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Chris Fisher
10-14-2012, 02:50 PM
The DEFINITIVE Jaws of the World Wolf How-to

I’ll admit it, this article is written out of frustration and anger. I’m sick and tired of arguing with people about Jaws of the World Wolf and its effects, especially with Necron players. They say it’s broken that they don’t get a save of some kind (since they get saves from EVERYTHING, even death itself). Well, they don’t, and they have no right to complain about broken rules in other people’s Codexes, period. I’m not a rules lawyer normally, and I hate when I have to be to smack down some cheat or crybaby, but it does happen from time to time. I’ve found the more someone tries to convince you that something you know is right, isn’t, they’re probably cheating, and they know it. Frankly, that kind of thing just ruins the game for everyone, but I digress.

First off, here is the exact text of the Jaws of the World Wolf power, from pg 47 of the Space Wolves Codex (parentheticals are my comments).

As a psychic shooting attack, the Rune Priest may trace straight line along the board, starting from the Rune Priest and ending 24” away. This line may pass through terrain. Monstrous creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes (including jet bikes, Space Wolves FAQ 1.1) and infantry (including jump infantry, Space Wolves FAQ 1.1) that are touched by this line must take an Initiative test. If the model fails the test, it is removed from play. Monstrous creatures may subtract one from their dice roll due to their tremendous size and strength; though remember that a roll of 6 is always a failure.
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How do you use Jaws?

Jaws is a hairline, not a beam like other psychic powers (Space Wolves FAQ 1.1). This means the line itself has no width. The FAQ suggests turning your tape measure on its side and using that to define your line. I’ll admit it works pretty well in a pinch. A laser level works better, but how many people carry those in their gear? So what you do is place your tape on the head of the Rune Priest and then point it anywhere you like. Everything touched by the line is hit. But ONLY those specific models. This means that yes, you can target specific models, like Fexes, Necron Lords and Imotekh (Space Wolves FAQ 1.1).

Every non-vehicle model hit by this line must pass an Initiative test, or is removed from play, it is NOT a casualty. Remember this, it is the first VERY important point to remember. This means jump infantry, flying Hive Tyrants, jetbikes and anything else that’s not a vehicle or walker can be targeted (Space Wolves FAQ, pg. 4). Since there is no specification in the rules about friend or foe; this means any of your own guys hit by the beam also have to make the test or be swallowed up by the earth. Plan your shots carefully in the movement phase so you don’t end up destroying your own men.

An Initiative test is a Characteristic test (WH40K, pg 7). This means you roll one die and must roll equal to or below your Initiative Characteristic to survive. If you roll over, you die. A natural 6 is always a failure. Monstrous creatures like Fexes get -1 to their roll, making their natural Initiative of 1 not the automatic death sentence you would assume. In practice it makes little difference in this case; I’ve only ever failed to nuke a Fex about twice. Bugzilla armies HATE the Space Wolves for really good reasons. :-D

Notice how nowhere in here did I mention Wounds? This is because Jaws does not cause Wounds (Space Wolves FAQ 1.1). This is the second VERY important point to remember.
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So what does all this mean to the poor target?

Well, first and foremost it means you don’t get saves of any kind. That’s right, no save of ANY kind. No armor saves, no invulnerable saves, no cover saves and no Feel No Pain or Resurrection Protocols either. But why, you ask? Because Jaws does not cause Wounds (VERY important point #2). The model is removed from play, not “removed as a casualty”.

The rules define a casualty thus: If at any point, a model’s Strength, Toughness or Wounds are reduced to 0, it is removed from play as a casualty (WH40K, pg 3). This is the third VERY important point to remember, the definition of casualty.Obviously, causing Wounds is the most common way to be removed as a casualty. Since Jaws does not cause Wounds, reduce Strength or Toughness models removed from play by Jaws do not count as casualties by definition.

So what recourse do models that failed their Initiative check have from certain doom? In short, NONE. If you fail the test, take the model off the table and put it back in the box. It’s done. It’s dead. It’s over. But just in case anyone has any lingering reservations, here’s a breakdown of the different ways people think they might get to cheat Wolf death:

In normal combat, to determine how many casualties are caused (VERY important point #3), you will need to allocate the Wounds (VERY important point #2) caused and resolve any saving throws the target is allowed (WH40K, pg 15). This means that Armor Saves, Invulnerable Saves, Cover Saves, Eternal Warrior, Feel No Pain, Instant Death, Look Out, Sir!, Reanimation Protocols and Ever-Living don’t apply since they all deal with casualties and wounds (VERY important points 2 and 3, WH40K and Space Wolves FAQ, pg 4). Jaws does not deal Wounds (VERY important point #2), it just makes the target go away, therefore you cannot prevent it by saves of any kind (VERY important point #1). Yes, Necron players hate this, but we all hate that no matter what you do to them otherwise, they get to come back on a 4+ (including Instant Death, being killed with power weapons and taking a Multi-Melta to the face).

