Phoenix Lords and their aspects

[jcflanker]

Most aspect warriors have an Aspect Phoenix Lord:

Aspect............Phoenix Lord
Dire Avengers...Asurmen
Banshees.........Jain Zar
Swooping Hawks...Baharroth
Sciorpions...........Karandras
Fire Dragons........Fuegan
Reapers.............Maugan Ra
Shining Spears.........None
Warp Spiders..........None

Does anyone know why the Spears and Warp Spiders don't have a Phoenix Lords of their own?

I think it would be cool if GW came out with them. Maybe in the next Codex.

[fuzzbuket]

ive always thought the same question when i played eldar I came up with the following:
a) they could be diverse guardians (eg uberbikes)
b) in the dex it talks about lots of paths perhaps there not aspects at all
c) spiders have a very dangerous aspect (eg 1 wrong jump to damnation) and their lord is either long dead or non-existent.
d) perhaps like the 2 lost legions its a create your own (autarches can be built into phienox lords worse stats but equipment would be the same.)
e) could be that kandras was origanly the **** lord but when the 1st lord went evil kandras was pulled to take his place!
f) they would not fit. asurmen is the first pheinox but a shining spear/ warp spider lord would be OTT powerful and expensive and better than asurmen!

you could always make your own datasheet! ( i tried and went FAR too powerful!:D)

fuzzbuket

[Kanaellars]

They dont have Lords because they evolved later... they were not Aspects. The shining spears venerate Asurman because they started out as Dire Avengers.

I would assume that the Warp spiders might have come from the Scorpions, but Im not completely sure there.

[Katie Drake]

Yeah, the reason that there aren't any official Phoenix Lords for either the Warp Spiders or Shining Spears is because both of those Aspects are relatively new - when the Aspect Shrines were first founded, these groups didn't exist.

That being said, I'm sure there would be some kind of Phoenix Lord for both of these newer Aspects. Somebody must've founded the first Shrines to these Aspects of Khaine, so I'd think that they would be the rough equivalent of a Phoenix Lord.

[Drew da Destroya]

It may just be that the founding Aspect Warrior isn't quite powerful enough to be a Phoenix Lord yet, and they're still just an Autarch (possibly still alive in their original incarnation?). Pretty much, their armor hasn't subsumed anyone else's will and taken over their brains, yet. It would be cool to see a Phoenix Lord rise up for either of these two aspects, though.

[Gotthammer]

Well the non-fluff reason is that the Warp Spiders and Shining Spears were created after the Phoenix Lords were created, so missed out.

Given the others are still using their 2nd ed minis to add two new ones would mean re-sculpting them all. Given how long Jes takes to sculpt anything I don't see it happeneing anytime soon.

As for a fluff reason I'd go with Katie and Drew's explaination - there's a couple of really badass Exarchs out there somewhere.

[Brass Scorpion]

The real answer as to why those "aspects" don't have Phoenix Lords is that they were introduced a few years after the original Aspect Warrior models and Phoenix Lords were designed, sculpted and released by the GW studio. When the original Aspects were created years ago, at the design studio not in the stories, they each got a Phoenix Lord model too. Warp Spiders and Shining Spears were ideas that the studio added later on without accompanying Phoenix Lord sculpts. I've been collecting Eldar since their army list was White Dwarf issue #127 and this info comes from first-hand experience, not hear-say.

[BrotherAlpharius]

Just to back-up Brass Scorpion there, my first White Dwarf was 148 so I'm of a similar vintage(:-D). The Aspects came first, then their corresponding Phoenix Lords and then later the Warp Spiders and finally the Shining Spears. Whether this real world order of creation is meant to apply in fluff or not I don't know.

For fluffy explanation, it could be that we are viewing information gleaned by the Imperium - they may have encountered the WS/SS later and may not know as much, it doesn't mean that the relevent Phoenix Lords aren't out there, it's just that nobody has yet met them and lived to report it!

[Denzark]

The real answer as to why those "aspects" don't have Phoenix Lords is that they were introduced a few years after the original Aspect Warrior models and Phoenix Lords were designed, sculpted and released by the GW studio. When the original Aspects were created years ago, at the design studio not in the stories, they each got a Phoenix Lord model too. Warp Spiders and Shining Spears were ideas that the studio added later on without accompanying Phoenix Lord sculpts. I've been collecting Eldar since their army list was White Dwarf issue #127 and this info comes from first-hand experience, not hear-say.

I have been playing since then and my collection goes back to WD 89. For the sake of pedantry I must point out the Phoenix lords didn't appear at the same time and probably only appeared in 2ed.