Pile in timing question

[Tepogue]

Ok, how are poeple handling piling in when initiatives are going to be modififed?

For example, 6 Bikers fighting 4 Necron Wraiths.
Bikers assault the wraiths
3 are in base contact.
Wraiths have the whips that make models in base contact drop to I1.
Following the pile in steps at I4 the 3 bikers should move in,
but do they get to strike at I4 or as soon as they come into base contact are they dropped to I1?

Conversely
Grey Knights with which ever weapon gives +1 to their I
Should the Grey Knights pile in on their normal I of 4 or at I 5.

And now Power fists
pile in at normal I, or at I1?

[DarkLink]

I6. Halberds give +2 I. You pretty much pile in at the I you strike at. That's the easiest way to handle it.

[metal_ead]

You are right Darklink. You pile in in your modified Inititive. Whip coils and Lash whips require their bearer to be in base to base for the benifit to work.

[Nachodragon]

So, that is a very important question though, if a model moves in to b2b with a whip coiled wraith on their pile in, do they get to attack then? The coils do not say at start of fight sub phase or anything, justmif something is in b2b. So, i would assume, they pile in, get knocked to I1, and then if they are alive at I1 then they attack.

[metal_ead]

By RAW the moment they touched the coils/whips they would revert to I1. So would fight later potentially.

[JMichael]

Keep in mind that Unwieldy (like Powerfists) doesn't actually modify your initiative. You simply strike at Initiative Step 1.
So a Marine with Power fist Piles in and Initiative Step 4, but strikes at Initiative step 1.

[Lerra]

Would it be possible for a model to strike at a high initiative, then have a lash whip pile into it, and strike again at I1?

[DarkLink]

No, the whip doesn't grant you extra attacks, it just reduces you to I1. You've already attacked, so you don't get extra attacks just because you became I1.


Keep in mind that Unwieldy (like Powerfists) doesn't actually modify your initiative. You simply strike at Initiative Step 1.
So a Marine with Power fist Piles in and Initiative Step 4, but strikes at Initiative step 1.

This isn't actually clear. Different parts of the rule contradict themselves. The description of initiative steps implies you use your base initiative, but the rules for attacks implies your initiative step is the one you actually attack at. Poorly done, GW.

[Tepogue]

Thanks everyone for the replies

The way we played it was to set everyone's I step at the start of combat. In my example of bikers vs whip wraiths.

The 3 who were not in base were I 4, so at I4 they piled in and attacked at i4

Wraiths struck at I2

3 bikers who were in base with wraiths struck at I1.

The rules as written don't seem to take into account modified initative values. If you use base initiatice values, then that Grey Knight with base I4 but weapon modified I6. would not pile in until I 4 and have missed his chance to attack? WTF that can't be right.