And that folks, is the full skinny on the Space Wolves’ great equalizer. Happy hunting!

Tynskel
10-14-2012, 04:33 PM
good rant for you.

Now, your homework assignment is to write a critique of White Dwarf's "Standard Bearer".
Chop Chop, it is due on wednesday.

pauljc
10-15-2012, 05:08 AM
I don't understand how any part of this power is confusing or open to debate anyway? 'Removed from play' is pretty damn clear to me.
It rips a hole in the ground and stuff falls in. :)

Anakzar
10-15-2012, 07:23 AM
Just tell them the save is the Initiative test.

spaceman91
10-15-2012, 08:20 AM
I cant see how people have a problem with this. The only time i ever saw a debate was before the FaQ came out and it centered around could u kill a dread.

Chris Fisher
10-15-2012, 05:45 PM
I don't understand how any part of this power is confusing or open to debate anyway? 'Removed from play' is pretty damn clear to me.
It rips a hole in the ground and stuff falls in. :)

I thought the same thing too, until I got into my 5th or 6th debate on this. The final straw was a league game a week or so ago. The Necron player I was playing was all whinny about me zapping his Lord (because he lost his ubber resurrection). He argued that being removed from game makes you a casualty (which by common definition he's right) and therefore he gets to come back. I told him no, the lord is toast, put him in the box. I was pretty adamant about it because I was tired of arguing the point. Plus, this particular guy insisted in an earlier game that his Necron lord's force field extend the invul save to the chariot he was riding. It doesn't, but you can't convince the little munchkin. So he apparently whined to the league organizer who claimed he found in the Space Wolves FAQ that Necrons DID get to come back from Jaws. This kinda pissed me off because I knew he was full of it since I'd read the FAQ myself already. So, I put this together to basically shut everyone up once and for all. And, from now on, I'm making sure I bring at LEAST two Rune Priests to any Necron game just out of pure spite, three or four in a big game. Sucks how some people just insist on ruining things for you.

Tynskel
10-15-2012, 08:07 PM
bwhahah!

You made one fatal error...

you made the assumption that people *READ* the rules!!
bwahahahaha! Foiled!

Chris Fisher
10-16-2012, 07:51 PM
Curses! Foiled again!

sludig
10-20-2012, 09:00 PM
The DEFINITIVE Jaws of the World Wolf How-to

As a psychic shooting attack, the Rune Priest may trace straight line along the board, starting from the Rune Priest and ending 24” away. This line may pass through terrain. Monstrous creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes (including jet bikes, Space Wolves FAQ 1.1) and infantry (including jump infantry, Space Wolves FAQ 1.1) that are touched by this line must take an Initiative test. If the model fails the test, it is removed from play. Monstrous creatures may subtract one from their dice roll due to their tremendous size and strength; though remember that a roll of 6 is always a failure.
___________________________________________
How do you use Jaws?


Thank you for this, but I am unable to find where jump infantry are affected in the FAQ or FMC for that matter. I have had this argument many times and want to finally put it to rest.

Nabterayl
10-20-2012, 10:02 PM
Jump infantry isn't a thing, there is only infantry that are jump. If the argument is that Jaws doesn't list jump infantry in the list affected unit types, that won't fly in 6th.

sludig
10-20-2012, 10:14 PM
this is the exact argument. and that Jaws cant target FMC in swooping #1 because they are swooping and because they have the subtype "Jump"

Nabterayl
10-20-2012, 10:35 PM
One of those things is true, but the other is not. Jaws can target a Flying Monstrous Creature on the grounds that it can target Monstrous Creatures (of which FMCs are a subtype, per endnote 1 below). Notwithstanding the previous sentence, it can't target a Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature, because only Snap Shots can target a SFMC (per endnote 2 below), and Jaws of the World Wolf cannot Snap Shot (as it does not require a roll to hit).

