Locked in combat with a gun emplacement?

[thecactusman17]

So to balance out people taking pre-placed cover saves and hydra platforms, GW allows models to assault them. This issue came up lately when my opponent took a very small elite force and I took a larger army with an aegis line and quad gun. The mission was the killpoints-equivalent one. So he manages to kill numerous units, get the VPs, and I still have dozens of guns trained on his last model. He looks around desperately, and settles on the only available course of action: Assault the unoccupied, unwounded t7 quad gun with a Paladin. No Hammer, no Might, no force weapon shenanigans. He just sticks and hopes to roll 5s for the rest of the game, which he does. The only models I have left are kabalite warriors, which for obvious reasons want to shoot at the titanic sized assault monster inches in front of them. If they assault, the chance to do any damage is negligible.

Now, we all know that read as intended, you probably aren't supposed to get to lock with the gun. The gun has WS-, after all. But read as worded, I've yet to see anything suggesting that he wasn't entirely in the right. You CAN assault weapons emplacements. They are NOT vehicles. And Space Marines can kill them at S4.

This is not a question of what you think should happen. Instead, are there any concrete parts of the rulebook or faq that addresses how models get locked in CC if one or both can't fight, and if they can lock in CC when the target has no weapon skill?

[Nabterayl]

I don't think the question is the emplacement's weapon skill, but rather whether it has an allegiance. As page 23 says, "Units that have one or more models in base contact with enemies are locked in combat." the paladin was in base contact with the quad gun, so the question is, was the quad gun an "enemy" of the paladin?

Although "enemy" is not defined, I think we must conclude that the quad gun was not an enemy. On the one hand, you bought it (unless it was part of the board setup, in which case it CLEARLY wasn't an enemy). On the other hand, page 114 tells us that the rules for each fortification type refer us to another set of rules, in this case, "battlefield debris." As battlefield debris, the quad gun may be used by any model in base contact with it, including the paladin, and may not fire on its own. Except for the fact that you paid points to be able to deploy it yourself, it is indistinguishable from quad guns placed as part of the board setup. Indeed, as page 114 says, the quad gun is terrain. To me, these factors - the facts that the quad gun is terrain, cannot fire on its own, and can be used by any player's models - weigh heavily in favor of concluding that the quad gun is nobody's "enemy," and thus, while units can assault it as permitted by page 105, they cannot become locked with it.

[ilan.inglis]

Nabterayl got it. you can whack it to wreck it, but never be locked with it.

[Chris*ta]

Respect Nabterayl. I never would've thought of that.

[Wolfshade]

It is similar to be "engaged" with an immobilised vehicle