Spray Paint

[Psychosplodge]

Just this week done some spray painting of a squad of space marines for about the first time in three/four years. Used the a new can of white undercoat from GW, and have questions,

has there been a marked decrease in quality of the paint, or has white always been this watery?

is the modern black the same, as I still have plenty of black in the old blue cans, which is significantly better quality than this white.

Is there less actual paint ans more propellant cause it's taken half a can for one squad, and I remember it used to last forever, I'm sure last time I sprayed white I got nearly two tau battleforces out of it. (the original tau BF)

[Cpt Codpiece]

i actually prefer the newer white to the old blue cans. i still have an older one blue can that i had forgotten about, and the newer white seems alot smoother. the black i find is great too.

i think it depends on the amount of shaking you do also. for best results i found warming the can in a bucket of warm water helps too.

but i prefer the white cans to the older blue ones. that being said i have moved onto tamiyas spray range for my base coats. they are really nice colours.

[Psychosplodge]

See I found the exact reverse, it's come out all cracked on about half the marines ¬_¬

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I think you should take it back to GW and show them what happened to your models, they should replace the spray seeing as there is quite clearly a mixture problem.

Also, how far away from the models did you hold the can??

[Psychosplodge]

The same as I always have, 12-18 inches....

I can't be arsed pissing about like that, plus it's too late as brushed over them now anyways, I meant to post this a week ago lol and only remembered last night cause the can was looking at me...

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

*Fry face*

[Psychosplodge]

As I said been a while since needed to undercoat...

So can anyone recommend a decent alternative?

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

You don't need an alternative, all my models are sprayed with GW spray and look fine.

[Psychosplodge]

lol, it's always worth trying an alternative occasionally, I recently tried the vallejio range and have been reasonably impressed...

[OrksOrksOrks]

GW Sprays are fine if you use them correctly, the problems you're having sound like you're doing it wrong and you'll get the same problems with any spray you use, cracking is almost always because of too much shrinkage, thats caused by using too much primer in one coat.

But if you want alts, the Army Painter range is decent, but same price range as GW, if you're in the UK, Halfords Primer (make sure you get a matt one) is good, I use the grey a lot, the tamiya range is pretty expensive but they're really nice.

[Psychosplodge]

Ah right cause the other 5-600 models i've spray painted before have suffered the same, and the black I used at the same time and in the same method produced the perfect finish I'm used to, but clearly this one time with a single squad I'm doing it wrong... ¬_¬

But thank you for the suggestions, I'm not sure I'd have considered the halfords primer but I think I have some of that laying around to have go with.

[DrLove42]

LOL yep sounds legit.

I've only used the White spray once, many a year ago. And even then i found it to be much thnner than the black.

I do everything in black spray now

[Psychosplodge]

Or, I may just do that lol.

[DrLove42]

And remember if you can't spray, GW do black primer in a pot now...

[Psychosplodge]

Now that I didn't know, does it differ to standard chaos black?

[DrLove42]

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat800007a&prodId=prod1500288a

I think its a slightly higher Pigment count that helps it cover the metal and resin

[Psychosplodge]

You'd think they'd do a bigger pot...

[OrksOrksOrks]

Ah right cause the other 5-600 models i've spray painted before have suffered the same, and the black I used at the same time and in the same method produced the perfect finish I'm used to, but clearly this one time with a single squad I'm doing it wrong... ¬_¬

But thank you for the suggestions, I'm not sure I'd have considered the halfords primer but I think I have some of that laying around to have go with.

Primer being too thick is what causes cracking, primer isn't supposed to be a heavy coat giving coverage and colour, its meant to be a thin coat allowing paint to grip, it shouldn't be turning your models a brilliant white and if it is, you're laying it on too thick, changes in humidity and temperature will change how it dries, if it dried qucikly and the coat was too think, then it cracks.

[Psychosplodge]

As I said it seemed much more watery, but and I tend to do multiple layers but, I'll bear it in mind for when I finish the tin.

How do you find the grey primer as a basecoat for covering with colour?

[Deadlift]

It's worth mentioning that humidity plays a massive part when spraying undercoat from a can, too hot and you can end of with powder coated minis, too cold and it can be thick. I found this to be especially true with army painter coloured primers.

Modelmate is the brand I use now for priming if using a spray. I love the grey primers they do and I personally prefer them to GWs.

But if you have an airbrush then the best primer
I have used is Vallejo. I am a massive fan of all their products and personally think all their paints and products are superior to GWs like for like.

It's personal choice. For me Vallejo takes some beating.

[Psychosplodge]

I'll have to look at airbrushes. might be worth the investment.

[Deadlift]

I'll have to look at airbrushes. might be worth the investment.

You can pick up a reasonable compressor and airbrush set for about £85 on eBay, 2 things to make sure you get are a double action brush and a compressor with a tank.

My 1st kit came with 2 brushes. I recently upgraded to a Harder and Steinbeck evolution, but that's for later ;)

[Psychosplodge]

whats the double action mean/do?

[Deadlift]

Double action means you can control the amount of paint that comes out
Of the brush. The further you pull back on the lever the more paint comes out. It takes a little getting used to but allows you much more control than a standard brush. The tank on the compressor is to store air and gives you an even pressure and an even flow of paint. No tank means the air can pulse out of the brush which is a pain in the arse. Also if you use your brush too long the compressor will overheat and turn off. I shat myself the 1st time it happened to me as I thought I had broken it on 1st use. Luckily it's a safety feature on compressors and once cooled down will work again :)

[energongoodie]

whats the double action mean/do?

Double action gives you more control with 2 parts. You push down and the air starts ( part 1 ) you pull pack and depending on how much you pull pack depends on how much paint is released. ( part 2 ) That's the basic gist.

On the spray paint front, I just use Halfords :) It works fine for me.

[Psychosplodge]

Cheers, I'm vaguely familiar with compressors, just never used an airbrush attachment lol

[Deadlift]

Brush brands I have used and like are, Iwata, Badger and Harder and Steinbeck.
You tube has a few great artists. Buy painted, Ichiban and Awesomepaintjob are all worth a look :)

[Psychosplodge]

No, not more youtube to need to watch! :D

I'll add them to the list of things I need to check out.

[Angron]

I use Krylon for my base coating needs. It's about half the price of the GW cans and IMO a far better quality. You can find it in almost any hardware store here in the US.

Edit: I also use their matte and satin clearcoat to seal my models.

[Nemesis]

As I said been a while since needed to undercoat...

So can anyone recommend a decent alternative?

Yes I can---Halfords do a range of Acrylic spray cans. There 'appliance white' is truly excellent.

I stopped using GW's white ages ago. I had the same problems as you and I just got fed up with it. I used to shake the cans for about 15 mins after warming them 1st, (the airing cupboards good for this), but they were still crap so I switched to Halfords--no problems since.

[Lukas The Trickster]

+1 for Halfords primer, its all about £3 cheaper. I have used GW primer recently and have never had a problem with it being watery - did you make sure to shake the can up properly as it sounds like the pigment and carrier fluid havent mixed properly. As for cracks in the paint, it sounds like you have had build up by spraying too close to the model - I hold the can at least 10-12" away and gradually 'dust' the undercoat on, sometimes allowing the first coat to dry first. Also, dont try to get undercoat into all the nooks and crannies as all you will do is create buildup of paint - I put one coat of spray paint on, then use a brush to get imperial primer/abaddon black into all the detail. I then dust another coat of black primer on to get an even coat over the model. Hope this helps.

[Psychosplodge]

I've never had a problem with black, but I think next time I have a go if I haven't invested in an airbrush, I'll have a look at the halfords stuff.