Endnote 1. See page 5 of the BRB FAQ: "Q: Melta bombs, plasma and krak grenades can all be used in against Monstrous Creatures in the Assault phase. Does this include Flying Monstrous Creatures? (p62) A: Yes, providing they are in Glide mode."
Endnote 2. See page 3 of the BRB FAQ: "Q: How do maelstroms, novas and beams – or indeed any weapon that doesn’t need to roll To Hit or hits automatically – interact with Zooming Flyers and Swooping Flying Monstrous Creatures? (p13) A: Only Snap Shots can hit Zooming Flyers and Swooping Flying Monstrous Creatures. Therefore, any attacks that use blast markers, templates, create a line of/area of effect or otherwise don’t roll to hit cannot target them. This includes weapons such as the Necron Doom Scythe’s death ray or the Deathstrike missile of the Imperial Guard, and psychic powers that follow the rule for maelstroms, beams, and novas."

sludig
10-20-2012, 10:53 PM
ok I get the part about swooping vs gliding. my issue was with the "jump" sub-type. The argument is that JotWW can't target a jump infantry or gliding\grounded FMC (because they are sub-type "jump"). As per your previous post
that won't fly in 6th. why will it not "fly".

pls for give the many questions I just can't see it.

Nabterayl
10-21-2012, 09:18 AM
It won't fly because that's not how types and subtypes work. In 6e, all jump infantry are infantry, though not all infantry are jump infantry. All flying monstrous creatures are monstrous creatures, though not all monstrous creatures are flying monstrous creatures. Now we have a rule that affects infantry and monstrous creatures, and somebody wants to argue that jump infantry aren't affected because ... why?

Because they aren't infantry, or that flying monstrous creatures aren't affected because they aren't monstrous creatures? Both of those statements are simply untrue. Jump infantry are infantry (because the BRB says so), and flying monstrous creatures are monstrous creatures (because the BRB FAQ says so).

Because sub-types aren't included in a main type unless explicitly stated? That's just not true. Sub-types are included by default, and must be explicitly excluded, not the other way around. Suppose I ask a math class to count how many parallelograms are in your previous post. The correct answer is three (one for the "join date" box, one for the "posts" box, and one for the quote). The answer is not "zero, because there are only rectangles, and rectangles are a sub-type of parallelograms, and you didn't say 'How many parallelograms and/or rectangles are in sludig's last post?'"

Similarly, if there is one assault marine on the board and I ask how many infantry are on the board, the answer is one, not "zero, because assault infantry are a type of infantry." You cannot argue that because something is a type of infantry, it is not infantry :p

EDIT: If that's not convincing enough, c.f. page 78 of the BRB, which states: "Only Infantry models can embark upon Transports (this does not include Jump or Jet Pack Infantry)." As this rule demonstrates, when 6e says infantry, by default it includes jump infantry (and jet pack infantry). If that were not true, the rulebook would not have had to explicitly exclude those sub-types of infantry from this rule.

Tynskel
10-21-2012, 10:11 AM
oh no! Slapping sludig in the face with cf.!
Not the dreaded cf.!

That had to hurt.

by the way, I am gunna slap back: cf. is one period because it is shorthand for one word: confer.

Nabterayl
10-21-2012, 11:07 AM
Heh, that wasn't meant to be a slap at sludig. I meant "if that's not convincing enough to anybody who thinks that X is not Y by virtue of being a type of Y."

And thanks for the correction.

Tynskel
10-21-2012, 11:51 AM
well, it is more of slugdig slapping one's self. If you pull the cf. card, one is saying, "Did you read this? If you haven't, you should not say anything until you read this."

sludig
10-21-2012, 12:22 PM
Thanks for the explanation. I really do appreciate it. And thanks for the explanation of cf. didn't know what it was I have always used CF which has an entirely different meaning.

Tynskel
10-21-2012, 12:42 PM
yeah, cf. means to confer, which means to discuss; exchange opinions.

In academic use, it is 'commonly' (cf. is not commonly used) used when bringing up an idea that has been thoroughly discussed, and if one does not know the topic, should stop reading the current paper, and read the references that are suggested.

Nabterayl
10-21-2012, 12:51 PM
cf. doesn't mean "to confer," it means confer, which is a Latin 2nd person singular imperative verb, from conferre, meaning "bring together, compare." cf. tells the reader, "cross-reference what you just read with this other thing I am pointing to."

Tynskel
10-22-2012, 06:22 AM
cf. doesn't mean "to confer," it means confer, which is a Latin 2nd person singular imperative verb, from conferre, meaning "bring together, compare." cf. tells the reader, "cross-reference what you just read with this other thing I am pointing to."

Hahaha! Whoops wrong spelling. I thought it sounded weird.

Never been good with spelling...