cultists and ~60 necrons/wraiths to cover his deployment zone and deny me the ability to land inside his deployment zone.

GUCO landed on target, His lord failed to rally his squad and ended up looking at my GUCO. My turn 2, GUCO assaulted and spend next 2 turns munching on necrons, eventually getting me the warlord objective.

2 of the Wraith squads tried to double team my 30 cultist squad. 1 failed the charge. fun fact: Mark of Khorne gives counter charge, which is passed to the squad that character joins. Burning Brand, flamers and 27 pistol shots took down 2 wraiths, 30 cultists, 27 of them getting 3 attacks, plus my Chaos lord killed 2 more wraiths, and we finished off the last 2 in the next round.

The end of the long and bloody struggle saw me holding 4 objectives to his hold 1 and 1 contested.

I got all 3 secondary objectives.

Overall

Guco is 1 heck of a Warlord. He can't be ignored and while not able to kill masses of models, he can ruin an enemy flank on his own

Herald on Disc - mostly useless, the larger sized base did allow me to get 5 flame templates on the drop compared to the 4 I can normally get, but for his points, I could have gotten 3 more flamers.

Flamers - so broken, if you have the will to drop inside template range you can hurt anything in the game (excepting flyers)

Horrors - 5 models seems so harmless and with flamers/screamers and large cultist squads comeing at my opponent, these got ignored, though they were MVP's for killing the 2 Ork Battlewagons in game 2

Screamers - soo broken, the ability to deepstrike in, then turboboost and inflict hits on the turn they arrive is second only to telling your opponent they are A3, S5 AP2 in close combat.

Chaos Lord - He did his job, conveying fearless to the large cultist squad, chopping up wraiths in the last game.

20 cultists - they killed Wyches in close combat, thats priceless, though heavy stubbers just aren't worth it, more flamers from now on.

30 cultists - lead by a mark of khorne character and these guys get counter attack, which is priceless, Ork numbers of attacks from ~4 point models.

Heldrake - the ability to vector strike 1 model and then flame another, gives this guy huge tactical usefullness. He survived all 3 games and even took down an Ork plane when I needed him to.

Havoks - They threatened stuff. but never really impacted anything except last game, per the mission rules they were able to claim 1 objective and thus help ensure major victory.

[alshrive]

an enjoyable read i must say! is there anything you think the army will struggle with particularly (ignoring Cron Airforce!)?

[Tepogue]

So far I havn't found a real weakness or bad situation. As long as you deep strike in flame template range, the 5 model flamer squads always managed to get 4 flame templates off and kill large numbers of troops or inflict 1-3 hull points of damage. If you charge the flamers you get hit with 5d3 hits that wound on a 4+ with no armor/cover saves.

Screamers with I4, S5 ap2 and 3 attacks base, eat everything in close combat in large squads. Speaking of that with all these models being 2 wounds Eternal Warrior and 5++ they are deceptively hardy.

The Tzeentch Demons are in a class of their own now. While the other 3 god's demons land and do nothing for a turn other than run. I can land and flamer with Flamers, land and turbo boost with Screamers for the fly over hits, Horrors can shoot and guess what, AP4 works wonders on thinning out Necrons. I don't see a need for Fateweaver or even a Lord of Change. I can get so many more screamers/Flamers for those saved points.

[usa_supersonic]

Maybe you can do a little guide on how to use flamers. Everybody says the are awesome- but I just don't get it.
Screamers-yes..that I can relate

[jamesdean13]

It would struggle with the Daemon Flying Circus. 5 FMC's that most your army cant do anything against while its in the air.

Probably have an issue with a solid "gun line" even though they're more scarce they're still scary as hell.

[jamesdean13]

Maybe you can do a little guide on how to use flamers. Everybody says the are awesome- but I just don't get it.
Screamers-yes..that I can relate


Flamers now have 2 wounds a 5++ the update also made them cheaper

Point them at a squad and it dies beings on a 4+ they wound with no armor saves allowed, against vehicles its a glance

I like to bring mine up right behind my blob of 5 FMC's with Fateweaver in the midst

[Tepogue]

I took on a Fateweaver, LoC and 3 Demon Prince army. I just murdered his troops, The Cultists/Havoks put out enough shots to knock FMCs out of the air.All the Flamers are jump Infantry, the Screamers are Jetbikes. I can cover ground amazing fast. The Heldrake can vector strike Flyers so it's good at knocking wounds off/grounding them. In the end, with no troops he could not claim any objectives and screamers ate the 3 Princes.

I won a cheese victory against a dumb Necron Player. He tried the air force and only deployed a Lord and 1 Squad on the table. 3 units of Flamers killed all the models and 1 Screamer Squad turbo boosted and spread out so he could not make the get back up roll. Game over turn 1.

As for Flamers, the key to them is 5 minimium in a unit(6 is better gives you 1 to lose before they fall out of their sweet spot in damage capabilities) You also, go big or go home. I put mine ~7 inches away from my target. Unless the opponent is spread out to max coherency, I can usually place 4 flamer templates and the center model just uses warp fire. If the opponent is say an IG squad. I hope each template covers 5 models. 4 templates * 5 models = 20 hits for 10 wounds. No armor, no cover = dead squad. This is what I'm aiming for. I also field 3 squads of flamers. So 1 is landing on target. If I mishap, I mishap. I only lose the unit on a 1. On a 2-3 I'll be stuck in a corner somewhere, but with 12 inch movement + run. I can still get back in the fight ( Note If you are playing objective missions put objectives near the corners, give your opponent no good place to deploy your wayward deepstrikers) 4-6 I'll be coming in automatically next turn. If you land in terrain, pfft, 1 in 6 you will take a wound, and you get your 5++ against it now. This is part of the reason I like to go with 6 models per squad.

[Learn2Eel]

Hah, nice! Bet the Necron player wasn't expecting that lol.

The word from a well respected tournament player in my local area; "those things (Screamers) are just too good for the points". Ditto Flamers.
Tzeentch Daemons really have it good now.